Is it possible?

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

Is it possible for me to help her see the problem and get some insight?

Is just what i want to know. Im day 9 NC but im missing her and getting the feeling im not doing everything i can do to help her. I dont want to get together with her. She cheated on me and lied too many times but i would like to help her.

Is this just my rescuer and extreme loyalty issues speaking or is it possible for me to do something about her and help her in any way?

Maybe im just being stupid. As i have seen around that disease always wins. But i get the feeling that maybe i could do more than just walk away. Maybe i could walk away and distance myself and from there be able to help her in some way. Like, help from a distance. Because although she painted me black, it is not total, she just did it to defend herself because she knows what she did and knows that i know now all about what she did also. If i contacted her now she would speak to me. Dont know, maybe im just trying to play with fire. Any opinions are welcome .

[Junknown]

Is it possible for me to help her see the problem and get some insight?

Is just what i want to know. Im day 9 NC but im missing her and getting the feeling im not doing everything i can do to help her. I dont want to get together with her. She cheated on me and lied too many times but i would like to help her.

Is this just my rescuer and extreme loyalty issues speaking or is it possible for me to do something about her and help her in any way?

Maybe im just being stupid. As i have seen around that disease always wins. But i get the feeling that maybe i could do more than just walk away. Maybe i could walk away and distance myself and from there be able to help her in some way. Like, help from a distance. Because although she painted me black, it is not total, she just did it to defend herself because she knows what she did and knows that i know now all about what she did also. If i contacted her now she would speak to me. Dont know, maybe im just trying to play with fire. Any opinions are welcome .

[BuildingFromScratch]

Although I did the compete opposite, I doubt you can help. I personally went insane after the relationship and sent like 10000 facebook messages to her about how she needs help and figuring out the truth behind all her lies. She ignored every one, can't blame her, it was insanely rude of me. Anyways, it's not your job to save them, I think your white knight ego is trying to survive. Really helping people requires patience, good timing, listening intently and accepting the fact that 99% of a person being helped is them wanting help. Doubt she'd want it.

[winston72]

Did you see yourself as helping her during your relationship?  Did you regularly provide her with insight?  If so, I wonder what you would do now that would produce a different outcome with her than you just experienced.

Given that the initiative for "help" is coming from you and not from her, the need might be more from within you to be that person than it is for her to gain some insight.

[Infern0]

I ask myself the same.  If you are a good person then of course it's hard to walk away from someone who you now understand is seriously unwell.

Thing is there's two problems... .

one) "I don't want a relationship with her"

Well you say that now, but if she gives you the sad eyes, tell you she's sorry,  she loves you please give her another chance... .9 days out,  you WILL cave.

Two) you are painted black

That's a huge problem and you could end up with a restraining order or something if you are not careful.

Here's my plan. Continue NC on my end, detach from her and work on myself. IF she reaches out to me for help down the line,  then I'll probably offer my help to her,  but it'll be on my terms. I will tell her that she needs to come to a psychologist with me and be assessed for BPD and that's the only contact im willing to have at this stage

The chances are minimal

[tired-of-it-all]

Is it possible for me to help her see the problem and get some insight?

Hell no!  The BPD brain does not work that way.  You will not change her you will only cause yourself more and more trouble and pain. 

[enlighten me]

Infern0's plan is probably the best.

A BPD will only seek help when they become aware that they have a problem. This is normally when they have hit rock bottom.

If you stay NC and she has always seen you as supportive then maybe it will be you she chooses to seek help from.

As much as I would love to give my exs a wake up call and let them know whats wrong with them I am realistic enough to know it wouldn't work.

Also NC will give you the time to heal and get yourself in a better place. This is good if she ever does seek help as you will be better equipped to cope. No point having a mess trying to sort out a mess.

[elessar]

Is this just my rescuer and extreme loyalty issues speaking or is it possible for me to do something about her and help her in any way?

I tried for years and years. I thought and spoke just like you. I still do to my friends and to my T and sometimes here. But today I have some peace because I feel emptied out and exhausted that I tried everything. And the more time you spend on these forums and others about this disorder, you will see there is nothing YOU can do to help her. Only when she feels she needs help (it happens rarely), only then will she get help. Maybe at that time you can be by her side.

