Bottled Up Emotions: (Lies, Denial, Cover-Ups) Where's the Success Stories?

[SeekerofTruth]

Hi All,

I already feel "wrong" for what I am about to post.  I feel rather depressed, intellectually overwhelmed, with an ever-increasing gnawing of pent-up frustration and anger.  Therefore, I would like to apologize in advance to anyone reading this who gets put off, hurt, or equally questioning of their own grasp upon reality and living a double life... .    I know these boards bring merit in many ways to many people. 

The AMAZING benefit the reading of boards are having upon me is essentially threefold:  1) in reading some of the horror stories across boards about the destructive impact that BPD partner has had upon one's life, the various nuances coalesce around a meaningful theme that helps me to understand or explain almost exactly something similar that I've experieinced in my relationship.  2)  Exposure to transcending the victim role, by understanding more about my role in the dance, coming to terms with my co-dependency, personality traits, unfinished business from my past that's predisposed me to encounter a set up in which my vulnerability gets left on the floor or in the gutter, only for me to pick up the pieces... .  as a possibility,  and 3)  Deeper reflections still on issues I have, echoed in others, access to some communication tools, by which to practice, hopefully to become more effective as a person and partner whether i remain in this relationship (marriage) or not, or in a future emotionally healthy and mutually FUFILLING relationship.

But I'm soo pissed.  Where are the success stories on here? 

Seems so many of us have been wounded and for those who've chosen to stay its more about damage control and less about thriving.  That breaks my heart.  What I am currently most frustrated by-- is this inability to confront my wife, on the hurtful impact some of her behaviors have had upon.  (In other contexts with different people, I can confront tactfully, carefully, and sometimes pretty hard hitting that takes denial as just another obstacle to penetrate thru).  With my wife,  it's like well, if you bring that up, she's just gonna go into sometype of tailsspin, counterattack, denial... .  or pseudo contrition only to ramp up her attack next time she's on the war path?

Currently, appears like she's been in the "loves me soo much" phase, but I feel my depression growing deeper, feel as though I am living a double life.  I have found SET as well as asking if i may give her feedback (praise, encouragement, praise) to have been helpful when discussing current issues.  My thing is, stuff from the recent past, less than 12 months ago... .  it's left a hole in me, a broken agreement... .  a cornerstone from which she unwrapped a powerful manipulation that really damaged me.  it gnaws at me.  If it were with any one else, i believe we would have had it out... .  instead to keep the peace, and promote a healthier future for us... .  I, I, I just love her harder (but secretly almost feel like I "hate" her cus i'm so pissed, hurt, and angry and good advice means I just can't cut to the chase with her)

I'm frustrated by MC.  I think we are done with our MC per se (maybe elaborat on another post) for now.  Thing is I also have a MH background in the field.  I have been on a quest to improve our marriage, and hopeful in finding a MC T who takes into account FOO issues, Axis II issues, and actively engages patients in "practices" on a consistent basis from week to week in order to faciliate new behavioral responses / changes in brain functioning, particulary for the high functioning acting out subtype... .    WHATEVER!  So I have been on the phone talking to a few.  I'm shocked that these gifted MC (including one that teach the courses on MC at a professional school)- are basically dismissive of BPD's destructive impact in relationship, but rather they look to key in on things like "levels of responsibility", "degree of closeness", and "softening attitudes" towards differences in personality.  I mean pleaaazee.  You come up on these boards, and you get a wake-up call real quick on the toll these relationships have while MC spins wheels with you on how to "play nice" and in my case, high functioning BPDw running circles around any accountability or holding to any solid, non shifiting reference point when it comes to a point of disagreement.

So I'm not sure.  I want to be clean with whomever I relate to.  So am I just suppose to stuff it, and forgetta bout it, when wife and I are in our loving mode, but underneath I'm hurting and pissed - my trust and confidence in being able to count on her - GONE, just accept it as a thing from the past and move on knowing what I know, and still loving her?  That seems fake.  It's too much pressure for me.  I try to practice Big Love, but on an integrity basis... .  it's like when and where is the IMPACT conversation going to be had with some one's who is empathy challenged (yet on her job apparently less of an issue, albeit when was the last time you met an empathic administrator? LOL).   

