Ex Has Contacted Leaving Me So Confused

[stixx44]

Short version of our r/s:

We were together almost a year.  She broke it off I Sept 2017.  No contact until February this year for a one week recycle.  She broke it off again.

After 5 months strict no contact in July I went to see her and we had a 3-hour conversation about getting back together.  We still have feelings for each other, but she wants marriage and I don’t.  We are both in our 60’s.  We parted on good terms but she did not want to resume our r/s and I accepted it. I did not expect to hear from her again.  No contact for 6 weeks and then... .

She texted me in early September out of the blue.  She sent me a snapshot of a huge framed pelican picture she purchased for her wall as she knows I love them.  She said she wanted to share this with me,  I responded “beautiful picture.” 

An hour later she texted “Funny, now when I look at it, all I think of is you.”  I responded with “.”

Since she reached out, I sent her a generic bday card two weeks later.  I inserted a short note stating I was glad we could at least contact each other here and there (I wasn’t sure I would ever hear from her after our meeting at the end of July) and also let her know I would be having two knee replacements (she knew I had problems with them.) And I wished her a birthday filled with love and happiness and added I was always there if she ever needed anything.

I got a thank you text a week later and she offered to help me with my recovery.  I thanked her and told her my surgery was not until January and I would let her know if I needed help.  That was it.  No further texts.

Just last week she texted again that she has decided she loves eating mussels (one of my favorite foods... .something she always hated) and wanted to share that with me (I guess she’s big into sharing lately.)

I took this second unsolicited text from her as an opening to engage her.  We texted most of the day.  I tried to keep it light and stay away from anything that hinted at our previous romantic relationship.  I was trying to build a certain amount of trust with her.  I want her to keep contacting me.  I want her to know that I am the one constant in her life who she can always count on to be there for her.

She started getting into deeper stuff.  She revealed that she had problems dealing with my emotions and realized she was being selfish.  I’m not sure what that means.  In turn, I told her that I realized that she felt emotions much more intensely than I did, but I realized that too late.

I texted that “now that the dust has settled between us, I’m so happy we’re able to now communicate with each other without arguing.  You always have my heart.”

She responded with “As you have mine.  You got me to fall in love, something I thought was impossible for me.”

We ended the texting on a light note... .I asked her again if she was serious about helping me in January when I have knee surgery.  She said of course.  I explained to her that I would feel most comfortable with her if I needed help with dressing and getting into the shower to which she responded “I always liked you naked best!”  I replied “” and that’s where it was left.

I am left scratching my head. I still have strong feelings for her but have been able to live life without her.  I don’t know what’s going on with her. I don’t know why she keeps reaching out so sporadically to let me know she’s thinking about me.  But yet she never makes a move to ask to meet or see me, and I won’t go there either, as she’s the one who left.

I know how much she once loved me.  I don’t doubt that she still has residual feelings for me.  But maybe she just gets into being nostalgic and that’s when she reaches out.

Regarding her offer of help, I can’t see asking her unless we have an ongoing r/s of some kind, even if it’s just texting. And I’m not sure, at this point if I should start initiating texts with her.

I would love to hear thoughts as to whether she’s getting ready to recycle or is truly doing some thinking about her part in the relationship.  I guess I don’t know where to go from here, if anywhere.

[once removed]

this sounds like post breakup contact where the ice has thawed, and you both think/remember each other a bit more fondly, and have each done some reflecting on what they could have done better. throw in some flirting, too.

are you looking to have her back in your life? as a friend or a romantic partner?

[Lucky Jim]

Hey stixx44, It sounds like you had a one-week recycle earlier this year, right?  Are you contemplating another recycle?  Plenty of us, including me, have done it.  If so, what makes you think another go-round would play out differently?  What has changed?  I'm asking these questions because it's common to end up back in the same place, except with more pain and farther down the line, after a recycle.  What would you like to see happen?

LuckyJim

[stixx44]

Thanks for your responses. Would I like another go at our relationship?  Yes.  I feel that with all the time and space between us, and the tools I’ve learned here, there might be a slight chance of our being together and working things out.

