What does one do? Just walk away?

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

I dont see enough here on the subject of helping these people to get help for themselves!  I dont know how they can on being so wretched to who ever is in the way and not know or figure out that something is not quite right with them!  If they are in so much pain all the time,  dont you think that would be a bell sign to them that something isnt right, mean awhile the average person around them never has problems like they do  My boyfriend  is still in his "hate" phase with me.  Our relationship is over.  To him IM a bad, bad  person and I have wounded him soo much, Ive dont nothing to him,  yet he is acting like I threw him under a train and now he cant walk and has to resort to a wheel chiar and blind seeing dog.    Poor poor BPD... . Im through with it. Im through with the endless chats of trying to talk some sense into him. I miss what he used to me before this happened,  but I know now things will never be the same. He's out of his mind now.  and now one who he is around knows this but me. How can people not see this?  I dont get it.   He says hes suffering all the time, depressed, hes the one who rejected ME!  He pathedic and I still dont get how the people around him friends and family can not be seeing this.  It inferiates me!   I tampered it down to him and just said I thought he had an anger problem.  Its been so obvious ,does he have a  glaring piece of glass in my eye to not see this?  he just goes on in his hateful depressed misery day after day. is there anyway to reach these people? Do I have to plaster all the symtems on his face book page? I wont do this.  it wouldnt make any difference anyhow,  he wouldnt know what it was, or would hate me more and probably have a stroke and then blame it on me, again and again. Im in no contact now because he has gotten so mean and awful in the things he says to me. I have to protect myself now.  Ive given up in the name of reason.   There is no reason.  This guy needs help. Do you just have to wait until they get themselves into some kind of trouble in relation to their behavior before anything is done to get them to face they have a problem?  This is just too much for me.

[goingtostopthis]

I dont see enough here on the subject of helping these people to get help for themselves!  I dont know how they can on being so wretched to who ever is in the way and not know or figure out that something is not quite right with them!  If they are in so much pain all the time,  dont you think that would be a bell sign to them that something isnt right, mean awhile the average person around them never has problems like they do  My boyfriend  is still in his "hate" phase with me.  Our relationship is over.  To him IM a bad, bad  person and I have wounded him soo much, Ive dont nothing to him,  yet he is acting like I threw him under a train and now he cant walk and has to resort to a wheel chiar and blind seeing dog.    Poor poor BPD... . Im through with it. Im through with the endless chats of trying to talk some sense into him. I miss what he used to me before this happened,  but I know now things will never be the same. He's out of his mind now.  and now one who he is around knows this but me. How can people not see this?  I dont get it.   He says hes suffering all the time, depressed, hes the one who rejected ME!  He pathedic and I still dont get how the people around him friends and family can not be seeing this.  It inferiates me!   I tampered it down to him and just said I thought he had an anger problem.  Its been so obvious ,does he have a  glaring piece of glass in my eye to not see this?  he just goes on in his hateful depressed misery day after day. is there anyway to reach these people? Do I have to plaster all the symtems on his face book page? I wont do this.  it wouldnt make any difference anyhow,  he wouldnt know what it was, or would hate me more and probably have a stroke and then blame it on me, again and again. Im in no contact now because he has gotten so mean and awful in the things he says to me. I have to protect myself now.  Ive given up in the name of reason.   There is no reason.  This guy needs help. Do you just have to wait until they get themselves into some kind of trouble in relation to their behavior before anything is done to get them to face they have a problem?  This is just too much for me.

[Waifed]

They have to want to get help.  Those that are higher functioning usually have narcissistic traits that keep them from believing that they need help.  Most never will get help unless they go in for depression, etc.

[santa]

There is no helping them. They're just going to blaze a path of chaos and destruction until they finally fizzle out one day.

Walking away is the only thing you can do unless you want to get dragged down with them.

[DiamondSW]

I tried everything I could possibly do to make my exBPDgf's life better -until I finally couldnt try any more and finally fell apart myself.

Listen to the advice here -I ended up in hospital.  1st time ever, been in 5 previous 'normal' relationships, one 7 years long, this 10mth relationship nearly cost my life. 

She's 'getting' help but I'm painted black and will be for a v long time.  It's Valentines tonight and she'll be at the church ball all dolled up and smiling.  I'm safe at home.  Emphasis on 'safe'.  And I'm so glad of that. 

That's how bad it got with my 'trying'. 

At the end of the day, she HATES herself and everything else is just a mask. 

[almosthadme]

Goingtostopthis,the best advice I got from this site is to go no contact and just walk away.You will not talk any sense into these people they believe what they want.