You are try if you want. But I am afraid after months/years you will exhaust yourself out and wonder like me "how did I waste half my life on trying to help someone who asked me for help but who always ran away from it and ultimately broke me down".

[ajr5679]

I tried also and it was hell. don`t do it . I ended

up in the mental hospital because I thought I was the one crazy.

[really]

If she wanted help you and so many of us here wouldn't be in this position.   It will only drive you mad as it has me and others here

[Junknown]

Yeah, i read all your posts and they make sense.

But there are some things that im unsure and make me ruminate about this... .

- I know i dont want to be back together with her. She is in no condition to have a serious relationship while she is so affected by her problem. I just want to help her. As i have a taped áudio call that my replacement gave me (she doesnt know about this and i dont plan on ever telling her) where she admits basically, a lot of her lies and betrayals to me and even says she did unprotected sex with the latest guy she was with, fearing now to have catched a disease im pretty sure i wouldnt fall for it again. There were also a lot of lies on that tape that she told to my replacement also, saying she told me all the truth and other stupid stuff that doesnt make sense and are lies and manipulation. Altough i really deeply still love her, this made me keep those feelings i can't erase but being unable to go back to her. Wouldnt this protect me from falling back? Apart from this, i saw that she is either back to her husband or has a new guy as i was undercover in a webchat she uses and saw her saying that (yeah, i know, its not healthy for me and doesnt help me heal :/ ). So im pretty sure she isnt breaking NC with me and my replacement because of the new toy she has for the moment.

- She admitted to me she had a problem several times. Admitted that she had a problem with men. That she became emotionally attached to them (she refused to admit that she betrayed me with more than one tough, and didnt admit her lies).

In the past she, in some lucidity moments, told me she was uncapable of being faithfully, that flirted with a lot of guys, that she couldnt take being lied and betrayed but if she did it to someone it didnt affect her much, that she was a lot sexual (she tought this could be because of her rape trauma) and in the last post in her blog she even said she knew she hurt me but couldnt understand the extension of the damage, but even tough she admits this, she manages to cover it up when the lucidity moments pass, by saying she didnt meant what she said and having really nice excuses for it. She is going to a psychologist in 2 days but she dressed up as the victim (on facebook, that my replacement can still see she wrote some stuff where she tells she is better now, without people that do harm to her and on the blog she says she is brand new now and on the recovering way) and i think she will only seek validation there and say how bad we were to her. She says she is going there because she gets too emotionally attached to other men but doesnt say betrayals are the problem (she cant admit she betrayed me with at least 3 guys). On the last conversation we had she raged at me and said again she never betrayed me with the guy that i have her admiting to in the áudio tape. She said that i cant forgive. That i prefer to throw at her face this stuff and make her feel bad.

So she admitted to me, in some moments, parts of her deep nature. She knew i couldnt tolerate them, that i wouldnt tolerate multiple betrayals, done intentionally and planned. That i wouldnt tolerate knowing she maintained two relationships at the same time and in a period of time she might have had 3 relationships at same time. So, she pretended to be someone she wasnt to protect herself from the abandonment she knew would come from it. Covered her true self with lies and deceiving and throwing sand at my eyes thinking i didnt find all this stuff odd and suspicious and that i wouldnt ever discover the thruth (thruth is, if it wasnt one of her replacements getting in touch, i wouldnt be able to know she was lieing and deceiving).

If she could admit who she really is to me. Knowing i would be there, not to punish or judge, but to help her see what she is doing wrong couldnt i help her? She would have to undress off the lies and stuff. And understand that i wont get in a love relationship with her anymore but that i could help her and be the support she asked me in the last time she told me she was going to the psychologist. But when she told me that she needed support (she talked about being friends, getting my trust on her back together and maybe one day, if i wanted, be lovers again) but she lied again, accused me, made me the bad guy and tried to make me feel guilty. Of course i wished all the luck and best fate in the world but i didnt fall for it. Not after this áudio call.

