Sick of getting treated like I am the problem

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

It's been a while since I posted. My wife is an undiagnosed BPD sufferer. She is also a heavy drinker and gets drunk on almost a daily basis. On the times where she isn't drunk, she can be a rather pleasant person. I'm sure many of you can see where I'm going from.

I can't seem to convince her to get sober for herself or for our family, and it doesn't work just to tone it down. She keeps bringing things up from the beginning of our marriage 14 years ago and even our 8-year-old son said she needs to stop bringing it up.

I want to divorce her because I don't see things getting any better, but I don't know if I have the intestinal fortitude to do so considering she is so strong-willed and so vile, and she also has no job and has shown very little ability to get and keep one for longer than a month. Lately that would be stretching it. I also don't want to deal with shared custody or child support but that's a secondary concern because things have just gotten so bad.

For example, she insults me on almost a daily basis, saying I'm fat or I'm gross, acting like she's doing me a huge favor by having sex with me and making me feel guilty for wanting that. I know this provides a horrible example to our kids of how spouses should act towards each other. On the other hand, I try to treat her as decently as possible, even though quite frankly she doesn't deserve it.

Can anyone offer any advice?

[guitarguy09]

It's been a while since I posted. My wife is an undiagnosed BPD sufferer. She is also a heavy drinker and gets drunk on almost a daily basis. On the times where she isn't drunk, she can be a rather pleasant person. I'm sure many of you can see where I'm going from.

I can't seem to convince her to get sober for herself or for our family, and it doesn't work just to tone it down. She keeps bringing things up from the beginning of our marriage 14 years ago and even our 8-year-old son said she needs to stop bringing it up.

I want to divorce her because I don't see things getting any better, but I don't know if I have the intestinal fortitude to do so considering she is so strong-willed and so vile, and she also has no job and has shown very little ability to get and keep one for longer than a month. Lately that would be stretching it. I also don't want to deal with shared custody or child support but that's a secondary concern because things have just gotten so bad.

For example, she insults me on almost a daily basis, saying I'm fat or I'm gross, acting like she's doing me a huge favor by having sex with me and making me feel guilty for wanting that. I know this provides a horrible example to our kids of how spouses should act towards each other. On the other hand, I try to treat her as decently as possible, even though quite frankly she doesn't deserve it.

Can anyone offer any advice?

[Lady Threshold]

I don't know if I have advice because I'm going through a similar situation and won't leave right now either. The heavy substance use and inability to hold down a job I know well. My SO does little more than play video games, surf the net and act like a teenager. She hasn't held down a an actual job in years and if she tries she either breaks down on the job or rage quits.

I think many of us who have SOs with BPD keep hoping they will get better but most times they don't because either they believe they can't or they fear the responsibility that comes with getting better and well, taking on responsibility. She has no right to insult you the way she does and I hope she is treating your son well and not doing the same to him.

Please do your best to take care of  yourself and your son and know you are not the awful person she tells you that you are. People with BPD often tear others down and when they are your SO they have so many little details of your life and they know all your fears so it's easy for them to do so. I'm sorry you are going through this. I'm sorry any of us are.

[kells76]

Hi guitarguy09 and welcome back 

I checked out some of your earlier posts to get a feel for the history. Correct me if I got this wrong -- you have two boys, and your W started "problem drinking" maybe ~5 years ago?

Does your W acknowledge that she has a problem with drinking?

Does anyone else besides you and the kids know about her drinking issues?

Have you ever gone to any Alanon groups?

Like Lady Threshold mentioned, taking care of yourself can be your #1 priority, because if you aren't healthy and grounded, you won't be in a good place to help your kids or to see clearly the paths forward for your relationship (could be divorce, could be staying together, could be something else -- hard to say at this point).

What kinds of things are you doing to stay grounded and centered right now? Keeping up on a hobby or interest? Going to counseling? Volunteering at the kids' school? It sounds trite, like "why would I work on the garden when the house is burning down", but we need to curate lives that aren't 100% focused on the drama that BPD brings. It models for you sons that you don't have to live a life totally focused on someone else's disorder.

...

