About to leave?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Thank you 


She's making comments about how I need to decide now if I'll "follow her" or not. Follow her values, goals etc. She puts on a powerful facade, almost threatening.

She's also wants me to watch YouTube videos about "betrayal trauma" with her, where the Youtuber says that the betrayed partner need to set ultimatums on "the cheating partner". She's the betrayed partner of course. She wants to make it seem like it's in her power and not my to decide whether we have a future or not.

This somehow makes me feel more confident to leave but only for a while. So her mindset somehow affects my thoughts about leaving. Which makes me question if I ever really feel strong myself.

This is the kind of thinking that to me, is reminiscent of my experience growing up. My BPD mother doesn't converse in a typical sense. She recites her ideas at you, insistst- expects one to go along with her thinking- and the thinking is distorted.

We didn't have internet or Youtube then so her ideas came from books, TV shows or something someone told her and she'd formulate something in her thinking about it.

By the time I was a teen, I could think for myself and know- this is crazy. I think Dad probably knew it was crazy too- but somehow there was a wavering of reality- do it anyway to keep the peace because, there's no reasoning with this kind of thinking.

There are two versions of reality here- yours and hers and she's insisting you adopt hers. And she is mentally ill.

This is one of the mysteries to me about my father- and I think the key to your not being able to leave your situation if you choose. I read in a book once that we "match" our romantic partners in level of "differentiation" - another term for enmeshment- and that each person believes they are more "differentiated" than the other. So you are perceiving your wife as the one with the problem, and she sees you as the one with the problem but it's actually both of you.

The enmeshment between my parents was visible.  She would put him up to saying things and doing things and he'd do it to keep the peace but did he really believe it?

I am not in a position to know for sure but I wonder if it is your enmeshment -wobbly boundaries- with your wife's thinking and ideas that makes it hard for you to hold on to your own.

The key is- this is you, and your boundaries- which means you can do the work of figuring this part out with your counselor.

[Notwendy]

Thank you 


She's making comments about how I need to decide now if I'll "follow her" or not. Follow her values, goals etc. She puts on a powerful facade, almost threatening.

She's also wants me to watch YouTube videos about "betrayal trauma" with her, where the Youtuber says that the betrayed partner need to set ultimatums on "the cheating partner". She's the betrayed partner of course. She wants to make it seem like it's in her power and not my to decide whether we have a future or not.

This somehow makes me feel more confident to leave but only for a while. So her mindset somehow affects my thoughts about leaving. Which makes me question if I ever really feel strong myself.

This is the kind of thinking that to me, is reminiscent of my experience growing up. My BPD mother doesn't converse in a typical sense. She recites her ideas at you, insistst- expects one to go along with her thinking- and the thinking is distorted.

We didn't have internet or Youtube then so her ideas came from books, TV shows or something someone told her and she'd formulate something in her thinking about it.

By the time I was a teen, I could think for myself and know- this is crazy. I think Dad probably knew it was crazy too- but somehow there was a wavering of reality- do it anyway to keep the peace because, there's no reasoning with this kind of thinking.

There are two versions of reality here- yours and hers and she's insisting you adopt hers. And she is mentally ill.

This is one of the mysteries to me about my father- and I think the key to your not being able to leave your situation if you choose. I read in a book once that we "match" our romantic partners in level of "differentiation" - another term for enmeshment- and that each person believes they are more "differentiated" than the other. So you are perceiving your wife as the one with the problem, and she sees you as the one with the problem but it's actually both of you.

The enmeshment between my parents was visible.  She would put him up to saying things and doing things and he'd do it to keep the peace but did he really believe it?

I am not in a position to know for sure but I wonder if it is your enmeshment -wobbly boundaries- with your wife's thinking and ideas that makes it hard for you to hold on to your own.

The key is- this is you, and your boundaries- which means you can do the work of figuring this part out with your counselor.

[ProtectiveDad]

Reading your thread the only question on my mind right now is, what kind of environment are you leaving behind?  Is it abusive?  How is she with your children?  Are you concerned about where they will be living?  Succinctly, have you considered involving an attorney before leaving in order to protect the children as best as you can, or is your spouse primarily focused on you as a victim and otherwise good with the children?

[ForeverDad]

Did I ever mention my effort to appease by apologizing?  I've mentioned it a few times on the site.  I even looked back at my notes and logs and was stunned I was unsure whether it was only several months, in my memory it seemed like a year.

About a year or so before my marriage imploded (with a police visit and events afterward) I gave in to my then-spouse's demands that I apologize, often for what she resurrected from long before, even though I'd already 'apologized' for them.  I gave in.  I would apologize for whatever she demanded.  Yeah, to keep the peace.  Soon she was demanding I had left something out of my apology and insisted I apologize yet again.  While I'm not generally this sort of person, I started leaving out portions of what she demanded.  Sure enough, I had to start over.  Once or twice I recall it was up to a half dozen times I had to restate my apology but I kept leaving out different segments. And she never caught on!

