They know exactly what they are doing..

[klacey3]

Today wasnt a great day due to family issues. Unfortunately I gave in and replied to a message my ex had sent. He was being suprisingly honest about his mistakes. He admitted several things. He admitted all the times he called me slut etc was because he wanted to make me feel bad about getting with anyone else. He never really believed I was a slut. He didnt really insult me to people and people don't hate me, he just said it to hurt me. All the times he accused me of never loving me was also something he said to make me feel bad. He admitted he exaggerated on things to have the best of both worlds during the relationship. Basically he admitted he told me lies and said things to manipulate me and that the reason for his nastiness was "i was lashing out because I was hurt you were ignoring me. I wanted you to hurt like I do. I didnt mean them, I would say anything to hurt you". He even admitted he knows he treated me badly and didnt respect me but now he does respect me. When I mentioned I was so hurt he lied and manipulated me to provoke feelings, he said at least he admitted when he did wrong things. I said that it was awful he continually did bad things knowing they are bad but do them anyway with no guilt" he asked what my point was and said he wont stop lashing out when hes hurt and he wont ever leave me alone.

Motto of the story - Don't feel too bad for them. They know what they are doing and they are only saying it for a reaction.

Despite confirming to my ex that we wont get back together he is adamant that we will be together, that i will mother his children and that although he knows he treated me badly during the relationship, that I will get back with him apparently when my "ego has calmed down". He actually said i am only not with him because of my ego. He also said that the reason I threw the flowers on the floor he got me after accusing me of lying about something awful was "just for attention and show". I am shocked that after explaining i threw them away in public was because i was so angry at him. He doesn' believe it and claims if no-one else had been present I would have put the flowers in the vase, i threw them away for show" I was so angry at this point I tried to get rid of him by telling him I didnt love him. He said he didnt believe me, he knows i love him and knows i havent even kissed a guy since we ended because of how much I love him. (So contrary to being told continuously that im a sex obsessed slut :-/)

I don't know why I am surprised... I feel a bit creeped out. I don't remember him being this arrogant. Does this all sound like a dysregulation or just a narcissist being honest?

[myself]

Honestly, it sounds like someone to just stay away from.

Perhaps the original moves were dysregulation. The rest is cover up.

Yes, agreed, some of this is definitely intentional. Which makes it worse.

[purekalm]

Eerie, because this sounds just like my dad.

He'd rage at her, leave her, cheat on her and make her feel like she was crazy.

And THEN, he'd come back telling her how much he loved her, how it was her fault that he acted the way he did because of how he perceived her treating him in a such a nice way that she'd fall for it every time not realizing he wasn't admitting to anything so much as he was making sure she took the blame for everything.

In my experience, he just couldn't stand the thought that he didn't possess her, but didn't want anyone else to have her either. One of those, if I can't have it, even if I don't want it, neither can you type of things.

Also, how would he know if you haven't kissed a guy? Is he stalking you? Do you live around the same area or have the same friends where he would be able to gather this information?

My dad also did this, he would literally stalk my mom when they weren't together. With his uBPD he "made up" a stalker/boyfriend that was always around when he wasn't and constantly accused and accuses her of cheating on him with this guy. When, in all reality, this person either doesn't exist, he hired them or they were after him. (He used to deal in drugs quite a bit, but now is more of the one just getting them apparently.) It's all extremely toxic and scary. He used to threaten her with death all the time, she was so afraid of him. He actually told her once that he would kill her because he hated her and but didn't want to leave her to find somebody else... .yeah, just PLEASE stay away. Yours sounds like my dad, the most dangerous kind.

My advice? Even if you have the slightest inkling of any rekindling, don't! He most likely only wants you now because he doesn't have you and you aren't currently with someone else. Their minds are tricky sometimes, but I've lived with one long enough to figure out most of his antics.

[Suspicious1]

I could have pretty much written the exact same post about my ex husband (not BPD). He admitted his abuses and was arrogant about the whole thing. "Yeah I did it, but it was because I felt *this* so it was understandable". All abusers use that reasoning - they can see the thing they've done or said is bad, but think it's ok for them to have done it because of the circumstances.

My ex wasn't BPD, but he did have a lot of NPD traits, and I've often wondered if he had that disorder in some form.

[Herodias]

I think mine was NPD and BPD and even SPD! After we split he told me the "truth" about allot of things too. I don't feel sorry for him. He makes his own decisions based on whatever he wants at that moment. It's very hurtful

[mitchell16]

that was my exBPDgf favorite line. " yes I lied to you mitchell16 but it was your fault because I couldnt tell you the truth" this was in reference to her hooking up with her ex behind my back. Or " yes, I treated you bad but it was your fault I warned you it was about to happen but you wouldnt listen mitchell16" this was after she asked for us to talk about the what was wrong with our relationship and I told her what I thought was the problems and she raged at me out of control. So in the BPD world it alway someone else fault when they act out.

