How long did it take for your BPD ex, to show her/his symptoms?

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

Ive been in a relationship with two BPD’s during my life. The first in my early twenties showed symptoms after only two months, being verbally abusive, would flirt with others when i was with her, and going back and forth (hot/cold). The second one didnt show her true colours before 1,5 years had passed. Although i moved in to her place after 4 months, we were looking to buy a house after a year and planning to have a child. During her stable periods lasting about two months, she was kind, loving and empathic, and rearly verbally abusive. She was 40.  The one i dated in my early 20, showed much more aggressive bpd symptoms, then the one i dated in my late 30’s. Is it normal to be relativelly stable for 1,5 years? How long didt it take before you saw their bad side?                                       

[bolling]

Ive been in a relationship with two BPD’s during my life. The first in my early twenties showed symptoms after only two months, being verbally abusive, would flirt with others when i was with her, and going back and forth (hot/cold). The second one didnt show her true colours before 1,5 years had passed. Although i moved in to her place after 4 months, we were looking to buy a house after a year and planning to have a child. During her stable periods lasting about two months, she was kind, loving and empathic, and rearly verbally abusive. She was 40.  The one i dated in my early 20, showed much more aggressive bpd symptoms, then the one i dated in my late 30’s. Is it normal to be relativelly stable for 1,5 years? How long didt it take before you saw their bad side?                                       

[SaltyDawg]

Intimate relationships:

#1 - uBPD/uNPD/u+exgf - I was too naive; however, in retrospect, as soon as I met her face to face (we had been chatting on a TV show IRC channel in 1997); however, I didn't get out until she did her first discard when she was cheating on me for a 2nd time.  Her issues were not hidden, but I didn't recognize them as I was unaware of what mental health issues looked like.

#2 - uBPD/uOCPDw - I still was too naive; however, she was a lot different than #1, if I could recognize yellow flags like I do now it would have been sooner.  However, as I was oblivious as to what BPD was it wasn't until 2 weeks after our 3 week honeymoon ended (5 weeks after getting married) when I realized something was seriously wrong with her in the head.  So, it was 2 years 5 months after we first started dating, and 2 years 9 months after we first met.  She kept her issues well hidden until she thought she had me hooked after we got married, and I still didn't know about BPD until nearly 2 decades after we met.


Non-intimate relationships:

#3 - dBPD-Therapist - we met on a facebook group of an author who had written a book on BPD.  It was a mentorship type relationship even though she is a licensed professional and author of mental health books, and I could recognize her behaviors as being BPD immediately as I openly challenged her assertions on an open post she later deleted on that forum.

#4 - uBPD/uGAD/+ D's bf's mother - immediately my CRAYDAR was going off as she had physical manifestations of extreme anxiety (doubling over from apparent butterflies in her stomach in our front yard and going out to make sure she was okay, it became readily apparent), kept my eyes open for symptoms, didn't openly display enough symptoms to meet the criteria of BPD until 5 months later when she had a major emotional dysregulation episode against my D.  D & her bf are both parentified caretakers and are emotionally supporting each other.

#5 - ASPD-SB - sociopath variant according to psychologytoday.com - 15 years of LC at the time I realized he had an issue - didn't realize he had issues until his 2nd kill, even though he did exhibit symptoms to me (anger management issues towards me) at 11 years.


Summary:

Each presents differently, have different comorbid issues; however, once each individual's pattern is figured out, they are very predictable in their behavior patterns.

[TheRedLion]

How long didt it take before you saw their bad side?                                       

I am going to take this as two questions:

• 1) How long did it take before she started showing her bad side?
• 2) How long did it take for me to recognize it?

1) How long did it take before she started showing her bad side?


One of the things I've worked out in therapy is that she started showing her signs of dBPD far before she showed instances of the emotional manipulation in the devaluing stage. Within the first couple of dates, she overshared about her ex to a degree unimaginable, painting him out to be some horrible abusive monster. From that day forward, every conversation included some mention of her ex to the point where it felt like there were 3 people in our relationship. She was actively texting with other guys and lying to me about it (she even slept with one of them, granted we weren't exclusive, but she lied to me about it). She was incredibly open, honestly wayyy too open, about her past hookups, relationships, and sexual history. There was no reason for me to know EVERYTHING, yet it was like once she started, she couldn't stop.

I definitely experienced the lovebombing, and at the time I felt like the king of the world. She told me she felt 'safe' and 'comfortable' with me after just 2 weeks, and said "I love you" after just 1.5 months. Everything was so intense, from the sex to the words of affirmation with hidden lies omitted. She told me she had BPD after 1 month, but she never explained what it was. And the fool that I am, I didn't ever think to ask.

