Self reflections and self management in the face of Manipulative Behavior

[Mommydoc]

I am back from a wonderful and restorative vacation, but my current situation with my BPD sister continues to be unpredictable and frustrating.

I used the time to do a lot of reading, self reflection, journaling, and overall self care (meditation, exercise, time outdoors and with friends). The self reflection helped me separate myself from her and focus more deeply on what I am feeling, what I need and want, including the legitimacy of self protection, protecting my mom, meeting my mom and my needs and spending a lot less time/ energy placating my sister and responding  to her constantly changing demands, requests and accusations. 

Her extinction burst intensified with my boundary setting about vacation. Much of it centered on her demanding me to “fire” my attorney and “ to stop waging a war to destroy our family.” Many distortions of facts. I made it clear I did not intend to fire my attorney, but also committed to working with her, and reiterated that I have taken no legal actions nor threatened any legal actions. I have simply asked her to sign an appropriate trust document which is a core part of her responsibility as co-trustee. A document she has had since May! I made a decision not to answer her texts or emails  after that unless they were positive or neutral or truly time sensitive. So low contact, not NC. It was good for my soul. But it was hard and even my husband who generally encourages low/no contact was getting stressed. After almost a week of NC and a week before my scheduled return home she made an unplanned surprise visit ( 5 hour flight across the country) to see my mother, meet with our trust financial advisor, and the original trust attorney. My mom’s facility and financial advisor let me know immediately, even though she didn’t contact my son or housekeeper who she normally would see when she visits. Though I didn’t really understand the purpose of her visit ( other than to gain some sense of control), and I was aware it probably wasn’t good I was able to stay relatively detached and managed to remain un triggered. ( the facility, my husband, and my friends were very suspicious and more upset than I was). I just reminded myself, I can’t control what she does, and stayed focused on my intentions for the trip.

A few days later, she reached out, “acknowledging” I was still on vacation, offering an “olive branch”, said she had signed the trust update documents and  suggesting that the original trust attorney could help us “reset”… was I willing to work with her. I said yes, and she requested we do a pre meeting ( tomorrow)  before meeting with the trust attorney. I agreed. This seemed like positive progress. Then a series a love bombs, including a sunset picture  that was a sign of “ God (dad) wink” indicating my deceased fathers approval, for our “new beginning”. Gag me.

Since getting back this week, I talked with both the financial advisor and the trust attorney, and there  are discrepancies in what she shared with me and their account.

Representation: original trust attorney is the one who encouraged me to get personal representation, and referred me to my current attorney. She says she encouraged my sister to do the same. My sister told her she had talked to 8 attorneys, but she could only name one. My sister told me the original trust attorney “wants to represent the trust”. Trust attorney denies that.  My sister told trust attorney I had agreed to fire my personal attorney. I  did not.

Documents: My sister told me she had signed the Trust update documents but that “trust attorney” wouldn’t take them as she doesn’t yet officially represent us. She asked me for 2 more weeks to “establish trust relationship with original trust attorney”. Trust attorney denies that and says she encouraged her to sign them and return them to me or my attorney. Trust attorney says  my sister  told her had signed them and was going to drop them off at my house with my son. She never contacted my son or dropped off documents. I think she has signed them ( financial advisor assisted her by providing a notary) but is holding onto them as a way to maintain control/ manipulate.

There is another set of distortions related to conversation with financial advisor that I won’t bore you with. Suffice it to say it’s a clear pattern.

I took what she said at face value and agreed to meet with her tomorrow. I now feel manipulated (again!) I played right into her hand. I can still separate myself, see her motives, and see the manipulation very clearly. I know I can’t change her or trust anything she says.

The original trust attorney has done estate planning for me, we have mutual friends and her son works for me. I respect her boundaries and recognition that she can’t be neutral or serve as a mediator between the two of us. She  thinks my sister getting her own attorney is the solution and in her best interest. As a favor to me she agreed to do a consultative meeting with both of us together and address my sisters questions/educate my sister  about the trust (addressing her list of 19 things)and advise that there are no active trust administration activities once the update documents are signed and filed. I asked her to be very clear with my sister in front of me, and that I will re-iterate what she advises. My goal is to get the signed trust documents and then press pause until things change with my mom. If we can’t achieve that, I realize I will have to go down the “removing her” as co-Trustee.