[Mutt]

Hi klacey3

Basically he admitted he told me lies and said things to manipulate me and that the reason for his nastiness was "i was lashing out because I was hurt you were ignoring me. I wanted you to hurt like I do. I didnt mean them, I would say anything to hurt you".

I hear rationalization and fear of rejection. BPD and fear of rejection:

Borderline Personality Disorder is a disorder of the emotions. Imagine a person who is extremely sensitive to rejection (fearful of even perceived or anticipated rejection) and has a limited ability to modulate their emotional impulses (love, fear, anger, grief, etc.). To protect themselves from their own feelings, they are prone to adopt a multitude of dysfunctional rationalizations and cover-ups.

For example, a person suffering from BPD may so fear rejection in a new relationship that they recreate themselves in the image of a person they believe would be lovable. When the negative emotions for making such a sacrifice surface - and not having the ability to modulate them, they lash out at the target of their affections for "making them do it" - rather than face their own feelings of inadequacy / fear of rejection, ultimately damaging the relationship they so fear losing, and reinforcing their feelings of inadequacy / fear of rejection.

What are the Symptoms of Borderline Personality Disorder?


Do you feel like you may be validating an attachment when you respond to his messages?

[klacey3]

Hi klacey3

Basically he admitted he told me lies and said things to manipulate me and that the reason for his nastiness was "i was lashing out because I was hurt you were ignoring me. I wanted you to hurt like I do. I didnt mean them, I would say anything to hurt you".

I hear rationalization and fear of rejection. BPD and fear of rejection:

Borderline Personality Disorder is a disorder of the emotions. Imagine a person who is extremely sensitive to rejection (fearful of even perceived or anticipated rejection) and has a limited ability to modulate their emotional impulses (love, fear, anger, grief, etc.). To protect themselves from their own feelings, they are prone to adopt a multitude of dysfunctional rationalizations and cover-ups.

For example, a person suffering from BPD may so fear rejection in a new relationship that they recreate themselves in the image of a person they believe would be lovable. When the negative emotions for making such a sacrifice surface - and not having the ability to modulate them, they lash out at the target of their affections for "making them do it" - rather than face their own feelings of inadequacy / fear of rejection, ultimately damaging the relationship they so fear losing, and reinforcing their feelings of inadequacy / fear of rejection.

What are the Symptoms of Borderline Personality Disorder?


Do you feel like you may be validating an attachment when you respond to his messages?

I probably did the wrong to reply... I am particularly weak at the moment because of family issues. Somehow it made me feel better to vent to him all of the reasons why I can't be with him.

I just wish I understood it all better. Npd or BPD... will he ever get to the stage where he will consistently love... does he really see the error of his ways like he is most recently saying due to be standing up for his nonsense...

[Mutt]

Hi klacey3

Basically he admitted he told me lies and said things to manipulate me and that the reason for his nastiness was "i was lashing out because I was hurt you were ignoring me. I wanted you to hurt like I do. I didnt mean them, I would say anything to hurt you".

I hear rationalization and fear of rejection. BPD and fear of rejection:

Borderline Personality Disorder is a disorder of the emotions. Imagine a person who is extremely sensitive to rejection (fearful of even perceived or anticipated rejection) and has a limited ability to modulate their emotional impulses (love, fear, anger, grief, etc.). To protect themselves from their own feelings, they are prone to adopt a multitude of dysfunctional rationalizations and cover-ups.

For example, a person suffering from BPD may so fear rejection in a new relationship that they recreate themselves in the image of a person they believe would be lovable. When the negative emotions for making such a sacrifice surface - and not having the ability to modulate them, they lash out at the target of their affections for "making them do it" - rather than face their own feelings of inadequacy / fear of rejection, ultimately damaging the relationship they so fear losing, and reinforcing their feelings of inadequacy / fear of rejection.

What are the Symptoms of Borderline Personality Disorder?


Do you feel like you may be validating an attachment when you respond to his messages?

I probably did the wrong to reply... I am particularly weak at the moment because of family issues. Somehow it made me feel better to vent to him all of the reasons why I can't be with him.

I just wish I understood it all better. Npd or BPD... will he ever get to the stage where he will consistently love... does he really see the error of his ways like he is most recently saying due to be standing up for his nonsense...

I think many of us on the boards have replied, myself included.