In therapy, I've realized that so many of these things were red flags that I should've realized. BPD doesn't just appear in the devaluing stage. BPD doesn't have "episodes"—it's a personality disorder that's present in the idealizing stage too. It's present at all times, but there are moments where the disordered thinking feels really good to us, and there are moments where it feels incredibly sh*tty.

2) How long did it take for me to recognize it?
I should've recognized it when she ghosted me for a full day and went out on a date with someone else (2.5 months in). I should've recognized it when she went on datings app (3 months in). I should've realized it when my self-esteem and mental health was so damaged that I felt like a shell of myself and started therapy. I should've realized it when she revealed all of the lies she told me, including the numerous other times she was on dating apps, the time she reached out to her ex and almost (?) met him, the time she slept with someone and lied to me about it, or lied about so much of her history/past relationship. But I didn't. I took it in stride. I accepted it. I appreciated her "honesty".

I overlooked so much for a long time (less time than others on this site, but still for a long *ss time). Eventually, she started devaluing me again and I started not accepting it or internalizing it. If she said something hurtful or compared me to someone, I'd tell her "I don't like that". She would respond with "you're just sensitive". And then she'd start a fight because she felt like she "couldn't say everything and anything around me".

I could tell those responses were unhealthy and confusing to me, so I started doing what I should've done 1.5 months into the relationship when she first told me she had BPD: I researched it. And I came across a great video about the BPD relationship cycle that I couldn't believe so accurately depicted what I had experienced (I don't know if I'm allowed to share the video link because of SEO google algorithms leading to this site, but if an admin sees this and I am, please let me know). After more and more research, I started to keep my guard up and prepared for the next cycle. And when the next cycle of devaluing hit, and it was far, far worse than any one prior, I ended it and have been in NC ever since (~7 months).

Pook's advice here is very valid:

Each presents differently, have different comorbid issues; however, once each individual's pattern is figured out, they are very predictable in their behavior patterns.

The one note I'd make is that some of us get so caught up in the pain of the devaluing phase, that we fail to realize the signs were there in the idealizing phase. The love-bombing that felt so good in the beginning should've been clear enough to realize that she wasn't a healthy partner and was engaging in manipulative tactics. My therapist has helped me see this clearly, and having started dating again, I've come across people who love-bombed me immediately and it really irked me. Instead of buying into it and placating that person, or getting excited that they are so into me, I stop myself and question: "why are they so into me? Do they even know anything about me?" and that helps me see more clearly.

So the answer to your question is the signs were apparent from the first weeks, but I didn't recognize them until the end. Hope this helps!

[kells76]

Hi bolling;

Good that you recognize that there may be a pattern to the relationships you choose. We can't change what we don't know  

Here's another way of looking at your question:

How long didt it take before you saw their bad side?                                        

What if the "good stuff" -- the love bombing, being painted white, being up on the pedestal, the honeymoon phase -- was also the "bad side"?

All the unhealthy behaviors are unhealthy, not just the ones that aren't fun for us. It's not like "as long as what she's doing feels good to me, it must be healthy". The "good times" are part of the disorder. So, in a sense, most persons who entered into a relationship with an untreated pwBPD were seeing "the bad side" right away... during the "good times".

It could be more helpful to think of it less as "the good stuff" and "the bad stuff" and see it all as one (poorly integrated) person. It was all her.

...

In regards to this question:

Is it normal to be relativelly stable for 1,5 years?                                      

Yes, I've heard a few examples here of a pwBPD functioning mostly OK for a while, but being "set off" by a high stress event or series of high stress events (natural disaster, death in the family, stressful parenting situation, job loss/change, move, etc). As BPD is a disorder of emotional regulation, it means that high stress times may highlight the disorder that's always been there.

...

As you reflect back on your relationships, do parts (or all) of them track with How a Borderline Relationship Evolves? What do you think?

kells76

[Augustine]

Is it normal to be relativelly stable for 1,5 years? How long didt it take before you saw their bad side?                                       

Yes, quite normal.

 Out of an 8-year relationship, the clinical behaviours didn’t manifest until the last 2-3 years, and then they progressed rapidly. In the last 2-years, she was almost completely unrecognizable.

I caught brief glimpses of her bad side when she was sub-clinical, but because the episodes were infrequent, they could easily be explained away as being attributable to other life stressors.  I didn’t place any weight on their occurrences.

Regarding her 2-year unraveling, it was stress induced.

