Anyone else feels like they just "know" something is off?

[Riv3rW0lf]

So... I am officially all moved into my new house, back in my home province, now three hours from uBPDm instead of ten hours.

At the exact same time I moved back here, my brother (the closest to uBPDm) also moved back. He also is about three hours from uBPDm.

My father told me uBPDm went to spend a weekend with brother, to help him set his house... Clean and put everything where they go. So she basically emptied all his boxes and made his home "home" for him.

I texted my brother two days ago, to see how he was doing. And... He said he was fine. There is nothing in his texts... If I show them to my husband, he would see nothing but somehow I just know something is off.

Yesterday I decided to ignore the pull. This morning I texted him again that he should send me pictures of his house (I just somehow need to confirm something is wrong in our relationship).

The thing is, everything was perfectly fine up to the moment uBPDm went to his house.

Call it a sibling link, intuition, but something feels absurdly off. I am thinking she got in his head... It's like I almost know what she told him: that I could have gone to see him on the road when I moved back. Something like that. I just know she put a seed in his head. He probably told her about the BPD. No biggie, I had told her myself I think she should consult a therapist on account of her symptoms, and I really don't mind.

She also did not text me for a week now. Which is fine by me. But it coincides with my brother's arrival and I fear for him? He is bipolar (from trauma) and the one she has the most facility to control and put against others. He came close to commiting suicide this summer and told me I basically saved him because I am the only one who kept texting him to make sure he was fine, the only one that cared. He has doubts about uBPDm but he still think she is sane. He told me recently : "she was a good mother... Right? Right? I mean, we are all good people now, she raised us well... Right sis?" I didn't know how to breach the subject, he is very protective of her.

I don't want to save him, he is a grown man. But I am wondering if our relationship isn't just doomed now that he is back and within the grasp of uBPDm.

Anyone else just... Know when something is about to explode, or come to light? Like something shifted in the air around me, it's very strange. Or is it just a fear born from habit?

[zachira]

You are wondering if your relationship with your brother maybe doomed now that he is within an easier grasp of uBPD mom. Reading your post brought chills down my spine and memories of how my mother with BPD controlled my brothers, and how similarly impaired dysfunctional familiar members have gained the upper hand with those who are extremely vulnerable to their manipulations. Your brother's past history suggests he is very vulnerable to how people in his life treat him. Your brother has told you how much he appreciated your help when he was suicidal. The big question may be whether you have the time or the energy to be more influential in your brother's life than your mother, and if it is in your best interests to do so. No easy answers here as you truly care about your brother, yet it is obviously very taxing to deal with both your mother and brother and all the unknowns. You probably aren't going to find out what your brother actually told your mother if anything. People with BPD can sense a change in attitude with the people they care to manipulate and then swoop in to regain control of their chosen targets. The long term solution is to help your brother become more of his own person, which is challenging with all the competing influences including the current ego strength of your brother and your mother's apparent determination to control him.

[pursuingJoy]

I can totally relate. My H took off work one Friday and drove 2 hrs to help his BPD mom paint her room. According to plan, I drove up the next day to help out. Soon as I arrived, my spidey senses went off. He would normally greet me with a kiss, but he didn't even get up off the floor where he was painting to say hi. Within 2 minutes of arriving, BPD MIL announced that she and H agreed she would move in with us - something H and I already agreed would never happen - but I had to let her decorate her space. H was oddly silent and faced the corner the whole time, I was blindsided, leaking tears trying to figure out what was going on, MIL kept babbling, a look of delight on her face. Straight up twilight zone

MIL's a master triangulator. She's always the victim and she assigns persecutor and rescuer roles. It seems to satisfy a need in her. In your mom's mind, maybe you're the persecutor and she's positioned your brother as potential rescuer? Instinctively, whether consciously or not, pwBPD gain from causing tension. Best thing I ever did was stay off the triangle and not take the bait!

So yes, I can definitely relate to feeling something weird in the air. You sound worried about your brother and clearly you care about him. I hope this blows over soon so you can reconnect.

[Notwendy]

What the  PJ?

Yes, I have the feeling often, I think it's that I always have my guard up around anyone in BPD mother's circle. More like I don't ever think something isn't off. With her, something is usually off as she's constantly manipulating the situation.

I tend to keep an emotional distance from anyone in her circle and I don't reveal personal information that I would not want her to know.  Even if people promise to not tell her, and they truly mean it, she has a way of getting information out of them. She pushes and pushes, or she sets them up. It's not that I have major secrets, I just don't want to share my everyday life with her.