[goingtostopthis]

I have another question.   Once they are in their  hate stage,   Do they ever come out of it? Do you think he might just contact me out of the blue and act like nothing ever happened?  Hes done this before.  Come out of it and returned to his nice usual self.  But now its been worse then ever. on going because Ive been engaging in debating his reasoning for hating me so much and wanting me out of his life.  I almost feel at times that this is more of a play hes putting on, because hes getting something out of punishing me and making me feel bad. It seems making me feel bad is really what his aim is,  and really ending the relationship is what he's using to do it with. This is what he has to hold over me to hurt me with,  this thinking in his sick mind he could get me back when ever he wanted, based on how desperately hurt I am,  you know. All this because his reasoning for dumping me has made no sense and so he has gotten me sucked into this running debate sort of thing where I can never win. I have felt as if he was provoking me into getting really upset, by blaming me for things that never happened and things that were stupid and over exagerated. It was so devestating to me!  Finally yesterday, I went along with his doomsday pronouncment of telling me I just needed to move on, and cruel statements of the sort.  I finally agreed and said, I think your right. We arent right for each other,there was some kind of weird closure and it was over.   And yet through all this rejection stuff,  he says, well I hope that someday in the future we can still be friends.   ANd im thinking,  youve got to out of your frickin mind! Whats this still be friends stuff all about?

[myself]

I have another question.   Once they are in their  hate stage,   Do they ever come out of it? Do you think he might just contact me out of the blue and act like nothing ever happened?

Yes. Being with my ex was like playing many games of crazy ping-pong at the same time. She bounced from love to hate in her brain, her interactions testing me, keeping the push and pull going at all times. You've already seen him do it, so yes the pattern exists. When they act like nothing happened, they're lying. It's an act. A question we need to ask ourselves is, Do we want to pretend, or live a real life?

[DiamondSW]

No, I think mine is still in her hate stage 4 mths on... .

I 'ended' the relationship after I couldn't take any more.  She rebounded in a week with some weird guy shipped over from a different country, I then helped her out of a massive hole with this guy (serious threats/abuse), and then she loved me for 2 weeks and then made my life hell. 

Push, pull, push, pull, revenge, hate... .  

Ultimately she HATES herself and frankly can't trust herself ... . so she's turned to god.  What that means in real life?  God knows!   

[goingtostopthis]

Well,   hes got real quiet for himself now.   He had me stuck in the silent treatment routine for about a week. It was on chat and I could see he was reading my messages.  It made me sick.  That he would just leave them there not answering, all intentional.   Its not that Im trying to demonize him or anything but after a while if you know them well enough,  you just know what theyre doing and why.   I wish I could see you all out there.  I know youre all out there real people just like me. Im starting to feel less alone which is good. 

                                                                  As far as the silent treatment is concerned, he puts on this front like hes not effected at all that our normal routine of seeing each other is gone. I need to remind myself of these truths and today is really the first official day of our no contact. Before he had me hanginng on, starring at the chat screen every 5 seconds to see if it had changed. He was feasting off every word I said, so I rather doubt he was feeling any pain in that respect.  Oh but I WAS!  I was in anguish!  Today,like I said is the first real day he has gotten nothing from me in any kind of words and he knows he wont.    So now what is he going to do? Do some soul searching?  Oh, thats a really bad joke.    He was very dependant on me before. We saw each other on skype every day like clock work for a least 6 months.  It makes me wonder how hes going to cope with that which he created?  If I cant be there for him in any way to hate and hurt, whats he going to do now? Frankly I dont care.  I just know I feel glad he cant touch me now and I can begin to take the time I need now to take good care of myself, to love myself through this a find things much better to put my attention on,  then him.

[Eodmava]

Hi goingto,

I tried for 3 years to get my ex wife into "real" therapy.  I went to marriage counseling and the rages were so great during the three sessions we attended that the counselor asked to meet with her alone.  She attended weekly 50 minute sessions, but that is not even close to sufficient for someone in the throws of this disorder.  If anything, the therapist (who was not a full fledged clinical psychologist and just an LPC) was in WAY over his head.  Even a "normal" person in therapy can start transferring garbage onto their spouse when psychotherapy gets going, but with a BPD it is about 1000x worse.  My ex was (probably) molested by her father.  The angry depressed woman that entered therapy, later left therapy one and a half years later more angry, more narcissistic, more emotionally constipated, more blaming... . and pushing for a divorce.  So... . I have to say that depending on the depth of the affliction... . therapy can actually make matters worse. 

