Making a Decision

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

I've decided I need to detach.

This is heartbreaking and oh so hard. I am frightened, hurting and worried about how to do this, given my failed efforts in the past. But I cannot keep putting myself and my kids through this anymore. If nothing else I have to do this for my kids.

Here's my plan for now, I would really appreciate advice, input and support:

1) I commit to not seeing him for at least a year. During that time I will work on myself. I need to examine why I have been engaged in a relationship that has been so traumatizing. I need to heal my childhood wounds and the wounds of this relationship. This will be the first time in my life I have committed to being single in order to heal.

2) If I do reengage with him following at least a year of healing, I commit to not involving my kids involved for at least six months or more, until he demonstrates change. Frankly I doubt that would happen, but it feels emotionally safer to leave that hope there.

I am going to try and stay as busy as humanely possible, especially on weekends, which are super hard for me. I just posted about an Emotions Anonymous group in my area that I can go to.

Since I have PTSD I need lots of structure and predictability, so I am going to try and create that. This may sound silly, but I already went into my calendar and wrote a year from now I could contact him if I want. I will put activities and reminders on weekends and such, and create check-ins with friends. I will probably post more than anyone ever has on these boards. I might even set a record for the amount a person can post. 

I am already getting flooded with panic, grief and pain and anger. I think one of my reasons for reengaging are these feelings that come up when I try and detach. I am just really angry at him all of a sudden, for being so abusive and hurtful. And angry at myself... .wanting to contact him is a way to minimize and avoid those strong emotions.

Question: what do you guys think about me telling my kids I am making a commitment to not see him? I haven't explained that he broke up with me again, this cycle has happened so often I think they are cynical of the whole thing, but relieved when he isn't coming around. The pros of making the commitment to them is I will have to stick to it. The cons are involving them in my private business, and a worry that it parentifies them. They are teens and young adults.

[HurtinNW]

I've decided I need to detach.

This is heartbreaking and oh so hard. I am frightened, hurting and worried about how to do this, given my failed efforts in the past. But I cannot keep putting myself and my kids through this anymore. If nothing else I have to do this for my kids.

Here's my plan for now, I would really appreciate advice, input and support:

1) I commit to not seeing him for at least a year. During that time I will work on myself. I need to examine why I have been engaged in a relationship that has been so traumatizing. I need to heal my childhood wounds and the wounds of this relationship. This will be the first time in my life I have committed to being single in order to heal.

2) If I do reengage with him following at least a year of healing, I commit to not involving my kids involved for at least six months or more, until he demonstrates change. Frankly I doubt that would happen, but it feels emotionally safer to leave that hope there.

I am going to try and stay as busy as humanely possible, especially on weekends, which are super hard for me. I just posted about an Emotions Anonymous group in my area that I can go to.

Since I have PTSD I need lots of structure and predictability, so I am going to try and create that. This may sound silly, but I already went into my calendar and wrote a year from now I could contact him if I want. I will put activities and reminders on weekends and such, and create check-ins with friends. I will probably post more than anyone ever has on these boards. I might even set a record for the amount a person can post. 

I am already getting flooded with panic, grief and pain and anger. I think one of my reasons for reengaging are these feelings that come up when I try and detach. I am just really angry at him all of a sudden, for being so abusive and hurtful. And angry at myself... .wanting to contact him is a way to minimize and avoid those strong emotions.

Question: what do you guys think about me telling my kids I am making a commitment to not see him? I haven't explained that he broke up with me again, this cycle has happened so often I think they are cynical of the whole thing, but relieved when he isn't coming around. The pros of making the commitment to them is I will have to stick to it. The cons are involving them in my private business, and a worry that it parentifies them. They are teens and young adults.

[Notwendy]

I suggest you don't involve your kids in this. If they ask- then tell them you are taking a break. I think more details is parentifying them. What can help is a 12 step sponsor to hold your feet to the fire if you so resolve, because like an addict or alcoholic- you will have moments of weakness. If you do lapse- a sponsor can keep you honest about falling into old patterns. Ultimately though you are in charge of this decision and you can seek out adults who can help you stick to it.

