Fun night ruined by one comment

[Slothie83]

My main problem with my husband has been random comments I make that I don’t see as a problem but completely set him off. I’ll use last night as an example. He surprised me by taking me out to an expensive steakhouse. Now, I’m pretty much a vegetarian but I’ll eat meat. Basically, the texture of some meats doesn’t sit right with me. While I was looking at the menu I made the comment of not knowing what I would eat. It was a passing comment, I did select something, and the rest of the meal was fabulous. Until this morning. All of a sudden he tells me that my making that comment made his entire night less enjoyable than it should have been and I’m ungrateful. I can’t even tell if that was an inappropriate comment or not! I absolutely didn’t mean to be ungrateful and I thought the night had gone well. This is just the most recent example of comments getting me in trouble but that kind of thing happens a lot. How do I stop making comments that set him off? Is there a rule of what kind of comments to make that are seen as complaining vs venting vs putting him down? I’m really trying to work on validating when he brings this to my attention, it’s just so hard because this comes up out of the blue for me!

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Cat Familiar]

I can easily be blunt, too candid, saying things that can be interpreted in similar ways as how your husband viewed your comment.

It will happen. How you respond afterwards is key.

“Yeah, I can see how that comment might have seemed thoughtless. I absolutely had a great time last night and the meal was really wonderful.”

You don’t want to get into JADEing (Justifying, Arguing, Defending, Explaining) yourself.

So what if he found “the entire night less enjoyable”? That’s not your problem, it’s his.

[Slothie83]

It’s so much easier said than done. I get pulled into JADE so easily. Until I read your comment, I didn’t even see that I used JADE. Of course I did though, I see it clearly now. Thanks!

[PeteWitsend]

It’s so much easier said than done. I get pulled into JADE so easily. Until I read your comment, I didn’t even see that I used JADE. Of course I did though, I see it clearly now. Thanks!

it's human nature to JADE, more or less.  you're being confronted with incorrect information, and your instinct is to correct it.

unfortunately, to a pwBPD, they don't distinguish between their feelings and facts.  They don't give you a chance to explain yourself, they just assume what they want.  Then when you tell them they're wrong - even if you mean well - that just plays right into their insecurities and they dig in even more.

It sucks that you have to change to accommodate their issue, but learning not to JADE is a good thing on it's own, and if by communicating differently you can minimize conflict with the pwBPD, that's a pretty great outcome. 

it's not always possible, as there are often more issues beyondd communication problems, but there are posters here that manage it.

[thankful person]

I have also had much experience of this. I too try to validate and not to Jade. I always had a sneaking suspicion that on many such occasions… my wife was actually not being truthful when she believed I had ruined an occasion… she was not being deliberately untruthful, but just having a warped perception of the past. Looking back I can see that sometimes it was more a case of that she had enjoyed the evening but then something the next day triggered her and literally changed her memory of the event, she looked for some way to make it my fault… and then I’d spend days apologising and trying to make things right. I don’t apologise for such things anymore. I don’t try to make things right. That’s up to her. She moves on much quicker now I’ve *mostly* stopped caretaking her.

[waverider]

Probably not just the words he is reacting to but his perception of your lack of enthusiasm to his "grand gesture". Grand gestures are not about you, it is about receiving a "Wow you are a so thoughtful/kind/great person positive response". ie it is his own personal gratification. What he heard was a comment about YOU, that was also less than enthusiastic. This led to a feeling of being let down, even criticism.

Grand gestures are often simply an attempt to buy praise, credit chasing. Thats why they are big, flash, and highly visible.

[Husband2014]

This happens with my wife almost daily and I did it wrong for so long using JADE. What has really worked for me is I turn it back on them by asking questions.  I start off by saying something like “I’m really sorry this upset you” then I would say something like “did it make you feel uncomfortable/bad person/scared, etc…”? 99% of the time she would change the topic immediately.

I say that if I’m face to face but if things heat up and she starts going in to insane mode and yells. I leave the room or house and she will eventually text and start ranting nonsense so in that case I say “I see you’re very upset about (whatever stupid nonsense she’s feeling) again I don’t gain anything by upsetting you and I’m sorry you feel that way. It’s best we talk when you are calmer”.  Then if she won’t stop ranting I’ll stop responding all together till she calms down or she will calm down.