My advice is to walk away... . quickly... . and don't look back, ever.  Time is better spent understanding why you were attracted to this person.  What was it about your love archetype that the BPD fulfilled?  I strongly recommend the book "Real Love" by Greg Baer... . second most important book I have ever read... . and I read a lot. 

Mava

[starshine]

Mine broke up with me suddenly and was on to the next relationship in 4 days.  I'm guessing he had her on the side.  She was someone I had considered a friend, and our last phone chat (about 3 weeks before he dumped me) was a fishing expedition.  I could see that in retrospect.  I kept minimal contact for a month, as he had some of my stuff and I was negotiating my garden out of our home.  The day I got that back was pretty much the last time we exchanged words.  I walked away and road out the storm as my heart broke over and over again.  I cried everyday for about 18 months.  It was really hard.  We had been together for 5 years and lived together for 4.  But honestly, I knew I couldn't be with someone who did what he did to me.  I really do value myself, and threw what was left of my broken heart into healing myself.  He still has stuff of mine, including expensive art.  I would like to get that back, but that would entail breaking my NC.  I could take him to court over it, I really don't know what to do.  I will probably just let it go, walk away.  It's been 2.5 years.  I loved him more than I had ever loved a man, and he just threw all of what we built together away.  Well, I guess he got the house, the furniture, and some of my art, so he didn't lose it all.  What a jerk. But, yup, all I could do was walk away.  What else was there to say?  "Ohhhh, baby, come back?  You don't mean to do that!"  Whatever.  He can stew in his own rotten juices now.  He's in another toxic relationship, that I know, for sure.  Walk away, start your healing, so when someone really great comes along, you might be healed enough to recognize the opportunity.

[Mutt]

I wish I could see you all out there.  I know youre all out there real people just like me. Im starting to feel less alone which is good.

A lot of us share the same experiences as you. You're not alone in this. Posting your experiences will help and others here will help.

I need to remind myself of these truths and today is really the first official day of our no contact.

It will take time, it is hard, but your doing good. 

Frankly I dont care.  I just know I feel glad he cant touch me now and I can begin to take the time I need now to take good care of myself, to love myself through this a find things much better to put my attention on,  then him.

You're on the right track goingtostopthis! Focus on you, and take care of you! 

[LA4610]

 "I almost feel at times that this is more of a play hes putting on, because hes getting something out of punishing me and making me feel bad. It seems making me feel bad is really what his aim is,  and really ending the relationship is what he's using to do it with."


Yes, it is a play he is putting on. Yes, making you feel bad is what his aim is. And, YES, he is getting something out of punishing you and making you feel bad. He is projecting all of the terrible feelings he has about himself onto you. This is one of the reasons these people freak the hell out when they feel they have lost you. There is no one to project their extreme feelings of self hate onto.

To answer your question "what does one do? just walk away?"... . Yes, crawl, walk, run away. It hurts like hell, but you have to do it. When I was back and forth with my ex my therapist told me "if you stick around long enough, you will DIE. OVER HER". It sounds extreme, but it is true. Look at the above poster who said he went to the hospital over his ex.

[goingtostopthis]

well ya... .   This is, how its felt.   At one point he accused me of trying to control him,and I thought,wait a minute!  Hes been trying to control me... . It all of a sudden occurred to me how powerless he must feel about himself. Hes  in this bad situation where hes out of a job,never has money, sometimes cant even afford food,he got debt collectors after him,  all this hit. It just goes on and on non stop.  But he wont go out and find a job. Just wont, has a million excuses why he cant do this.  Hes all ways playing the victim, all the traits, there they are. And aliments going on with him everyday, hs back hurts, he gets these headaches he says that blind him but wont take anything for them, his knees hurt,   his hand hurts, cant sleep, on and on.  He says ever since I came to see him his life has been hell.  It was hell before I got there.   He does nothing to find a job and then he wonders why his life is hell. I got sucked into kind of being his counselor or stabilizer through all this plus trying to deal with my own problems through this.      But back to my point,  its almost as if hes really gotten off at all of a sudden starting to talk down to me like a child, and its in all ways in a real shaming hulmiliating way. and its because Im the one being blamed with this problem of having anger issues with the fights he has been starting with irrational rages, well,  this just cant be fixed.  Of course it cant be!  I ask him what exactly am I doing , if you tell me I wont do this anymore? Well,   guess what, he never has a clear answer or an answer at all. He doesnt want there to be a solution to this problem. No way!   It just has to be this vague fault of mine that is doomed to never ever be able to be changed. This is typical isnt it?   He couldnt have his control trip if this problem could be resolved.   I have to be flawed.   

