Divorce coming back as a topic my uBPD wife after a long good phase

[olafinski]

Hi to all,
posting after quite a while because luckily my uBPD wife, now close to 50, went through a really good phase without any major incidents for almost 2 years. There were just a couple of smaller tantrums that I managed quite easily using common tools.

The major issue we have is that we live in a sexless marriage triggered by, it seems, 3 separate issues. 1st and probably most important is that I always had problems with erection which were probably a result of my long-time undiagnosed diabetes type 1 which was diagnosed when I was 35 (16 years ago).
2nd is that as a type I was never a guy that can "do it with anyone anytime anywhere", but needed some kind of a romantic setup and kind of a safe emotional situation where there would be no fear of rejection, probably a psychological issue that I have. I am an over-thinker, and not really relaxed in sex, and when I get distracted I lose erection, which in combination with problem no 1 creates situations in which my partner may feel that she is the problem.

3rd issue, specific for this relationship, is that my wife had showed a lot of anger because of her uBPD and for a long time I did not know how to feel about that, so it made me afraid of her and put me in a state of walking on eggshells all of the time, which basically means that I have lost all of my male spontaneity and charm in contact with her, afraid of her reaction.

The thing is that we are otherwise really incredibly compatible and have a good effect on each other, and also share incredible love and devotion to our son, now 13 yo, who is everything to us.

At a lot of moments I told her that I would seek therapy to help me with my issues, but she would always stop me saying that I don't need it, probably afraid that I would talk about our relationship and her outbursts.

Because of this and because I am really busy handling my company, cooking and handling the school (it has all come on my back), the problem is always pushed under the rug unresolved.

Now after a long period of her being OK, and things in life starting to be normal, kid bigger and more and more time for the two of us coming soon our way (still not there...), I thought that we will be able to restore intimacy and become closer in that respect.

But in last two weeks she saw me twice pleasuring myself and reacted hurt, and after that told me that she wants a divorce because "I locked her in our marriage" and that she wants her life back and for me to move out.

It was not an incident, she told it quite calm and I think that it was not from the perspective of BPD. Off course, you can never be sure.

She is off course right, this is not the life as it should be, but I can not freely express the real reason I am unable to approach her, because any mention of her being guilty for anything starts triggering her BPD which obviously has not disappeared but is just weaker and better controlled (also because of me following the recommended behaviour).

As our son is just entering adolescence and is in a really really sensitive period, where a lot in life is defined, I am really afraid that pursuing her express desire to divorce would be a big mistake for everyone included. I don't feel safe letting our little one live with her alone during adolescence, as I see some traits of his mothers psychology in her, which I am trying to better by spending a lot of time with him and being there for him, and it seems to work as he is growing into a self-confident young man, though a bit stubborn, too sensitive and a bit immature for his age.

I think that she will also later on think of this as a mistake because she is not aware of how much time we spend together and how much our lives are interconnected. She does not have anyone else close except her parents which are quite old now and also with some major psychological issues (her mother is a narcissist that has killed every bit of self-confidence in her).

Does anyone have experience with a situation like this, when a partner that is in a good phase start "thinking about herself" and wants a divorce, and you are not sure it this is her or her BPD speaking?

I am lost, I must admit. I really think that right now this would be a big mistake, and even if we don't manage to work it out now when we start getting more time for ourselves, that we should wait for at least 2-3 years until our little one passes through this first ugly stage of puberty when big decisions about his life are made (which high school etc).

There is in theory a possibility that we could divorce and I could find a place close to her (she does not mind) and that our little one could have "two homes" (she does not mind, says that I will be able to be with him as much as I want), and that it might work even better because at least we would not fight. But I am afraid that she would still have incidents but there I would not be there to navigate them and they would be directed upon our son who is not mature enough to handle them... I think that might create big problems later on.

Please help, and advice is really appreciated.

Thx

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[HurtAndTired]

Hi Olafinski,

I have read back through your posts over the years and several things stand out to me. Please correct me if I am wrong on any of these things.