But I can sense a change in how people relate to me after BPD mother has made up stories about me to them. You are probably sensitive to this as well

[Methuen]

Call it a sibling link, intuition, but something feels absurdly off. I am thinking she got in his head... It's like I almost know what she told him: that I ... I just know she put a seed in his head. ...She also did not text me for a week now... But it coincides with my brother's arrival and I fear for him? He is bipolar (from trauma) and the one she has the most facility to control and put against others. He came close to commiting suicide this summer and told me I basically saved him because I am the only one who kept texting him to make sure he was fine, the only one that cared. He has doubts about uBPDm but he still think she is sane. He told me recently : "she was a good mother... Right sis?" I didn't know how to breach the subject, he is very protective of her...Anyone else just... Know when something is about to explode, or come to light? Like something shifted in the air

If you are getting "off" vibes from both of them, and those vibes happen to be a concurrent "change" in behavior from both of them, it's likely that your spidey sense is accurate. 

So if I have this right, you and your brother have both recently moved, and you are both closer to your mother, but you and brother are still in different places.  Your mother went to visit him, and since that happened, things are "off"  with both of them.  You are concerned about his well being because of history.  He is especially vulnerable to her powers.  You care about him. 

When you texted him and got a "nothing" response, was she still in his house?  When you texted him the second time, was she gone?  Did you get a response that time?  Can you call and talk to him in person?  Maybe hearing his voice and talking in person would be helpful to both of you, but only if she is gone.  Keep in mind she may be enlisting him to tell her everything you say about her or them.  Or, is he strong enough to keep your confidence and not get sucked into her triangulation games?

The intuition you are asking about is that little voice in the back of our head that protects us and keeps us safe, in my humble opinion.  I have learned the hard way to listen to that voice.  I learned by lesson about listening to that voice the first time when I was 16.

If your brother has confided in you in the past that he trusts you, and that you helped him because you kept texting him, and that "saved him", just wow.  That is also a lot of responsibility he may have put on you unintentionally.  How do you feel about that? 

How do you feel about Zoom/Skype/FT with him, if the texting hasn't been productive?

[Methuen]

Soon as I arrived, my spidey senses went off. He would normally greet me with a kiss, but he didn't even get up off the floor where he was painting to say hi. Within 2 minutes of arriving, BPD MIL announced that she and H agreed she would move in with us - something H and I already agreed would never happen - but I had to let her decorate her space. 

PJ:  Is this really happening?  I mean...what?

[Notwendy]

Yes, PJ the  is not at you, but the situation. I don't know if I would have stayed composed in that.

[Notwendy]

I also realize the feeling something is off if my default.

BPD mom has painted me black to her FOO, but lately, they have tried to make a connection with me. I know at one point she told them to not speak to me and we were NC for a while. She then lifted her ban and they speak to me now. I don't know if they are now on to her and sincerely trying to make a connection with me, or if she's still the one controlling our contact. Regardless, I can't trust the relationship even if they were sincere due to her convincing them to not speak to me.

At a recent visit, they wanted to get together, I reached out by email to one of them to ask about the plans. I tried again and didn't get an answer. Just the attempt to contact them was difficult due to the emotional impact of them complying with her to cut contact with me in the past. But I am also trying to be civil about it, civil but keeping an emotional distance. When I got no answer, I was upset. I thought maybe this person was told to not speak to me. I decided to ask them about it, and they apologized saying they were busy and didn't see the email. Is this true? I don't know. Maybe it is, but the dynamics are such that, I will think something is up regardless.

You know your brother. Something may be up. Or he got busy and forgot to reply. I think regardless, we are used to being wary.

[Goldcrest]

Hey Riv3rW0lf as pursuing joy has mentioned BPDs love to triangulate, they need and thrive off drama. You do know when something is off, we have been programmed to be hyper vigilant and pick up on so many hidden cues.

 

I don't want to save him, he is a grown man. But I am wondering if our relationship isn't just doomed now that he is back and within the grasp of uBPDm.

Their will always be challenges that you'll have to navigate but make sure that you look after you. It is so hard to know that your sibling is hurting or being fed a pack of lies, and not having any control or agency in that. This is the world we live in when it comes to family.

My brother and I had a falling out years ago which my mother used as an opportunity to split us up. I lost 14 years of my relationship with him through my mothers triangulation and no contact, fuelled by her. I missed out on seeing my 4 nieces grow up (I have no children of my own). When my dad died and I saw my brother again at the funeral. The monster he had been built up to be through my mother's lens, gave me the biggest hug and we now have such a strong and validating relationship. I guess I tell you this to give you hope, to trust your love as siblings will find a way through.

[pursuingJoy]

PJ:  Is this really happening?  I mean...what?

M, no worries friend, this happened in 2019. It landed us in marriage counseling, and shortly after, I learned about BPD and y'all.    But it left me on pins and needles . Like nw says, I'm wary all the time and I gotta be honest, it is emotionally draining.