I believe the stuffing of this for me, is partially maintaining my depression.  I'm also conflicted, because on the divorce boards, an important truism in one of the pop-ups is about being solution focused.  That  means letting go about differences from the past and focusing on solutions in the present.  I know that's wise.  Inside feeling twisted.  Feels like a compromise on my integrity and on my turth.  So i let it slide, focus on the future, still inside of me I'm gonna feel like wink-wink, i just pulled a fast one to grease the wheels.

Any guidance on how to confront a big issue that's been really hurtful... .  ? (it's more about an agreement that was broken... .  which to me "word" is very valuable).  My risk because it is hurtful, is that I lay it on thick and with guilt... .  which i believe would be righteously legitmate, and once things get rolling, if I encounter resistance would be to find the bottom line words and put them on point!  (which generally tends to work effectively in any other type of encounter/confrontation I have engaged in with others, with the exception of ... .  my wife, why?)

At a loss, confussed, messed up inside, deeper into the abyss... .  

Seeker

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Want2know]

But I'm soo pissed.  Where are the success stories on here? 

SoT... .  take a look here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=113820.0

After reading the link above... .  what kind of success story do you foresee for you?

[SeekerofTruth]

really?

[Want2know]

really?

Yes, really. 

[CodependentHusband]

Seeker,

   I think I totally get what you are trying to say in your post, and I can see why you expressed some hesitance in posting it here. You have probably spent much of your life as on optimist... .  Thinking that, in the end, truth prevails and hard work pays off. For me, I found myself going through all of the stages of grief for a while when I realized that my marriage to dBPDw simply wasn't going to be anything like what I had imagined... .  heck, why do I used the word, 'imagined?' I DIDN'T imagine it, after all... .  it was right there in front of me, and poof! It was gone, almost as quickly as it arrived. So, I can't say with certainty that I know how you feel right now, but I sure think that I do. Anger, resentment, pessimistic thinking... .  it all goes with the territory... .  I'd even say it is NECESSARY in order to heal, and I think that is true even if you decide for sure to leave. Carrying around all of that negative energy for longer than absolutely necessary is too great a burden, in my opinion.

  You know, I used to think that I have brainwashed myself into happiness. Every once in a while, that idea pops into my head again. That may or may not be the truth... .  if ever knowing what the real truth is is even possible. Honestly, does it matter though? I still have some pain... .  no doubt about it... .  I still have some doubts every once in a while... .  But the happiness that I do have has to be real... .  it feels too real to not be genuine. My wife is mentally ill. She is in denial about her mental condition. Her reality is that there is something very wrong with the entire world that surrounds her. She's not exactly the person that I thought she was when I married her, but, after truly accepting her and my marriage for exactly what it is, I STILL love her. I didn't think I could love her unconditionally... .  didn't think it was even possible. I can't say with certainty that I will always feel this way, but I can say that the fact that there is so much less turmoil in my r/s now, my marriage stands a much better chance.

  I know this sucks. I'm sorry things are as they are. I hope that you can find what is going to work best for you.  

[Aundrea]

I don't know how helpful my reply is going to be as I'm new to the boards and new to theraphy and the strategies... .  

I can see you are very upset and I totally understand how you feel. The situatitions you have described can be so heart breaking and easily send you into depression. It's not easy living with someone who is unable to give you so many things in a relationship you crave and feel you need.

But one thing I did notice was as you said, your depressed. Are you in any individual theraphy for yourself? I can understand how you want to help and comfort for and also work on the issues in the relationship, however if you are depressed and allowing the issue to still greatly affect you, then there is no way you will be able to look at the situation and have a positive outcome.

I'm still having trouble with this as well. I'm very co-dependant and emotionally enmeshed, however I am breaking those tied and allowing myself some happiness and detaching from the hash words he says and his confusing and demeaning actions.

Another thing I noticed is how you hold a strong value with your word, and others holding true to what they say... .  I am the same however I have found that I can only go by my partners actions and not his word. When he is not emotionally regulated I can not take notice of either.

I guess what is your desired outcome? Is it to love your wife for who she is and have some type of happy relationship, or are you looking for validation from your wife, that she broke her word and she hurt you, and for her to be truly sorry for he actions?

If it is the 2nd unless she is in intense theraphy, for many years, the 2nd is unlikely and hiolding onto the hope that will happen is only damaging to you.

