where does our obsession with pwBPD stem from?

[Depression = 72% of members]

Not sure about you guys, but my fixation with my exBPD partner is not the first time I have experienced periods of obsession.

If I were to be honest, I've had it maybe 4 - 5 times in my life. And I am not sure those exes were borderline.

So this clearly demonstrates that I have my own issues - exclusive of BPD. The past year has been one of exploring what those issues might be.

Codependency ranks high on the list of possible diagnoses and I tick an awful lot of those boxes. And some of the reading talks about obsession being a maladaptive coping mechanism for childhood trauma, that actually causes more pain. Shame at feeling obsessed and out of control breeds more fear, loss of control, more shame and more obsessing about ways to curb the resulting anxiety and fear.

But how do you get to the root cause of the maladaptive coping mechanism?

How are we meant to cope better?

How do things get so distorted that a situation that was fine one day (break up) becomes an obsession the next?

I think pwBPD become a riddle and don't make the finding of that answer any easier, so these things drag on. But still, how do we find the answer to the root cause of codependency and obsession?

thanks

BB12

[bb12]

Not sure about you guys, but my fixation with my exBPD partner is not the first time I have experienced periods of obsession.

If I were to be honest, I've had it maybe 4 - 5 times in my life. And I am not sure those exes were borderline.

So this clearly demonstrates that I have my own issues - exclusive of BPD. The past year has been one of exploring what those issues might be.

Codependency ranks high on the list of possible diagnoses and I tick an awful lot of those boxes. And some of the reading talks about obsession being a maladaptive coping mechanism for childhood trauma, that actually causes more pain. Shame at feeling obsessed and out of control breeds more fear, loss of control, more shame and more obsessing about ways to curb the resulting anxiety and fear.

But how do you get to the root cause of the maladaptive coping mechanism?

How are we meant to cope better?

How do things get so distorted that a situation that was fine one day (break up) becomes an obsession the next?

I think pwBPD become a riddle and don't make the finding of that answer any easier, so these things drag on. But still, how do we find the answer to the root cause of codependency and obsession?

thanks

BB12

[HowPredictable]

There are some excellent threads that discuss the unique fascination that partners of pwBPD often have for solving the "riddle" of why these people behave the way they do.  For starters, try this one, and in particular the post by 2010:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=161524.msg1548981;topicseen#msg1548981

And yes, I too had a long period of fixation with exBPD, trying to untangle his disturbed psyche and fix his problems.  Prior to that, I unwittingly became an "expert" in the dysfunction of a prior ex, very likely toxic NPD.   Seems to be my thing.

[bb12]

thanks HP

great thread! and yes, I think I was a Lonely Child and that this affected my ability to move on. Got stuck in understanding mode.

my ex more likely NPD than borderline and yes, I reckon I am expert on that dysfunction now too.

time for this stuff NOT to be my thing any more!

bb12

[Surnia]

Hi bb12

This is a very good question and you made some very important observations about yourself and your mechanism.

One thing that helped me: The unhealthy coping mechanism I have in present days were developped to my best in childhood days. As a very little child you have stick with your parents. You have to do all for your mother, she is the one who protect you, nourish you. You had no choice in early childhood days.

As a adult I have choices. My focus is now: Learning new behaviours. Rewire my brain. In my case, learning to be more assertive, sticking with my boundaries. Unlearning and new learning. For me it is not resolving a riddle. Its about learning new skills. This is my path. I guess there are others out there.

[KellyO]

Very good topic!

And acute for me, since after being many weeks quite stable I find myself kinowing my ex is still the love of my life. I have red this forum carefully, and I have noticed that for many people this BPD-person was something different. Not for me. So I don't even like to throw diagnoses anymore, I have seen all kinds of behaviours, one ex was very narsistic, one was pathological lier with sex addiction, one was quite normal but super-selfish... .  I have a long list of disaster relationships. I have come to conclusion I'm very much the problem. When I'm on defense and angry I blaim my ex for everything, when I'm "myself", I can very well see how emotionally unstable I am, how much I have problems. For two years I have worked with myself, and it is a long road with bumps. And yesterday I realized, I still keep hope to make it work with him. I still have love for him. I know it is real love, now I just have to live with it. Our relationship was this lonely child/abandoned child-thing exactly. I criead when I red the description here, it was devastating. Like, was my love nothing more than coping issues and drama and twisted mechanisms.

