F.O.G?

[CoasterRider]

I've heard this and assume it to be an acronym. Can someone explain what it means for us newbs on here?

[fromheeltoheal]

Fear, Obligation and Guilt, the state we end up in when a borderline 'shares' their pathology with us.  It takes a while out of the relationship for the "fog to clear", so to speak, meaning we get our feet on the ground and start to think more rationally and objectively about the relationship.

[SeekingAdviceinCa]

F.O.G. consumes us and clouds our rational judgement.  It's the thing that causes us to continually jump back into a relationship that by any reasonable measure is toxic, abusive, unhealthy, one-sided, etc.  It's the thing that kept me in a bad marriage of 6 years where my wife cheated physically and emotionally, was verbally and emotionally abusive, had all sorts of drama and roller coasters, etc.  The F.O.G. engulfs our sense of "normalcy" and perpetuates the unhealthy relationship because we are just stuck in the middle of it.  It prevents us from seeing the harm the relationship does to ourselves.  

[Waifed]

Its the thing that kept us from calling them on the carpet for all of the BS they inflicted over and over.  I have this fear of immediately falling back into the FOG if I were to run into my ex.  4 months out and I am still paranoid.

[Turkish]

In short, it is what they call emotional blackmail. Anyone can do it, actually. My X is lost in the FOG being hopelessly codependently enmeshed with providing for her family, depsite having 3 adult siblings who hardly lift a finger to help everybody. She gets self-worth from it. I tried to call her out on it once, but she shut me down. I did help explain FOG a few weeks ago over an issue she had with her mother (which I think was all my X's FOG), to try and help her out. I feel for her and that it made her the dysfunctional part of who she became to be.

I let FOG surround me for 5 more years when I had almost concluded she had BPD in Year 1. Hope this helps... .

[Turkish]

This might help, too. I confess I haven't read through all of them. And often make up my own abbreviations.

What do all these abbreviations mean?

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Coasterrider, FOG is the toolbox of manipulators, in my view.  My BPDxW used all three techiques frequently on me, with much success.  If you are a caring person like most of us Nons, you may find yourself particularly susceptible to this type of arm-twisting, without being conscious that you are being manipulated.  Those w/BPD are experts at using FOG.  Now, it's obvious to me when someone attempts to manipulate me, but it took a long time for the FOG to clear!  LJ

[bpdspell]

FOG is the toolbox of manipulators, in my view. 

I wholeheartedly agree with Lucky Jim.

Fear, Obligation and Guilt are used to emotionally bond others to cosign their negatively impactful behavior. These tactics advantageously are used to support their entitlement.

Spell

[Ironmanrises]

It is the fire, smoke, and heat while in hell on earth; in simple terms.

[laelle]

My ex use to keep me FOG'd so I would accept the relationship even tho my needs were not being met. I was made to feel guilty for having needs in the first place.

Any problems in my life, I was forwarded to my ex husband to deal with.  When he had problems, I was front and center (manipulated into fixing his problems, anxiety, rage or frustrations) normally the website for Western Union saved as a "favorite" on my computer.

I still continued to give money to "our apartment" that he never intended for me to move into (knowing this fact).  He never meant one promise he ever made me, but he never failed to guilt me into feeling shame for doubting his motives.


I am really glad that he is out of my life forever!

[Clearmind]

Workshop - US: What it means to be in the “FOG”

Good explanations. My own FOG stems from my own childhood rather than something I felt because of my ex. Obligation: “When our sense of obligation is stronger than our sense of self-respect and self-caring, blackmailers quickly learn how to take advantage” - FOG stems from lack of self worth and self esteem -- which is learnt/developed from childhood stuff or our family of origin (FOO).

FOG does not go away with the ex - its intrinsic in us and something we need to process.

[growing_wings]

the issue with the FOG is that is hard to clear it!... . it takes a while after you leave the r/s for the FOG to lift. I was very susceptible to it and she would know which buttons to press to make me feel fear, obligation and guilt... .  

i cant wait to be really really out of the FOG... i am not there... have improved, but arggghh.

[fromheeltoheal]

Workshop - US: What it means to be in the “FOG”

Good explanations. My own FOG stems from my own childhood rather than something I felt because of my ex. Obligation: “When our sense of obligation is stronger than our sense of self-respect and self-caring, blackmailers quickly learn how to take advantage” - FOG stems from lack of self worth and self esteem -- which is learnt/developed from childhood stuff or our family of origin (FOO).

FOG does not go away with the ex - its intrinsic in us and something we need to process.