Loving her for who she is, involves the understanding that the likelihood of her being empathetic is virtually zero. Her having the consisting skills to be able to sooth you, is nearly impossible... .  You are going to have to radically accept her for who she is and honestly accept her limitations. You are going to have to learn how to come to terms with situations and move on from situations yourself and you are going to have to learn how to self sooth. This is why the individual theraphy for yourself is so important, important for you.

Ppl with BPD are very good at mirroring others actions, but only for short periods (in my partners care it's dropped to about 2 hrs).From what ive seen it takes a lot of energy and after my partner has done it, it emotionally drains him... So for your wife, at work she may be able to put on the act, of acting empathetic but it being a skill she actually has and is able to rely on that skill all the time is very doubtful... .  This is why she can do it at work but not at hone. And I understand how crushing emotionally it is for you

The stuff I have been through with my partner in the last 12 1/2  years, I still can not speak of on here. However since coming to this forum and doing some reading, I can honestly say even though he can be a total ASS, I can understand my part in the dance and seeking theraphy for myself and working on my self has been a life saver!(not by a MC- but by a trained psychiatrist in BPD and either trained in schema or DPT). Unfortunately i have found that counsellors, psychologists and MC's) focus on CBT and in no way understand the complexity of BPD. my partner runs rings around them and turns he seasons into validation for his messed up behaviour... .  

The best thing I have found is to shelf trying to work out with him our RS issues and work on my own issues, and my own responses. I can't make him change, but I can improve myself and improve so much in the RS by working on myself ... .  

You wanted a SUCCESS STORY

well maybe my story may help... .  

I met him when I was 18, he was 23. He was an alcoholic, didn't finish school and didn't stay in employment very long (under 3 months). He was violent and his way to deal with issues was to beat the hell out of the ppl (males) who got in his way. He was a womaniser and still lived in a place his mother rented... .  

He bounces from low to high functioning BPD. His mother also has it, as does his brother as well. BPD traits he has them all. Man the crap I have been through over the years is heartbreaking. I am now 30 and we have been together 12 1/2 yrs and have a DD 10 and DS 4... .  We have broken up twice, once for 5 days and the other for 3 days. Once was because I moved his 'cup on the sink' and the other because he felt I breached his privacy ( when it turned out his brother had hacked all our social accounts, bank accounts etc).

FF to the now 12 yrs later.

He has now quit alcohol for 7 months now. he drank up to 2 litres every 2nd night.

He has quit cigarettes for 9 months.

He is eating 6 meals a day and losing weight.

He is eating healthy.

He has built so many things around the house (boats, traitors, verandah's, pet cages, painted the house, new walls for new rooms)

He gets up every morning between 5 & 7am and goes to bed at 8 or 9.

He has tried 3 different psychologists and had to wait until the new year to make an appt for the psychiatrist who is going to do DBT.

He has trained our puppy in 'positive behaviour techniques' rather than training by punishment.

I now feel safe to leave the children with him for small periods a day.

When he is feeling low he retreats to the room and researches something so he is still doing something positive.

He is not working, I don't think he will ever have the ability to work for other ppl, but he has plans for a home business once he learns better coping skills through theraphy.

He now comes to the kids sports training/games 8x a week.

He no longer sabotages any if mine or the kids happiness.

Me

Due to me not knowing the right way to respond to him and also the added pressure of the kids. I had a breakdown, left work, left uni, left my sporting actives, stopped anything I liked, became isolated from all friends and family and had plans to kill him the children and myself... .  

Now

I am doing sports/social activities/working and going back to study next year as well as working.

I am no longer depressed and when I do get down I am able to come out of the FOG a lot quicker as I have understanding of why he is the way he is and have been able to accept him (well a lot more than i did)

I have friends and my family back

As a family and his and mine relationship

We do things together all the time, we have been able to have more productive conversations as I've learnt SET and JADE and so he is feeling more trusting of me and opening up more. I'm not walking on egg shells and I give him the space to work out his own crap instead if always trying to fix it for him... .  

We went camping 3 weeks ago for the first time EVER for 5 days and 6 nights and he only had 2x minor moments that only lasted for 1/2 hr as I knew how to not make them worse by my actions

[GreenMango]

Aundrea thank you for sharing your story.  All I can say is Wow... .  and it sounds like you both are doing the hard work and succeeding.  That's awesome.

I often wonder if the success stories are so few and far between is because people (myself included when I came here) tend to look for support or help when times are rough and when things get better the need for support wanes.  It may just be the nature of needing support and what people come here for. 

