Introduction: He thinks he's fine, I'm "the crazy one"

[BumbleBee83]

Hi.  I'm new here.  I have been married for just over a year to my husband who I'm fairly certain suffers from borderline personality disorder, as well as narcissistic personality disorder.  We have seen a therapist together a few times.  A few different therapists, a few times.  Two have mentioned BPD to me when I met with them alone.  I already had my suspicions.  

We had a terrible honeymoon.  We were in a foreign country and I guess the fact that he was out of his element (did not know the language, customs, etc.) put him on edge and in a VERY bad mood.  He did not understand the order of operations at the espresso counter at the airport on our way home, and he lost his marbles. Threw his food out because he was so embarrassed.  Of course he did not SAY he was embarrassed.  He said the people were all jerks and didn't know how to run a business, they were laughing at him, etc. etc.  But I know it was because he was embarrassed that he did not understand how their ordering/receipt/food delivery process went.  It carried on to the plane ride home where he called me a man hater.  This is because I have giggled (WITH MY HUSBAND) before about how I have a male family member that makes a big deal about getting a cold and literally goes to bed for days with chicken soup.  We've had a few private laughs about it over time, but now I'm a man hater.  

This has continued now for a year.  I stupidly thought that if I said the right things at the right time in the right way, that he would get help.  See a therapist.  Go on some medications.  He is high-functioning in the whole scheme of things.  But now I realize that he is never going to get help.  He thinks he's fine.  I'm the crazy one.  He says doctors are "kooks" and medication is for people who are "nuts".    He says I go to a therapist and take antidepressants and anti-anxiety medication because clearly I'm the one who has the problems.  I go to the therapist because it helps me.  And I take the medication because of him.

There are no support groups in my city.  I'm grateful for this one.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[isilme]

Hello, welcome to BPD family.

This has continued now for a year.  I stupidly thought that if I said the right things at the right time in the right way, that he would get help.  See a therapist.  Go on some medications.  He is high-functioning in the whole scheme of things.  But now I realize that he is never going to get help.  He thinks he's fine

BPD is not like clinical depression, where you can get on meds and feel better.  Things CAN improve, but the fact that BPD is tied to avoiding shame and blame, and yes, embarrassment, it's very hard for a pwBPD to admit they need to change how they react to the world.  So, let me start off that while therapy CAN helps SOME pwBPD, it's not the end goal for a "fix".  Many of us on here never tell our SOs they seem to have BPD.  BPD is hard to actually diagnose in a clinical setting, many Ts miss it.  Many T's can even fall for the story told by the pwBPD and then make YOU out to be the problem. 

It's a learned set of behavior meant to protect them from ever acing not being perfect, not being right, far easier to make the world wrong than them ever be wrong.  TO admit it means they would need to paint themselves black - they have trouble with people being, well, people.  Someone has to be ALL good, or ALL bad. It confuses them to care about someone, but then be upset with them or disappointed in them. 

It's good you are in T.  I hope it helps you - we all need a place we can talk.  Just don't hinge getting him into T as the only solution. 

I think if you read "I hate you don't leave me" and "Stop Walking on Eggshells", it may resonate a bit.  Or, just read and reply to any of the posts on here.  We all welcome someone validating for us what our SOs are not equipped to do.

And that's the big point to look at - BPD is an emotional disability.  And in men, it does seem to be a lot like NPD at times, too.  Self-aggrandizing, needing to be right, never embarrassed, blame all embarrassment on everyone else.  My husband is like this, it can be hard to manage around it.  Also, it's like diabetes.  It's always going to be there, and even if you do "everything right" some days will be better than others. 

I found that trying to be more validating and to stop arguing after it becomes fruitless and just enrages him, helped overall make our lives calmer. 

How is your day to day?  How do you handle things he says or does that made you believe BPD was involved? 

[BumbleBee83]

Thank you for your kind reply.  It does help to have validation.  Sometimes I begin to believe the horrible things that he says about me.  Such as:  I'm a spoiled child, I am completely unsupportive of him, I have to have everything my way, that he had a boatload of self-esteem for the first 45 years of his life... .then he met ME!  And I have broken him down into this person that is completely unsure of himself.  I know none of this is true.  In fact, I think the opposite is true and he's projecting how he feels about himself on to me.  But he can go after me for days sometimes, and there are times that I start to wonder if he's right.  It takes a while to recover from his attacks.  Usually we just don't speak for several days. 

The day to day is, well, day to day.  He kind of cycles.  It's been maybe 7-8 weeks since his last major meltdown.  But, also, I am learning not to trigger him, so it's possible that I'm the reason that he's been pretty good for this long.  Not triggering him for me means not talking too much, not talking about my friends (boring) or my work (I'm bragging and somehow belittling his work and leaving no time left for him to talk), agreeing with every idea he has, wording things "properly", not mentioning that he's angry or upset for hours or days, not "complaining" (this includes mentioning that I have a migraine, but he can bemoan every little thing that he doesn't like about our beautiful new house and it's not complaining, it's something else that I can't even describe because his explanations of how I'm wrong and he's right are like being caught in a tornado and I can't understand or remember what he says sometimes), those kinds of things. Right now we are at the beginning of one of our days long silent spells, I guess you'd call them.