• Your wife has been making very regular divorce threats for many years and has never followed through
• You decided long ago that the best path forward was to "not poke the bear" and basically appease your wife to reduce BPD incidents and maintain peace in the home
• Your wife is not empathetic towards your medical conditions or psychological/emotional state and needs
• Your wife does not believe in psychology
• You have not done any work around establishing boundaries about what is acceptable behavior to you or consequences that your wife will experience if she crosses those boundaries
• You have done some individual therapy, but no couples counseling
• You are the main breadwinner in the family and your wife would be financially hurt by a divorce

I have a situation that is similar to yours in some ways and different in others. My wife is dBPD, but does not accept the diagnosis. Like yours, she does not believe in psychology. I tried to appease my wife for years to reduce her outbursts but had very limited success. To complicate things, my wife is not high functioning and sometimes gets physically abusive towards me when she is dysregulated. This puts me and our 2-year-old in physical, psychological, and emotional danger. My wife also makes frequent divorce threats but does not follow through. We would both be financially devastated by a divorce. I call her threats "divorce fantasies" because they are just that. It is her imagining a perfect world without me where everything is great. The reality is that she would be barely scraping by and living in a crappy apartment after we lost the house in a divorce.

About nine months ago I read the book "Stop Caretaking the Borderline or Narcissist: How to End the Drama and Get On with Life" by Margalis Fjelstad. It was a life-changing book for me. I realized that my wife was never going to get better while I was caretaking/capitulating/enabling her BPD behavior. I created and enforced strong boundaries for the first time in our 12 years together to end her abusive behavior. It has been a rough ride since then, but she is finally having to deal with her negative emotions because I no longer allow her to project them onto me. By refusing to be her caretaker, I not only have been able to remove myself from abusive behavior, but have put her in a position where she has to be responsible for her own behavior.

It sounds like you might be in a caretaking position yourself if I am reading your prior posts correctly. Have you thought about boundaries to protect yourself and your son? Are you currently in therapy? If so, have you brought up boundaries with your therapist? If you are in therapy, does your therapist specialize in BPD or other cluster B personality disorders and are they aware of your wife's condition? What makes you think that this divorce threat will turn out any different than the prior ones?

I will wait for your responses and get back to you. Until then, hang in there. I know it's tough, but you have been through this before and have come out the other side. You can't let your wife's moods/episodes dictate the quality of your life. Try to take care of yourself in the meantime. You can't be there for your son if you aren't taking care of. yourself first.

HurtAndTired

[olafinski]

HurtAndTired,
you got it mostly right but caretaking is not 100% correct.Its somewhat more complicated and not B/W because my wife has an OK salary, is from a well-standing family that live in a house where she could basically return tomorrow (if she really wanted and if they would not tell her that she is crazy cause they adore me), and can take really good care for herself.
On the other side I am a creative earning x5 so yes a main breadwinner but only in a way of providing a better lifestyle for all of us. Also because I am what I am, she is in many ways my anchor and lighthouse cause I tend to overthink and enter timewasting projects that never see the light of day and before her I lived in a constant state of being near mania, working too much.
So we are a good match and if it was not for her episodes and the fact that we lost our intimacy I would say we are a perfect couple.

Now some half hour ago when our son went out to play we discussed the situation, her wanting me to love out, and she told me that she never really loved me, ever, with that cold look in her eyes.

I know for sure that we can not divorce, at least not now, in this stage of our sons life, and I am not sure how to prevent that.

Curently my plan is to play along and buy time.

[olafinski]

Sorry a typo near the end, “to move out” and not “to love out” obviously :?

[EyesUp]

Hi Olaf,

It sounds like you've developed and applied some skills in order to get through the past year or two, and your W may have been triggered by what she witnessed.  Is that fair?

In this case, consider how that scenario might play out if you and your wife had a different dynamic.  If she discovered you in the act, she might smile and say "can I give you hand with that?"

However, in the context of your specific history, she likely processed your solo act as a rejection. 

From my distant vantage point, the questions are, was it just perceived as a rejection, was it an actual rejection, and/or does she still have some desire for intimacy that's not being met - which makes the rejection (real or perceived) more acute?

If any of this rings true, is there a chance to repair?

If I read correctly, you recognize that intimacy is missing in the relationship and might be willing to do something about it - but you haven't found a safe way to proceed with or without communicating with your W.  Is that fair?

Does anyone have experience with a situation like this, when a partner that is in a good phase start "thinking about herself" and wants a divorce, and you are not sure it this is her or her BPD speaking?


If anything I suggested above rings true, I wonder if there's a way to kill two or more birds with one stone by attempting to reintroduce intimacy to the relationship?

Not easy for you, I understand.  At a minimum, you could start with a pill... have you tried this in the past?   From what I've read, a significant percentage of men around our age (I'm just slightly older) are actively accepting this form of help.


I am lost, I must admit. I really think that right now this would be a big mistake, and even if we don't manage to work it out now when we start getting more time for ourselves, that we should wait for at least 2-3 years until our little one passes through this first ugly stage of puberty when big decisions about his life are made (which high school etc).