She seems a bit more reflective lately and is not blaming me for everything.  She went to therapy (only three times) but was told that she contributed mostly to our demise because of her excessive drinking.  I know that exacerbates the problem and if she cannot get that under control, it will be difficult to work through things.  But I am willing to try.

At this point... .I’m in my 60s, as is she, I feel she is the one for me.  I will either be with her or alone, as I don’t want to look for anyone else.  I am not desperate to be with her.  I don’t think she can hurt me anymore than I’ve already been hurt... .and I have weathered that pretty well.

Truthfully, I don’t think we will find our way together.  I have a feeling these latest text messages are just her way of making herself feel good and knowing I’m there helps her.  I have no problem with that.  She’s a wonderful person beneath all the issues and if I can be there in any way, I will.

[LoveOnTheRocks]

I am the mother of a BPD, and not the lover of one (anymore).  The biological father of my DBPD was extremely disabled by it, as is my daughter.  Neither lover or parent with a BPD is extremely settling as far as I'm concerned, and being the lover of one in my past, I always felt that he excelled in some areas where others might not try so hard, because he knew he had difficulties in relationships with others.  I mention that, because I once felt as you say you felt, which is it is her, or noone.  I used to think that after such a dynamic lover (though it was pure turmoil in many other ways), I would never be able to appreciate a "regular... .settled" person.  I was wrong.  I've been married to my husband 16 years.  He adopted my DBPDD and has been a rock, even though we've both struggled with the hand life has dealt in many ways. While my husband doesn't "effect" the more extreme highs and lows my uBPDx used to, I have been happy with his dependability. 

I noticed another comment you made about how you refuse to make the first move since she was the one that broke the two of you off.  If, in your heart, you'de like to see her, I'm wondering if perhaps this persistent attitude might make things more difficult?  I am new(er) at this diagnosis, and certainly new on this board, so if this is a boundary and not something you are willing to look at, please forgive my asking you if you wanted to look at that a little.  Being honest about how I feel with my husband has never been a bad thing.  Even my husband and I have issues where I want to create a hard line, but if I do so, ultimately, I can't fully reconcile with him, which is crucial for our marriage to succeed and thrive.

I hope you have a good setup for your knee replacement surgery.  I am facing that, and know how critical it is to have a dependable "helper" to get me through the first month, at least, when I will be dealing with so much pain and difficulty in every aspect of life. 



 

[stixx44]

I guess I’m gunshy about contacting her because I did that in February after 5 months of no contact.

We had a wonderful week together... .she was very glad I came back.  And then after a wonderful night out, she told me on the way home in the car that she still wanted marriage in her life. I told her calmly that my views on that subject had not and would not change.  She texted me when I got home that if she stayed with me, “then I have to give up my dream.”  Five months of no contact followed that.

This was a conversation we had on our first date when we talked about what we want from life.  I was clear I would never marry.  She accepted that... .then.  I still question why she pulled that out after a very nice evening and a great week together.  I feel as if she used it to bring about another split.

As for my comment of her being the only one, I say that not because I believe there’s no one else for me, but I am getting older and don’t have the desire anymore to go online or to meetups to meet anyone.  I can be ok with being alone.  So if it’s not meant to be with her, then so be it.  I have friends and family and a good life in the meantime.

What brought me back here is a change in her behavior—her initiating contact about things that remind her of me, her offer to help me with my rehab.  And her statements of insight that she never voiced before.  She’s certainly not lovebombing me, and her texts are weeks apart.  But obviously I am on her mind.  Before these texts, I thought I was all but forgotten.

If there’s a chance to reconnect in some way, I would take it.  I am trying to be thoughtful, respect her space, and protect myself at the same time.  Normally I would get in my car and go over to her place. 

I want to do something different this time.  Perhaps my knee replacements will be the silver lining in all of this.  Maybe she actually will show up and help and we’ll either rekindle what we had or become casual friends.

But I’m also prepared for her not to even remember the dates and not text me again for a very long time.  One thing I have learned here is that nothing can be predicted.