I am making my way through Stop Walking on Eggshells.  It will be helpful.  This current argument spun out of control because I tried to explain my feelings to him in a rational way.  I tried to defend myself when he said unkind and untrue things about me.  It's so hard to hear him talk to me that way.  I don't know why he's with me if he really feels that way.  I could have married someone that really loves me... .

Most recently he threw a birthday party for me.  It was stressful on him.  While it was sweet of him to try to do that, anything stressful makes both of our lives hard.  As the party got closer and he became more stressed, he came to me with all of his frustrations.  Telling me what a pain in the a** everything was, how this was ruined and that was ruined because a person or two cancelled.  I was home for a flower delivery he wanted to intercept and he was furious.  Blaming me for coming home at the wrong time and saying he can never surprise me.  It was awful.  Who wants a party like that when you have to feel guilty about all the trouble you are causing?  I cried a little the morning of the party.  I really tried not to because I knew how mad he'd be, but I took about as much of the blame as I could.  He's still rubbing it in my face that he did this fabulous thing for me and I could have been happier about it.

My goal right now, I guess, is to really learn to use strategies not to engage with him.  It seems hard to be the one all the time that's not supposed to show emotion.  To not let them know they are hurting you or getting under your skin.  It seems like I have to be the mommy to an insolent child that's never going to grow up.  I'm sad and scared and angry.

[isilme]

BumbleBee83,

I can relate to almost every feeling you listed.  I can also say that it doesn't have to always feel this way and that I am sure on good days you feel better.  I've had some pretty crappy birthdays because H either didn't want to even try (fear of failing), or he was stressed and freaked out about tiny things that don't even matter to me.  He is like this about our wedding anniversary, too (we took 20 years to finally get married) so no matter what effort I put in, he's going to freak out and cause a fight. 

Yes, we are more emotionally capable, and sadly, that means we shoulder more responsibility for handling ourselves, while they seem unable to do so.  But, I will say I've noticed that some things H does IS him attempting to calm down  -silent treatment is both a punishment AND his only method to calm down.  So I focus on giving him credit for the latter and take it as a break from being yelled at.  Win win? 

I think you are working to find ways to keep things from escalating, but this is not supposed to mean you suppress all emotions (yes, it can sure feel that way).  If you find new, more effective ways to communicate, avoiding invalidation and JADEing you can find ways to make your thoughts and preferences heard.  It takes time, and practice, he needs to be trained a bit to accept your new ways of talking to him. 

Yes, things can be one-sided.  Yes, he will complain.  A lot.  Dear God it wears me down, too.  Part of my problem with the complaints is that I see them as a call to action, for me to "fix" things or "make him feel better".  But I can't.  Only he can fix these things, or they are really not a problem at all, or his disordered thinking has painted someone or something black and so it's not even real, or, it's his own demons he's fighting but he can't do it internally. 

I think my H has no internal monologue, hence the incessant complaining.  He has admitted a few years back he cannot process bad feelings unless he has a target, a human being, to yell at.  On some level he knows this.  He still yells at me when it rains, as if it's my fault, but I try to simply not let any pain reach me about it.  I think he can't work through problems without talking forever about them - he does not really want input from me (since he ignores it usually in the end).  He just can't THINK it, he can't talk to himself (like I do - I'm bad about that), he has to talk AT me for things to click in his own head.  I am literally a sounding board for his words to echo back at times.

This current argument spun out of control because I tried to explain my feelings to him in a rational way.  I tried to defend myself when he said unkind and untrue things about me.  It's so hard to hear him talk to me that way.  I don't know why he's with me if he really feels that way.  I could have married someone that really loves me... .

This is JADEing.  With rational people, we believe we can solve disagreements by Justifying, Arguing, Defending and Explaining.  This works with people on issues where there is little to no emotional stake in the game.  But, every one of these is an invalidation to a pwBPD.  The minute you catch yourself explaining - stop.  Depending on the level of dysregulation, where you are on the level com calm to rage, you may be able to backtrack and use SET instead.  Sympathy, empathy, and Truth.  If you are too far down the scale, it's best to simply disengage as best as you can, and then when calm, determine if its, even important to return to the topic.  Some topics simply need to be dropped.  Some, like things that affect bills or jobs, can't be dropped.  If you have specifics, we can ask others to chime in on suggestions on how to approach tough conversations.  I find a loosely planned script can help a bit sometimes.  DEARMAN is another tool people use, but I am still working on stopping JADEing when I catch myself, and using SET when I remember to. 

Also, this might be small consolation, but he does love you.  I believe pwBPD are most likely to show this side to only those they consider close enough to them to see it.  Lucky us, we get to see Mr. Hyde because H thought so much of me he feels I am an appendage of him, and treats me as such sometimes.  I am an external organ, to process all things he can't, to manage all things he'd let fail, and allowed to see him at his very worst.  And his best.  I have to give him that.  As bad as the BPD can be, he is someone I think tries to be a good man - he's just not always good to me.  And he has this disability, BPD, that makes that so. 

Remember the words said in anger are the disability.  It's like he has emotional food poisoning, and needs to vomit out all the bad emotions, and sadly, he needs you to catch them for him.  You don't have to hold onto them.  Do just what you'd do if he was really projectile vomiting on you - you'd not keep that around, you'd go rinse it off. 

I hope thigns get better.