I read “whose pulling your strings” by Harriet Braiker during my time off. She talks about transforming  yourself from being a soft target to a hard target for manipulation. I am anchoring to her “basic rules of manipulation”.

“ You cannot and will not outmanipulate a skilled manipulator; do not even try. Always pay attention to what the manipulator does, not what he or she says. Do not inquire why he or she is behaving in a particular way and expect to get a valid, useful, or truthful answer. Remember, “Why” is a luxury question. Just because a manipulator denies being manipulative or disguises his or her motives verbally does not mean that you are wrong in your identification. Do not expect the manipulator to give you an honest answer. You cannot and will not change a manipulator by pointing out his or her shortcomings. Do not bother telling a manipulator that she is not being fair or kind or loving. If your purpose in doing so is to effect change, forget it; it simply will not happen. You cannot appeal to a manipulator’s empathy with your feelings. Do not imagine that by telling him how you feel as the victim of manipulation you will accomplish anything. The manipulator does not care; he most likely is incapable of empathy altogether. The only effective way to change a manipulator is to make her tactics ineffective by changing yourself. You will not change the manipulator, but you can change the manipulative relationship. When you stop rewarding manipulative tactics by ceasing to cooperate, comply, please, or acquiesce, you will necessarily alter the nature and the dynamics of the manipulative relationship.”


I am emotionally detached, I have to stay connected legally due to our shared legal obligations to the trust, but I plan to listen, validate where possible, but mostly focus on protecting my mom’s needs and becoming a hardened “impenetrable” target. I told my therapist, the “hatches are closed” no emotional entry points. Hold me to that my friends!

[Notwendy]

I think I need to read that book. It's hard to fathom that our family member would have the mindset of a manipulator. It seems to be an entirely different way of seeing things that we can't relate to. My BPD mother does these things and I have already concluded that I can't "win" because I don't think that way. My H once told me "don't even try, she's 10 steps ahead of you". I also can't go these - ethically and morally. It wouldn't even occur to me to do things like that because I think it's hurtful.

It also comes as a surprise when it's a family member because we assume they care about us. If  telephone scammer calls and says " I think this is a great deal for you" - we know they are scamming us. We don't expect that from a sibling or parent. It's hard to re-frame them as anything else.

As much as I try to see it, BPD mother wins- because I don't even see it in this way. There's nothing to win as far as I am concerned. It's all a losing game. I don't even want to get into. It's not on a financial level like your situation is, but more on a relationship level where she manipulates me into doing things for her, believing things that aren't true. On a material level- it's on some of her possessions- if she knows I want something sentimental.

It's hard to know what your sister wants and why the surprise visit, because to fly there cost money and if she's struggling, that's an expense. I do think she showed a side of her you didn't expect- to that extent. In a similar way, my mother's behavior when my father passed away went to a level of hurtful I had not seen before. I knew she could be hurtful but I didn't expect her to go as far as she did, mainly because I still saw her as a "mother" and mothers don't do that with their own children at least in my own frame of reference. I think this was similar for you. Sisters don't do that to their sister.

It's not you, and it's not about me. Sadly, it's their level of disorder. But as Maya Angelou said "when someone shows you who they are, believe them". It's not that I can't forgive my mother and I am not even angry at her because I know it's her sad and strange thinking that drives it,  but that I have seen what her distorted thinking will lead her to do when she's angry and I am wary of that. Now that you have seen your sister's behavior, you can be prepared for that too. You can still have compassion for her struggling with mental illness and also take steps to protect yourself as needed.

That "waging a war to destroy the family" - what a load of garbage. I recall a similar type of email from my father when I started to have boundaries with BPD mother. "I just want to be a happy family again". Well this meant "get in line and appease your mother" and that is what your sister wants too- her way. She's the one seeing this situation mainly in financial terms, not as a "family". You have been treating her like family.