My brother and I had a falling out years ago which my mother used as an opportunity to split us up. I lost 14 years of my relationship with him through my mothers triangulation and no contact, fuelled by her. I missed out on seeing my 4 nieces grow up (I have no children of my own). When my dad died and I saw my brother again at the funeral. The monster he had been built up to be through my mother's lens, gave me the biggest hug and we now have such a strong and validating relationship. I guess I tell you this to give you hope, to trust your love as siblings will find a way through.

Such a great story. Thanks for sharing, gc

[Riv3rW0lf]

MIL's a master triangulator. She's always the victim and she assigns persecutor and rescuer roles. It seems to satisfy a need in her. In your mom's mind, maybe you're the persecutor and she's positioned your brother as potential rescuer? Instinctively, whether consciously or not, pwBPD gain from causing tension. Best thing I ever did was stay off the triangle and not take the bait!

PJ, in my case, she does paint me as a persecutor, but HIS persecutor. She invents things I should have done for him, or how I probably don't care about him because I didn't call, nor text, nor visit for exemple. Even though I have two young children and lots on my plate, I seem to always end on the : "she doesn't do enough for you, because she doesn't love you" side, while she is the "but come to me my beautiful boy, I will always be there to save you". So she is the rescuer and him the victim.. except that when he gets very down, she is not the one checking in on him, is she...

Thankfully he still calls me. I think he know the difference between being helped VS being saved. I help him see himself while she just takes control of his next actions. Not the same approach, and I think he realizes one is healthier than the other... For now.

[Riv3rW0lf]

If your brother has confided in you in the past that he trusts you, and that you helped him because you kept texting him, and that "saved him", just wow.  That is also a lot of responsibility he may have put on you unintentionally.  How do you feel about that? 

How do you feel about Zoom/Skype/FT with him, if the texting hasn't been productive?

I am not sure how I feel about it. I am currently working on distancing myself from it in case it does end up happening. I am not sure I want to carry the weight of his death if it ever comes back to it and I don't end up texting/calling at the right time.

There is also a lot of pressure to be a certain way. He is very sensitive and when I lose patience, it hurts him 10 folds. He paints me as the perfect little sister and when I am not, he gives me the silent treatment... It doesn't usually last. But just to say.. he did develop a lot of our mother's nasty habits.

He is also always comparing us... Yesterday he called himself a non-playing character because I bought a new house that is worth more than his. It is all very superficial. And I do always have to wonder if he is the one saying this, or if BPDm put this in his head. He is highly sensitive to suggestion.

I won't lie, it is a complex relationship and my husband doesn respond well to it. He thinks my brother is a "parasite". I really hate when he says that. I am protective of my brother. I know what he went through which tighten the bonds between us... But it's true that he can be a lot to deal with. He doesn't mean to be, but he is mentally ill and it comes with extra pressure and fighting.

I love him but I also have two young kids now and less time and energy to deal with his ups and downs. But he is alone. And he is also the one that brings me back to BPDm. It's like I keep trying to break those two appart. Like my sole purpose in our family is to break him free from her grasp do that he can finally be happy, be himself.

But in the end, it is not in my power, is it?

I feel I have to learn to let go and focus on my husband and children.

[Riv3rW0lf]

I also realize the feeling something is off if my default.

Yes, that's what I've come to realize. That maybe those intuitions I get are just... Default. Because drama between us three is so common that my default position became: well something must be wrong.

I ended up texting him again yesterday and we texted for a hour. In case of what she might have told him, I showed interest in seeing his house and visiting him this summer. He responded well to that and sent me pictures. We said we would talk on the phone soon.

I do think she told him something but that me mentioning a visit this summer bought him back.

In a way, I am lucky, because I don't think our bond can be broken. I am his little sister, and I don't think he will ever be able to completely cut me off his life. I was there for him for every single one of his struggles and physical problems. Concussions? I was keeping him awake. Eye surgery? I was cooking super, dessert and putting drops in his eyes. Suicide? I texted just in time. But then... She can make my life very hard through him though...

Maybe I can help him in the long run, but I do have to be very prudent in what I tell him and how I approach it because he does say EVERYTHING to uBPDm... Borderline dynamics is so tiring... !

[Riv3rW0lf]

The long term solution is to help your brother become more of his own person, which is challenging with all the competing influences including the current ego strength of your brother and your mother's apparent determination to control him.

Exactly ! And it is exhausting and it brings a lot of problems in my own family when I do that. For every steps he makes toward himself, I have to fight both her and his own habit of defaulting back to her. It is tiring and stressful. Lots of thinking left to do about this whole ordeal.