Owed money

[Depression = 72% of members]

Just some advice really. I've blocked her number and whatsapp & she blocked me, too.

I gave her stuff back and collecting mine pretty much straight away. She owes me some money, which she said she would transfer. If I didn't need the money then i would write it off, but i do. I know she is skint at the moment, but I would like to know when she can pay it to tally up my finances.

Is it best to just give her a quick call no? Because I don't want to have any further excuses to try and contact her. I know i will get weak later on & will use it to speak to her.

[Eric1]

Just some advice really. I've blocked her number and whatsapp & she blocked me, too.

I gave her stuff back and collecting mine pretty much straight away. She owes me some money, which she said she would transfer. If I didn't need the money then i would write it off, but i do. I know she is skint at the moment, but I would like to know when she can pay it to tally up my finances.

Is it best to just give her a quick call no? Because I don't want to have any further excuses to try and contact her. I know i will get weak later on & will use it to speak to her.

[LettingGo14]

Just some advice really. I've blocked her number and whatsapp & she blocked me, too.

I gave her stuff back and collecting mine pretty much straight away. She owes me some money, which she said she would transfer. If I didn't need the money then i would write it off, but i do. I know she is skint at the moment, but I would like to know when she can pay it to tally up my finances.

Is it best to just give her a quick call no? Because I don't want to have any further excuses to try and contact her. I know i will get weak later on & will use it to speak to her.

Eric1.  It's a catch-22.  You have options, of course: (a)  You could ask a mutual friend to send a one or two line note -- e.g., "Eric wishes you well and wonders if you can send $xx by Friday via mail."   (b) You could write a letter.

Or, you could consider it an investment in the healthier you to walk away from it.   

No one can tell you what's best. For me, my triggers were such that "any" contact could send me spiraling.  But, I had a bike of hers, and I asked her if she wanted it.  She said no, so it sits in my basement until a later date when I will likely sell or donate it.   It is a bike -- I no longer imbue it with meaning, because I want to be healthy, and I own my perceptions & reality.

What is best for you?

[Loveofhislife]

Well, this has been my "justification" for clinging to BPD when I knew I was in the devalution phase.  My gut tells me LettingGo14 is correct--that I should let it go.  As a registered dietician/friend said to me several weeks ago when BPD was stalking me and obsessing over me--even in the midst of a doctor's appointment when I said I could not talk--she said there is no amount of money worth risking yourself, your psyche, your spirit, or your physical health for.  It is a significant amount, and I know my dietician friend is correct, but Eric1, I truly believe that the paying me back issue has been a control tool of his.  When I told him last Tuesday night that I didn't want or need his money--I received the first ever silent treatment for nearly a week.  THIS treatment from someone who has scarcely taken a breath without checking with with me for the last ten months.  So, paying me back may have been a control mechanism for him, but it has been part of the power struggle for me.  I now realize that this is yet one more area in which I need to LET GO... .

[Eric1]

I dont want any reason in the future to have contact, and i might be jumping the gun, but could she be thinking that if she doesn't pay straight away, it does give reason for us to talk again? I know she would be delaying it because she is tight of funds at the moment, but she wanted me out of her life, then surely paying up and having no-ties would be best? I always have struggled in the first few weeks when i've intitated NC, but once after that, i wouldn't contemplate calling her. She would always call me & it's seriously delayed me moving on. We broke up nearly a year ago & have a number of recycles since, it's got me nowhere.

[LettingGo14]

but could she be thinking that if she doesn't pay straight away, it does give reason for us to talk again?

This is what our minds do, Eric1.  We wonder, we hope, we try to figure it all out.  And it's okay -- but... . we have to recognize we are projecting ourselves when we ask questions like this. 

We broke up nearly a year ago & have a number of recycles since, it's got me nowhere.

I am sorry, Eric1.  It is hard.  I have been there.  We can only start where we are, and set our intentions for ourselves.   Detachment leads to freedom.

[Eric1]

If i'm honest, i'm probably just using the money as an excuse to contact her.

I still need the money, but i want to speak to her more.

[Mutt]

Eric1, it depends on the amount of money here. If it were an amount that I can recover from, I'd cut my losses, what's important is that I need to detach. My ex is extremely difficult to deal with when it comes to money, because of her sense of entitlement. I cut my losses for my own emotional well-being and sanity. If you're married, have property etc Do you think it's worth asking the legal board? If it's a few hundred bucks, I wouldn't lend her any more money. Lesson learned, but the aggravation and pain of trying to co-ordinate getting it back, what's that worth to you? My emotional well-being far out ways money, because I will recover from a few thousand bucks in the long term.

[Eric1]

Should I tell her I'm writing off the money?

I don't want to be waiting to see if she pays it into my account or coming to assumptions why she hasn't.

[LettingGo14]

Should I tell her I'm writing off the money?

I don't want to be waiting to see if she pays it into my account or coming to assumptions why she hasn't.

Eric1 -- I can't tell you exactly what is right for you; however, no contact may be more beneficial to you.  You can then focus on ameliorating the stress of "waiting" or "making assumptions" (in other words, you can work on the things you can control).  Does that make sense?

Another way to consider, if my company "writes off" a bad debt, we don't necessarily tell the debtor.  We just write it off, and move on.

[Mutt]

Another way to consider, if my company "writes off" a bad debt, we don't necessarily tell the debtor.  We just write it off, and move on.