[zachira]

You are really doing a great job of managing your emotions, though it is natural that you are triggered by how your sister is doing everything to manipulate everybody involved with your mother's care and the Trust. I hope the story I am going to tell you about my sister will be helpful in some way. I originally hired an attorney who had worked with my siblings and I over other property issues to represent both my sister and I which my sister agreed to. My sister immediately started manipulating the attorney, and I told him it was not going to work. I told my sister to get her own attorney. She hired the attorney from the best law firm and had top notch lawyers. I eventually hired a good lawyer. I got the property issue settled in my favor. I believe this is because there was a limit to how far my sister's attorney was going to go in meeting her narcissistic demands, including losing his license. My attorney and her attorney had a long time established working relationship and respected each other, which was disclosed by my attorney before I hired him. The two attorneys interacted with each other, and I had no direct contact with my sister during this time, though she sent me many letters through her attorney, none of which I responded to. Your sister probably does not want to get an attorney because the first order of business will likely be that your attorney and her attorney would be directly communicating, and you would likely not have direct communication with your sister, which would be a big relief for you, and feel like abandonment to your sister. Your sister is not likely to respond well to having an attorney tell her that he/she can not get her demands met. You might set a time frame for how long you are going to wait until you take legal action to remove your sister as Trustee. Knowing how trying it is to deal with a difficult sibling or in my case siblings, who you have legal and financial ties to, is exhausting and heart breaking. I am keeping my fingers crossed for you, that you will be able to resolve these issues sooner than later. Have you considered only meeting with your sister with your attorney present?

[Riv3rW0lf]

MommyDoc,

Reading your post, I personally don't feel like she succeeded in her manipulations at all. You agreed to a meeting, but you still discussed with the attorneys first, it doesn't seem like you actually took anything she said at face value. Part of you prevented that. Part of you, conscious or not, is guiding your every steps toward protection because you know her illness, and you understand the patterns.

I honestly admire your detachment, and how you managed your emotions through her surprise visit. This is one of my greatest fear right now, to see my pwBPD come to my doorstep to force face to face meeting. The thing they will do.

But we protect ourselves now. We know how. We have the tools and we understand their illness more than they do. We cannot manipulate them, but we don't need to: we just need to keep our boundaries clear, be true to our own values and protect ourselves.

When we do that, they cannot manipulate us, because we are listening to our guts. Our guts, our experience with them... We don't need to know it consciously, our bodies know. We can feel love, be compassionate, but still be detached and firm.

And if our limits lead to them throwing us out of their life, raging : we can accept the loss, because we grieved it long ago, and we can exit the relationship when the rages begin, because we know we come from a loving place, and their rage was never about us.

I hope she signs and gives over the documents to you. And if she doesn't, I can see, in your writing, that everything will still work ok, because you are in control of yourself, and you are stronger than ever.

 

[Mommydoc]

Thanks so much.

We don't need to know it consciously, our bodies know. We can feel love, be compassionate, but still be detached and firm.

I am trying to hold compassion for her disorder, for the positive things we have shared, while detaching emotionally, allowing myself to see her behaviors without judgment. I have come to realize how my denial and looking past her behaviors/ motives have made me complicit in the dysfunction.

Admittedly, the biggest battle was with  myself. Allowing myself to  see her as she is. Also acceptance that I can love and offer compassion while balancing that with self compassion, self /mom protection. As you may recall, the first step for me, was a weekend of intense anger, which I think represented the first step in radical acceptance.  My own self limiting beliefs that self sacrifice on my part,  love and altruism could result in a win win with my sister were an obstacle for me. You said it NotWendy.

