4 years later I'm back on the boards with a NEW BPD Partner...

[Candace30]

Hello everyone.  I never dreamed I'd be back on the message boards with a new BPD partner, but here I am... .  

I stumbled across this site over 4 years ago when I was involved in a same-sex relationship with a BPD female.  These boards helped me TREMENDOUSLY, and I was able to detach and leave that relationship.

Now I'm here because I have been involved with a BPD male for the last 2 years and 11 months.  It seems that I have just repeated the same relationship pattern, but with a different partner.  I don't know why it never occurred to me that he was BPD.  All of the signs were there, but it didn't occur to me until last week what I was dealing with.  I think because he is a high functioning BPD, compared to my ex gf.

Over the past few years, we have been engaged in a very frustrating push-pull dynamic.  He creates distance between us when we get too close, but comes running after me when he fears losing me.  I thought he was just being your typical commitmentphobe. 

There are other so many things that I overlooked because I was so focused on the "commitment" issue.  Some things I overlooked include hypersensitivity, intense rages, constant testing of my love for him (sometimes making up ridiculous stories to make me jealous), lack of boundaries, calling repeatedly at all hours of the day and night until I pick up the phone, emotional abuse, control issues, silent treatments, cruelty, constant put downs, neediness, abandoning me at critical times, picking fights when things were calm or we were getting close, substance abuse, flirtations with other women right in my face, and blatant disrespect.

He has told me many times that he is aware that he is "toxic", that he "has hurt every woman who has ever loved him or tried to get close to him", and that "he maintains his distance because he knows he is hited up and he doesn't want to hurt me too".  He's told me this many times, and again, I was so focused on getting him to "commit", that I thought he was telling me this as a way to avoid a commitment to ME.  That maybe, "he's just was not that into me".

I've been praying about our situation, and it's like a light bulb has been turned on for me.  I don't know how I didn't see it.  I was so focused on his REJECTION OF ME and what I could do to be seen as someone worthy of love in his eyes that I overlooked everything else. 

I spoke with him on Saturday and explained borderline personality disorder to him.  He'd never heard of it, but agreed with me that he had all of the traits.  However, when I broached the subject of going to therapy, he didn't seem like it was something he wanted to do.

So, now I'm walking away from the relationship.  It is extremely difficult for me.  Especially since we were just intimate 2 nights ago.  I want so badly to believe that we can be together, but history has taught me that this is not possible.  History has taught me that it usually does NOT get better.  Especially if the BPD is not in treatment.

So, I'm here and I'm hurting.  But I know that I need to walk away from this relationship for me.  I am hoping that being here will give me the strength to leave like it did in my other BPD relationship.  And I hope that I will get whatever help in insight and need so that I WON'T be back here again in the future with a NEW BPD partner. 

So, hello everyone!

   

[Rose Tiger]

Oh sweetie!    I'm so so so sorry this happened to you again!  You're not alone, I went from a NPD partner to a BPD partner and the moment I realized that I hooked up with another PD, oh wow, all the blood drained from my face as I thought "I've done it again".  It is heartwrenchingly painful and my heart really goes out to you.

My ex wasn't so accepting of there being anything wrong with him as your partner is being.  But be forewarned, sometimes they will agree at first and then turn on you like a bat out of hell.  You just don't know how this will process over the coming days and weeks.

Do y'all live apart?  You are right, this is going to be rough but not rough forever, there is light at the end of the tunnel.

[Candace30]

Thanks Rose Tiger.  There is something about myself that is attracted to BPD partners, so this is something that I am going to need to explore.

We had a long discussion about him being BPD.  I told him that I was committed to him, that I loved him, and that I would be willing to remain with him through the long haul if he sought therapy.  He listened and agreed with me.  He said he believes he may have BPD based on my description of it and his past relationship history.  He told me that he loved me too and again reiterated that he cannot control his behavior, and does not want to hurt me.  We had a great night together and were physically intimate. 

Then the next day he was distant again, not answering the phone when I called.  Today he posted a picture on his social media site of himself with 3 women in bikinis caressing his chest with their legs draped over him.  He knows I can see the picture.  So, he either 1) does not care if I see it and/or 2) was being intentionally disrespectful/trying to hurt me.     