You know as a child how many times you got your hopes up over your parents and they let you down. Not that you would intentionally let your kids down. But we are all human and can let ourselves down. If someone does fall off the wagon- a sponsor can help them get up again. This is an adult journey. You can tell the kids you are getting help with your childhood issues, but don't involve them in your relationship issues.

[HurtinNW]

I suggest you don't involve your kids in this. If they ask- then tell them you are taking a break. I think more details is parentifying them. What can help is a 12 step sponsor to hold your feet to the fire if you so resolve, because like an addict or alcoholic- you will have moments of weakness. If you do lapse- a sponsor can keep you honest about falling into old patterns. Ultimately though you are in charge of this decision and you can seek out adults who can help you stick to it.

You know as a child how many times you got your hopes up over your parents and they let you down. Not that you would intentionally let your kids down. But we are all human and can let ourselves down. If someone does fall off the wagon- a sponsor can help them get up again. This is an adult journey. You can tell the kids you are getting help with your childhood issues, but don't involve them in your relationship issues.

Thanks Notwendy. You are absolutely right. Good advice. I will seek out adults who can help me stick to the commitment. I know it is going to be super hard. I think if the kids ask I will say, "I am taking a break. In the meantime I'm working on my own childhood issues." I do feel comfortable sharing I am working on myself because that's a good role model for them.  

Tonight I am going to the movies with my sons. We always have a good time together so that will be nice.

[patientandclear]

Once again I completely identify, and I really see that the rising tide of panic and fear of the implications of making such a decision have made me doubt it is the right one in my own life. I have stuck with it but it has been hard. I think maybe not being as clear-eyed as you about how much it necessarily would hurt made it harder for me.

For what it's worth, years back I took a nearly one year break from seeing or contacting my BPD ex (and I totally get why it is reassuring to write in your calendar that a year hence you can contact him). He was immediately enthusiastic about resuming contact and we went on to have a good, meaningful, 15 months of close contact (before it crashed and burned again). In other words, I'm guessing the door will not be closed if you choose to re-engage at that point.

I remain so impressed with your ability to separate your pain from your decision.

[formflier]

Yep, leave kids out of it.  If they ask, think through what to tell them

Make it a life lesson for them and not the answer to their question

Perhaps answer it in the context of a lesson about boundaries.

FF

[HurtinNW]

Once again I completely identify, and I really see that the rising tide of panic and fear of the implications of making such a decision have made me doubt it is the right one in my own life. I have stuck with it but it has been hard. I think maybe not being as clear-eyed as you about how much it necessarily would hurt made it harder for me.

For what it's worth, years back I took a nearly one year break from seeing or contacting my BPD ex (and I totally get why it is reassuring to write in your calendar that a year hence you can contact him). He was immediately enthusiastic about resuming contact and we went on to have a good, meaningful, 15 months of close contact (before it crashed and burned again). In other words, I'm guessing the door will not be closed if you choose to re-engage at that point.

I remain so impressed with your ability to separate your pain from your decision.

Thank you. That means a lot to me. And yes, one of the problems is I can promise a year from now we would be right back to the races. One of the draws of him is he remains convinced I am "the one" even as he repeatedly breaks up with me and is abusive. I am sure a year from now he will be single. He has had very few girlfriends, especially of the serious variety. In some ways that makes it harder.

One of my big struggles is the G in FOG. I feel a lot of guilt. I don't think he will do well without me. But he also didn't do well with me. That's the terrible, sad, awful part.

[Grey Kitty]

At some point the kids will realize that he isn't around. Knowing who will be in the house with them is very much their business. Perhaps you will need to state it explicitly, or perhaps they will figure it out.

Reasons why you are doing this is a very adult conversation. Someday your kids will be ready for adult conversations about how relationships work and don't work. Save that for such a day.


Things you can do to cope with this for a year... .

... .Over the years at various times I've been pretty capable of obsessively posting a LOT here. It isn't the worst coping mechanism out there! (If you overtake my total number of posts in a year, you might be cruising for a record, but that is a lot of work!)