We had moved from the west coast of Canada, to the east coast; went from city living, to rural living; and from condo-dwelling in the heart of a city, to a period property located rurally that needed renovation/restoration.

 Canada had introduced the Emergency Measures Act during our move as a result of the Trucker’s Protest in Ottawa, so life became pretty challenging, and the locals in our new location weren’t exactly giving us a standing ovation when we arrived, so the stress was phenomenal.

Even I was buckling under the pressure, and neither of us was going to be shortlisted for the best behaved human award anytime soon.

However, there was a notable difference between us, in that she truly lost most (if not all) of her contact with reality, and was in a state of unchecked emotional/behavioural free fall.  Behaviours that all of us here are all too familiar with.

However, it was only after our relationship ended did I finally connect all the dots.

I think Kells76’s input is of inestimable value: the illness was always present.

It’s only in hindsight that I can see all of the maladaptive thoughts and behaviours that took place over the course of those eight years.

[SaltyDawg]

I came across a great video about the BPD relationship cycle that I couldn't believe so accurately depicted what I had experienced (I don't know if I'm allowed to share the video link because of SEO google algorithms leading to this site, but if an admin sees this and I am, please let me know).

I'm interested in learning of this video.

[Pensive1]

I'll answer the questions in reverse order.

How long didt it take before you saw their bad side?

In my case, it was a 25 year relationship. My ex's BPD symptoms ("bad side") began to clearly manifest very early in the relationship - within a month. In part because of this, I left the relationship, but soon returned.

My mother had BPD, and I'd become aware that she had BPD by the time I became an adult. I thus should have immediately recognized it in my ex, but didn't. In my ex's case, I did quickly recognize that her resentment and view of herself as perpetually a victim was like my mother (and that's part of why I initially left). But there were differences - my mother often threatened suicide while my ex never did, etc. So I was in denial that my ex had BPD, until she moneybranched and left me, and my therapist pointed out the BPD. In retrospect, I can't believe I didn't recognize it, especially given the severity of it.

Is it normal to be relativelly stable for 1,5 years?

I think often there can be longish periods of relative stability. In my ex's case, it was a tumultuous and difficult relationship throughout. Throughout much of the 25 year relationship, she declared she was breaking up with me every couple weeks. However, there was still a certain type of stability. When her son became meth-addicted, suicidal, and homeless, the extreme stress led her to severely decompensate. The BPD symptoms became far, far worse and she monkeybranched and left.

One element of this was also that, in the midst of the chaos with her son, at a point when I was out of town, a guy with NPD began persuing her. There's a tendancy for people with BPD to be attracted to people with NPD (and vice versa). And for her,  jumping into a new, intense relationship with this guy allowed her to escape the pain of her son's situation.

[EyesUp]

My experience mirrors what others have said:

BPD behaviors were always there, what changed was the severity and my own ability to recognize and accept it - rather than attempt to justify or explain it.

I'd say the most prevalent behaviors have been hypersensitivity to criticism and yet also a sort of indifference to others.

The sensitivity to criticism borders on gaslighting, when no intended criticism was present. In some instances, it's more intuitive to simply acknowledge and apologize. In other instances, any effort to discuss or understand is perceived as fanning the flames.

The indifference to others could be as simple as ignoring that the shopping cart is blocking someone else, or it could be interrupting something to take a call that turns out to be from an ex - but not offering any comment or even an acknowledgement that the prior conversation was interrupted.

These dynamics get mixed in with what feels like a constant stream of micro-aggressions, which makes isolating and recognizing some patterns - in BPD or in your own response to BPD - that much more challenging.

In my case, all of this coincided with ongoing therapy that seemed to give my uBPDxw a forum to air her many grievances and victim narratives (and get attention and perhaps some validation), but rarely any sense of change...

[boundriesrus]

This is going to sound very familiar compared the other stories above. I have been coming around to the idea for the past 9 months or so that my wife is undiagnosed high functioning bpd. I completely missed all the signs, red flags and what not early on in the relationship. It has been almost 11 years since we first started dating and it's been 9 years since we got married. The relationship moved rather quickly, she told me she loved me, 2 months in...while black out drunk at my parents house for Fathers day that year, after having thrown up all over the floor from the lemonchello shots my mom was making, and I was cleaning her off in my parents shower from the puke, while she was trying to engaged in sex at this time, and I kept having to remind her, she's covered in vomit, and is in my parents shower getting clean off. The next morning she had no recollection of the events, and once I told her she was so ashamed she went out and bought my parents a new trash can, as she blew up the other one throwing up everything into it.