Strangely, the picture didn't hurt me.  I was more so in DISBELIEF that he would actually post something like this 48 hours after we'd been intimate and when he knew I would probably view. 

I feel slightly used, like I "played" myself by being physically intimate with him, but I also know that I can't beat myself up about it because everybody plays the fool at some point or another.

We don't live together, to answer your question Rose Tiger.

These boards are INCREDIBLE, and I am hoping that they can help me to get through this. 

[Scout99]

I couldn't agree more! These boards are incredible!

I can't tell you (both who have shared here), how relieving it feels to find that I am not the only person in the universe who apparently have a "PD's come to Mama" sign in my forehead... . (I am joking a bit about the sign... . )

I have just like Rose Tiger been in one very painful relationship with an NPD, that got me thankfully into therapy... . But here I am too, again... . But this time on the verge of getting seriously involved with a man who I have realized is a typical BPD, just like you Candace30... .

Just like your guy, Candace30, my guy also flips in and out of being insightful about his behavior and about all the times he has hurt people close to him in the past... . And then he can turn and say things like he won't be faithful to me as long as we don't live in the same city... .    

And then later the same day or in the week pretend as if those things have never been said and instead engage in a committed conversation about our "future together"... .

He is at the same time oversensitive and fearful about hurting me... . So I have come to the conclusion that when he does stuff like that, it is not at all about me... . But instead, all about him... . It is when his anxiety sets in that he gets fearful and start fretting about our relationship, and more specifically, about all obstacles that exist that might lead to him loosing me... . (fear of abandonment)... . And then to protect himself he tries to detach by degrading our relationship... . (fear of intimacy)... .

At least that is the only logic I have been able to sustain in all this, since there are actually no signs of him pursuing any other women or even that he wants to... .

I think looking at your guy, the posting of pictures on his social media site is perhaps not as much a means to hurt you. If you apply the same kind of "logic" to his irrational behavior, one could see it as his way of protecting himself now that he feels he has been exposed by you as not the "great guy" he wants to be for you, but in a way a bit "mental"... .

That has likely set off his fears of abandonment and also his fears of what the intimacy with you means... . to him! And that in turn creates a whole lot of anxiety and worry inside of him, that he wants to escape. Escape since he probably doesn't have any better coping skills, is probably to show off some independence... . Like posting a photo of himself with some ladies... .

It is very good however! That you have had this talk with him... . Because even though his immediate reaction might be very weird and also painful for you... . Borderliners do function like a pendulum... . And he will bounce back... . But then you have been able to maintain your ground and your boundary. And you will be in a different way more able to decide whether to stay or go should he come to you and tell you he is seeking help for instance... .

The opposite would have been worse... . That is if you had not dared to talk to him about what you saw, but instead had started to walk on eggshells... .

I do however understand your pain... . Because these vulnerable and or damaged people have a tendency to get under our skin and trigger our good traits of caring and loving... . So we love, so hard... . And then letting go hurts... . But allowing the anger and keeping your boundaries will, you'll see, make it a bit easier this time, should you choose to go!

I am standing on the fence too... . waxing an waining from one day to the next... . In my case being with a borderliner is still a step up, compared to the hell of living with a man who was a full fledged narcissist... . But there are also days when I truly wish I could just meet and fall in love with a man who is just plain normal... .

My heart goes out to you and I hope for the absolute best - for You!

scout

[Rose Tiger]

Oh no, you too, Scout?   :'(  I thought I was getting better after the NPD blender, I thought I finally found someone I could be with forever.  I invested a lot of myself into the r/s.  It was very hard to detach.  Like two pieces of fly paper stuck together and trying to pull that apart.  It doesn't come off in clean sheets but in rips, tears and pieces.