Taking it one day at a time... . 

[LoveOnTheRocks]

Hi Styxx44:

I appreciate your great communication and answers to my questions. I’ve thought of your answers and people (women) in general this morning, before answering, because given your thought and care in responding to me, I wanted to give you a well thought response in kind.

I’m 52 years old and a woman, and not being emotionally involved in your situation, I honestly feel like I have a good objective understanding of the issues you’re working with here.  The both of you want different things, and to me, this isn’t so much about her BPD as it is about her upfront and homest communication in the beginning.  I can’t tell you how many women I’ve known who don’t let feedback like “I don’t ever want to marry or marry again” NOT deter them from trying.  We imagine that if things go really well, there is a chance this stated position of the other person might change, so... .we continue to date the person who has said they won’t ever marry again, thinking they may very well change their mind if things go swimmingly, and it is discovered that in fact, a true connection has been found.  After the connection becomes clear, and yet the “attitude” of the partner doesn’t change, even if we are emotionally vested, we realize that our goal and the other person’s change of heart won’t ever actually transpire, so we let go. I wonder if she said she would like to be married in your first date, even if she said she didn’t “require it.” If she said that, regardless of how she rationalized your position, then she did actually say she did want to be married.  Reading your post, it’s clear she has feelings for you, but that the two of you really want different results from a relationship. Spending a week of bliss with you in February only painfully reminds her that even though the two of you have a great connection, ultimate she honestly desires a lifelong commitment to result from her vesting herself into a man. 

She IS telling you what she wants.  Ultimately, I don’t believe you will be able to change her mind about what she wants any more than she can change your mind about what you want.  What I think will happen, if you continue to “flirt” with this connection, is more pain, because when it comes down to it, it’s going to always come down to dissatisfaction, regardless of the other things that happened in the relationship.  No matter how good or how bad the communication goes, no matter the attraction... .resentment is the resulting feeling if she allows someone else to encourage her to do what ultimately doesn’t lead to what she ultimately really wants.

If she did say that she would like to be married on your first date, did you hear that and do like her (in opposite), and imagine that she could be satisfied with a great relationship, if that’s what you gave her, and let go of her desire to be married, in favor of being perfectly content just having a great connection with you?

Reading your posts, all the discontentment centers around the fact that each of you really wants different things, and neither of you can persuade the other to “let go” of their stated desired outcome in favor of just enjoying the great connection that the two of you seem to have.  Both are feeling a loss of the connection you have, but recognize that ultimately, the connection can’t fully satisfy either, because the goals of each of you are so different.

What do you think about how I am understanding things?
Do you think you and her could objectively talk about the actual problem any further?

Is there a chance either of you could change your mind about what you ultimately want out of ANY relationship (meaning, the “partner” isn’t the problem, the individual desires are, and ANY partner would likely get the same reaction)?

 

[LoveOnTheRocks]

Objectively seeing two fictional individuals:

Billy and Susie.

Billy is a great guy who would like to meet a great girl to spend time with.  He doesn’t want to be married... .he has his reasons.  Could be he’s already been married, his wife passed away or they divorced... .or could be he doesn’t like being tied down, he see’s life as an adventure in which people come and go in his life, and he’s a totally free spirit.  Regardless of the “details” of Billy, the fact remains, he knows himself, what he wants and doesn’t want, and he’s a great guy! If he meets a great gal, she’ll be the only gal he commits to, but he would be most happy if the commitment he’s willing to make  is limited to monogamy, and he has his reasons, and they are AOK, because he has a right to seek and do what he feels is best for him.

Susie is a great gal who would like to meet a great guy and get married. She’s never been married before and would like to be with someone she knows has made a commitment to be THE someone she can depend on for the rest of her life.  Alternately (and this is because we don’t know for sure), she may have been married before and the commitment wasn’t solid for one reason or another, but at this point in her life, deep down, if she invests time into a man, she ultimately is doing it with the goal of seeing if he can be the one she’ll live with until death do they part.

Neither Billy or Susie is wrong for being who they are and wanting what they want from spending time with a special person of the opposite sex.  That said, they are completely wrong for each other and should not date.