Tons of Lovebombing, always telling me the exact things I wanted to hear. Everything I wanted to do, activity wise and sexually, putting me son the pedastool type stuff. It was too good to be true. Lots of mirroring as well. Kinda scary how well these personality types are able to read you and come across as "nothing seemingly wrong" to the untrained eye. Think of it as watching a magician for the first time, it truly is magical how they do that stuff. But then you work backstage and you see the gimmick to the tricks. The next time you see it performed, you know exactly what is going on, and it's nothing magical anymore about what is going on. You see the manipulation for what it is... a trick. Except in the magicians case, that is their job and they are aware of what they are doing with a delivered purpose, except in this case, the magician doesn't see what they are doing as manipulations or tricks, they think what they are doing is truly magic, but sadly at the end of the day, its just a trick.

9 months of Dating, Got Engaged, Engaged for 9 months, married for 9 months and then started trying for kids. She was two years older than me and was terrified that she wasn't going to be able to bear children. She was really stressed out about that and that's when the first signs of emotion dis regulation started. She caught me at our Halloween party, sneaking a cig with a friend behind the garage after drinking a bunch that night. It was just 1. But the she pretended nothing was wrong for the rest of the night. Gave me the silent treatment the entire next morning. Then after I brought us breakfast in bed (which I did every weekend), she exploded out of nowhere on me, screaming, flailing her arms, crying...all about me having the one cigarette the previous night. A simple, "hey you told me you were quitting" type comment would have sufficed, or even better yet, Are you stressed about something". More importantly up to that point I was lead to believe that if I acted in anger and had explosive moments in our marriage, similar to how both are parents where while growing up, as well as her ex husband, that she would walk and not think twice. Then she looses it like that, and ignores that it ever happened, unless I bring it up to say I don't appreciate that, or I apologized for whatever she was screaming about.

But for me and my wife, it only ever happened during above average stressful times. After I decided to quit my previous company due to partners embezzling and being assholes (actually BPD and NPD/ASPD married couple), she started acting this way again and extremely entitled when I asked her to go back to work to help with bills, she refused, I asked her to stop spending money, she said she was going to continue to spend it like we were already getting out buyout money (guess what, we didn't;t and had to sue...now almost 2 years into it and still waiting for depositions and the rest of the evidence, been an absolute nightmare in court) and now having to tell my spouse that during our time of trying to have our child, she ended up splitting one night when I was having a panic attack about everything and didn't/couldn't have sex she started screaming and crying and ended up sexually assaulting me before I eventually pushed her off of me and I left the room. I don't think she remembers this event, but the thing is I did, and her sexually charged behavior only got more aggressive after that and it pushed me away and in the end gave me PTSD/Sexual Trauma.

For those that are reading this and want to avoid situations like everybody else has gone thru here, read up on all these examples, establish strong boundaries in the beginning, and if they are truly balanced individuals, they will respect those boundaries and even establish some of their own. That is the way a healthy relationship should be.

So Yeah, if you look at it in my timing sense, 9, 9, 9 months intervals of relation stages before the first real big outward expression came from (there were other instances I now look back on and realize I missed some other signs and expressions of dysregualtion, but I was trying to be understanding of her previous situation (first 2 weeks, dumped everything from her sexual assaults, to her abusive first marriage and what not, and honestly I felt sorry for her and wanted to try and give her an experience of something better. For a while it was, but always had this feeing of no matter what I seemed to do, she always wanted more, all the while while telling me this wasn't going on. It is all very confusing, and if you have ADHD like I do, it's easy to get gaslighted and confused. Hence why I am also in therapy for gaslighting trauma from previous biz partner. So yeah...nothing good comes from there disorders sadly, and is best to keep healthy distances in the future.

[Skip]

I am going to take this as two questions:

• 1) How long did it take before she started showing her bad side?
• 2) How long did it take for me to recognize it?

I think this is the crux of the matter. I might go on step further and say how long did it take for use to realize that the relatioonship had a serious ongoing problem?

[once removed]

disproportionate anger and general dysregulation were there from day one. it seemed like mood swings. shed lose her   and go off on me, yelling, shouting, saying nasty stuff. id give it back. when shed get back to baseline, she would fall all over herself apologizing and idealizing me, blaming herself. she had just stopped taking medication for bipolar when she met me, and at the time, i attributed it to that.