[goingtostopthis]

continues...     Hes got to have the control now,its going straight to his ego. What does he have to worry about being abandoned when hes making it happen to me.  He tells me its over yet all ways sticks in this thing about how maybe we can still be friends.  If im so bad, why doesnt he block me.  He lefts a channel open to chat still. He tells me my posts are awful and they make him sick and are effecting his immune system.  I read back at them and Im thinkng,I dont see anything awful in this?  this is good stuff. Im trying to help this problem and work it out. It was all implied of course that "Im awful".   and Im thinking if my posts are soo awful,  Im not grabbing him by the arm and forceing him over to the computer to read them? Giving me the silent treatment is his power charge. He is so impotent in his life other wise that this is the only way he can live with himself and have any kind of autonomy, fake or not. His brain is like a childs,  just surviving on this very low primitive level.   There is no real love here, and this is what I need to work on facing. To exsist at such a low emotional level, to be that desperate to feel good about himself at the price of me to fabricate all this stuff in his reality so he can do this for himself.  There were never two people in this relationship,  its all ways just been him and his needs.   

[goingtostopthis]

I still hear his negative stuff about me still running in my head,  but I have to say its been getting less and less. Being able to write here has really helped.  Thank you everyone! 

[Mutt]

well ya... .  This is, how its felt.   At one point he accused me of trying to control him,and I thought,wait a minute!  Hes been trying to control me... . It all of a sudden occurred to me how powerless he must feel about himself. Hes  in this bad situation where hes out of a job,never has money, sometimes cant even afford food,he got debt collectors after him,  all this . It just goes on and on non stop.  But he wont go out and find a job. Just wont, has a million excuses why he cant do this.  Hes all ways playing the victim, all the traits, there they are. And aliments going on with him everyday, hs back hurts, he gets these headaches he says that blind him but wont take anything for them, his knees hurt,   his hand hurts, cant sleep, on and on.  He says ever since I came to see him his life has been hell.  It was hell before I got there.   He does nothing to find a job and then he wonders why his life is hell. I got sucked into kind of being his counselor or stabilizer through all this plus trying to deal with my own problems through this.      But back to my point,  its almost as if hes really gotten off at all of a sudden starting to talk down to me like a child, and its in all ways in a real shaming hulmiliating way. and its because Im the one being blamed with this problem of having anger issues with the fights he has been starting with irrational rages, well,  this just cant be fixed.  Of course it cant be!  I ask him what exactly am I doing , if you tell me I wont do this anymore? Well,   guess what, he never has a clear answer or an answer at all. He doesnt want there to be a solution to this problem. No way!   It just has to be this vague fault of mine that is doomed to never ever be able to be changed. This is typical isnt it?   He couldnt have his control trip if this problem could be resolved.   I have to be flawed.    

I'm sorry for what your going through, that sounds like a lot. I just wanted to make sure that you're getting the right tools and support that you need.

I noticed that you have some posts on  [L5] Staying: Improving a Relationship with a Borderline Partner and my apologies if I'm misinterpreting because I'm jumping in the middle here, but are you planning on staying or leaving the r/s? You'll get the best help for your situation based on if your staying with the person w / BPD in your life or leaving.  

I still hear his negative stuff about me still running in my head,  but I have to say its been getting less and less. Being able to write here has really helped.  Thank you everyone! 

I agree, writing and posting here helps a lot. 

- Mutt

[goingtostopthis]

I am leaving.  I have left. Its over.  I thought about working it out at first but as time went by I realized I cant help this guy. My focus here is to help myself through the stages of recovery.  Thank You

[acknowledgement]

"There were never two people in this relationship. Just him and his needs" powerful simple mantra to say when leaving a BPD "relationship". Shift the focus to wHY you chose this person self discover and vow to NEVER engage in their maddening push pull dance again!

[goingtostopthis]

I chose him because I was really attracted to him. I got a really good feeling about him.  I liked him.  I didn't see any of these signs until 3 months later. So what is one to do about that?   I loved him.  I couldn't undue my feelings.  I often wonder does it really help at all to tell yourself youll never make the same mistake again.   When I don't even know what I did wrong in my chosing.  Im say this honestly.

[DiamondSW]

Walk away... .

Think of it like this:  I was humiliated publicly 4 times on the streets of London -screaming, no care about me, whether I got home ok, anything.

When I was crying, my BPDexgf told me "you're only crying about the dead girl"... .   (a past gf died of breast cancer aged v young, but I got past it). 