... .do you have an individual therapist? I recommend it.

... .Schedule in physical activity. Walking. Running. Bicycling. Swimming. Zumba. Yoga. Gym workouts. Anything. Whichever ones you like most. If you can make your commute to work involve walking or bicycling every day that is great. I'm prone to low-grade depression, and physical activity helps. I know several people who are prone to anxiety, and physical activity helps them. For some people, low intensity (like walking) is enough. For other people, it needs to be more intense/aerobic to keep their mental state good.

[unicorn2014]

I did read this. I guess I was confused as to why you didn't post your first detaching post on the detaching board. Also why you were talking about things a year from now. My experience has taught me that detachment is one day at a time. If we look at our relationships with men with borderline personality disorder as addictions much like drugs or alcohol, we can only deal with them one day at a time. Also I don't know how familiar you are with the 12 steps but making a decision isn't taking action, its making a decision. What is the first action step you can take?

As to involving your kids, I don't think its a good idea to talk out loud to them about what you're doing unless they ask you. You know that triangulation thing you were talking about on my thread? Now if your children see you visibly upset and ask about it, then you will have to make a decision as to how much you are going to tell them or not tell them.

[HurtinNW]

At some point the kids will realize that he isn't around. Knowing who will be in the house with them is very much their business. Perhaps you will need to state it explicitly, or perhaps they will figure it out.

Reasons why you are doing this is a very adult conversation. Someday your kids will be ready for adult conversations about how relationships work and don't work. Save that for such a day.


Things you can do to cope with this for a year... .

... .Over the years at various times I've been pretty capable of obsessively posting a LOT here. It isn't the worst coping mechanism out there! (If you overtake my total number of posts in a year, you might be cruising for a record, but that is a lot of work!)

... .do you have an individual therapist? I recommend it.

... .Schedule in physical activity. Walking. Running. Bicycling. Swimming. Zumba. Yoga. Gym workouts. Anything. Whichever ones you like most. If you can make your commute to work involve walking or bicycling every day that is great. I'm prone to low-grade depression, and physical activity helps. I know several people who are prone to anxiety, and physical activity helps them. For some people, low intensity (like walking) is enough. For other people, it needs to be more intense/aerobic to keep their mental state good.

Thanks Grey Kitty. My kids are ages 13, 19 and 20. So I do have two young adults, both of whom have already had serious relationships themselves. So there is a level of adult discussion that I think can happen. My only concern is to not make them feel responsible for my emotional well-being. That is my job.

At this point he hasn't been around much the last six months or more anyhow. This last recycle I kept him separated from the kids for the most part, because I didn't want to put them through this anymore.

I think I will tell them I am taking a break to work on my own issues.

I just got back from a super long walk... .and I worked out this morning. Vigorous exercise is critical for my self-care so I am definitely upping the ante!

I'm trying to budget in a therapist. As FF suggested, it is worth it and we can tighten our belts a bit.

[HurtinNW]

I did read this. I guess I was confused as to why you didn't post your first detaching post on the detaching board. Also why you were talking about things a year from now. My experience has taught me that detachment is one day at a time. If we look at our relationships with men with borderline personality disorder as addictions much like drugs or alcohol, we can only deal with them one day at a time. Also I don't know how familiar you are with the 12 steps but making a decision isn't taking action, its making a decision. What is the first action step you can take?

As to involving your kids, I don't think its a good idea to talk out loud to them about what you're doing unless they ask you. You know that triangulation thing you were talking about on my thread? Now if your children see you visibly upset and ask about it, then you will have to make a decision as to how much you are going to tell them or not tell them.

Hello Unicorn. To be honest, I posted here because this group feels safe and comfortable for me. There is a lot of anger on the detaching board, especially male anger at women. That doesn't feel like the best place for me. Of course the moderators can choose to move this thread, and I am reading that board for the parts that are helpful.

I agree with one day at a time, but I also know for myself that making a commitment to a period works. It is a way I can detach. I am trying to take meaningful action too. Here are some of the actions I am taking:

1) I am checking out a EA group this Wednesday.