she pretty much moved herself in against my will for the first three months of our relationship, and i had a really hard time with that. i remember writing in my journal that this didnt feel like love, but that it was like we were crawling into each other - enmeshed was the word for it - and that i had no time or space to even process it all. it was within days that she told me she loved me. we were fooling around in the moment, and i remember hesitating (she noticed) and thinking "oh man, i cant NOT say it back"  

there was lovey honeymoon stuff, surely there had to be, but i mainly remember all the knock down, drag out, hours long fighting. it was obvious to me even then that it wasnt sustainable. somewhere in the third month was the first time i "tried"/threatened to break up with her (told her "its over" during a fight). i didnt want to, but it was bad enough that i felt like i was "supposed to".

she went back to her place, finally, but that never changed between us; we fought a lot, and we fought hard, and break up threats became something we both used all the time. we said and did things that were hard, obviously not impossible, to come back from, but i knew very quickly we were toxic; i told her as much. over the years, while our love definitely grew and matured, the relationship sort of played out with me withdrawing, and her clinging, and our battles over that. she didnt self harm, no big time substance abuse (some drug use), no eating disorder, and while she had poor impulse control that impacted our relationship and occasionally her life, it didnt rise to any consistent, severe, quality of life issue, so on my end, the hardest things for me to deal with were her anger/difficulty regulating her emotions, the clinging, the jealousy/accusations, and the snooping/invading my privacy. those were always present. we really clicked in powerful ways, i think we both did our best to be "good boyfriends and girlfriends" and tend to each others needs and ill never forget that love, but man, we both constantly pushed each others buttons at least as much.

[TheRedLion]

I'm interested in learning of this video.

Here's the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W50-F65tbBE

It's from the point of view of a non-BPD partner and the conversations that are mentioned, even down to the word choices, were a shock to me (they were so accurate to my experience). The video quality is meh, but it was my wake-up call

[Pook075]

In my case, I was married for 25 years and didn't see any real BPD signs for the first 20 years.  There were some red flags very early on (violence, black/white thinking, projecting, etc) but I was too young and dumb to recognize them.  We split up three times the first two years, and each time I fought like mad to get her back.  Looking back, I don't regret it for the kids sake.

By year five or six, I made a conscious decision not to argue anymore...it just wasn't worth it.  When she did things that drove me up a wall, I just bit my tongue and forgave her a few days later.  I realize now that it was a very unhealthy decision since my wife kept everything bottled up.  She became increasingly depressed and detached over the years...little by little...until the woman I married was gone completely.

We divorced a few days ago after an 18 month separation, and ironically we talk more now than we have at any point over the past 5-7 years.  But that's because we've both healed from the abusive cycles that we were stuck in because of a dysfunctional marriage.

So to answer your question directly- I was clueless my wife had BPD for 25 years, even though we have a BPD/bipolar daughter.  Looking back though, it was there from day one and I simply didn't realize what I was looking at.

[zondolit]

I've read that some people with PDs are able to keep it "contained" until they get a commitment from you. Once they think you are into the relationship far enough that  you won't leave them, they can show more of their full self. This was surely my experience. I resonate with the many comments that say the PD was always there. It was; I just didn't realize it. The charming, kind, intelligent, interesting person that most people think my stb ex-husband is is what I also experienced while dating. Once there was a marriage commitment, things changed. But at that point I was just so confused. . .and committed.

[Augustine]

Zondolit raises some points of interest regarding how they present themselves, socially.

Admittedly, the private/social self dichotomy applies to everyone, but not to such a colossally wide variance as in the case of BPD.

I think it certainly calls into question the anosognosia element, as the extreme switch in public to private selves implies a high degree of self-awareness; they understand that the behaviour of the private self is socially unacceptable.

Additionally, there’s the disjointed and often deeply paranoid thought processes.

It’s only in my post-relationship reevaluation that I can see the BPD thought processes at play.

 I’d allay her fears/worries when she’d present me with day-to-day interactions/scenarios that seemed implausible. Like her co-workers/boss deliberately conspiring against her, or deriving oblique interpretations from otherwise innocuous conversations.

I’d offer a benign reinterpretation of these events that would be equally as plausible, just to reassure her that she might have grasped the wrong end of the stick.

Sadly, in the last two years, the inversion in interpretation was 100% and even if things were clearly spelled out positively and unequivocally in black-and-white, anything passing through the BPD filter would deliver a negative output.

Returning to the social/private self, her interpersonal acuity was stood on its head, returning to normal, in the presence of the people in her immediate social circle. In these instances, there was no BPD filter at work, as she knew that it would raise more than few eyebrows.

It does give me much to reflect upon regarding the nature of this disorder, and the actual degree of self-awareness present.

In hindsight, it truly was like having a relationship with an apparition, or someone who never was (and could never be) truly present.

It’s all incredibly sad, really.

