Is friends possible after separating?

[Robert1977]

Hi, I'm looking for some advice.

I started to date a girl recently who has BPD. After we became romantically involved she had her first episode then another 10 days later, both times she reacted very badly to events where she believed I had rejecting her. I could not relate to what she saw at all. I could not have avoided it.

The change was massive and so sudden, out of nothing or almost nothing. Being in the most amazing honeymoon phase made it all the more painful to experience - she went from loving me, giving me all of her attention to hating me.

The sudden change was too much for me - I explained this and said I was going to stop communicating for a while to give myself some space. I'd never experienced anything like this before, I was heart broken to lose someone I'd gotten so close to and was having a great time with.The sudden changes happened at moments when we were getting on really well.

She moved on with another guy immediately.

3 months have passed and I'm wondering if I should try to be friends. I've remained friends with previous partners (none had BPD)...We have similar interests and were friends before for a short time before we moved onto being intimate.

I'm not interested in rekindling the romantic side of the relationship. I've messaged her a few times recently - half the messages she blamed me for everything that went wrong and said she did not want to be friends and the other half she was amicable and polite.

Generally is it possible to be friends in this situation? Or does it generally lead to more problems and it's best to forget about them?

Thanks so much for listening...

[SinisterComplex]

Everyone will have their own opinion here. There is no right or wrong answer. It just depends on you and what your expectations are. If you want true friendship...meaning you are not secretly hoping for something romantically to develop again then it may be possible. Whether or not it is right for you is strictly up to you and no one else.

Most importantly for you have to a friendship you have to have strong boundaries and you must be comfortable with completely walking away if it is not working for you.

Please be kind to you and take care of yourself

Cheers and Best Wishes!

-SC-

[once removed]

first, its a real gut punch to have someone youve cared for jump in a new relationship immediately.

in general, friendship (and i mean more than just being polite when you see each other) after separating is possible, but rare.

when it happens, its often fleeting, not some lasting bond.

when it lasts, its not usually close. im pretty good friends with an ex i ended bitterly with. we catch up a few times a year. i go to her halloween party. thats about it. i enjoy it, but it aint deep, and i wouldnt miss it.

3 months have passed and I'm wondering if I should try to be friends.
...
I'm not interested in rekindling the romantic side of the relationship.
...
half the messages she blamed me for everything that went wrong and said she did not want to be friends

do you want to be friends? and if so, why? think about it. what would the basis for friendship be? what appeals to you about the idea?

if it is to mitigate the feelings of loss, trust that those feelings will probably pass if you dont act on them, and once you have fully grieved the loss.

[Augustine]

Generally is it possible to be friends in this situation? Or does it generally lead to more problems and it's best to forget about them?

It typically leads to further issues that get progressively worse.

These issues are best addressed by a mental health professional who maintains an objective emotional distance.

For want of a better term, you have too much skin in the game to be objective.

Befriending someone who alternates between reviling you, to brief moments of (seeming) acquiescence, is going to do far more harm than good…for both of you.

From what I have read from personal accounts from either side of the BPD equation, the best medicine is strict no contact.

[Pook075]

Is it possible to be friends?  Sure, it is absolutely possible.  Just know that the relationship may often be one-sided as your ex seeks validation elsewhere.  As others mentioned, the boundaries you put up will go a very long way in deciding how beneficial that friendship actually is.

I have to point out though that she said that she doesn't want to be friends.  It may be smart to back off for a bit longer and see what happens down the road.

[Rev]

Hey,

You've already got two great responses to the question we all ask ourselves at some point - unless the situation is abusive to the point that it becomes clear that it's not something one would want. 

One thing that all these relationships to is affect our nervous systems and we look to stabilize them by doing what we know to have worked in the past. Except that these relationships are really nothing like those of the past. You have already acknowledged that (sometimes painful) truth.

So now that you've read these two responses - what does your own intuition tell you about whether or not you'd want to have a friendship, let alone if that would be even possible.

What do you think?

Hang in there.

Reach out any time.

And welcome to BPDfamily. Sorry for what brought you here. Happy you found us.

Rev

[Cat Familiar]

Judging by what I’ve read here, being friends after ending a relationship is statistically improbable, but possible.

[Robert1977]

The question of why would I want to be friends is a good one...I've been thinking about that.

The times we had as friends before we became romantic were good and I think there's a part of me wants to see if that part can be salvaged / preserved. The real problems started as soon as we became romantic.

I definitely don't want to be romantically involved again...i.saw enough to know the extreme mood swings would return and likely be worse. I also know how this affected me - deep confusion and pain at behaviour that seems so cruel and twisted. I've rarely experiences such malice. It may be caused by mental illness but that anger is real and the destructive actions are painful to encounter.

A part of me thinks friends will not be possible and I have to let go. Friends is just a way of not accepting total loss.