2) I am researching ACOA groups I can do.

3) I am doing lots of self-care and structuring my days.

4) I am reading, posting and learning a lot here and other places, including ordering Pete Walker's book.

I respond well to structure so that is my approach so far. 

[unicorn2014]

I read Pete Walker's book and it didn't do anything for me, I already knew everything in that book.

I understand what you are saying about the detaching board however that is really making a commitment to leaving. The detaching board has the lessons on leaving, not the deciding board. Also just because other people are angry doesn't mean you have to be. Additionally you can post on the PI board as you have been.

I know for myself that if I move over to the detaching board, that's it, I'm done, there's no going back for me, there is no recycling, so I'm not posting there until I'm absolutely ready to leave, and I'm not there yet.

If you are interested in learning the 12 steps I strongly urge you to find a traditional 12 step group such as AA, Al-anon or ACA. AA has open meetings where you can start learning about the 12 steps and how they work in people's lives.

I will repeat what I said about relationships with dysfunctional people being like addictions. I know I've been struggling with my own problems in that area since my pwBPD 2nd suicide attempt. I remember I was on the phone with a 12 step friend shortly before my pwBPD attempted suicide and that is what my friend told me. Although my pwBPD hasn't attempted suicide since, the relationship is still as problematic now as it was then. In my case that's because my partner is still married and still living in another state.

----

At any rate I applaud your decision to leave, that is never an easy decision to make .

[Daniell85]

I made a committment to myself about my ex, too. The conflict that blew us apart this last time had all of the elements of what has been so painful for me to cope with in the relationship. I didn't know what else to do immediately, except to walk away.

Specifically I walked away because he orchestrated a nasty situation, and when I showed some upset began ST, blocking, another smear campaign. Honestly, I am so tired out on that silliness.

I am not sure I am done, but I am done for now. I am meeting with a new therapist this week, and will see how that goes. I decided to wait two months, and evaluate how I feel. In the meantime, the ex ( IMO) really needs some time to think about his own life. He has been enormously upset about his own side of things, so broadly, I think it's a positive thing for him to spend time with himself.

And your ex, too. Left on his own for a longer period of time, maybe he can sort out his house and job situation. Hopefully he will think on his part in things. I honestly believe that when you step back for longer than they believe you are going to, they do start thinking on their side of the street instead of being all over your side about how awful you ( we, the nons) are.

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Hurtin', You've been through a lot and I support your efforts and decision, which I predict will lead to greater happiness for you and your kids.  If I could add one thing to your action list, it would be to observe your feelings and take steps to process them as they come up.  (I guess that was two things!).  There are different way to process feelings, in my view, and sometimes a combination is best.  You can: write in a journal; talk to a friend or family member; breathe deeply and let the feelings pass through you; do artwork or play music; practice mindfulness meditation; look at your feelings in an objective way (e.g., How interesting that I feel sad); etc.  You get the idea.

LuckyJim

[HurtinNW]

Daniel85, I am almost worried about that. The pattern with my ex is that after several weeks to several months after breaking up with me, he does have insights. He moves through the anger into regret, and then starts apologizing.

However, I need to remember that his insights never stick, and they do not lead to change. I have also realized he regrets his behaviors because of the outcome, not because the behaviors themselves are hurtful. Another poster said he sees BPD as an accountability disorder and I think that makes sense. My ex doesn't take accountability and instead quickly scurries back into creating narratives of justification when the relationship resumes. He has not made any progress in examining his behaviors, especially his FOO issues. Also frankly I think he lacks empathy.

I also am going to avoid seeing him. I've relapsed before running into him at events. So part of the commitment is not seeing him anyplace until I am well into healing or past healing.

Lucky Jim, those are great ideas! I am trying hard to identify my feelings. I've been doing a lot of ruminating, including waking in the middle of the night thinking about him. I have a tendency to go over everything in my mind, torturing myself. So I am telling myself "you are ruminating" and then I try to identify the real feeling, which is usually hurt or anger. It is hard to sit in the feelings. I know a lot of my intense feelings right now are grief. Grief for the relationship and also grief for all the childhood wounds this has opened up. I really was hoping to find love and acceptance in this relationship and it is a terrible, shattering loss to face that I will not.