It also comes as a surprise when it's a family member because we assume they care about us. If  telephone scammer calls and says " I think this is a great deal for you" - we know they are scamming us. We don't expect that from a sibling or parent.

much as I try to see it, BPD mother wins- because I don't even see it in this way. There's nothing to win as far as I am concerned. It's all a losing game. I don't even want to get into

Win win is how I think, it is not how she thinks. She sees it as win lose and she sees me as the winner.  My father pointed this out to me before he died, and yet I couldn’t really believe that someone who said they loved me, could  or would intentionally manipulate me or would prioritize money over my mothers well being. My  denial was likely protecting me at one point, but it was also preventing me from some ultimately necessary realizations/ acceptance of the reality. It’s like I was at a play, sitting in row 100 and now  I am in a front row seat and can see every detail of the set and every facial expression. I am seeing things I didn’t want to see, or were more comfortable for me to look past, but it’s OK, as I now have clarity and am embracing it.

Zachira your story continues to be so helpful to me. It lines up completely with what my personal attorney tells me. She believes that any attorney who attempts to represent both of us will fail and ultimately the only win will come from us both having separate attorneys. Unfortunately, despite agreeing to obtaining her own attorney multiple times over the last month, she has not taken that action, and I believe it is because she knows that she would lose contact with me, as you describe, and she would also limit her  ability to manipulate the narrative.

Riv3rWOlf she did successfully manipulate me and it is pretty clear. I trusted her account of the conversation with the trust attorney and agreed to “ an extension” to get the paper filed. As it turns out, she misrepresented what the trust attorney told her, and it was a ploy to manipulate me to fire my personal attorney and hire the attorney of the trust jointly. The trust attorney sees the situation clearly, and is not willing to represent both of us. My only goal right now is to get the trust documents signed and filed, and even though she apparently has signed them, she refuses to send them to me or my attorney, she will only send them to the trust attorney she wants to “represent both of us”.  We are at an impasse.  The trust attorney agreed to meet with us together but that is going to be a mess, because my sister will turn on her, when she tells her what she told me… and my sister will blame me.  I don’t know how to get her relinquish the signed papers.

I get that she is emotionally on fire, that she is suffering. She has intense anger towards my parents, particularly my father, that she can’t direct towards him, so instead she has made him a deity, and directs the anger towards me. She has shame about her financial motives so she has invented a crazy narrative that validates her position as victim and me as her persecutor, and any attempt on my part to disengage sends her into a manipulative rage. Each of us getting an attorney would mean we weren’t engaging with each other, which is part of why she is refusing to go down that path. Yesterday when we talked, she was all over the place, changing her position, distorting things, raging, making crazy accusations and demands. She was completely dysregulated and the farthest form a “reset” ( which she asked for and offered, hence re-opening conversation) one could imagine. We got no where, as I expected. My husband listened in, gave me an A+, for staying calm, reframing, validating, staying in inquiry, while maintaining boundaries.  After we finished his comment, was “your sister is really mean, she’s getting worse and that was abusive.” The conversation is all about her feelings, all the time, my perspective, my feelings and what was actually said ( and even who said it) are not relevant. I get blamed for any slight anyone has made towards her. She accuses me of withholding financial information from her, and when I ask her what she needs that I haven’t given her, she  can’t come up with anything. She wants a financial accounting, but she also told me to cease and desist the accounting that I initiated at her request. The best one, she raged at me for saying she wanted to move my mom from her facility. I said perhaps I misunderstood, you don’t want to move mom?  Her response I never said that.  (Only a thousand times). Two minutes later she told me the director didn’t treat her with respect because I had poisoned them against her, and she was going to “refuse to allow” my mother to stay where she is.  She says she’s angry I haven’t put it in writing that I will cover my moms excess expenses if she runs out of money, so when I ask her if she wants it in writing, she says no. She feels “disrespected” by everyone, and everyone treats her that way, because of “my coercion.”She has no self awareness of how her actions impact others react to her as they do. She threatens me with legal action over and over, I get a lawyer ( who takes no actions against her other than to suggest she be cooperative) but  I am waging war and destroying our family.

The great part of it is I am in a good place, frustrated of course, a little irked on myself for agreeing to the meeting with the trust attorney and the extension, but mostly feeling like I have grown.  My therapist, my kids, my husband and my friend who knows the situation see and validate my progress. I have achieved radical acceptance and have emotionally detached. I felt really good after the call despite it being such a nasty call.

