Is It Worth Trying to Talk to Quiet BPD Ex?

[lovingmyself1st]

I can’t shake the feeling of wanting my ex back. I SEE her. I know she’s trying to manage everything with quiet BPD symptoms. I wish she knew that I could see her, and that her mental health is not something she needs to be ashamed of with me. It’s not something she needs to hide. I can’t “help” her with it, but I can walk next to her in it. I wish I could tell her that.
Mage broke up with me out of the blue, said she had been thinking about something I said for a long time & now has so much resentment built up she can’t see a future with me. This happened immediately after a scary diagnosis at the doctor (non-mental health related).

I want to send her an article about Quiet BPD, which I know she is very aware of. She is in regular therapy and is medicated. I want to try to talk openly about this.

She has told her family several times that just because she’s the one who ended things doesn’t mean she’s not sad. She cries about our relationship ending. That has to mean something.

Do you think it would be worth a try? Or am I going to make everything worse?

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[kells76]

A few thoughts come to mind as I reflect on your post.

One is that BPD is by definition a disorder. As member babyducks has suggested in other posts, this means it isn't just "a lack of insight about something" or "not really understanding what's going on in the moment". BPD is not an issue with lack of information. It is a fundamental difference in how perception is structured. It is not possible to "educate someone out of their BPD mindset", as much as we may want to for their well-being.

Two is that part of the "package deal" or "constellation of behaviors" of BPD is that the disordered-ness becomes more heightened as the closeness of the relationship increases. Coworkers, doctors, dentists, acquaintances, etc, often have less experience of the disordered traits, because those relationships aren't as intimate as a romantic relationship, for instance. The flip side of that dynamic is -- it can be "easier" for a pwBPD to take in difficult information from someone in a less intimate, more removed relationship. Heightened intimacy = heightened danger = stakes are higher when introducing something conflictual in the discussion.

Three is that BPD is a shame-based disorder. Showing a pwBPD something that indicates they are damaged, defective, not quite well, etc, is doing something in an area of their life where they have a major deficit -- in managing shameful feelings. A typical "tool" that a pwBPD has to "manage" shame about the self is not to let it in -- to deny, wall out, block, argue, anything to stop there from being a giant finger pointing at them saying "something is wrong about you".

I hear your desire to help and support her.

I also know that on so many of these boards -- this one (family/conflicted), child w/BPD, parent/sibling, etc -- what we as members have to face is that the tool and skill set for having a relationship with a pwBPD is very, very nonintuitive. In other relationships, "it works" to use logic, to educate, to share facts, to hash it out, to talk through it. These normal relational tools are generally at best nonimpactful, and at worst actively harmful/make it worse in relationships with a pwBPD. Logic and reason don't have the same impact on a pwBPD that they do on a broadly-normal mind. Again, this points back to #1 -- BPD is a disorder beyond just "I didn't know this fact".

So, all that being said, learning new information and thinking through outcomes is something we, as broadly-normal minded people here, CAN do. We can learn and grow and make changes and grapple with letting go of our inaccurate beliefs and accepting new data.

If you learned that you presenting her with an article about "quiet BPD" would probably make things worse (shame), and that because it'd be you, a (former) romantic partner, sending it to her, she'd probably completely reject it, what would you do with that new information?

LOTS of questions and food for thought, so I'll wrap it up here...

[lovingmyself1st]

Thank you. Those are really good points. I’m still trying to understand how her mind works.

I think I just want to reach out and let her know I’m thinking about her. Maybe say something like this:

“ Hi, I don’t know the rules here. If This is overstepping a boundary, please tell me. No expectation to respond.  Just wanted to let you know that I’m thinking about you. Hope you are beginning to find some peace and some clarity.”

[kells76]

Yeah, I get what you're saying. You're on Bettering, so your goal is to reconnect, I believe? Accurate?

One non-intuitive skill when wanting to make a relationship better with a pwBPD is --

when it comes to words, less is more. It's HOW we do, not WHAT we say, that communicates the most.

There is literal content in your idea of what to send her:

“ Hi, I don’t know the rules here. If This is overstepping a boundary, please tell me. No expectation to respond.  Just wanted to let you know that I’m thinking about you. Hope you are beginning to find some peace and some clarity.”

and a lot of words.

That amount of words and rational content will likely be overwhelming. It might even backfire. I suspect you can imagine her blowing up in response, sadly.

The non-intuitive skill of "less is more" has to do with gauging the vibes of the interaction while using as little left-brain-overwhelming stuff as possible.

I think what I'm getting at is --

what you want to do is reach out and see how she's doing and see where you guys are at, right?

With "broadly normal" people we can do that with words that mean what the words mean.

With pwBPD, we may have to approach it "perpendicularly" -- we test the waters, use fewer words, and leave a lot of non-claustrophobic "space" for them to respond.

An alternative might be, for example:

a low key GIF and a text saying "these puppies are so cute"

This is so, so counterintuitive to "having relationship talk". But it is still gauging how the relationship and interactions are going. It is keeping the pressure off of "the two of you" and instead "testing the waters" with something really, really neutral and low key. See how she responds to that. Does she engage? Does her tone seem neutral to warm?