[formflier]

 

I would focus more on what to do WHEN you run into him than on avoiding him.

A bit concerned that if you set your schedule to avoid him, he is still controlling your life.

It's one thing to not go to his house, or a public party that he is putting on.  It's another to avoid going to a public event that would be fun, because he is likely to be there.

I'm ok with doing that for a month or two, just to be safe, and if there are other fun public things you can do.  Not really sure how big the area you live at is,

FF

[HurtinNW]

That's a good point, FF. I live in a smaller city, so avoiding him isn't too hard. I have made the mistake before of going to an event soon after a break up and seeing him there, talking to him, arranging to meet... .well, you get the picture. Relapse and recycle. I want to wait until I am sure that won't happen. Just seeing him really affects me. I think at this point I do have a trauma bond with him, and I need to break it.

What I want to focus on right now is trying to make my world as healthy and healing as possible.

There's lots I can do and not have to worry about seeing him. We have tons of activities, and my usual daily stuff like the gym, going for long walks, seeing movies with my kids, are all things he doesn't like.

I really appreciate all the support you guys are giving me. It means a lot to me.

[formflier]

I'm a metrics guy, and then I try to match that up with  principle and "the right thing"

I think it's a fine thing to say for the next two months (the metric) you will set aside the principle (living your life) and take active steps to avoid him or the possibility of him in public places. 

I would feel good about you setting a date instead of taking my two month suggestion.

The point is that eventually you need to live your life.

FF

[Grey Kitty]

I have made the mistake before of going to an event soon after a break up and seeing him there, talking to him, arranging to meet... .well, you get the picture. Relapse and recycle. I want to wait until I am sure that won't happen. Just seeing him really affects me.

I like the idea of planning what you will do if you see him too.

Since you know you are at risk of doing something like this, your plan is pretty easy--make sure it doesn't get to the recycle phase!

1. If you see him, don't go over to talk to him.

2. If he comes over and does end up talking to you, rehearse what you will say. I'd recommend something like "Someday I hope we can talk and be friends, but I need to keep you at a distance for now." (And walk away after saying that, or after letting him say "OK"

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Hurtin', Rumination, in my experience, is usually unproductive.  I suggest that you tell your mind to "Cancel" or say it out loud, then consciously shift your thoughts to something positive.  Identifying your feelings is a worthwhile exercise, in my view.  If you are like me, you may have ignored and suppressed your emotions over a long period, so your feelings may seem unfamiliar at first.  It might help you to identify feelings if you consider the four basics types: mad, sad, glad and afraid.  Most feelings are variations on these four.  See if you can identify which category your feeling might fit into.  Usually one can sense when feelings are arising (for me they come in waves), which is the right time to stop and sit with whatever the feeling is.  You are doing well, so keep up the good work!

LuckyJim

[HurtinNW]

Thanks all,

In my family whatever I felt or said or needed was usually discounted. I didn't always learn to trust my feelings or feel I had the right to make a choice about what was good for me. Right now I think it is important for me to honor my feelings. And my feelings are telling me strongly that seeing him would be counterproductive. So I am going to not put myself in that spot if I can help it.

I do think that if I run into him a plan is a great idea. I don't want to leave a door open to "later" because he takes that as an invitation to contact me. How about a polite, excuse me if he approaches in public? If he runs into me and approaches me, how about I say something like, "I need some distance, take care," and then walk away. If I say I hope we can be friends later he will take that to mean tomorrow.

Lucky Jim, the ruminations are very unproductive, and something I do a lot. That's a good idea to put a stop to them. I need to separate ruminations from the feelings. I've been having a hard time sleeping, and woke up against last night at 3am, ruminating. I realized I was doing the PTSD thing of examining an event in which he had been abusive, and picking apart my behavior... .as if my behavior could have changed anything. It is a form of blaming myself, part of the feeling worthless and unloveable. It also avoids the feelings underneath. I am feeling vastly sad. I am afraid. I am deeply hurt. I am angry. A lot of these feelings predate him and go to my childhood. I feel he betrayed that child self. That's the hurt talking, I know. It's hard to let myself feel those feelings because they are so deep.