Spot on 

[willy45]

Yeah dude. If you can survive without the money... . And the key word here is SURVIVE as in not going to die if you don't get it, then write it off. Don't tell her if you can. If you need closure on it, then do it but know it will cause you a world of pain. Trust me. If you can, think of it as paying her to go away. How often do you get to do that? It's pretty rad if you think about it and pretty liberating. You are paying someone to go away. Pretty strong statement.

[willy45]

Think of it like this... . If a complete ahole came up to you and was being an ahole to you, how awesome would it be to reach into your pocket, pull out a wad of bills and give to them to go away... . and not even care about the money. That would be pretty baller. Be a baller.

[yoshitx]

There is always time in life to make more money.  But you cant buy time.

I have been out for a few years now.  Lost every penny I had to get my life and children out.

Worth every cent.  Would have given more faster if i knew how much better things would be.

[Eric1]

I would just be using it as an excuse to contact. I know she's not good for me, I've been through enough recycles to see that. She runs at the first sign of trouble, lies, manipulates and triangulates. There is no sustaining it. Yet, I'm still here, a year on, idolizing her & wanting to be with her - deluded that if we have it another proper chance, things would be different.

[Mutt]

I would just be using it as an excuse to contact. I know she's not good for me, I've been through enough recycles to see that. She runs at the first sign of trouble, lies, manipulates and triangulates. There is no sustaining it. Yet, I'm still here, a year on, idolizing her & wanting to be with her - deluded that if we have it another proper chance, things would be different.

The same thing happened to me as yoshi, I lost every penny and was cleaned out, but it's over and have no regrets.

It's good that you're being honest, you want to have a tether for a chance to stay in touch. It's not avoiding or distorting your true feelings about the situation   the same thing over and over, expecting different results is crazy making behavior. You can change and break the cycle, she is mentally ill and won't change unless she gets help for herself.

Have you read the 10 beliefs? The belief that this person holds the keys to your happiness?The 10 beliefs helped me to take inventory and look at things realistically.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=140180.0

[AchingHeart]

The ex owes me a crap load of money!

I have no intention to ask for it back. I haven't told her I wrote her off either. I suppose she has figured it out by now though.

I know any sort of contact is just going to hurt me even more. Besides, I have no energy to argue with her on the exact number, when she has to pay it off by, etc... .

I'm doing exactly what someone posted here, I'm  considering it an investment for myself and for a better future.

It's a costly investment but if it's better for me on the long run then it'll be one my wisest investment 

If you can do without that money then pass on it. That's my opinion.

[Eric1]

I just want to call her & apologise for how I acted. The last drunken argument we had was probably one of the worst, and although she did start the altercation & said some really spiteful things, I retaliated & said some nasty things back.

I know I can’t keep going round in circles like this, and I know it’s now over for good between us, but I feel guilty, as I always do.

[LettingGo14]

I just want to call her & apologise for how I acted. The last drunken argument we had was probably one of the worst, and although she did start the altercation & said some really spiteful things, I retaliated & said some nasty things back.

I know I can’t keep going round in circles like this, and I know it’s now over for good between us, but I feel guilty, as I always do.

How do we work with guilt, Eric1?  It's a valid feeling, and worth considering all angles. 

The traditional view is to apologize and request forgiveness.  If forgiveness received, perhaps we can move on.  If forgiveness rejected, we still have to find a way.

Can we start by forgiving ourselves?   To me, that's where the rubber meets the road in the aftermath of our relationships, which are often messy and emotional and distressed.

Can you forgive yourself, and give yourself some space to heal?

[Eric1]

She called this morning. We've blocked each other, but you can get through by withholding your number. I ignored the first call, the second, but when it got to 14, i awnsered.

She apologised for calling, but said she couldn't sleep because she was worried then when we were apart, i might have caught something off another girl. I've told her before and reiterated that i always used protection. I told her this after we had sex, and the day after that.

We havn't spoke for 5 days, and this is what she calls with!

[Mutt]

She called this morning. We've blocked each other, but you can get through by withholding your number. I ignored the first call, the second, but when it got to 14, i awnsered.

You're re-enforcing undesired behavior, she knows it's going to take at least 14 calls for you to answer.

Here is a 2 min video on youtube on how extinction burst works

www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqHfEJt1ZV4

Common Trap: Remember, you don't want to inadvertently give them intermittent reinforcement to dysregulated behavior. This is easy to do, and once established extremely difficult to unlearn.

Intermittent reinforcement: slot machines use this. They pay out on irregular schedules. You never know when you will win, but you know that if you keep pulling the handle that sooner or later a pay out will occur. It may happen on the third pull or the twentieth pull, but you will win if you keep trying. The fact that you KNOW that you will eventually win, keeps you hooked into trying.

What does this mean? If you tell your partner that you won't answer the phone while at work, and they call you 20 times, and you answer on the 21st attempt, you have just inadvertantly given them intermittent reinforcement. Now they know that if they bug you enough, that you will always eventually respond. This actually escalates the behavior you are trying to stop. They believe they can win if they just keep pulling the lever, even if they go broke trying, they will keep at it. The more irregular and unpredictable your response to them, the more they will keep trying. It is the combination of hoping they will get their way and not knowing when it will happen that keeps them trying.

How to discourage dysregulated behavior.?

Consistency in not responding is the only way to discourage undesired behavior... .

Your partner has to learn that  when you say no, that you mean no.  Any hint of weakness is a reward, encouraging him/her to continue trying.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=85479.0