[SinisterComplex]

I've read that some people with PDs are able to keep it "contained" until they get a commitment from you. Once they think you are into the relationship far enough that  you won't leave them, they can show more of their full self. This was surely my experience. I resonate with the many comments that say the PD was always there. It was; I just didn't realize it. The charming, kind, intelligent, interesting person that most people think my stb ex-husband is is what I also experienced while dating. Once there was a marriage commitment, things changed. But at that point I was just so confused. . .and committed.

Can that happen...sure? However, do not be under the false pretense that PD sufferers have that much control over their disorder. In truth what it amounts to is that people with PD's can keep up a facade until triggered by something which they have no control over. If the right trigger hits them at the right moment their dysregulated emotional behaviors come out. However, the problem is many unsuspecting partners brush it off and sweep it under the rug and forget the blinking neon lights were right there from the beginning. It always takes two to tango so I would chalk it up as equal blame.

Cheers and Best Wishes!

-SC-

[jaded7]

Ive been in a relationship with two BPD’s during my life. The first in my early twenties showed symptoms after only two months, being verbally abusive, would flirt with others when i was with her, and going back and forth (hot/cold). The second one didnt show her true colours before 1,5 years had passed. Although i moved in to her place after 4 months, we were looking to buy a house after a year and planning to have a child. During her stable periods lasting about two months, she was kind, loving and empathic, and rearly verbally abusive. She was 40.  The one i dated in my early 20, showed much more aggressive bpd symptoms, then the one i dated in my late 30’s. Is it normal to be relativelly stable for 1,5 years? How long didt it take before you saw their bad side?                                       

I'll contribute here. I did not recognize the 'bad' side when it first showed up, it was only later when I started reading about BPD and meeting with a therapist (who called her behavior abusive) did I start to recognize things.

I'd say concerning behavior started in the the first few weeks of dating. On our second date I got kinda tipsy and made some passes at her that she shut down, which was fine and good. She said something about 'tomorrow night'. The next night she came to my place and texted me she was here, and I came down to go out to dinner with her. She was really off the whole night, short and disconnected and not pleasant to be around.  I remember thinking how strange it was, how uncomfortable it was, that this wasn't the person I had seen before. I remember thinking I don't think I want to go out with her again.

Our next date we planned to go to dinner. She came again to pick me up, and said 'can I come up up?'. We sat on the couch and she said to me "what are we doing here? Do you want to pursue a romantic relationship or not? Because I don't need to be traveling across the city for coffee dates, I have plenty of friends for coffee dates. And my life is busy" Note, we'd never been on a coffee date, nor did I say I wanted to go on a coffee date.

Turns out, I learned later she was mad at me for coming down to meet her in the car on the previous date because she wanted to have sex. She told me this. Which then led to the ultimatum on the next date.

She told me she loved me within a 6 weeks or so. I said nothing.....which then lead her to say "I'm not saying that to get you to say that".

In the first two months or so she invited me every other weekend for dinner at her place, stay over. I would buy the food, she would cook it. The first one went well, I had a very nice time and thanked her, of course. The second one went horribly. We had eaten and were sitting at the table chatting, and I got up to clear the plates and rinse them to put in the dishwasher. She got extremely panicked or upset when I was rinsing the dishes and snapped at me "what are you doing!!!" "stop that!" "don't do that!" I had no idea what she was referring to, I was just rinsing dishes and trying to help. Then "oh my god, just put the dishes back on the table!!". So I did, very confused. We sat a chatted a little more and I asked her if she'd like to go sit on the couch and listen to music. She stood up, very angry, and angrily grabbed the dishes to take them to the sink. Started angrily rinsing the dishes. I asked if I could help, she said something like "some help you are!". I reminded her that I tried to do the dishes, she got more angry and said "do you think I like to wake up to dirty dishes?!". I said no, I don't think that. Then she said "and WHO PUTS DIRTY DISHES BACK ON THE TABlE!". I remind her that she told me to put them back on the table.

These were all in the first few weeks of dating. I'd say by the 5th month the regular criticism had started.

[PhoenixKnight]

I first noticed something was off with my ex on the first date. Prior to that we had been friends for about 3 months, and she told me how awful and abusive her ex partners all were. I felt so sorry for her.

on our first date she got very drunk. We ended up meeting up with her friends and family, and her cousin got into a large-scale argument with her then-partner. My ex got very involved in this when protecting her cousin, and I felt a knot in my stomach. the following morning she never mentioned it and just spoke about it being 'a good night'.