My mother suggested yesterday, perhaps I should let my sister try to negotiate a move to an assisted living near her. I asked her if that is what she wanted, and she said no, definitely not, but she didn’t think it would be successful, then we would have given her a chance to try. I think my mom is trying to make it “not my fault” she is here close to me, but I told her not to worry about that. If it is what my mom wanted, I would do what it takes to make it happen, but  she is just trying to make my sister happy. I told her I thought it could make things worse and reminded her that my sister  would never forgive me for their decisions. I reassured her I am  truly  OK with it. I realized in that moment, that I really am.  Our relationship is not salvageable and may never even achieve civility.

And if our limits lead to them throwing us out of their life, raging : we can accept the loss, because we grieved it long ago, and we can exit the relationship when the rages begin, because we know we come from a loving place, and their rage was never about us.

There is no sense of loss. I realize, she is just not capable of having a healthy relationship with me, and I can still love and care for her from a safer place. Her rage isn’t about me, but I am the often a trigger for her rage. Not my fault. What’s been happening is not good for either of us and I am ready to move forward.

[Riv3rW0lf]

There is no sense of loss. I realize, she is just not capable of having a healthy relationship with me, and I can still love and care for her from a safer place. Her rage isn’t about me, but I am the often a trigger for her rage. Not my fault. What’s been happening is not good for either of us and I am ready to move forward.

You see everything clearly now, in your own situation. How you managed to remain calm and centered while she was at her worst, abusing you and using all her tools against you, really goes to show how far you have come. Congratulations MommyDoc, on staying true to yourself, on protecting yourself. And thank you for sharing your journey and strength with us here  

Might be wishful thinking on my part, but with neutral parties engaged under the form of lawyers, I think it is a matter of time before she gives you the signed paperwork. Even pwBPD know when it's checkmate for them. Right now I think her rage would qualify as the extinction burst we read on here often... Just gotta hold your center, which you are already achieving with success.

I am happy to see you in a good place. You deserve to feel this peace and to enjoy your mother's last moments in this world with you. Your sister rages are now were they belong : just irritating background noises, but not strong enough to overshadow your well being.

 

[zachira]

Mommydoc,
I let my sister hire her own attorney first, after I told the attorney representing us both it would not work. I then waited to hire my own attorney when it became necessary to do so, as I felt I would be spending endless amounts of money on unnecessary legal fees, with my sister determined to get the best of me financially, as she has considerably more money than I do. Your situation is different, as you hired your personal attorney first, and your sister seems to be refusing to hire her own attorney. There came a point when I had to hire my own attorney because my sister was determined to force the legal proceedings on to me, and I would have lost. You may have to proceed without your sister having an attorney, which could be very time consuming as court and/or arbitration cases take a long time to schedule. Whether your sister has an attorney or not, you may want to talk with your attorney about when to begin the legal proceedings that require a court hearing and/or arbitration proceedings. There may come a point in which your sister decides she has to hire an attorney and/or sign the agreement to make you sole Trustee. My best advice is to try to set a time table with your attorney for what steps you are going to take with your sister with your attorney giving you her best time estimate of how many months/weeks it could take to rap this up. It sounds like you have all the cards to get to be appointed sole Trustee, and plenty of evidence that your sister is not capable of sharing these responsiblities with you. I hear you and feel your pain about having to go through all of this with your sister. When it comes to setting better boundaries with a dysfunctional sister, which could include permanent no contact, you are the only one who knows in your heart what is right for you.

[livednlearned]

Perhaps one of the biggest takeaways for me with the legal piece is to set deadlines with reasonable consequences for non-compliance. Consequences don't have to be punitive, they can simply be that your L will do this or that if and when the deadline is missed.

Like zachira mentioned, it's up to you to decide how long to let things go before moving to the next level (removing her as co-trustee). I can see pros and cons of moving quickly or slow walking things.