If she doesn't want to respond, she won't -- she doesn't need it spelled out. But if she isn't in the mood, or is angry, or whatever, taking it out on a GIF of puppies "saves" what is left of your relationship, in a way.

Does that make sense?

That if you want to reconnect, don't make it "all about relationship talk". Use low key actions to express that you are stable, calm, and chill, while still thinking of her.

I think that's part of what's so nonintuitive about interacting with someone with BPD -- we really, really can't rely on "words that are said". It's HOW we do the interactions that communicates so much more.

So, if it were me, I'd keep it neutral, not about the relationship, not "telling her she doesn't have to respond" which to her may feel, still, like "you telling her what to do", keep it light. Keep whatever content you send NOT about the relationship, so that if she reacts in a big way, the damage is done not to you guys, but to something neutral and separate. It keeps a door open for her to respond as much as she wants, without pressure, and without everything being explained in words.

So much of this is about "reading the tone" or "feeling the vibes" of where she's at, plus:

Less is more.

Keep it chill.

Work on you.

It's not "don't reach out", it's "HOW am I reaching out".

...

Thoughts?

[lovingmyself1st]

I would have never thought of it that way. I can see how she might feel like I’m trying to tell her what to do with that phrase.

Maybe I’ll sit on this for a while. Sending a gif is not something we would have done with each other, but maybe I can think of something. I don’t want to come across as manipulative or controlling - that’s not the goal. She is hypersensitive to feeling like I’m trying to caretake her - so i don’t necessarily want to “check in” and make her feel like she has to tell me how she’s doing.

The thing is - she finds SOMETHING to text me about daily. Whether it’s “I found this pot lid in the cabinet, it’s yours.” Or “I’m not going to that class at the gym Friday in case you want to go. Do you want me to let you know when I’ll be there?” Or “do you know where this paperwork is? If you tore it up out of spite I wouldn’t be mad.” (Which I didn’t of course)

I just want her to know that my door is not closed, and she’s on my mind.

Any other ideas ? This is really helpful.

[lovingmyself1st]

Thinking more about what Kells said - It makes sense. When I talked to her last week, she was tracking with me much more than she had the week prior (when she was very dissociated/disconnected). She asked me if I had any questions. I asked permission to bring up a question I had about what was happening. She agreed & said she was in a place to talk about that.  I phrased everything as "I wonder if..." instead of accusing or trying to act like I knew what was going on. I tried to come from a place of curiosity. I said,

"In the doctor's office, as you were realizing this was more serious than you were expecting, I wonder if you were suddenly feeling extremely vulnerable, infinentely more vulnerable than normal. I wonder if the mere thought of having to rely on me was possibly terrifying? Because what if I chose to not be there for you - or worse, tried to control you. I wonder if you pushed me away because, maybe deep down, you're nervous that there's a chance that things that happened with your ex might happen with me. ...The way she treated you like a child, the way she resented the obligation to be a short term caretaker, the way she tried to control you, the way she shamed you about money. You couldn't trust her - she showed you over and over that you couldn't trust her with your heart. I wonder if your heart is trying to protect itself. I wonder if the walls you had built around your heart to protect yourself maybe have you on high alert and high guard for your heart's safety."

She told me that she did think she felt this way - but this is way deeper than she's even thought about up to now. She's too overwhelmed to be thinking this deeply, even though normally, we'd have deep, emotional conversations regularly.

It was in this moment that I knew she needed space & time. So I don't want to push it or demand a conversation. My friends keep telling me I deserve answers, but from everything I've read about bipolar disorder, and symptoms of BPD, sometimes people need time to decompress, self regulate, and figure out what's going on. Sometimes everything is too jumbled, moving too quickly, too overwhelming. I really feel for her in this.

My hope in reaching out to her is to just gently let her know I'm thinking of her.

I'm still trying to think of a less direct way of doing that - a way that uses few words, and has zero ulterior motive attached.

[kells76]

I can see how she might feel like I’m trying to tell her what to do with that phrase.

Right. This is part of the "nonintuitive" side of communication skills with pwBPD -- whether we mean to or not, sometimes what we say has an effect on the pwBPD that we don't intend. So we have a balance to maintain -- not "sugarcoating" things or "babying" her, that is, still communicating what needs to be communicated, and not saving her from managing her own responses, with an understanding that we can still communicate the "core" or "vibe" of what we need to, yet in a different way than we usually would.

That is to say, it's true that you would never want her to feel pressure to respond, yet in the explicit saying of "no pressure to respond" there can be an implicit message, likely unintentional, of "you must make sure that you do not feel pressured, I am telling you this". There is a level of sensitivity to that stuff with pwBPD that is very, very different from "broadly normal" people. So yeah, the balance is between "we still need to communicate" with "maybe I can make changes in how I say things, and see how that goes".

Sending a gif is not something we would have done with each other, but maybe I can think of something.