That being said, some of the most successful strategies to dealing with larger, ingrained issues that many of us members come up against is to be proactive and consistently reinforce the more helpful strategies and support as both a refresher and a reminder.

[qkslvrgirl]

... .  and in my case, high functioning BPDw running circles around any accountability or holding to any solid, non shifiting reference point when it comes to a point of disagreement.

Hey Seeker - My uBPDh is the same way, so I totally relate to above statement. After being together for 12 years, the "success" is that I am more aware of how I am triggered by his behaviors as well as the daily events of life (work, normal stress of living, etc.). My success is now focused on living happily and not letting my ego get hurt or stressed over other people's issues. I've reached a point where I recognize when I'm in resistance mode and shift out of that pretty quickly.

Bottom line is that I probably would not have reached this place if I hadn't sought out and resolved my own issues. I guess that is the success in life I wanted, anyway. So good luck with the reality of your life: I know you can reach a place where all the crap is just that - and you can be happy anyway.



Quicksilver Girl

[iluminati]

SeekerofTruth, it's time to have a Come-to-Jesus talk.  I'm not saying this to be mean or disrespectful.  However, based on your comments, it's clear that you need to see the light on a few things.

You need to stop marriage counseling not now, but right now.  This is not a joke.  Yes, I know your marriage is difficult.  Yes, I know you're hoping to work on issues in the marriage.  Right now, doing cocaine and heroin while listening to Shalimar and Marilyn McCoo and watching a highlight video of University of Kentucky's men's basketball team during the 1980-81 season would be more productive in fixing your marriage than marriage counseling.  Heck, throw in some of that Molly, and you might be able to get her guard down for 5 minutes.

You said that you are a mental health professional.  Therefore, I assume you're familiar with the DSM-IV and its critieria for borderline personality disorder.  One of the nine crtieria is "Identity disturbance: markedly and persistently unstable self-image or sense of self".  This means that she has pretty much no idea of who she is and what she is about without outside influence.  This also means that she has little idea where she ends and you begin.

Marriage counseling is based on the premise that two individuals who are married can work to resolve their differences and improve their marriage.  However, if one person doesn't really have the foggiest clue who they are as a person, then it won't work.  At all.  At least the, ahem, recreational pharmaceuticals will give you a buzz.  Heck, even the drugs might prove an unhealthy coping mechanism (which, for the record, I do not recommend) by which your wife can shield herself from her self-shame and deal with you as a person.  But the marriage counseling will not work until she gets help for herself, and likely until you get help for yourself. 

You, as individual, need to clean up your side of the street before you can deal with each other.  That is it, and that is all.

[tuli]

Your writing is very clear and what you say makes sense to me.  Sometimes the label of borderline becomes a problem in these kinds of discussions.  We use it to label this problem as a disease to lessen the shame and hatred attached to this set of behavioral problems, but then it leaves us unable to have a framework to express the pent up emotion that we carry living with a BPD. 

So let's say we take the labels off.  We find that this person is someone who feels less than (whether through abuse and/or genetic sensitivity).  They feel like they are not as good as others, defective, born wrong, not good enough.  And that's the basis of the borderline condition that leads to addictive destructive choices.

The specific borderline behaviors that we usually are talking about within a relationship forum is the destructive coping mechanisms that highly insecure people use to feel equal or as good as secure people.  It's really the same mechanism that creates any abuser whether it is a bully, a batterer, a dictator.  It is the unwillingness to feel the humiliation and fear that can come along with not feeling adequate self-worth and the willingness to privately take socially-unacceptable steps to feel just as good. 

Each time they use a defense mechanism that makes them feel better at the expense of someone else, they hate themselves a little more and it makes it harder to resist the next time.  And these mechanisms are like hard drugs.  Once they find relief from their humiliation, it becomes very hard to resist the next time.  Once they are addicted to partner degredation, they become like an alcoholic, someone who will be prone to relapse in this area for the rest of their life.   

Abuse is addictive behavior, so success when married to someone abusive depends on how entrenched they are, and how much time you are willing to devote to calmly enforcing boundaries.  As long as you have a high functioning BPD without suicide or fidelity problems or chemical addictions, theoretically you can do it.

You have to be very rock solid in several areas and have a BPD that is willing to sit down with you regularly in good times and review the agreement that you will be following in your marriage.  It's fine if they say they are too emotional to follow the standards, but they have to at least agree that they subscribe to socially-acceptable standards in terms of how people in a marriage treat each other.