I look back at the way my ex behaved in court, keeping us in litigation on average once a month for 4 years. It was definitely a way for him to stay negatively engaged, fighting for something he didn't actually want, but at least having an audience to listen to his grievances.

His behavior seemed overwhelming and even dangerous to me in the beginning. Now, all these years later, I feel pity for him. I don't think he was capable of organizing himself enough to follow through on the things I feared, though that is in part because the legal system all but took custody of our child away from him.

At one point I realized he was not unlike a medical issue that I was going to have to live with. Once a month appointments that became routine, a bit unpleasant, no real guarantee that they would end but one could hope. When I began to see him as a chronic issue, he became a tiresome, unpleasant issue I refused to let ruin other parts of my life, although financially he did a number on me.

It is so sad, really. In some ways, I can see how your sister would feel so frustrated by the imbalance of responsibility, yet the BPD traits, and psychosis in particular, mean she is not in her right mind to be making decisions, especially ones that impact the health and well-being of her own mother. Her lack of self-awareness and inability to work with you cooperatively are truly tragic, for her just as much as you.

When we talk about radical acceptance here, it truly is radical. I can think of nothing more radical than behaving at odds with the compassion I feel for someone in my family. When there are BPD traits involved, the feeling of compassion must become divorced from the natural actions that we associate with compassion. For me, that is possible only because the alternative, to act in compassionate ways, undermines safety.

[Mommydoc]

It was definitely a way for him to stay negatively engaged, fighting for something he didn't actually want, but at least having an audience to listen to his grievances. His behavior seemed overwhelming and even dangerous to me in the beginning. Now, all these years later, I feel pity for him. I don't think he was capable of organizing himself enough to follow through on the things I feared

This is fascinating LNL. I now realize all the texts, emails, pictures she sends me are all ways to stay engaged with me. It frequently doesn’t matter one way or another if I respond. I have no idea what my sister wants, as it literally can change in a matter of minutes. But now it doesn’t matter, I feel free not to worry about it, not solve it, because nothing really ever gets solved, and it all represents a distorted narrative to reinforce herself as a victim and me as her persecutor.

Like you, I felt threatened, I was so worried about her legal threats that I retained a lawyer. But like your ex, she probably isn’t organized enough to follow through on her threats. She asks for tons of documents but never reads them. I have transitioned to see her as an irritant that I need to limit my time with, hold boundaries but someone who can be tolerated. None of it seems unbearable anymore, now that the emotional detachment is more firmly established.

I didn’t consult an attorney with an intent to take action against her or to remove her, but rather with the intent to protect myself and my mother. At this point, I can keep setting boundaries and consequences, while giving her reasonable choices and opportunities to be involved. The trust is essentially on autopilot and I have no need to win by getting her removed as Trustee, I think the cost  is not worth it. It’s not actually even the financial cost, but the emotional cost of that process, that doesn’t seem worth it. And thank you Zachira for reminding me that the cards are laid out should I decide to go down that path. I get to choose if or when to play them.

My biggest challenge is setting boundaries around how often and how we communicate. Phone calls/ FaceTime and in person are consistently hostile and definitely don’t work for me. I would like to get to a more transactional /email type communication once a week. I haven’t figured out how to get her there however. 

I am definitely going to slow roll this, there is really no reason not to. Taking it a day at a time and feeling good… any advice on limiting contact with someone who can literally text 8 times an hour appreciated.

[Notwendy]

This is fascinating LNL. I now realize all the texts, emails, pictures she sends me are all ways to stay engaged with me.

Like you, I felt threatened, I was so worried about her legal threats that I retained a lawyer. But like your ex, she probably isn’t organized enough to follow through on her threats.

Yes, in retrospect, the way my parents behaved when my father was ill, their accusations at the time were not threats they planned to follow through with. Yet, I felt threatened- I think a main one was that my integrity felt threatened. This is a value for me. When I asked to have access to some of their funds in case of an emergency - it was with intent to help if needed. So when I heard BPD mother saying I "forced her to the bank" as if there was another motive, it was outrageous to me and I backed off. Then, she felt abandoned and reacted even more.