That said, lets say that they meet each other and sparks fly.  They agree to go on a date to get to know each other, as they literally know nothing about each other.  In their first meeting, Billy speaks up first, telling Susie how he feels about marriage and what his goals are.  Susie thinks to herself... .hmmm... .this guy has probably been let down before... .or this guy is so awesome, I just know he wouldn’t continue to feel this way if he spent time with me.  I can see so much potential for the two of us.  We have the attraction needed, and beyond that, as I sit and listen to him talking, I can see so much in common.  I don’t need to run him off by telling him that I want marriage.  I am sure he’ll see things differently if he gets to know me and see’s what I already see... .we can and will be great together.  No need for me to put marriage pressure on him... .I’m sure every girl he’s ever met has already done that... .WE ALL KNOW that’s what girls do to guys... .and given time, he’ll see for himself what I can already see... .we are meant to be here together, now, doing what we’re doing, and it’s going to lead to great things.
I won’t “go there” with the whole marriage speech... .

Fast forward, she didn’t give him the speech, but nothing about her heart’s desires ever changed.  He knew who he was and what he did and didn’t want from the very beginning... .it’s all a logical decision... .one he came to, was comfortable with, is still comfortable with... .and right for him.  That said, Susie’s dreams and rationalization in her head, from date one, didn’t transpire, and Susie finds herself more and more frustrated, disillusioned and upset... .even resentful... .because this man just can’t see how perfect the two of them are together. 

Susie is operating from her emotions... .she always was... .and she made a grave (though not intentionally deceptive... .she thought like a lot of girls think... .which is that women pressure men almost out the gate, with marriage... .and if it’s meant to be, it won’t be hard for Billy to see that and take the next “natural” steps).  Again, she was not intentionally trying to manipulate him, she actually was thinking she’d give him a break with the pressure of the marriage speech... .and if it was meant to be... .later down the line he’d see that... .and it would come natural for him to want to tell her he didn’t want to live the rest of his life without her and for that reason, ask her to marry him.

So... .there’s a problem now. 

Susie’s way of thinking didn’t factor in Billy’s logics overriding his emotions... .certainly for most women, this is impossible, because emotions rule our lives... .or are certainly at the forefront of our thinking and decision processing and making.  Now, Susie’s hurt and resentful and Billy’s bewildered and confused as to why Susie is just now bringing this “NEED” up.  Not only does she “want” to be married as a result of the birth of a successful relationship, she is actually identifying this as a “need.”

Now, nomatter how wonderful the connection is between them, Susie cannot and will not be satisfied with it.  Regardless of how much space Billy gives her, whether he sends her flowers or hangs the moon for her at night time every night, he will not be able to satisfy her, because he never could have given her what she needed from a relationship... .from the first two paragraphs, it was clear that while they were both dynamic and incredible people, they weren’t right for each other. ... .and nomatter what either person does or does not do with respect to the other... .the two of them will never be content in the relationship unless one of them (on their own accord, and not as a result of manipulation from the other), decides that they would be ok with having different relationship goals.

Regardless of the emotions that have resulted from having spent the time and being intimate with the other, the objective facts are, that this never would have worked out, because even though both parties are great people, they are not the right person for each other. 

[stixx44]

Thank you so much for taking the time to think about my situation and write such thoughtful comments.

The marriage thing is complicated... .for me.  And I explained my reasons to her early on.  I had a partner for 40 years.  We had a wonderful relationship.  She died 6 years ago from cancer.  We were both church-going Catholics.  I still am, and my faith is very important to me.  Being gay and being Catholic causes its own internal struggles for me, but I deal with it.  However, I will not get married unless I can get married in the Catholic Church.  That will not happen in my lifetime.

My former partner and I lived as if we were married for many happy years.  We didn’t need marriage although we would have done it if it was available to us.  I told my ex that I could offer her everything I had with my former partner. 

It was not enough.