Drilling down into some of the details you shared, to see what options might be there:

For example, she insults me on almost a daily basis, saying I'm fat or I'm gross, acting like she's doing me a huge favor by having sex with me and making me feel guilty for wanting that. I know this provides a horrible example to our kids of how spouses should act towards each other. On the other hand, I try to treat her as decently as possible, even though quite frankly she doesn't deserve it.

Are the insults in person, or over text, phone, social media...?

What do you usually do when she starts saying those things?

[guitarguy09]

@Lady Threshold - Yes, it sounds very similar! Mine spends all day watching and singing along with music videos, and complains that video games are a waste of time even though she wastes all of hers away. Rage quitting a job - sounds familiar! She had a childcare job which lasted for a month and she complained that she was getting left out by her coworkers and she wasn't part of the clique. Then she complained that I wasn't doing enough at home to make up for her being at work. Ironic! Considering I make a good paycheck, we're not rich but at least average for a US family.

I notice that I still try to be kind and do nice things for her, so I do still care for her, but that is decreasing over time. For example, the other day when she got a new phone, because she lost the old one (God knows where that went but that's another story), I put on a screen protector but it wasn't perfectly lined up. It was good enough though and she was happy with it, so I just left it as is. She abuses her phones to no end anyway. This time I only paid $150 for her phone versus $450 last time, since she doesn't appreciate what she has. Like you said, I'm holding out hope that she will decide to be better and the spouse I thought I married in the beginning.

I forgot to mention I have another son who is 12. He gets so annoyed at her singing and has no time for her self pity.

[guitarguy09]

@Kells76 - Exactly, 2019 was the start of her drinking problem. Basically every body on both sides of the family know about it. I've tried Alanon, she's tried AA very unsuccessfully, she's even gone to a rehab once for 5 days and that clearly wasn't doing anything so thank God I had them send her home otherwise we would have an even worse bill. She's also gotten a couple prescriptions of Benzos from the ER to ease off the alcohol, which worked only for a short time, but I told her it's too expensive to do anymore since it doesn't work.

She acknowledges she has a problem with drinking, but clearly just existing is satisfactory for her.

I feel pretty happy with my life and my boys, I play golf sometimes, video games, sports with the kids, and enjoy my work for the most part. I do volunteer when I can at their school, and it's nice to see other sane parents and see how normal life should be.

We've both agreed that divorce would be the best because she clearly still holds a grudge against my family for stuff that happened towards the beginning of our engagement. She thinks I should have stood up to my family over her ridiculous behavior. Just another thing we can't talk about. Like money.

As far as the insults, she insults me via text or in person. Today she said as she has before that the only reason she stays is for the health insurance (eye roll).

[ChooseHappiness]

I'm holding out hope that she will decide to be better and the spouse I thought I married in the beginning.

I think many of us wind up here because we held out hope for so long. And perhaps because we don't have adequate boundaries. One of the books I read on BPD said that people with strong boundaries don't usually stick around long enough in a BPD relationship to get enmeshed. Those of us who are strong caretakers and fixers are the ones that usually wind up trapped and hoping for change that will never come.

Do you really think she will become the person she once was? What would it take for that to happen? And how likely is it?

I forgot to mention I have another son who is 12. He gets so annoyed at her singing and has no time for her self pity.

How does parenting time typically work in a divorce in your region? In my region (Canada), it's typically a 50/50 split between parents. Around age 12 and up, though, the courts begin to recognize the wishes of the child. So a court may allow a child 12 or older to remain with one parent but not another if that is their wish. Or majority time with one parent, etc.

From the sounds of your situation, divorce may be complicated. If she's not working much and you are, you may be responsible for high child support costs, as well as spousal support. That may be different if you can demonstrate that she has proven herself to be unwilling to work (vs. voluntarily staying at home raise the kids, etc.). But I would consult a lawyer about that.

[guitarguy09]

@ChooseHappiness - That makes sense. I don't have good boundaries or at least didn't when we started dating. I'd say it's very unlikely that she would become anything like what I want at this point.

I think since she has no job, the judge would at least grant me half custody. But I would probably be on the hook to her for payments. She's talked about just leaving and giving me full custody but I don't know whether she would actually do that. I haven't consulted a lawyer yet but I'm getting close to that point. I would almost have to have her kicked out, but again, where would she go.