I think you feel your integrity has been threatened too but when it comes to such accusations, I also think it's important to be protected from false accusations. Since I didn't have access to my parents' funds, the best way to protect myself was to not have it. You already have access to your mother's funds and so, I think it's wise to have gotten legal protection and accounting. I don't think we can assume they are just saying things they won't act on.

Once BPD mother told me if I touched anything in her house, she'd call the police. Maybe it's just her empty threats, and she'd not ever do it but what if she did, in a rage? She's also accusing people of elder abuse whenever she gets upset with them. Home health workers don't stay with her long- and I can see why they'd be scared when she says these things. I'm wary of being alone with her for this reason.

But since I have not participated in or reacted to the drama, the relationship feels "empty" and disconnected. I realize that drama is how my mother engages people- and stays engaged with them. The problem though is that she goes too far with it. As much as I have learned to not be too reactive to her, spending time with her leads to me being in tears. She has a way of turning my good intentions into something else and that is frustrating. She often brings up the wish for us to help her go through her things in the house, and then when we do, she finds something to be angry about.

I think what is going on with your sister is something similar. It's a value for you to ensure that your mother gets the best care at this time and this mission extends beyond just being a daughter- it's your profession to do that. So your sister's accusations feel hurtful. I don't think it's a conscious thing that this kind of engagement is directed at that. It's emotional. And yet, money is a tangible asset and I don't think it's a good idea to trust they won't take it too far. On that basis, I think you are wise to enlist legal assistance.

[zachira]

I think you are fully understanding that your sister is what Bill Eddy would call a high conflict personality. Bill Eddy is a social worker and lawyer who specializes in educating the public about high conflict personalities, including people with BPD, and how they affect different areas of life including divorce, legal disputes, the work place, etc., I have read several of his excellent books and am familiar with his website. Now you know that you and your sister are complete opposites when it comes to dealing with conflicts. You are looking for solutions while your sister is continually moving the goal posts and changing what she is unhappy about in the moment. You are asking for suggestions on how to continue to engage with your sister while putting your mother's needs first and lessening the impact of the draining interactions you have with your sister on your wellbeing. Whatever boundaries you do decide to set with your sister, you will have to be firm in maintaining them for the boundaries to work. I have found that some lawyers can be real role models when it comes to setting boundaries that keep them from becoming overwhelmed by cases with very high conflict personalities. I was initially very frustrated with my lawyer because it did not seem like he was defending me, with all the lengthy correspondance sent by my sister's lawyer with letters written by the lawyer himself or letters written by my sister, which were all very aggressive and accusing me basically of being a terrible person. My lawyer's key strategy was not to show any of our cards until we needed to, and he was right about that even though it still hurts to never have seen anything in writing from him that says anything positive about me. Woud you consider asking your lawyer what her recommendations are about contact with your sister? As always, you are the expert on what is right for you.

[Mommydoc]

Great suggestion Zachira. I have read his main book BIFF and refer to it regularly. His background and how he weaves his knowledge of PD, therapist perspective with his legal and writing skills is very unique. I agree my sister definitely fits the definition of HCP. I thumbed through his books and just downloaded, So what’s your proposal, which feels like the place we need to get to. Thanks for pointing me back there. I agree with the emphasis on boundaries. The easy route would be to go low or no contact, but it isn’t possible, so I need to balance the amount of contact with strong boundaries. It is making me distracted at work now that I have to deal with it again, working out rhythm is disrupted and my husband is tired of hearing about it.

The trust attorney is going to send an email today agreeing to be a neutral party to receive the documents  and meet with us for Trust Administration  legal review, but also clarifying her boundary/unwillingness to represent “the two of us” together as co-trustees. I expect another round of fireworks and accusations. I set out my boundary out this morning, that she needs to return the signed documents. No threat, no consequence, but also not agreeing to any further meetings or contact, which she is urgently pushing for.