I can look back to my more stable relationships and see I have BPD-traits. I can see relationships after age 30 and see I am codependent. I can see my ex has ADHD and 100 other problems. I still love him, I just can't be with him. And it kills me. I don't believe my love is trauma-bond or imagination or attachment. I really love him. We are just not good for eachother. I said to him we kill eachother emotionally. I believe there can be a bond between people that is not from this lifetime or from this world. We both have this feeling... .  but for him it is too easy solution to replace me, and I can't trust him. I just have to accept things are like this now, and live with that. And keep working with myself.

None of this was his, or mine, fault. We did not choose to be like this. We wanted to be happy, and we have no idea how. I have no idea what a healthy relationship is like, I have never seen one. And he believes every man is like him, he is normal. So he really believed for a long time our relationship is very normal, and we just have fights. For me those were episodes of abuse. He can't be different yet, he does not know how. I'm sure one day he will. But I'm not there wittnessing it.  But it is how it is.

[almost789]

I wish I knew this myself. I've spent so much time obsession about his disorder I know more about him than me. The root cause stems from most likely something built into our brains from childhood, adolescense or perhaps adulthood in some cases. A good therapist obviously could probably help you find the root cause for the issue. What I find though is alot of therapist aren't all that good and many of them have their own issues and if you get one of these they could potentially mess you up more than you already are. This is my mistrust speaking, but really, it's not easy to find a good therapist. They are not all equal. I've been reading into books that take you back into your childhood trying to find my answer. Some of them are on this website.

[FindingMe2011]

   In some relationships, the idealization phase is the partner being in lonely child stance and the Borderline being in abandoned child stance.*Both need saving* Both need attachment to stave off the pain of being alone.  This is one type of bonding seen in this community.

In this bond, both people bring core trauma to the relationship. Mirroring reenacts the earliest childhood experiences to rise up and emerge into consciousness.

In idealization, there is a dual identification and projection for both people that they have found a perfect love- however, one partner (the “lonely child”) does not yet realize that the other partner (the abandoned child= Borderline) has no whole self- and is utilizing a fantasy of a part-time good in order to fuse with the partner's part time good and become one.

The lonely child has spent much of their life becoming “one.”  When a lonely child finds an abandoned child, both parties feel needed. However, rather than truly loving the individuality of both parties- the sad, fantasy aspect of mirroring magnifies the unhealthy *needs* of both people.

When the lonely child begins to question the reality of mirroring (reality testing) this raises core traumas into activation concerning both the questioning (uncertainty) and the hope (unfulfilled expectations) of the unrealistic attachment. "Lack of inherent trust" is found in both parties at this stage.

Reality testing causes the lonely child to pull away because certain things don't add up- as you say, "the idealization phase slowly erodes."

Pulling away, even while in the lap of comfortable luxury- triggers the abandoned child issues of the Borderline. This causes panic reactions of clinging behaviors by the Borderline to prevent the retreat of their desired love object. These immature demands can look like entitlement to others, especially to a lonely child, who has learned early on to be self sufficient and to self soothe- but the entitlement markers are highly charged and emotional to a Borderline, which isn’t Narcissistic grandiosity- it’s ego deficiency and panic.

The entitlement phase brings a hidden "angry and aggressive child" out from hibernation and into full view and this usually occurs when the lonely child least expects it.  The angry child that emerges is pissed and has delusions of persecution that are ideas of reference from earlier childhood trauma. It’s at this point that the angry child (Borderline) will become enraged and try to cast off shame.  They may attempt to harm himself/herself in order to scapegoat the lonely child- who unwittingly stands-in for the earliest attachment.  This triggers the lonely child's trauma from their earliest attachment as well.

The Borderline wants so badly to be whole that they demand that the lonely child create wholeness for them- which the partner succeeds in doing early on but then relaxes. The Borderline temper tantrum, with its ideas of reference being so very childlike and fantastic, perceives the relaxation of the partner as though the attachment is split up. In order to cope, the Borderline must now find another part time perceived good object to self medicate the emotions of feeling badly from the split.  If this cannot be accomplished, the surge of limbic fear concerning anger and abandonment causes such great pain that self harm is often inflicted for relief.