Candance, there are lots of articles on this site that will help you understand the mind set.  He doesn't feel the way you do when it comes to love.  Their love is immature, infant-like enmeshment.  They can't do two individuals, only one combined being that must agree or the devalue kicks in.  I suggest you start protecting your inner feelings by only sharing them with supportive others, like a T, friends and here on this site.  Resist the urge to fix him.  Validate his feelings and let the chips fall where they may (in regard to his healing).  This is the detaching process.  There is a wonderful book for helping you understand your feelings/trauma right now, it's called the Journey from Abandonment to Healing.  Right now you are in the 'shattering' phase.  Please get this book to help you understand what you are feeling and why.  This will get you on the right road for your own healing.

Being intimate with someone creates 'soul ties'.  It's like you've given pieces of your spirit to him, it bonds you.  Unfortunately, with the disordered, they don't feel the same way.  They can cut their feelings off like a light switch.  Painful!  How can I tell you that it isn't personal, they do this to everyone.  You can't beat yourself up because you were there in good faith.     Now is the time for yellow alert, shields up (around your heart).

[winston72]

Yes, these boards are amazing... . life savers and then life enhancers.  Thank you RoseTiger, Scout and Candace for your candor.  It is so helpful to read your posts.

I have managed to have the same relationship with three different women over the past 10 years.  Ugh.  it is so demoralizing to write this... . the admit it to myself... . to "face the facts"!  I feel so sad about it.  I am, thankfully, undergoing therapy now and have been for the past year.  The wounds of my earlier life were fully exposed in this last relationship, so there has been much progress as a result.  Much pain and frustration, but much progress.

I have a simple observation in response to these posts.  The behavior of Candace's SO in posting the photos of himself with other women after the intimate conversations and night together is appalling, truly appalling.  Scout, your analysis and explanation of the dynamics is excellent.  I have dissected such sequences in my own relationship many, many times.  But reading these accounts highlights for me how twisted I had/have become.  I accepted terrible behavior and accommodated myself to it through elaborate explanations.  If I intellectualized it enough, my pain would lessen and I could fit it into a narrative for myself as to how it was part of our relationship.  And, I desperately wanted to stay connected, to be a part of the life of my SO and would do anything to make that happen. 

I see the awfulness of how Candace was treated.  My response is to warn you that more pain lies ahead!  Be so very careful.  I have endless scripts of explanations as offered by Scout, yet when I read the post I think it is too much rationalization when a relationship with a healthier person would be so much better.  I want to encourage both of you to do the obvious... . seek healthier partners.  Yet... . I struggle so awfully to do that for myself.  My natural self leads me to desire the connection even if it means the awful photos the next day and the mental gymnastics to make sense of it all.  The road to health for me is a slow crawl up a steep mountain!

Thank you for your posts.  My heart is with each of you.

[Candace30]

Thank you everyone for your responses.  You all have provided me with a lot of insight. 

Let's see - we had the talk about him having BPD on Saturday, he admitted that he thinks he may have it, we got close/bonded, and then spent the night together.  When I left him on Sunday morning, everything seemed fine.  He hugged/kissed me and asked me to call him later, which I did and he did not pick up the phone.  Then he went and posted the picture of himself with the 4 bikini clad women draped around him with the caption, "Are you enjoying your summer?  I hope so, because I KNOW I AM!"  He knows I could see this.   

Today is Tuesday and I have not heard from him in 48 hours.  He is distancing himself from me.

Now that I know what's going on, I don't feel so bad.  I know that this is not about me; this is about him.  At first I was very angry (so angry once that I stayed mad for 18 hours straight), but now I just feel compassion for him and for myself.   

I've never done anything to hurt him.  I've always been there for him, encouraging him, building him up, helping him to run his businesses, being his best friend and his greatest cheerleader.  But it seems that the more I am there for him, the more he intentionally tries to hurt me.

Not sure what his strategy is right now, but I'm sure he'll be back.  I just want to do the work on myself, to make sure that I do not continue to repeat this cycle with him (or someone new) again and again and again. 



 

[letmeout]

Seek healthier partners... .   That one has me thinking.

If you have never experienced healthier partners, you look for comfort in the familiar.

Is the damage caused by unhealthy relationships going to prevent healthy partners from connecting with us? Thinking from the emotionally healthy perspective, would I want to date someone who has been through hell from crazy relationships? 