The worst it gets for me is her extinction bursts and she would
Start threatening to do something that she knows will annoy or embarrass me like “I’m not coming to dinner with you family today”,  I used to do this really wrong and beg and plead now I just say “your choice I’m taking the kids and will go, hope spending time alone will make you feel better. It’s your choice” then I leave. 9 times out of 10 she is bluffing and comes.

Just annoying but the more I do it the better it gets and she stops acting out.

[hurtingbad]

Not that I know what to say to help, but I find myself doing the same thing.  It's gotten to the point where I try VERY hard not to say anything at all, for fear that it will be taken wrong.  I have never (intentionally) said anything mean, but many times whatever I say comes across that way to him anyway.  My undiagnosed BPDh was in a bad car wreck 17 years ago and hasn't been able to work since.  He enjoys yard work and does what he can (sometimes too much) and that exacerbates his leg/ankle pain.  Not too long ago, he said "tonight's not going to be a good night", meaning he wasn't going to sleep well.  Don't know why  , but I responded by saying, "well, that's not going to help" (only meaning like if you say you're going to have a bad day, you'll have a bad day).  Would have been better to say nothing at all.  He lost it.  Started saying I don't believe he's in pain and never have.  How he wishes I could be in half the pain he is just so I could pretend to understand, etc.  It was bad.
It's hard for me not to make little comments that don't mean anything to me, like the comment you made, or that I think are cute or funny, but I'm trying.  Just keep telling myself, think before you speak!

[thankful person]

Not too long ago, he said "tonight's not going to be a good night", meaning he wasn't going to sleep well.  Don't know why  , but I responded by saying, "well, that's not going to help" (only meaning like if you say you're going to have a bad day, you'll have a bad day).  Would have been better to say nothing at all.  He lost it. 

This used to happen to me all the time with my dbpdw. It is hard to get into the habit of constant validation and not JADEing (don’t justify, argue, defend or explain anything!). But it gets easier with time and it is worth it. The irony is that it does feel like a continuing form of caretaking, but if we’re to have a successful relationship with a pwbpd then it’s essential. I was always looking on the bright side, making light of matters, being positive, being reassuring… and pointing out that you really don’t know how tonight or tomorrow is going to be. WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG. All of this was WRONG. The first thing I learnt was to pause. I’m thinking, “I don’t agree that tomorrow is going to be terrible. What the heck am I supposed to say?” I found very quickly that the pause actually helped tremendously. This is partly what they mean when they talk about “listening”. I found my wife felt “heard” and therefore validated, simply from me not jumping in (with the best intentions) to tell her she’s wrong and it’s not as bad as she thinks. I always desperately wanted to make things right. But being cheerful is not the answer. The funny thing is I learnt this “cheerful invalidation” from my mother, even though it still doesn’t work when she uses this with me! These days when I don’t necessarily agree with my wife, I often just say, “mmm” whilst making eye contact, and this works much better. I do sometimes attempt to repeat back in different words what she’s said and describe my understanding of her feelings. However this is more risky because if you get it wrong it can make things worse. So here it has mostly helped me just to say less.

[hurtingbad]

Thankful,
I can't seem to figure out how to quote a portion of your response, so I'll just type it here 
"I always desperately wanted to make things right. But being cheerful is not the answer."
 
As I stated, I'm trying to stop myself from just blurting out any comments, but it goes against my grain to not try to be cheerful when trying to cheer someone up or help them look at something a different way.  I guess it just doesn't work that way with pwBPD   I am trying though, and thank you for your input 

[waverider]

Thankful,
I can't seem to figure out how to quote a portion of your response, so I'll just type it here 

Click excerpt tab, then choose which part between top and bottom start/end quote brackets and delete what you dont want. Then type your response at the bottom after the last  "/quote" brackets

[waverider]

 
As I stated, I'm trying to stop myself from just blurting out any comments, but it goes against my grain to not try to be cheerful when trying to cheer someone up or help them look at something a different way.  I guess it just doesn't work that way with pwBPD   I am trying though, and thank you for your input 

Yes they take you having the opposite view to their negative view as saying they are wrong for feeling the way they do. If you want to cheer things up you first need to acknowledge they are feeling the way they do. eg " I can see this is very upsetting, wouldyou feel any better if we xxxx?"