I understand how overwhelming it can be to contemplate this change.

In my case, it seemed to be impossible - until it became necessary.  Thinking back, objectively,  only thing that changed was my perception - as well as my uBPDxw's.

You and your W share a child and it sounds like you also share positive and complimentary attributes. Breaking that bond will not be easy. However, it also sounds like you've started to consider how it might work. My suggestion it to continue to actively brainstorm with yourself - or here - or with a T - and continue to read (the Caretaking book was helpful to me, too).  The key, I think, is to not get stuck in passivity or avoidance either way:  Either work to preserve the marriage, or explore how to change the marriage.

One thing that bought time in my marriage - when I woke up to my uBPDxw's frequent threats to D (which I previously viewed as a sort of fantasy and emotional attack rather than a true threat), I introduced a boundary:  If you make that threat even one more time, then I will take you at your word, and we will D.  Either we're working on our relationship, or we're not.  It's as simple as that.  Sure enough, I didn't hear any threats again for a few years...

Of course everyone is different and ymmv... 

[olafinski]

EyesUp, thanks for your support! Means a lot.
About our intimacy - problem is most certainly on my side but I think it is solveable if we would be able to work it out together with an expert in family therapy. The problem is that this is never going to happen.
As for the D, I think that I must do whatever I can to avoid it happening. First and foremost I am afraid to leave our son alone with her for a longer period where her episodes might occur without me being there. Second, she would later feel sorry but would not admit it (she is like that. when she cuts someone out thats is a complete cut).

[HurtAndTired]

Hi Olaf,

Thank you for the clarifications. Just a little bit about my situation that might resonate with you. I have also struggled with intimacy but for slightly different reasons. My ED has been caused by a non-cancerous tumor on my pituitary gland that throws all of my hormones off balance, including my testosterone. Under the care of a really good endocrinologist, I am back to being hormonally balanced. All of the gear works as advertised thanks to TRT (and occasionally a little pill), but like you, I need to have emotional intimacy to want to be intimate in a physical way with my wife. With her rages and abuse, I don't feel very safe around her when she is dysregulated...let alone in the mood.  I also still have performance anxiety due to her taking physical failures due to medical issues personally. She doesn't understand that her being nasty about ED only made the problem worse.

This is something that we are working on in couples therapy, but it comes down to this. I will not have sex with her if she has:

• Been drinking
• Is dysregulated
• Has been nasty to me in the day leading up to a possible intimate moment

With BPD, I can only police my side of the street. In that regard, I have made a commitment to try to do what I can to increase intimacy from my end. This means that even though I don't emotionally trust my wife, I understand that she cannot offer me the type of romance/cuddly encouragement that I need to feel safe. If she has at least been positive/neutral toward me during the day...and it's been awhile, or I'm feeling frisky, I am taking the responsibility to initiate intimacy with her. Sometimes I get shot down, but no biggie. Other times things don't work as well as I would like them to (performance anxiety) but there are other ways to make sure that she has a positive experience. I always let her know that I am much better now that I am being treated for my medical issues, but that I am in my 40s and cannot be expected to be like 20-something in the sack.

Like you, I got in trouble for a solo act...hey we are all human and have needs. I know that she was taking care of her own business as well but don't care and don't feel the need to search her browser history in some type of witch hunt. As a part of my boundaries, access to my electronics are now completely off the table for her. We are both adults and deserve some modicum of privacy. However, I also see that I was seeking a substitution for intimacy that I rightly should have been having with my wife. That's on me and I take ownership of it. Not that having an occasional solo act should be a crime, but it shouldn't be the only thing that you are doing.

As for the divorce threats, much like EyesUp said I have put a stop to them. Just a few weeks ago my wife was back at the divorce talk for the umpteenth million time and I lost it. I told her flat out "If you want a divorce, get an attorney and file papers. That's not what I want, but if you file papers I will get my own attorney and from that point on we will only communicate to each other through our attorneys. I will not ever talk to you about this again." That shut her down and I haven't heard her bring it up again since. If she ever does, I will repeat that statement. If she files, she files. However, her long track record of using divorce threats but never following through show that she is using it as emotional manipulation. That trick no longer works. I suspect that your wife is also manipulating you based on her track record, but that is your call to make. I can only share what worked for me.

Finally, the whole "I never loved you" thing is a feature of BPD splitting. She means it in the moment because she is split on you. When the split is reversed, it will no longer be true. It's all a "normal" part of the BPD world.

HurtAndTired