Ok, fine. I accept that this is a difference not to be bridged.  My problem lies in her not leaving me alone, contacting me, pulling me back in the way that she can.  Why?  She hasn’t changed her mind, as far as I know.  But then I think... .she just had a birthday.  She’s getting older.  The possibility of her finding someone who will deal with her issues and her drinking are dwindling.  Maybe she is rethinking and I’m starting to look better to her.

I don’t know.  All I know is I will field her sporadic texts as best I can and deal with whatever comes.  I have had my great love.  Many people cannot say that, so I’m very grateful for having had it. 

[once removed]

you have what sounds like an irreconcilable difference here, and i think LoveOnTheRocks did an excellent job in laying it out.

i think that whatever you do, you dont want to wing it, or just follow her lead.

try to set aside for a moment what she may or may not be open to... .she may change her mind, the two of you may come to an impasse.

are you open to changing your mind about marriage?

[LoveOnTheRocks]

Hi Stixx44:  
I didn't realize you weren't male and her female, so my posts to you "accused" you of being a male, when I am getting now that you are female.  I am only noting that, because if I have offended you in any way, by not understanding, I wanted to apologize to you.

Whatever the reasons for your desire not to marry, and any reason would be valid, because each of us has a genuine need and right to decide, first and foremost, what is best for us individually, before we add another to our world... .I agree with the question our moderator asked... .are you willing to change your position on marriage here?  

If you are, then there is a good chance you can "get the girl back," because that's what she wants from you, or whomever it is she is involved with.
If you are not, then regardless of how you see her chances (she's getting older, she's also an alcoholic)... .she really doesn't see it like you do.  Even if she does, it will kill her hope and dash her dreams to acquiesce to that... .this would be the same for anyone... .it's called settling, and no one WANTS to settle for the only thing they can get in favor of getting what they want in their heart of hearts.
Also... .and most important for you... .if she settles for what you're willing to give her, believe me, it will not come without a cost... .she will always be unhappy about the fact that she had to, and you'll pay... .one way or another... .

In reading your posts, when I take out your impressions, opinions, and thoughts, what I am left with is the bottom line issue you have.  It's unfortunate that we humans do this to ourselves... .but we get emotionally entangled with people and then we look at wants/needs and it's too late... .our emotions are already "there" so to speak.  The best thing we can do for our own self is to accept reality for what it is... .not try to change it... .or hope someone else will.

I am sure she misses you and periodically checks in to see if you're wavering on your stated position... .finds out you aren't, and goes back to her hopes and dreams of what she wants and what she knows you ultimately cannot or will not give her.  Being unprepared to let go of her desires for marriage, and wanting to hold out for a chance still, she goes back to her little corner in the world where she can salve her wounds and hope for a better day tomorrow.  It's what we all do.

On the subject of Catholic church wedding, I have a few questions.  I believe (and we don't have to believe the same thing... .hear me out and decide for yourself, and it's perfectly fine if we don't see things the same way)... .but I believe all these "manmade" religious types are just that.  I am a Christian who believes that when I get to heaven, they will not have Methodists, Baptists, Catholics and so forth, because all of these came after the bible... .where all of us who believe in the God of the Bible are called "Saints."  (In the bible, believers are called "Saints" and not Methodists, Baptists, Catholics and so forth).
Are you devoted to being Catholic, or are you devoted to the God of the Bible?
I am asking this with respect to the issue you have regarding getting married in your Catholic church.  Only you can answer this.  You don't even need to answer to me, but perhaps, if you are a Christian/Saint... .there is an alternative place where a Christian or Saint could take vows.  
Just wondering if... .if this is the biggest issue you have with getting married to her or any other female... .it could be resolved simply by going to another CHristian Church that does permit, within it's bylaws, a homosexual marriage... .Episcopal churches, for example?

Is it the position of the Catholic Church regarding homosexual marriage that is the problem?  If the Catholic Church changed it's position, would that remove all the roadblocks you believe are currently in place, or are there other issues herein that are causing you internal conflict?

[stixx44]

No, I will not change my mind about marriage. If we are ever to move forward, she would have to change her mind.

That’s why I really don’t think we’ll ever be together as a couple again.