I discussed the option of filing the documents without her signature with the trust attorney who thought that might be an alternative. (My attorney doesn’t like that option).  It demonstrates her lack of cooperation with basic trust administration duties, while demonstrating my desire to fulfill the trust responsibilities.

I think you feel your integrity has been threatened too but when it comes to such accusations, I also think it's important to be protected from false accusations

Thank you for the validation NotWendy. I feel  comfortable with my decision to seek legal representation for exactly that reason. I have come to recognize self protection as a critical component of self compassion that I deserve and need to offer myself. There is  irony that the thing I feared so much is now the thing I really want, ie for her to get a lawyer. It has all been hurtful, but I also have a sense of healing, and almost see the pain she has caused me as a source of strength and resilience. Like you, the relationship now feels empty and so much less threatening to me. Almost hollow with no substantive weight. And my scars create clarity for me, make me less of a target for her, as I have the self awareness and clarity I might have previously lacked to live my values and protect myself and my mother. Most importantly I have figured out a way to do it that feels authentic to me, that isn’t retaliatory, isn’t hostile but is firm detached and kind. It is still quite draining and consuming however.  Riv3rWOlf’s words still resonate strongly.

we can accept the loss, because we grieved it long ago, and we can exit the relationship when the rages begin, because we know we come from a loving place, and their rage was never about us.

[zachira]

The thing you feared the most, for your sister to get a lawyer, is now what you want the most. So contrary to what we would think we would ever want, yet a major step in dealing with a high conflict personality when there are legal and financial issues that have to be resolved. It takes so much integrity and heart to have this wish and follow through with it. Unlike high conflict personalities who have unlimited financial resources (which your sister doesn't) who often thrive on being involved in law suits, this at one time would have been the last thing you would have wanted: to wish your sister would get a lawyer. I like the plan you have with the Trust lawyer. I am also glad you have your own personal attorney to give you legal advice that would be a conflict of interest for the Trust lawyer. You are carefully proceeding one step at a time. It nearly always makes sense to avoid litigation if you can, due to the cost, what seems like a never ending wait for resolution, and the terrible emotional toll you fear it would take on you. Slowly you are breaking the emotional connections you have with your sister which cannot be measured because of the blood ties and shared history from birth. I admire your courage and your strength in continuing to take the necessary steps to wrap this all up, which hopefully will be sooner rather than later.

[livednlearned]

any advice on limiting contact with someone who can literally text 8 times an hour appreciated.

I think it depends on how you feel and your tolerance.

The nuclear option is to get a new phone with a new phone number. Move everything over there and leave your current phone number for your sister. Check it when you feel centered, or have your husband check it.

Early in my divorce I did this with email. Anything from my ex I forwarded to a trusted friend who would let me know if anything required a response. I would say it was a 1:25 ratio. For every 25 emails, only 1 required a response.

Texting is obviously a bit harder to forward or ignore. I no longer have alerts on my phone. No banners, no sounds, no badges.

I used to get text messages from SD25 and eventually played the "I'm old" card. "My generation doesn't text."

If I respond, it's usually a thumb up or a smiley face, which I guess doesn't scratch that itch for her. She rarely texts me anymore (though I'm also able to be somewhat removed as a step parent). 

My H used to have a flip phone and though he could text, it was challenging. His smart phone definitely made things worse when it came to SD25, though the upside is that she only calls once a day instead of multiple times a day (unless she's dysregulated).

I tend to lean toward non-verbal boundaries when I see repeat proof that verbal boundaries only create more headaches. It can be a bit like saying you don't like when someone pulls your hair, which tells them exactly how they can hurt you.

In that case, it's more about how you tolerate their extinction burst. My H tried to limit SD25's texting cold turkey (trying to set up a time once a week to talk) and she responded with suicidal ideation. It seems like something similar may have happened when your sister flew out during your vacation.

If it's hard to manage the extinction burst, maybe give yourself a ratio, only answering 1 out of every 10 texts, and only ones that require a response by objective measures. Or  train yourself to not read the messages without a trusted person previewing them first.

It's kinda tough in the age of electronics