Any more opinions after i gave the context of the situation?

The best way is to really run and leave her behind? She opened up with me in part about her problem but didnt go any deeper because she knew i couldnt take it and could leave the relationship. Now im not in a relationship, we could share a different bond, if she told me the thruth and i supported her through the solution. I just cant bury these feelings. Dunno if i ever will be. I would really like to help her improve herself. Because i know she isnt happy with her dark side. Once she told me she had a really dark side and that if i saw it i wouldnt be able to stand it. But i know this wasnt her bragging, was her admitting a problem and telling me she cant solve it  .

[enlighten me]

I think the only thing you can do is wait for her to seek help from you.

She needs someone she can trust so that she can open up and she cant trust you because she knows she has hurt you. If you have ever been angry at her and accused her of what she got up to then she will not trust you. She will see you as a threat.

The only thing you can do in my opinion is wait for her to contact you then let her know that even though she hurt you, you have no bad feelings for her and want to understand and help her. Explain that you understand that trust is a major issue and how you can understand if she doesn't trust you but you are willing to prove that you are trustworthy and hope that if she ever wants to then she could talk to you.

With a BPD actions speak louder than words. They are so used to saying what they need to say that whatever you tell them is taken with a huge pinch of salt.

[Junknown]

I see. That might work. She asked for my support last time but was opening a door to a future relationship and was keeping her lies to make me eat the bait. I was angry at that time because i knew the truth, and i kept asking her to be true with me, that i could only be friends with someone who was true to me, that it would be better than lieing and she kept doing it, lieing and lieing and lieing... .I dont want a relationship with her anymore, as i know it wont work... .But she thinks, maybe, that because she lied and kept me blind, and i still have feelings for her, she might come get me some time later.

I think she is seeking support on her husband at the moment and even having a romantic relationship possibly with him again (he knows everything she did in the past 1 year and 7 months, but he is kinda stuck because he has codependency with her and he is tied to her by their son, so he cant move on and leave her and allows her to treat him bad and demand some things as a result of that). So, i would guess she will only make contact when things go rough again with him or whoever she is seeing.

I used to talk to him and get along well with him in the past 4 months, due to some stuff that made me be accepted by him and going to their house as her boyfriend (although i always respected him and never did anything in front of him, so that might have earned me his respect). But during the previous period he used to hate me and compete with me for her with no results as he was black and i was white.

But i dont think her husband, although he knows something is wrong with her and admitted it to me might know what really is wrong. I never trusted him to the point of telling him she is BPD as she talked to him and he talked to her a lot since they were "friends" again - now i question if they were really only friends or something more (maybe she even betrayed me with him again, dunno) as she started using the proposal ring again she had because she said it was good looking (and he even got sucked into a lie with her to save her from me discovering her affair with another guy - frankly dunno yet why he did this... .He saved our relationship that time... .).

So, i dont know. She asked for support, i declined it because i was angry and she kept lieing to me. Ill consider the options and see if it is better for her to initiate conversation or for me to send a message to her and try to make her see, that i could try to help her, the same way she always trusted me and had some consideration for me and would come to me when she was under serious danger.

But, to be true, i think the best option would be NC. But heart doesnt follow the mind many times. And when you love someone and want her to be ok and get over her problems you dont always follow the reason unfortunately :/.

[Junknown]

Went to my therapist a moment ago, i read her all the messages we exchanged before i went NC.

She said it sure was a nice degree of manipulation she did there. A nice act to get me to forgive her and feel guilty. And i was always excusing her, saying she did that because of the disease and the way she sees things and how she cant see how i love her and want her good but that i cant trust, etc.

She then asked "why do you act like you are her caregiver? You are not her psychiatrist or psychologist... .Why do you keep trying to help her and rescue her?"

I only say "because i love her".

Thats the only reason. Wish i could erase my love for her... .She did so many bad things to me and others. Why do i keep caring?

Will remain NC, i had almost a relapse but now i see clearly i cant be her caregiver anymore... .Im not supposed to. If she asks for help, sincerely, and lets all lies fall, i will do my best. Otherwise i wont do a thing.