The lonely child is often very surprised by this. The anger and dysregulation are in contrast to what he/she perceives are necessary for the circumstances. (The lonely child fails to see need disguised as "love."  Therefore, the lonely child seeks to understand the Borderlines ideas of reference concerning "love" in order to cope with the neediness and begins a line of questioning.  The Borderline retreats.

Lonely child is "understanding driven" and gets drawn into the Borderline acting out. The lonely child now has a mystery- the Borderline dilemma of "who am I?" This is very likely the same way that the lonely child came into existence as an “understanding driven” child. Especially when he questioned the motives of his earliest attachments during infancy and adolescence.

The lonely child *understands* the need to be held, loved and understood – because that’s what he longs for in others. The lonely child feels that in order to deal with acting out of the Borderline- the lonely child must project the aura of grace, compassion and understanding upon the Borderline and also guide, teach and show the way- because after all, that’s what the lonely child would want someone to do for him. There was a large reason that the initial mirroring (of this fixer /rescuer ego) worked so well in the idealization stage- the relationship really WAS the projection of lonely child that was mirrored, not the deficient ego of the Borderline.   

[waitaminute]

The root cause of why many of us like to be the knights in shining armor is interesting. But for me, I want to understand this not to eliminate the "knight" within me but to help the "knight" make better choices on the who, what, why, when, and where the armor should shine.

For instance, I am an engineer. I will convert my engineering skills to water resource engineering... .  Helping people that have no clean water. But even in that field there can be some truth to the saying "no good deed goes unpunished". There are some places where war and greed will punish those who try to help people. And since I value my hands attached to my wrists and my throat in one piece, I might have to be a "knight" from a distance.

At the personal relationship level, it's a little harder to stay safe. I tend to merge with some...   like those who mirror. So I don't have all the answers yet as to what kind of rs is good for me. Working on it.

[myself]

Great questions, bb12. Many good posts from you recently, your self-work is really working! As deep as we go, digging through our own roots, at certain times there also needs to be an acceptance that the roots themselves stretch back through the generations, and we may never get to the bottom of them. We do our best to be able to continue forward, in the healthiest ways we can. Changing our own patterns. I think this is a different process for each of us. Your issues may not be mine, etc. Focusing more on yourself would cut down on time spent focusing more on others (one easier answer). Learning to not obsess over obsessing sounds good, too. Making sense of life is one thing. Living sensibly is another. That's why we're here. The whole BPD 'square peg in a round hole' situation distracts us from the reality of our Actual Chances. It was all worthwhile, for awhile. It helped us find: Ourselves. The emptiness we feel, coming through betrayal, abandonment, abuse, etc., can be filled with ruminations, anger, despair... .  Once we begin to get past it, refilling ourselves with positives not negatives, we're really on our way to something better. Let's learn from the past, make less mistakes in the future, and 'obsess' about a healthier here and now.

[HostNoMore]

Very introspective question bb12:

For me trying to comprehend the incomprehensible is a quest to understand why I allowed myself to be drawn into a BPD quagmire and chose to remain.  I know why I was drawn to her initially.  I was attracted to her, and we got along very well.  She contacted me out of the blue and told me that she wanted a relationship.  I was very vulnerable too as I was just out of a relationship with a great woman who had to relocate to a place far away in order to find work.  At this point, everything was normal but very quickly the BPD crap started.  Even though I had no clue of what BPD was, I still should have turned around and walked away.  Yet, I did not do this.  Why?

The "Why" part is where I turned the mirror that my exBPD used to trick me onto myself and began to examine myself in great depth.  I learned that people pleasing and low self esteem were my main issues.  They hurt me in my BPD relationship, and even worse, they hampered my career.  Now, that I have recovered from the trauma of my BPD experience I can clearly see the main issues that have haunted me my entire life. I've made amazing progress in overcoming them.  First you identify the problem then you solve the problem.

I recently had an old friend return into my life.  She has had nothing but an endless string of abusive boyfriends and a husband for nearly 30 years.  She is getting divorced right now, and her number one issues that she realized were people pleasing and low self esteem too.  We had a very long conversation about these subjects that went on for quite a while.  I think she is going to be OK from here on out though as she told me she will have nothing but healthy relationships for her onward as will I.

For the gained knowledge about myself, I am very thankful that I experienced the madness we call BPD.  I would not have been able to say this one year ago.  That which does not kill us makes us stronger.