Hopefully one of the things you agree on is that being in the marriage you are both promise to generally support each other and promise that you will be protective of each other's emotional and physical wellbeing.  This agreement alone covers a lot of problems with borderlines.  Every time they are not supportive and protective, you agree that when things calm down you will have a sit down to discuss where that went wrong.   

The other major area that you need to be very clear with your partner on is that it is not healthy for someone to take care of another person's emotional needs for them and they need to know that will not be happening during the marriage and that you will never be responsible for your partner's feelings.  This takes another large portion of the abuse out of the picture.

The relationship agreement has to be revisited every time it's breached without anger, resentment, frustration on your part, over and over, and every boundary needs to be continually enforced, again without emotions, but if you can do that long term, you could get some success.


 

[waverider]

I often think along those lines Seeker. I am becoming more aware that dealings with, and life with, my partner is more of a treading water survival and coping life. The forward going, developing rewarding aspects of life which I am building on are becoming more and more solo aspects.  The bond changing in real terms from partner to carer. Having that underlying thought process that is completely at odds with my spoken words and actions, feels like having a workplace persona and a private live one as separate entities. That is not the path to true harmony

This is a negative and dangerous path. How to rectify this discrepancy I dont know, but we have to develop and grow onwards together rather than on my own or I will outgrow the relationship and it will ultimately falter.

I am becoming more aware of this at least, and so will start to focus my attention to that.

I was once towed behind her and subject to her fickleness, now that is no longer the case I am my own driver now and am passing and moving on down the road. She does not have sufficient motive power to keep up. So for the RS to survive I will have hook her up somehow and tow her along. But I need to be strong enough and powerful enough in myself that the drag of towing does not overwhelm my own stability

[yeeter]

I get the anger.  Indeed, it's a stage of grief over the realization that you will never have a normal relationship.

I get the resentment.  Be careful on this one.  It will eat you up inside.

You do need to figure out exactly what you GET out of this relationship.  Not what you hope to be sure.  But something or you wouldn't be in it still

Leading has helped me.  A lot.  And understanding what you can, and cannot get from your partner will reduce the frustration when you don't get something that cannot be given.

I tried MC ... .  8 different T's.  Some very highly qualified and carefully screened.  They were not helpful, and often triggered more deregulation.  I dropped it and it's worked better (but at the same time we do, on occasion, refer to something that was said in the MC)

I look forward to reading how you work through it... .  

Do you know what you 'want'?  And given the understanding of the limitations, is this 'possible'?  Because if you are latched on to wanting something that is not achievable, it's an exercise in frustration.   Most here reset their objectives after learning the reality of what they are dealing with.

[Foreverhopefull]

Finding out that all you ever dreamed of or have been shown in movies, TV and everybody else's relationships about what is a good relationship will never be yours is a hard blow. Fact is the definition of our good relationships are very different. We can't think like others that don't deal with BPD.

Our reality is that we will spend more time as caregivers than lovers, we will work harder on our relationship than our pwBPD, we will feel alone and worst of all, we will rethink our life often. That's our reality. Thing is, when they are having a hard time, they take big chunks out of us and often leave scars, but they forget about it when everything is good. It's easier for them to forget than it is for us, we need to get the help we need to deal with the scars.

Personally, I'm not doing MC. I know that we are not perfect, I know that what we live is not "normal" and that rarely will a MC understand why I stay. Most don't believe that we can make it together. I will only accept to go if I find an MC that understand BPD. During this time, I have built a relationship with his T and the three of us work together to making life easier for all of us. I don't ask about the sessions, all I get are tips and leads on how to insure that I help him keep his progress. Things like not to try and "fix" things for him when he messes up, not take charge of his appointments (not make the calls , etc), try not to book things last minute that will require me to disrupt the routine. I've also received a ton of good reference materials and sources out there that can help me vent or get the help I need to get through it all.

The good part is that when we see them make an effort to live an easier life, we notice and appreciate it even more. When they show us affection, we feel the love. When they say that they love us, we know it's true.

You want a success story,look at the little things she does. Slow down and watch her, listen to her words, look at her. You might notice a bunch of things that have changed.

Our choice to stay and make it work is not an easy one, it requires us to make the choice daily. Look for the signs that she's working on getting better, that helps me feel like it's worth staying.