[Grey Kitty]

HurtinNW, Your plan if he tries to talk to you sounds excellent. 

I hope you don't even need it for quite a while.

Are you feeling any peace with your decision to end things with him today?

[Lucky Jim]

I am feeling vastly sad. I am afraid. I am deeply hurt. I am angry. A lot of these feelings predate him and go to my childhood. I feel he betrayed that child self. That's the hurt talking, I know. It's hard to let myself feel those feelings because they are so deep.

Hello again, Hurtin', Seems to me like you are doing an excellent job identifying your feelings.  When you're feeling grounded, perhaps after doing some deep breathing, you might try this exercise: let the feelings pass through your body, the way lightening passes through a lightening rod, into the ground.  Holding onto lightening is dangerous, whereas the electricity is diffused when it goes into the ground.

I suspect a lot of these feelings do date from your childhood, which is one reason why you got into a BPD r/s in the first place.  Now that you have identified the source you have the ability to change the pattern.

Suggest you take good care of yourself.  Go slowly and be kind to yourself.

LuckyJim

[patientandclear]

I realized I was doing the PTSD thing of examining an event in which he had been abusive, and picking apart my behavior... .as if my behavior could have changed anything. It is a form of blaming myself, part of the feeling worthless and unloveable. It also avoids the feelings underneath. I am feeling vastly sad. I am afraid. I am deeply hurt. I am angry. A lot of these feelings predate him and go to my childhood. I feel he betrayed that child self. That's the hurt talking, I know. It's hard to let myself feel those feelings because they are so deep.

I relate.  The PTSD-inspired reviewing of events to find the thing you could have done differently that would have prevented the hurt ... .it took me months or years to understand what was happening to me in these terms.  It's great you are aware that is what is happening.  I find this very very difficult to stop, but going after and deeply accepting the underlying hurt and sadness seems like the key.  My recovery proceeded most effectively when I used a concept of welcoming the hurt.  Sort of a "bring it on, I welcome you" mentality.  It was so painful but it was supposed to be there, if that makes sense.

xxoo

[gotbushels]

Good luck HurtinNW.

Here's a handful of easy steps you can take to supplement your plan. It was put up yesterday and has the right gist.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=291870.msg12744857#msg12744857

I hope the next few weeks for you go smoothly and without any hiccups. Take things in your stride and relax.

[HurtinNW]

Are you feeling any peace with your decision to end things with him today?

Hello Grey Kitty, No peace yet. Conviction, yes. Insights too, and I know I am surviving so far. One of the challenges is we have gone as long as three months before between recycles. My confidence has been unmoored. But this time does feel different. The biggest difference is realizing the relationship is hurting my kids and making the commitment that they come first. The second difference is really letting myself grieve the idea it is over.

Which is incredibly hard, very painful.

When you're feeling grounded, perhaps after doing some deep breathing, you might try this exercise: let the feelings pass through your body, the way lightening passes through a lightening rod, into the ground.  Holding onto lightening is dangerous, whereas the electricity is diffused when it goes into the ground.

I suspect a lot of these feelings do date from your childhood, which is one reason why you got into a BPD r/s in the first place.  Now that you have identified the source you have the ability to change the pattern.

Suggest you take good care of yourself.  Go slowly and be kind to yourself.

LuckyJim

Thanks Lucky Jim. I will try that. Yesterday I was dealing with a lot of anger coming up. I was able to name it, and what it felt like. Letting these feelings come over me is tough because they do feel so big, so raw.