You're right Clearmind.  I hate it that you're right, but you are.  In a sense my ex did me a favor: I could have gotten into a relationship with someone who was compassionate, empathetic and validating, and who would have seen the insecurity and low self esteem, helped me with them, maybe enabled me.  My borderline opted for blackmail and manipulation instead, I do credit myself with feeling that I wasn't being treated right and put an end to it relatively quickly, self preservation, but it was a feeling and not a thought at the time, I had done no processing. 

Now I see that I had a desire to make the relationship work and cared for her, but got blindsided by the way she is, and went way beyond caring into obligation, and felt guilty when blamed.  The good news is the pain all of that caused for me was a wake-up call, an opportunity to address self esteem issues.  Self esteem, literally respect and admiration for yourself, and self confidence, are not things we get but things we do.  I didn't get a lot of validation or emotional communication growing up, but it wasn't that bad, and today I've noticed that when I live true to my values and with integrity I feel much better about myself; not rocket science, just living 'right' by my definition.  I was not in that place when met her, I was scrambling, out of control, in denial about what was really going on, not taking control of my life, susceptible, a perfect mark for someone with an attachment disorder.  I don't think it would happen today, not when living 'right'.  Stay tuned... .

[Waifed]

Workshop - US: What it means to be in the “FOG”

Good explanations. My own FOG stems from my own childhood rather than something I felt because of my ex. Obligation: “When our sense of obligation is stronger than our sense of self-respect and self-caring, blackmailers quickly learn how to take advantage” - FOG stems from lack of self worth and self esteem -- which is learnt/developed from childhood stuff or our family of origin (FOO).

FOG does not go away with the ex - its intrinsic in us and something we need to process.

Clearmind, could you expand on this?

Also, I assume pwBPD use manipulation to gain control over you (passive aggressiveness) so that their fear of abandonment is less threatened (in their eyes).  The by product is the FOG for us?

[bpdspell]

My own FOG stems from my own childhood rather than something I felt because of my ex. FOG stems from lack of self worth and self esteem -- which is learnt/developed from childhood stuff or our family of origin (FOO).

Spot on. Our BPD ex's cannot use Fear, Obligation and Guilt to exploit us unless it's already living inside of us to a certain degree. Healthy levels of self-worth, esteem and respect exist to set us up in a world of healthy boundary setting, self-value, and following through on when something doesn't feel right. All of which none happened with my ex. He plowed right through my life and I allowed him too because of my own childhood blindspots.

I now understand that I am a survivor of narcissistic abuse. My mother is quite emotionally immature and suffers with stunted emotional growth to this day. I was never validated, honored or valued by my mother in the way I had always dreamed of and in many ways did the "dancing bear" act  and it's many derivatives to get her much needed attention. The schema/narrative/pattern was repeated with my ex and was why the pain hurt on such a primal level when my ex manipulated me. I was dealing with mommy dearest all over again.

The toxic BPD dance is like a tape deck and our ex's hitting the "play" button. History has a way of repeating itself until a cycle is broken for good.

Spell

[Clearmind]

My own FOG stems from my own childhood rather than something I felt because of my ex. FOG stems from lack of self worth and self esteem -- which is learnt/developed from childhood stuff or our family of origin (FOO).

Spot on. Our BPD ex's cannot use Fear, Obligation and Guilt to exploit us unless it's already living inside of us to a certain degree. Healthy levels of self-worth, esteem and respect exist to set us up in a world of healthy boundary setting, self-value, and following through on when something doesn't feel right. All of which none happened with my ex. He plowed right through my life and I allowed him too because of my own childhood blindspots.

I now understand that I am a survivor of narcissistic abuse. My mother is quite emotionally immature and suffers with stunted emotional growth to this day. I was never validated, honored or valued by my mother in the way I had always dreamed of and in many ways did the "dancing bear" act  and it's many derivatives to get her much needed attention. The schema/narrative/pattern was repeated with my ex and was why the pain hurt on such a primal level when my ex manipulated me. I was dealing with mommy dearest all over again.

The toxic BPD dance is like a tape deck and our ex's hitting the "play" button. History has a way of repeating itself until a cycle is broken for good.

Spell

Spell, I agree and a good analogy about our ex's hitting our "play" button.

Like you I grew up in a dysfunctional household. Given we learn our relationship skills from our parents and tend to repeat them when we are adults - I did not have a great grounding. My parents fought a lot. My mother was an enabler and my father was an alcoholic and likely BPD traits. As a child growing up in that type of environment I was not taught to have healthy boundaries, I was taught that limits were limitless, that I had to be the "good girl" for fear of being entrenched further in my parents own dysfunctional relationship, I was a silent child who learnt to placate rather than take any stance.