[Candace30]

He circled back around already.

He called me just now "because he was thinking about me, wanted to know how my day is going, and wanted to see if I'm ok".  He asked me if I'd call him later.  I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't answer when I call later, which he's done before.  Lol.

What I really want to do is bring up the issue of him having BPD again but I don't want to overwhelm him.  I would be willing to add him to my insurance so that he can get treatment.  I don't want to scare him off though. 

[MaybeSo]

Okay, so he provides this as a relationship partner:

Some things I overlooked include hypersensitivity, intense rages, constant testing of my love for him (sometimes making up ridiculous stories to make me jealous), lack of boundaries, calling repeatedly at all hours of the day and night until I pick up the phone, emotional abuse, control issues, silent treatments, cruelty, constant put downs, neediness, abandoning me at critical times, picking fights when things were calm or we were getting close, substance abuse, flirtations with other women right in my face, and blatant disrespect.

He has told me many times that he is aware that he is "toxic", that he "has hurt every woman who has ever loved him or tried to get close to him", and that "he maintains his distance because he knows he is hited up and he doesn't want to hurt me too".  He's told me this many times, and again, I was so focused on getting him to "commit", that I thought he was telling me this as a way to avoid a commitment to ME.

He is telling you he is a toxic and unstable relationship partner. Period. I believe him. I believe him 100%. And it just chaps my hide that a man can announce this level of woundedness and unavailability and it actually DRAWS women TO THEM!  It just makes me want to spit!

So, with all that knowledge, your concern is this:

What I really want to do is bring up the issue of him having BPD again but I don't want to overwhelm him.  I would be willing to add him to my insurance so that he can get treatment.  I don't want to scare him off though.

 

Candace, this isn't about him.

This is about you, my dear.

This is about you.

You are investing in a broken person, a person who is unable to have a relationship without all the drama-trauma you just listed above, and you are choosing drama-trauma over having a relationship.  

Are you addicted to the drama?

Is he just a re-creation of a past childhood trauma, hurt or disappointment?

Are you just avoiding having to deal with your own issues by becoming attached to an ill person?

If you want to 'talk' about therapy with this with him, you better be prepared to talk about it a lot and to live with all the stuff you just wrote about and it will only get worse, a lot worse.  And it will go on and on and on and on and on.  Like for years.   Therapy takes years if it takes at all.  

This can take forever if you don't start directing your attention elsewhere.

Having had an 8 year relationship with a man EXACTLY like you just described, and having seen him do 8 years of therapy... . I can tell you that while he is more polite, and the rage has quieted down and he has some better tools for dealing with people... .

He has the EXACT same relationship patterns 8 years later that he has always had. EXACT. Maybe even a bit worse, because he is an even smoother operator now.  He presents as just a tortured soul with a lot of touching psychological insights that needs love and has a lot of love to give... . and women (a lot of women) just eat it up.  They EAT IT UP.  Until they are discarded, used, cheated on, or left with very little understanding of what just happened.

I hope you are smarter than so many of us on this board and really learn to listen and believe your eyes. When a man shows you he is an emotional wreck and a commitment-phobe, he is showing you the truth. In this case this man is even saying he is bad news, and that he hurts people.  This seems to be enticing you even more to do some kind of rescue intervention or to convince him or yourself of something other than the truth.

This is about you. Do you think your love is going to fix this? It's not.

It's not. You are NOT that special, you are not that powerful and this has NOTHING whatsoever to do with you, anyway.

Love/sex/romance doesn't fix this Candace. It's the fuel that drives this sickenss.  

He doesn't need a woman's love and sacrifice,  he needs to stop dating and put himself into treatment... . until he is sure he won't hurt anyone anymore. But he will never do that, and why should he?  When he has so many women who find his kind of 'sickness' enticing and compelling and attractive and a challenge, or a rescue project, and a huge distraction so they don't have to deal with real life and real relationships.

You are not helping him, you are part of the problem.  

You will not get love out of this man.  You will get a huge amount of work and heartache, you will not get intimacy, you will not get a real partner, you will not have an adult partner, nor any stability and reliability whatsoever.  You will get to care for and date a wounded, angry child.