I relate.  The PTSD-inspired reviewing of events to find the thing you could have done differently that would have prevented the hurt ... .it took me months or years to understand what was happening to me in these terms.  It's great you are aware that is what is happening.  I find this very very difficult to stop, but going after and deeply accepting the underlying hurt and sadness seems like the key.  My recovery proceeded most effectively when I used a concept of welcoming the hurt.  Sort of a "bring it on, I welcome you" mentality.  It was so painful but it was supposed to be there, if that makes sense.

xxoo

That does make sense! I hadn't realized before what I was doing, and how it relates to my PTSD and childhood trauma. I remember once in our early efforts at couples counseling the therapist kept saying I was not the problem. I simply couldn't see it. My ex was saying I was difficult and I agreed (part of me still does). I can see now that even if my behaviors are not always perfect, I am blaming myself in a very young way for being the cause of the hurt given to me. The feeling goes that I am "bad" and if I get hurt it is my fault.

The PTSD way of thinking then is if I got hurt, I search out what I did wrong. So I find myself going over break-ups, including this last one, thinking if I had reacted/acted differently it would be different. It's hard to break that pattern, because it always feels like it has truth to it. But a healthier person would think, "yeah, maybe I made some mistakes, but boy I sure didn't deserve that response!" Or, "why the heck am I still here? This isn't good for me!"

I like the idea of welcoming the pain. Making it my friend. It does make sense that the pain is telling me something that I have listened to before.

Thanks all. You are really helping me.

[HurtinNW]

Grey Kitty, I wanted to add one other difference I am feeling, and that is a feeling of hopelessness.

In the past when my ex recycled, we always welcomed him back. The kids were welcoming, and I was very optimistic. Pretty soon he and I would be back to talking marriage, making plans... .and then the cycle would start again.

Over time each time he returned he was a little less positive, a lot more critical, and the feelings of hopefulness and trust eroded. The kids began resenting his persnickety, critical behaviors. His baby steps into spending time with them ended (I don't think he was even aware of this change). The mask started coming off with the kids. Through this all he recycled, and recycled, and recycled.

This past year the kids gave up. They were tired of it, lost all faith, were hurt, and disliked his behaviors when he was around. My daughter began referring to him as "temporary man." My older son, who is quite a mensch, felt ex had no control over his emotions. Younger son, who is tenderhearted, withdrew.

So when we tried again this last time, it felt like the world had gotten small. He was clearly not comfortable in my place, though he said he wanted to come over and help. The kids refused to engage with him, though they were polite. I didn't want to go to his place, because it felt like a booty call. That left going out on dates, and I don't have much time for those. The consequences of his behaviors had led to this place where we had few ways of connecting and rebuilding. It was the same as four years of repeatedly bombing a city. There wasn't much left.

And then, after all that time and several years of him being unemployed and not really looking, he declared he wanted to sell his house and move in with us. As I posted, I didn't think this was unrelated to the fact he is out of money. I said no. Within a week he found an excuse to rage and break up with me again.

So the new feeling I have is one of hopelessness. Even if I wanted to rebuild after this break up, I don't see how we would. The tools are not there: the city was destroyed. It would take huge effort for him to regain trust with my kids, and that is not going to happen. It would mean him taking accountability for his anger issues and behaviors, and I don't see that happening either.

In some ways I feel I have no other choice than this path.

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Hurtin', I understand what you are saying but personally don't see your situation as one of hopelessness.  You have to let go of the old in order to grab onto the new.  This signals movement.  You are stepping out of old roles and rules.  You're shedding the inauthentic and revealing your true self.  These are all good things.  You're graduating from what in order to move towards what will be.  You could say that you are undergoing short-term pain in order to gain long-term happiness.  Hang in there,

LuckyJim

[HurtinNW]

Hey Hurtin', I understand what you are saying but personally don't see your situation as one of hopelessness.  You have to let go of the old in order to grab onto the new.  This signals movement.  You are stepping out of old roles and rules.  You're shedding the inauthentic and revealing your true self.  These are all good things.  You're graduating from what in order to move towards what will be.  You could say that you are undergoing short-term pain in order to gain long-term happiness.  Hang in there,

LuckyJim

That's a nice way to reframe it, Lucky Jim. I am stepping away from an unhealthy relationship into a more hopeful future. 

[Lucky Jim]

I am stepping away from an unhealthy relationship into a more hopeful future.

Exactly.  LJ