In a healthy environment a child's emotions are validated not dismissed and a child is given room to learn about healthy boundaries and limits. If I was in fact taught these life skills I would never have chosen a person like my ex - he was not the first BPD by the way - so I agree Spell I repeated many patterns over and over.

My childhood was full of fear - fear of being further abused, put down, criticised if I didn't comply with my father. I felt obligated - obligated to conform and be good and bend my own values and morals to please my father and I felt guilt and shame if I failed in his eyes. This FOG cycle went around and around in circles. At the time I did not realise my father had strong BPD traits - who does as a child.

As an adult, I dated men who also emotionally abused me - I didn't stand up for myself because of the FOG I had learnt, as a way of relating from my father/parents, to the men I dated. I was walked over and then claimed victimhood - pity party all over the place.

I have healed from my childhood. I no longer feel the need for FOG to placate, please others and care-take others - instead I believe if everyone likes me I am doing something very wrong. I have found who I am, what I like, what I dislike, I have opinions, I have boundaries and I am not afraid any more to use them. FOG does not exist because I no longer need to relive my childhood.

I dated Borderlines to make redemptions from my past. Not only was I accustomed to toxic relationship, after all I grew up in a toxic household, I was also use to being put down and saying nothing and doing nothing - I had also got that as a child. To me a "normal" relationship was like the one I had with my ex which is the reason I hit bottom and was absolutely shattered when we broke up - I didn't see it coming? How could that be? My relationship was a mess! And I wanted him back  .

hit

My suggestion for anyone who has experienced a break up with a Borderline is to really think about their past, think about why you suffer FOG - its likely its not just with your ex, you can feel FOG with your co-workers, friends and family as well.

We are adults with adult privileges now - we get to call the shots. Put down the victim card what you believe your ex dealt you and start looking at the reasons why you attached. They didn't do this to you, you stuck around this person for a very good reason - that reason will become apparent if you are willing to dig deeper than "my ex is a witch [insert another name"] - I get it hurts I really do - you want revenge - and I think that is natural to an extent. Trust that there will come a time when you don't think about them so much because you have learnt to value yourself way too much to want to be abused by a disordered person.

Hugs to you all 

[Changingman]

FOG is a lost place somewhere unknown in the world and in you. The world seems ok but an underlying anxiety pervades you, so you do what any confused individual does and start to shut down instinct and reality. Some things become imperceptible only to be regained when out. The difference between your friends perception of your experience and yours.

A way for evil people to confuse and manipulate the good. Think North Koreans crying when their mass murdering, famine inducing psychotic dictator dies. People who lived through Stalins reign of terror are still grieving the killers death, lost in a delusion.

A labyrinth you walk through, walls around you a demon stalking you, lost, you wander into the centre trying to find a way out only to find yourself deeper.

[Clearmind]

A way for evil people to confuse and manipulate the good. Think North Koreans crying when their mass murdering, famine inducing psychotic dictator dies. People who lived through Stalins reign of terror are still grieving the killers death, lost in a delusion.

My ex certainly was not evil and I was no where near the 'good'. We each played a very defined role that contributed to the toxicity of the relationship.

Being mindful of our role is a good place to start exercising empathy rather than blame.

[Changingman]

A way for evil people to confuse and manipulate the good. Think North Koreans crying when their mass murdering, famine inducing psychotic dictator dies. People who lived through Stalins reign of terror are still grieving the killers death, lost in a delusion.

My ex certainly was not evil and I was no where near the 'good'. We each played a very defined role that contributed to the toxicity of the relationship.

Being mindful of our role is a good place to start exercising empathy rather than blame.

Mine was. I can see it now a con artist. Using everyone around her and feeling just her own feelings, hurt a lot of people, bit some, slept behind pregnant wives backs with their husbands, enjoyed torture, couldn't care about others feelings, just awful person.

I have issues... . Mum and codependency. But 4 years of care and then this crap, oh I'm convinced that the lack of love she feels for herself produces sadistic narcissism and hatred revenge for anyone close. I was confused but I can see it now.

Evil is too religious in feeling, detached from humanity and caged in a constant struggle to like/love anything is closer.

[Clearmind]

I have issues... . Mum and codependency. But 4 years of care and then this crap,

Good place to start to dig deep - this is the key to healing.