[livednlearned]

It might be time to focus less on her behaviors and more about what you want your kids to take away from these years left under your roof.

It's easy to become weak leaders in these families. No one wants chronic conflict and many of us do what we can to keep the peace. Except for kids, what they absorb is how to accommodate bullies and put their needs second to what someone abusive wants. These dynamics can play out in friendships and romantic partnerships later. 

Substance abuse and BPD is not a problem you can fix because partner dynamics tend to be part of what fuels the problem. Just a hint of intimacy can be very frightening for someone with a poorly defined sense of self. The pressure to be vulnerable and reveal intimate parts of herself probably feel foreign and unsafe. 

Most of us who gravitate and stay in these relationships tend to be following a script that we then pass on to our kids.

Even if you aren't in a position to leave, there are small things you can start doing to introduce healthy behaviors and model them for your kids.

If nothing else, it can give you a sense of how hard it is to make meaningful change, and why it's not easy for someone with a severe mental illness and addiction to give up destructive behaviors, even for a loved one.

Start small. "Can ____ do this for herself?" If the answer is yes, think twice about whether to do it for her, especially if she hasn't asked you to.

A lot of the work is about clawing back the bits and pieces of self-respect that have been torn away over the years.

[ForeverDad]

I think since she has no job, the judge would at least grant me half custody.

Don't assume that.  This is where legal consultations or interviews are essential to help you devise practical strategies more likely to succeed.  You assume logic and everyday common sense would carry the day in family court but in reality it is a mass of laws, prior court decisions, court policies, procedures, etc.

She's talked about just leaving and giving me full custody but I don't know whether she would actually do that. I haven't consulted a lawyer yet but I'm getting close to that point. I would almost have to have her kicked out, but again, where would she go.

Your spouse is an adult just as you are an adult.  How she lives her own life is truly her decision.  That is what divorce does.  However... whatever she chooses to do with her life, your responsibility is primarily for yourself as a father, they're just children needing proper examples and your better parenting by example is that important.

[ChooseHappiness]

I think since she has no job, the judge would at least grant me half custody. But I would probably be on the hook to her for payments. She's talked about just leaving and giving me full custody but I don't know whether she would actually do that. I haven't consulted a lawyer yet but I'm getting close to that point. I would almost have to have her kicked out, but again, where would she go.

I agree with ForeverDad that you can't assume anything. The courts will follow whatever the standard rule is in your area, and the personal circumstances of each of you will likely not affect that. Talk to a lawyer.

I would almost have to have her kicked out, but again, where would she go.

If the relationship is at an end, then it's not your responsibility to figure out where she goes. That's on her as an adult. Your role is to be a caregiver for your kids and yourself, not her.

[livednlearned]

Have you read Bill Eddy's Splitting? That's pretty much required reading for any of us here who had to navigate family courts with a disordered spouse.

[guitarguy09]

Livednlearned: I've started to read Splitting. It's a good one. I know from all my experiences that I won't be giving her any heads up about anything and I will make sure to read it through before I do any legal actions. As far as leadership, my kids definitely see me as the leader in the household. My younger son said without me they would be in real trouble. I think they mostly just try to ignore her when she's dysregulating or splitting. She talks so much about how she hates my family but my kids don't see why they're so bad (they're not).



"
It might be time to focus less on her behaviors and more about what you want your kids to take away from these years left under your roof. "

True!

"Start small. 'Can ____ do this for herself?' If the answer is yes, think twice about whether to do it for her, especially if she hasn't asked you to. "

Yep! Yesterday I started small by having her put away a meal box we got from a food service. She's been sitting on her backside and drinking the days away while I've been taking over household chores. Then I prodded her to make dinner, which she yelled at me about so I'm not sure how happy I was with that. LOL

"A lot of the work is about clawing back the bits and pieces of self-respect that have been torn away over the years."

Yes!!

ChooseHappiness and ForeverDad: That's right, I can't just assume what the courts will give me given the bias towards the mother. I was hoping since I'm the only employed parent that would play a part, but it might not. Also, it will be on her (and not me) to find housing. She has really been hating on me the past couple days off and on, mentioning separation last night and finding low income housing. So at least she's coming to the realization that she will need a place to live if she leaves.