Get into therapy now and figure out why you are attracted to this and why you want to fix this (not possible) and get healthy by fixing yourself.  

If you are really walking away from this, do not discuss therapy with him anymore.  This is not your job. Let it go. You will be doing both of you a huge favor.

If you are not walking away, and plan to keep contact with him, please move to the Staying Board asap for support.

Please.

[winston72]

MaybeSo... . such a powerful post.  Thank you so much.  It really spoke to me.  Really spoke to me.  I am chastened... . and I am in therapy, in NC with my exGF and asking myself the very questions that you raise... . I was in a relationship very similar to Candace's.  Again, thank you Candace for your candor.  Here is to a better future for you... . and for me!

[winston72]

And Candace, just to reiterate after your more detailed account... . his behavior is really, really appalling.  That sequence of events is really bad news, whether or not one is reading it on a BPD web site.  In the context of this web site... . that is one sick dude.  And you need to really investigate what you are doing with him.

[Candace30]

Wow Maybeso, that was really powerful.  I could feel you reaching through my computer and virtually trying to shake some sense into me - that's how powerful it was.  I am going to keep what you wrote and re-read it again and again. 

[Candace30]

And Winston72, I get what you are saying.  If someone I cared about was telling me this story, I would be absolutely appalled.  But for some reason, I seem to be desensitized when this behavior is directed at me.  I don't know why this is.   

[winston72]

Candace... . the same is true for me!  I have to remind myself over and over about what actually happened to me and even then I minimize and rationalize it.  I am, as  you say, desensitized to my own abuse.  I feel it and respond to it in others, but not myself.  Hmmm... . that is worth some more thought!

[Rose Tiger]

Just to be a broken record  the book The Journey from Abandonment to Healing will explain why you are feeling so drawn during this time and how to work your way through it. 

[Candace30]

Thank you Rose Tiger.  I will check that book out. 

[tailspin]

Candace,

It's good to know this forum helped you to detach and leave a dysfunctional relationship 4 years ago.  What stands out to me from your post is how you diagnosed your partner with BPD.  

Recognizing the symptoms of mental illness is the easy part; the hardest part is to identify and heal the broken parts of ourselves that compel us to repeat patterns of dysfunctional behavior and uncover why we are attracted to unhealthy partners in the first place.  

Detachment without healing will keep us coming back here... . and we will learn to rely and become dependent upon this site to feel better about ourselves without taking the time to understand why we feel bad about ourselves to begin with.  

The hard work required to heal cannot be outsourced. I hope you are able to once again detach from your partner and I really hope you have the courage to ask yourself the tough questions and find the answers to keep you from coming back.

tailspin

[Candace30]

Very true Tailspin.  I plan to get myself into therapy immediately.  The first time you find yourself involved with a BPD or in an unhealthy relationship, it might just be bad luck or coincidence.  2 or more times and it's a pattern!

I have an idea why this is occurring.  Some unresolved things from my past.  I guess that's the deal for most of us here.  Hopefully therapy can help me to work through this and emerge a better/healthier me. 

I DO want a happy, healthy relationship and a family.    

[seeking balance]

Very true Tailspin.  I plan to get myself into therapy immediately.  The first time you find yourself involved with a BPD or in an unhealthy relationship, it might just be bad luck or coincidence.  2 or more times and it's a pattern!

I have an idea why this is occurring.  Some unresolved things from my past.  I guess that's the deal for most of us here.  Hopefully therapy can help me to work through this and emerge a better/healthier me. 

I DO want a happy, healthy relationship and a family.    

Almost everyone has issues - the degree of which does depend on our emotional upbringing... . as such, not everyone stays with a pwBPD.  We might date them, but after a few months - emotionally healthy people tend to see reality a bit better and break away - it might not be easy, but they don't do the dance for nearly as long and they tend to be proactive.

You probably did this time around a bit better, a bit different, right?

Good for you that you are going to focus on you - the only thing we can change is ourselves - there is a lot of power to that

The Personal Inventory board is a great place to work on this stuff while in therapy.

Peace,

SB