No... . I was crying because YOU ARE BEING AWFUL TOWARDS ME, MAKING ME FEEL WORTHLESS, AND YOU'RE REMINDING ME OF SOMEONE WHO DIED AND WHO I LOVED V MUCH BECAUSE YOU CAN'T FACE YOUR OWN BEHAVIOUR.

Result = hospital (for me)

church services (for her) 

Just don't bother with these people unless they try to get help and take responsibility for their actions.  Or you could get vvvvv ill. 

Oh, and if you think anything you do will 'improve it' you're wrong.  Only a T can improve it and my own personal T today said she'd only had 1 BPD success in 'hundreds' of sufferers.  ONE.

[goingtostopthis]

It makes you soo angry, doesnt it?  The anger I think you cant do anything about is a part of what I think makes you sick.  I had to take the day off the other day. I needed to rest and just stop everything so I could think and sleep.   I think they only care about you so far as they think they are getting "their" needs met. They are like Nars.   it's all about them,  everything... .

                   I dont know what to do about my feelings sometimes because I see these other sights and videos about people who acknowledge this illness in themselves.  They are suffering all the time!  And it seems easy to want to say, well youre suffering all the time because maybe youd feel better if you thought about someone else for a change. I know a large part of my recovery over this is going to be me being honest with myself with what was really happening with in the dynamics of the relationship from the very beginning.  It was full of a lot of frustrations where I felt like I was the only one who had an optimistic out look on life and very slowly by talking with him I felt this was being eroded. I believe if you really want something in life you can get it if youre willing to work for it and have a positive attitude.  Well, hes never been willing to really want to work for anything.  There was all ways a reason why things werent going to get better for him.   This kind of stuff wears on you and it makes you angry.    One of the last things he said to me was that he has his own life to sort out, and I was thinking,  His life has "never" been sorted out! Sorted OUT? What is he talking about.  He is all ways having one bad thing happen to him after another  and it occured to me last night something else must have happened that he didnt want to tell me about. I asked him, because I couldnt figure out why all of a sudden he was being so mean to me.  He said Im not telling you because then youd hold it against me. I dont mean to sound mean like him, but honestly... his life is hit!   and his only way of coping with it is to do what he did to me. For the longest time I couldnt figure out why he lives the way he does and never does anything productive to help himself.  Now I know.  Hes a BPD.   It all feeds in to how he gets attention on himself as the victim of course. I think of his self induced misery and I have to ask myself,  Do I really want to have any thing to do with this anymore?

[cosmonaut]

They have to want to get help.  Those that are higher functioning usually have narcissistic traits that keep them from believing that they need help.  Most never will get help unless they go in for depression, etc.

This is the truth!  You can't save anyone who doesn't want to be saved.  Especially when it comes to mental health.  This isn't like bleeding where you can bandage the wound even if they don't want it.  With mental disorders if they won't cooperate there is nothing anyone can do.  The best psychiatrists and therapists on Earth are powerless to help them.  You can pray for them and ask Jesus to save them, but that's all you can do.  Just pray and hope.   I would have done anything for my uBPDexgf.  Anything.  I'd have gotten her any help she needed.  She just won't do it.  She doesn't want to be saved.

[Mutt]

He is all ways having one bad thing happen to him after another

 It all feeds in to how he gets attention on himself as the victim of course.

There's a little bit more than playing the victim that comes into play goingtostopthis.

They don't look at the consequences of their actions like you or I. I can analyze a choice and think of the possible outcomes and the consequences of those actions, they live in the moment and act impulsively and don't understand the consequences of their actions.

Another, is that they feel so out of control in the inside and they feel comfortable when there's chaos around them because if they can control something. It feels like a natural habitat for BPD, and it's makes the non feel stressed.

I like stability and routine, and I often told the ex, "there's always some sort of drama from you and your family!" It made me feel sick inside with all of the drama.

[Mutt]

This is the truth!  You can't save anyone who doesn't want to be saved.  Especially when it comes to mental health.  This isn't like bleeding where you can bandage the wound even if they don't want it.  With mental disorders if they won't cooperate there is nothing anyone can do.  The best psychiatrists and therapists on Earth are powerless to help them.  You can pray for them and ask Jesus to save them, but that's all you can do.  Just pray and hope.   I would have done anything for my uBPDexgf.  Anything.  I'd have gotten her any help she needed.  She just won't do it.  She doesn't want to be saved.

You are right cosmonaut You or I are not above this disorder. No amount of love will cure this. It is up to them to get help.