Another part of me feels sorry for her and would love for her to have some success, staying friends with an ex and having a friend. This is probably wishful thinking. Even now when I msg it's 50/50 whether I get a pleasant reply or all out blame and deluded fault finding. I've got much better at not taking it personally and not being romantically involved has greatly reduced the painful impact of her suddenly turning on me for no obvious reason.

I think there's one more reason - we met through mutual friends but since separating I've not seen those friends...I'd like to see them again but I don't want to cause any drama.

I guess the emotional optimist in me would like to try, to see if it's possible, to give it a chance. She's mentally ill and a part of me wants to help in someway. The pragmatic in me is countering this with a predicted 98% fail rate and just more prolonged suffering for everyone.

Maybe I shouldn't push and see if she initiates a move for friendship..



 

[Rev]

The question of why would I want to be friends is a good one...I've been thinking about that.

The times we had as friends before we became romantic were good and I think there's a part of me wants to see if that part can be salvaged / preserved. The real problems started as soon as we became romantic.

I definitely don't want to be romantically involved again...i.saw enough to know the extreme mood swings would return and likely be worse. I also know how this affected me - deep confusion and pain at behaviour that seems so cruel and twisted. I've rarely experiences such malice. It may be caused by mental illness but that anger is real and the destructive actions are painful to encounter.

A part of me thinks friends will not be possible and I have to let go. Friends is just a way of not accepting total loss.

Another part of me feels sorry for her and would love for her to have some success, staying friends with an ex and having a friend. This is probably wishful thinking. Even now when I msg it's 50/50 whether I get a pleasant reply or all out blame and deluded fault finding. I've got much better at not taking it personally and not being romantically involved has greatly reduced the painful impact of her suddenly turning on me for no obvious reason.

I think there's one more reason - we met through mutual friends but since separating I've not seen those friends...I'd like to see them again but I don't want to cause any drama.

I guess the emotional optimist in me would like to try, to see if it's possible, to give it a chance. She's mentally ill and a part of me wants to help in someway. The pragmatic in me is countering this with a predicted 98% fail rate and just more prolonged suffering for everyone.

Maybe I shouldn't push and see if she initiates a move for friendship..



 

There you go ... Sounds like your are beginning to sort stuff out.  As Sinister said, there's no one size fits all answer. Each of us just needs to get to that place of acceptance that you mention.

And that would be true of any loss.   That word there - loss - is tied to grief.

Have you considered doing some grief work.  Depending on your area, there might even be some free workshops you could go to.  But from my personal experience, the words you write here indicate that you are on the road to coming to some sort of personal comprimise.

If that is in fact the case, I'd like to offer you some insights.

1) Loss always involves some sort of suffering. Managing the suffering itself is a skill.  Too much and you end up in a funk that impacts the rest of your functioning. Too little and you prolong the suffering.

2) Sometimes people will bypass the suffering because they interpret the suffering as a sign of failure and so begin to feel unnecessary shame and/or guilt. It's natural to feel these things because all healthy human beings are equipped with the capacity to feel shame and guilt. The key becomes recognizing when those feelings are creeping in unnecessarily because our thoughts are distorted - aka wishful thinking, idealizing the past, etc.

What do you think?

Hang in there.

Reach out any time.

Rev

[jaded7]

Is it possible to be friends?  Sure, it is absolutely possible.  Just know that the relationship may often be one-sided as your ex seeks validation elsewhere. 

I don't see that as friendship. Friendship is knowing each other deeply, respecting each other, being there for the other when they need you, speaking kindly to them, responding to calls/texts, wanting the best for the other, sharing a sense of togetherness, and having a commitment to continuing the relationship.

If it's one-sided, as it will be with the BPD sooner or later, if it's tinged with the potential for a blow-up and ghosting, or attacks and verbal abuse, that's not a friendship. They are the same person that did those things. Just like the relationship I had, it's NOT a relationship.

[Pook075]

I don't see that as friendship. Friendship is knowing each other deeply, respecting each other, being there for the other when they need you, speaking kindly to them, responding to calls/texts, wanting the best for the other, sharing a sense of togetherness, and having a commitment to continuing the relationship.

If it's one-sided, as it will be with the BPD sooner or later, if it's tinged with the potential for a blow-up and ghosting, or attacks and verbal abuse, that's not a friendship. They are the same person that did those things. Just like the relationship I had, it's NOT a relationship.

I don't see it as a true friendship either, but my soon to be ex-wife and I are now civil and able to talk things through about the kids, the finances, etc.  She'll never be my best friend once again, but we have restored somewhat of a friendship and can communicate.