Do you feel like there's a part of you that finds it hard to believe that someone that you loved has a serious mental illness?

[patientandclear]

I think it's a particularly hard assignment to conclude that someone we love isn't going to be a reliable partner in the face of their assertions that they've learned and they're sorry.  Even if we know that they are mentally ill and even if we understand a lot about that mental illness, it still is very difficult to stare them in the face (literally or figuratively) when they're begging and making assertions of change, and maintain a course away from the relationship.

Which is just to say that this is super hard and it's super hard to be sure of the right thing to do, even if you're acting in the interests of your own future happiness. I know I would find it hard to turn away from what your guy is saying right now. I know, because I HAVE returned to an abusive r/ship (not the BPD r/ship that brought me here) with similar promises of change and statements of responsibility.

For what it's worth, I wish I had not. I probably took away the single best chance my abusive alcoholic exH had to really grasp the consequences of his behavior and consider doing the hard work of making real change (not saying that is how pwBPD function--"doing the hard work of making change"--with BPD it's not that linear and is even harder).  But my point is, saying "I see how I caused this and I want to change" is a far cry from having changed. Or having made concrete steps toward change.

If you agree, which it sounds like at some level you do (because you're still trying to stay gone), I might suggest explaining yourself in a firm but kinder way. It's not helpful to get mad at him. If you're going to make the hard decision to let him experience natural consequences, and you know you can't and shouldn't accept how things were, and you don't think they can be managed using Staying board tools or you don't want to go there ... .Then, you can explain your current position in a way that is devoid of blaming. With "I" statements that explain how you want your life to be, and an assessment that that doesn't seem possible with the two of you without a lot of change that there hasn't been time for yet. Or that your feelings have changed because of what has happened, and you just can't feel in love feelings anymore as a result, but you care for him and know this is sad and hard, and wish him well, and appreciate all that was good.

Point being, if you're going to hold this line, which 99% of emotionally healthy people would probably agree is a smart choice, you can still explain it kindly, and doing so in the long run probably will make it easier to be glad of your choice.

[klacey3]

I think it's a particularly hard assignment to conclude that someone we love isn't going to be a reliable partner in the face of their assertions that they've learned and they're sorry.  Even if we know that they are mentally ill and even if we understand a lot about that mental illness, it still is very difficult to stare them in the face (literally or figuratively) when they're begging and making assertions of change, and maintain a course away from the relationship.

Which is just to say that this is super hard and it's super hard to be sure of the right thing to do, even if you're acting in the interests of your own future happiness. I know I would find it hard to turn away from what your guy is saying right now. I know, because I HAVE returned to an abusive r/ship (not the BPD r/ship that brought me here) with similar promises of change and statements of responsibility.

For what it's worth, I wish I had not. I probably took away the single best chance my abusive alcoholic exH had to really grasp the consequences of his behavior and consider doing the hard work of making real change (not saying that is how pwBPD function--"doing the hard work of making change"--with BPD it's not that linear and is even harder).  But my point is, saying "I see how I caused this and I want to change" is a far cry from having changed. Or having made concrete steps toward change.

If you agree, which it sounds like at some level you do (because you're still trying to stay gone), I might suggest explaining yourself in a firm but kinder way. It's not helpful to get mad at him. If you're going to make the hard decision to let him experience natural consequences, and you know you can't and shouldn't accept how things were, and you don't think they can be managed using Staying board tools or you don't want to go there ... .Then, you can explain your current position in a way that is devoid of blaming. With "I" statements that explain how you want your life to be, and an assessment that that doesn't seem possible with the two of you without a lot of change that there hasn't been time for yet. Or that your feelings have changed because of what has happened, and you just can't feel in love feelings anymore as a result, but you care for him and know this is sad and hard, and wish him well, and appreciate all that was good.

Point being, if you're going to hold this line, which 99% of emotionally healthy people would probably agree is a smart choice, you can still explain it kindly, and doing so in the long run probably will make it easier to be glad of your choice.

I know I shouldn't be horrible but it is so infuriating. I told him all the nice things when I broke up with him, wished him well etc. He doesnt believe its over. Even after being out right nasty to him and bluntly telling him im not interested he responds with "im going to get a tattoo with your name on it". Its like talking to a brick wall...

It just makes me sad. His life is so ridiculous. He has so many issues with confidence it stops his doing basic things. Hes now a 30 year old caveman. He had 1 driving lesson and stopped because he felt like an idiot for stalling in his first lesson, he hasnt had a proper job in 10 years, he can barely have sex because he was always too worried about not being good at it, he still lives with his family and he cries because I wont be with him because of how he acted.