After that I remember going to her house and having a bottle of wine. She was rolling round all over the floor singing to Whitney Houston. It was weird. Then she started to make passive aggressive comments because I wasn't as drunk as her (boring etc). Knot returned. The first big one was when we were watching TV on new years eve. I was literally sat next to her on the couch but happened to have my arms folded (that's how I sit). She then turns to me and says 'IF YOU DON'T WANT TO BE HERE, WHY DON'T YOU JUST F*CK OFF'. I was flabbergasted. She then went and sat on the other couch, before storming upstairs on her own 5 minutes later. That was about 3 months in. She split up with me the next day, but came back 2 days later apologising.

I could list any number of blow ups and dis-regulations over the coming years, and the knot in my stomach only grew and grew. Then she'd be amazing for a couple of weeks and I'd fall in love with her all over again. It didn't take much for her to turn again though. I became so sensitive to everything I said, the way I moved. Unless my body language was completely warm and welcoming, she would question why I was in a mood (9 times out of 10 there was absolutely nothing wrong).

To be fair to her, the explosive reactions became less frequent, but her overall depression and lack of passion for life deteriorated. She blamed our relationship on on her mood. Whilst being heart-broken at another discard is really tough, I do not miss walking on eggshells constantly, tiptoeing round, not knowing who I was coming home to each night.

[jaded7]

I first noticed something was off with my ex on the first date. Prior to that we had been friends for about 3 months, and she told me how awful and abusive her ex partners all were. I felt so sorry for her.

I forgot this one. Within the first month or so. My ex requested we go to a quiet place, she had something really important to tell me. There she told me she was in abusive relationship with her ex-husband. She went over the cycle of abuse, the Duluth Model, etc. Of course
I was a good listener, very loving, and really felt bad for her. I have never known anyone from an abusive relationship, and I really felt
for her.

Now, during our 2 year relationship she increasingly made me the emotional validator for her re: her ex, whom she referred to
with a derogatory name, who she lied to repeatedly (I witnessed it), to whom she told her son to lie to (she told me about it), and who
she told her son "was a bad person, you might as well know this now".

She took to forwarding me his texts to her, his emails to her. So I had about a year and a half of seeing his communications
with her, with him not knowing that I was reading them. Here's the thing, I never once detected an abusive person in those communications.
Not once. I detected someone who was frustrated with her and her lack of communication (something I experienced many, many times), someone who was communicating with a very level tone and very clear words. Nothing abusive, at all. And I know she lied to him, I know she
told her son to lie to him, I know that she ignored his texts for days and days. I've watched her keep her son from his grandmother (her ex's Mom) who lived less than a mile from her, while her ex lived 3.5 hours away. I watched her ignore her MILs texts to bring birthday presents over. In 9 years, she never once let her exMIL come to see her grandson.


And they didn't use My Family Wizard. Every abusive divorce I've ever seen the court has required the couple to use My Family Wizard in order
to protect the woman from the man's threats and harsh words.

And, of course I now know that my ex IS abusive, provably verbally abusive (you can see the names she called me elsewhere here, the yelling an putdowns, etc).

I think her having the special meeting with me in the beginning was to get the story of victimhood out there early, so I felt bad for her. Which I did.

[Clearmind]

First time I met him. It was love bombing from us both.  Over the top affection to get the upper hand.

[boundriesrus]

I think her having the special meeting with me in the beginning was to get the story of victimhood out there early, so I felt bad for her. Which I did.

Right there with you buddy. My Wife did the same thing in the first week of dating. Told me all the horrible things that had happened to her throughout college and her first marriage. Sexual assaults (multiple from different men) her sexual promiscuity, her ex being physically and emotionally abusive. I honestly felt bad for her and wanted to give her something better. But the more I gave, the more she took, and when I finally started saying no to things, I saw the anger monster arise, or her doubling down on her wants and needs. Major issues with boundaries...

I keep telling my therapist he needs to do a school sponsor program to go around and teach a red flags seminar to graduating high school students and college students discussing the types of issues and personality disordered people out in the world they will more than likely come across and how to protect yourself from getting caught into the their traps.

The oversharing thing is something I will definetly carry over with me whenever I decide to put myself back out there.

[jaded7]

I honestly felt bad for her and wanted to give her something better. But the more I gave, the more she took, and when I finally started saying no to things, I saw the anger monster arise, or her doubling down on her wants and needs. Major issues with boundaries...

Yes, I now know that being the 'victim', the whole narrative, is a part of certain cluster b presentations. Like you, I felt really bad for
her and wanted to 'prove' to her that men can be kind, good listeners, thoughtful.