[Zarion]

Not sure if you still read the thread but I will give you my own experience. My ex , who has perhaps subconsciously admitted either quiet BPD or Covert NPD to me, and I dated for 2 years. He had fear of vulnerability and hard to open up. After the 1st year, he sort of broke up w the reason of his problem  but never said the diagnosis..but not healthy for relationship. So he is aware..And that he loves me too much but sort of we are so close and together that he almost was saying he can ‘act’ a certain way around others w me he won’t do that to me.  Almost seemed he knew this would all show up w how close we were but w his friends who he keeps arms length he can pretend.

However, after that little 2-3 week calm of melting, we were together another 9 months. Then, at almost 2 year, blindsided me w false claims he wants to heal and I don’t want him to(from what?), he’s getting worse, and that I never gave him space from the 1st b/u (he never asked and wanted me around all the time!)
He was angry (never saw that before). I sort of called him out (alluding to get help) but was in shock too and shut down. He called me back to tell him he stayed w me for those 9 months so I wouldn’t suffer!>? Meanwhile, he was the one in that time thanking me so much, love of his life, bc I am helping him so much w his problem in that time. (Whatever it was). Told me he hates talking the problem and I kept asking and he does not know me anything (I asked him 3xs what is the problem and he would not tell me exactly what it was)….It was really hard and I was numb for 5 months. I never reached out based on that. Literally we went from hanging out on a nice night to that on my way out.

In 9 months, never heard from him, no text, zero except 2 times..something minor and ridiculous and zero w the breakup. But he kept me on all media, maps, etc. I found out thru mutuales that 2 months after our b/u, he also dropped w his best friend and some other bizarre things.

Then we were at the same univ.  He completely ignored me as if I never existed. I was so hurt bc we were friends and extremely close on that and dating level. This was the person I wanted to marry. The ignoring really hurt more another level.

One day he approached me about 11 nmonths post b/u and mentioned some intrusive thougths he was having (he thought were real).  He was also trying to come up w justified reasons for b/u. Yet, after that convo, he still ignored me till one day he tried to sit w mutual friends again and I and I said no, you cannot act like I don’t exist but pretend otherwise in front of people. I was heartbroken bc I embarrassed him but it was a year of hurt.

Now fast forward to 2 months after that. He frantically approached me ‘needing’ to speak to me, and he needs to apologize for many things. I was dealing w other stressful things..and I said no not now, it is not a good time. Anyway, I agreed to eventually speak w him about 3 weeks later. He unloaded ALL sorts of trauma fro childhood, later in life, disclosed some emotional and mental stuff..you name it came out. I told him the truth that I never thought of us not being friends. He claimed I was over him and moved on and he is never going to get over me and move on. He told me he was so happy w me, he wanted to marry me, that he was not mentally well when he did the blindsiding. (Also neither of us dated others). Not a day went by he didn’t think and miss me. Both admitted to not being over, and he said he wants to get back but this problem is still here. He also told me that from 6 monhths in (Gave a date!) he thought I was going to break up w him constantly. I NEVER was!

We spent 4-5 months together —all the time. People thought we were couple, but we weren’t.

Then summer —suddenly one day, like a switch about 2 months ago. I could sense he was different. We were done univ but he does not live far from me. Pulling away, acting weird, not as much engaging.  Went from texting all day to slow fade of every few hours. Asked if he’s ok (something seemed to happen w work that stressed him but would not tell me and he was constantly walking like walking it off for HOURS) or if something I said was misunderstood. Asked this 3 times. ofc no it’s all fine.I had the feeling lying to me over really stupid things for no reason. Also it seemed a little one sided as far as convo, interest. He was ALWAYS interested and asking me questions.

 Well now, he’s not answered my texts in a few days.  So I guess here we go again.  For me, probably this piece hurts me the most long term bc I really wanted him in my life as a friend. HE sounds like a** here but he really wasn’t. He’s was a beautiful person.

I actually had planned to speak w him in the summer comfortably at ease  about his unloading/traumas, and my reactions to that blindside now that we were comfortable, and I processed it (he seemed to unload during bad times for me and I was in shock what he told me). —I never saw him all summer just the texting constant to zero. Ofc after the slow fade, I went back to deep dive certain things. —-Like the apology was for his benefit, his guilt, but not really for me bc if it was, this would not be happening again right now. Even tho white little lies over nothing, trust is harmed.   I have no idea in his mind what he is upset with

As friends, all he had to say was he is going thru some stress  and can’t talk or talking mental health break…)of note he is really off social media and walking like 4-5 hours a day I’m sure for stress)..But it seems like yes he has a problem, but he (and he/I ) are affected if I am romantic or a friend.

Got long winded but I am not sure it is possible for friendship. I don’t know if the person always sees you as more and just can’t handle the dynamic. I am very sad trust me. I wish it was different. In my case I don’t think he is seeing anyone else, but it is like he pushed those close to him far away.

I still plan to give my letter. Maybe that is the scorched earth forever.

[Zarion]

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