Exactly, and that's where this site isn't a "one size fits all" thing. Your loved one is a unique individual, not just a pwBPD, so take any of these tools/suggestions with consideration about her personality, moods, your dynamics, etc.

The thing is - she finds SOMETHING to text me about daily.

So what that says to me, given the "low key" content she's texting about, is that she is thinking of you. If she weren't, or didn't want to be in contact, then... she wouldn't text.

I just want her to know that my door is not closed, and she’s on my mind.

I would see her texts as her putting out some feelers, too, like she is also "testing the waters" on a pretty neutral topic. See if you can "tone match" with her -- i.e., when she asks "is this pot lid yours", don't immediately go to "yes, and do you still want to be in a relationship?" I wonder how it'd go to keep it light, yet still engaged: "It sure is, that sounds like me -- scatterbrain in the kitchen! Thanks for finding it" or something (again, based on who she is as a person/individual, so whatever words you would actually use). Follow her lead -- she is texting, and it's about chill things. That isn't nothing. Responding to what she is texting about shows you are listening to what she's saying and how she's saying it. Could be worth a try -- an indirect way of showing she's on your mind. After all, if you didn't want to think about her... you wouldn't respond.

[lovingmyself1st]

What if I kept it light with something like this - she tried to get me to go to Orange Theory for months (it's a chain of gyms she loves). After we broke up, I could not motivate myself to get my workouts in, so I decided to give Orange Theory classes a try (at a different gym than she goes to of course). What if I say something like this,

"By the way, you were right about orange theory...I do love it."

[kells76]

What if I kept it light with something like this

...

Sure, that could be worth a try -- it's based on who both of you are as individual people, and it's about a pretty neutral topic, it seems. And her response can give you information to feel out if that is working.

Pulling back to a 30,000 foot view, though --

This board is a fantastic resource for working through exactly what you're doing: "There is a way I want to communicate or something I want to say, but now I know BPD is in the mix, what are better ways to do/say it?" It's a really good place to get feedback on specific situations, specific things to say, etc.

And,

there's also a bigger picture to keep in mind, that members like once removed and formflier often bring up here. That is -- you want to go back to a relationship.

What's going to be different this time? Not just in the details and specifics, but bigger picture.

Some members talk about it like -- it's almost like starting from scratch, like dating someone new. There's a way in which you can't just go back to how it was.

And there is a potential for loss there. I believe there is a quotation attributed to long time member JoannaK, something like: once one or both partners in the relationship work to get healthier, they are different than they were back when the relationship first started. And that difference can mean that the relationship is no longer workable.

So as you work through the detail stuff and building new tools/skills, which is critical, it's also important to take some steps back, too. "Reversing the breakup" isn't just a matter of "working the specific tools". It's also taking a big picture view -- what brought you into that relationship anyway? What kind of work can you do on yourself with a T to get to a healthier place? Are you willing to accept that if one or both of you works hard and changes to become healthier, that it may be too much change to go back to the relationship as it was, or ever?

These are questions only you can answer for yourself.

So, there's a lot of "both X... AND Y" on this board. It's both for working out details and trying new specific ways of communicating...

and it's about taking an inventory of yourself, figuring out what you contributed to the dynamic, and deciding how you want to make things different on your end... and being realistic about the fact that tools, skills, boundaries, etc, don't necessarily "guarantee" success.

Lots to think about...

kells76

[lovingmyself1st]

Yes, of course. I appreciate that reminder. Thank you. It can be easy to get wrapped up in the anxiety of the small things.

And yes, we are both in therapy. We've both been in therapy since long before we met - she for her things, me for anxiety and for little "t" trauma from a previous emotionally abusive relationship. She and I had both had hard relationships in the past, and came into this one talking about a lot of what we did & didn't want up front. We set very clear boundaries up front, very clear expectations about communication up front. And for so long things went well. We communicated, we communicated more, and we communicated more. It was such a safe feeling to be on the same page, and to work through hurts and frustrations as they came up.

Honestly, I think the chances of us getting back together are very slim. And also, I don't have to decide right now. I'm trying to not only learn by reading books and talking with others on this forum, but also I want to honor my feelings & what I'm authentically feeling right now. In this moment, I authentically feel like I want to gently tell her I'm thinking of her.

I have no idea if I 100% want to get back together with her. Part of me does - for sure. And part of me is worried that we wouldn't be able to overcome this as a team - that we'd be right back in this same position down the line. I have to decide if that's a risk I'm willing to take. And right now, I don't know.

I do know that I am my own bus driver - I'm not allowing myself to be a passenger on my ex's bus. I am processing all of this grief to the best of my ability with my therapist, with my most trusted friends, and with my brother. I'm spending time with friends. I'm working on house projects. I'm journaling and reading a book about attachment. And I have other self care things lined up to do over the next few weeks. I'm taking time to take care of me right now. That way, whether I decide I want to pursue reconciliation or permanent separation, I will be in the healthiest place possible given the situation.

I hope that makes sense!