Finally, after months, I told her (Boundary) that henceforth I would only apologize for what I decided merited an apology.  And just once, not over and over as she would rehash past triggers she had never let go.

Was she upset?  Of course.  But our marriage was already degenerating, it was less than a year, perhaps months, until the above crisis finally imploded our marriage.  I had dithered during those final couple years, how much longer I would have straddled that fence, half in and half out, I'll never know.  Yet I saw the looming slow motion train crash approaching.  She wasn't truly listening or responding and I knew it was inevitable.

I wasn't nearly so well informed as you are, I had learned of "personality dysfunction" only a couple months before the implosion.  About the only thing I did smartly, though minor - because she forced it by refusing to cooperate with the retirement loan terms for my used car purchase - was to get my loan at a local bank where they required me to open a personal checking account for depositing my paycheck.  Yes, predictably she raged about that too.

I have my own issues, traits and challenges.  They're mine, other members have other issues.  Hey, we're all different in one way or another.  Right now you're facing one of your challenges.  We will always support you in any way we can.

[15years]

Thanks FD for sharing.

Personal challenges are hard enough without a dysfunctional rs. Feeling down for a day... That doesn't stop a dysfunctional partner from lashing out at you for hours even if you told them you were having a bad moment. That's just too brutal.

Reading your thread the only question on my mind right now is, what kind of environment are you leaving behind?  Is it abusive?  How is she with your children?  Are you concerned about where they will be living?  Succinctly, have you considered involving an attorney before leaving in order to protect the children as best as you can, or is your spouse primarily focused on you as a victim and otherwise good with the children?

Not abusive towards the children, but it's not a healthy environment for them.

[15years]

Me following my old colleague on Instagram has led to my wife texting me today that I'm not welcome at home if I don't fix the problem (unfollow her). It doesn't make me feel panicked, but I have issues with the timing.

Am I creating obstacles for myself? We have a family event tonight, it's not a very important event but something that S8 probably would like to attend. Should I simply accept that there will be no perfect time, and that I'll have to sacrifice tonight's event for making a positive change. There's always something in the way.

Could I just inform her that I acknowledge her position and that there are other reasons as well why I think this "result" is inevitable. That I'm not coming home tonight, and expect to meet the kids soon. And that I wish no further discussion on our future at this moment.

There are probably a naive aspect to this plan. She has no intention to end things, she's only pressuring me. The question is, should I see this as an opportunity, now that she has brought it up (which is one of the hardest things to do).

[Notwendy]

I would agree that there isn't a perfect time to actually leave. I think it would be when you decide you are ready to take action.

I also don't think there's a time where she isn't going to react, or that her reaction will be easier. The decision is on your part- regardless of her reaction. One consideration is safety and making sure that anyone who could be in  physical danger is not in harm's way.

I don't know if you have spoken to a DV hotline or person. They have advice for how to leave- an "escape plan" in a safer way from a potentially abusive partner. Since there is a history of physical abuse to you, I think it would be a good idea to hear what they have to say.

I don't have personal experience with escape plans but from what I have heard, the advice is to not say anything before leaving. Your wife has made an empty threat. Responding with "I'm not coming home tonight" is also a threat and will escalate the drama. She also won't take accountability for her statement. I know this because of my own experience with a BPD mother who has distorted thinking. It doesn't work because she re-writes the story in her own thinking to something else.

She also makes threats. Sometimes she follows through, but sometimes they are obviously not true threats. I agree, sometimes the way to respond is to let her face her own consequences but this doesn't register. She will say she "never said that" or come up with another explanation.

If you reply that you aren't coming home and remind your wife that she told you not to- this is blame shifting and with someone who is thinking in victim mode- you may as well be lighting the match to the drama fire. You need to own your decision. You will be blamed regardless. But you don't base your actions or self image on someone's distorted thinking. You have to hold on to your own self image and decisions. You can't change someone else's thinking.

Should you take this opportunity? If you can follow through with it- but you need to own your own decision. The decision to leave or stay is complicated- not easy but if someone leaves, they have concluded that it is the best decision out of two difficult ones.

[kells76]

She felt like she didn't want you to return home... at the time she sent the text. Her feelings may have already changed.

If you base if/when to exit the relationship on her feelings and statements, then you're letting her and her roller-coaster emotions take the lead in your decision-making.

It's certainly an option -- you also have other options, such as making your own decisions regardless of what she texts to you.

You get to be in charge of what you allow to guide your decision-making.