And like you, the relationship ultimately became about what she 'needed'. She in fact said the words "I need you to _____", "I need _____" many many times, invariably I was confused as to what she was talking about. I need you to prioritize our relationship.....???? She was the most important thing to me in the world, I would
answer every call, respond to every text, listen to her talk for hours, support her, get a fill-in at my business to help her with something, leave my phone on at night in case she had an emergency. I honestly have no idea what she was talking about.

The word 'no' completely set her off.

~No to sex, said kindly and gently because I needed to get up at 5:20am? Explosion, anger.

~No to going on a trip that I couldn't arrange coverage for at my business for? Explosion, anger, name-calling, put downs for 3 hours. I even suggested some shorter trips that we could do "don't you dare suggest an alternative!!"

~No to coming over to my place to 'connect' after huge abuse the week before- but repeated assurance that I would call her when I was done' with my work at my business that night- resulted in multiple, immediate, dismissals saying I'll just come find you, multiple 'no, don't just come find me. I'll call you when I'm done'. She then showed up anyway, and berated me until 3 am. Blaming me for 'taking her to a brewpub when I knew she hated brewpubs' that she knew I was going to (I told her 3x on the call that day, I did this every other week with my clients) AND when when she just showed up she said that "she was going to the brewpub but then saw the lights were on in my business". Then later, "if you had told me you were going to the brewpub then none of this would have happened" (her berating and yelling and belittling me until 3am).

My gosh, the crazy making. All because I said no. And if you notice, the ignoring of my wishes, my very clear words, my boundaries,
my 'no's got somehow twisted into me hurting her, making her the victim of me. When she's the one who yelled, called me names,
mocked and belittled me, stomped around the room and pointed her finger in my face.

[boundriesrus]

It is always a set of rules for YOU to follow....and not THEM...

Im thinking of the title "Double Standards" for the title of my life story in regards to my marriage thus far.

My wife's explosive anger is thankfully moreso on the lines of crying, instead of raging. Don't get me wrong, Ive been raged at as well. But the simple "No" and establishing a boundary results in crying/sobbing and that can go from 0-100 at the drop of a hat, then from 100-0 just as fast. I seriously thought I was loosing my mind when I saw her switch back and forth in a single sentence one time while out to dinner. I seriously am worried about her mental health and just want her to get the proper help needed to she can continue to be a parent in our daughters life, and hopefully be able to get to a better place mentally for her next relationship.

[ENY BOY]

Took mine 3 days. Literally. You can read my original post. But the relationship continued for 10 years unfortunately. After she used me up and got everythinh financially out of me that there was, I was discarded without explanation or closure. We were living together and engaged. Of course, as it often is, when you are discarded by a BPD (or a non BPD), the next target is lined up. 3 days. Crazy.

[ChooseHappiness]

There were little flags here and there at the beginning, but nothing that couldn't be explained away as a personality tic. It only really started to show after the birth of our first child around 10 years into the relationship, when she couldn't handle the stress of parenting. I initially thought it was postpartum and took over pretty much every part of parenting. At which point she seemed fine again, although a little off. She's always been extremely high-functioning and masks very well.

It got worse with the birth of our second child, and I was quickly the sole caregiver for both our children. Everyone in our life was highly aware of the fact that she had ceased to be a functional parent. She was still a relatively good partner most of the time, but her neediness began to increase, as did her depressive periods. So then I thought it was depression or anxiety, etc. I'm a problem-solver by nature, so I kept trying to fix the problem, but it became clear there was no solution. Even if I fixed one thing, she shifted to some other area of her life where she was a victim, etc.

When the pandemic hit, she spiralled completely out of control. Began seeing other people to reclaim her sexual identity, began using tons of drugs and alcohol, got fired from her job, blew up every friendship she had, became completely estranged from her family... I'm sure you know the routine.

It was at this point that I knew something was seriously wrong. We began living in separate parts of the home and I solo parented for three years. I wanted out but a divorce lawyer had told me I would never get sole custody in our region, so I stayed for the kids. I couldn't in good conscience let them be with her without me intervening. She is often emotionally abusive to them and has on occasion been physically abusive, so they need someone to intervene.

Unfortunately for the children, we are now getting divorced and she is experiencing intense splitting to the point she believes I have been the negligent parent and she is the ethical one. I was initially bewildered by this to the point I began to distrust my own sense of reality. But a number of people pointed me to the BPD diagnosis, where my last twenty years finally made sense to me. It's a brutal experience and I worry about the children, but at least I understand what is happening now.

So in my case it took a long time to really show itself -- it was more a slow unveiling than a sudden reveal and it seems to be related to stress issues more than anything else. Every day I'm grateful that I don't see the world like she does because it must be terrifying chaos.