BPD and old age- DO they get better without Help

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

Hi, I was doing pretty good with No contact and my EXBPDgf of over 2 years was 58 when I met her, and 61 when I finally left.  She did pretty much all of it.

She Rage out of control without warning, over stuff like my hair was too long. (Not even over my ears) or I wanted to take her on vacation (But she was looking for a job) so she raged at that, and these rages involved even hitting while driving the car, or starting a fight with a guy in a restaurant holding seats for his friends, things like that, and of course the ever wonderful, blaming me for this or that, or I can't even do this, or saying things or accsuing me of things I never said. 

She use to go to a 12 step program Child of Alocholic parents, but eventually somehow got kicked out of there.  She quiet bright, and attractive, and Knows all the guidlines and rules of twelve step program and CO-Dependency.  Doesn't live it but does practice at times when convienent. . 

She even mentioned a few times to just validate her, and really I was a novice and had no idea, but usually did say, I sorry you feel that way.  I didn't know about SET, but highly suspect after 1 year she was BPD.

Anyway, the IFs,  After 3 failed marriages, 4 engagement, and some guys before me and our 2 1/2 year romance , she most likely on to another, since she is very attractive and well built.  But we did have corresposndence 4-5 months ago and she seem to wanted me back.  At one point she begged me.  I almost did.

I know I shouldn't since we broke up several times, mostly her, and finally by me because I was so exhausted and worn out, and the last straw was catching her very active on a dating site, (We were exclusive) and her refusing to get off, saying I can't tell her what to say or do.   Sort a real slap in the face.  No remorse, no feeling for me, yet she still wanted to be with me, but I wasn't going to stick around for my replacement. 

Actually after typing this, I feel stupid asking this question since she treated me so badly. (Sickness or not)  It doesn't matter. 

But do they get better with age?  Do they learn something after each break up.  I mean , I know she wept tears, and did it before, and well, yes, it didn't mean much, since she actually devalued me even more once I was back , but do they get better, or just wishful thinking, like I can come back, and things woudl be better.  Yes, I know I would have to change quite a bit regardless and real apply SET and other tactics to gain peace. 

Gee, then again, even writing this seems awful to even try, like so so risky to be chopped up again. but she , like others I heard made us feel so alive.  It's probably due to the BPD, the good & bad parts.  I know it could never be a normal relationship. 

It's been 2 months N/C and 14 months not seeing her.  But I guess, I am having a weak moment or rationalizing or hanging on.  Not good!  I guess at age 61 if she could control herself then , 62 not going to be much better.   

[outside9x]

Hi, I was doing pretty good with No contact and my EXBPDgf of over 2 years was 58 when I met her, and 61 when I finally left.  She did pretty much all of it.

She Rage out of control without warning, over stuff like my hair was too long. (Not even over my ears) or I wanted to take her on vacation (But she was looking for a job) so she raged at that, and these rages involved even hitting while driving the car, or starting a fight with a guy in a restaurant holding seats for his friends, things like that, and of course the ever wonderful, blaming me for this or that, or I can't even do this, or saying things or accsuing me of things I never said. 

She use to go to a 12 step program Child of Alocholic parents, but eventually somehow got kicked out of there.  She quiet bright, and attractive, and Knows all the guidlines and rules of twelve step program and CO-Dependency.  Doesn't live it but does practice at times when convienent. . 

She even mentioned a few times to just validate her, and really I was a novice and had no idea, but usually did say, I sorry you feel that way.  I didn't know about SET, but highly suspect after 1 year she was BPD.

Anyway, the IFs,  After 3 failed marriages, 4 engagement, and some guys before me and our 2 1/2 year romance , she most likely on to another, since she is very attractive and well built.  But we did have corresposndence 4-5 months ago and she seem to wanted me back.  At one point she begged me.  I almost did.

I know I shouldn't since we broke up several times, mostly her, and finally by me because I was so exhausted and worn out, and the last straw was catching her very active on a dating site, (We were exclusive) and her refusing to get off, saying I can't tell her what to say or do.   Sort a real slap in the face.  No remorse, no feeling for me, yet she still wanted to be with me, but I wasn't going to stick around for my replacement. 

Actually after typing this, I feel stupid asking this question since she treated me so badly. (Sickness or not)  It doesn't matter. 

But do they get better with age?  Do they learn something after each break up.  I mean , I know she wept tears, and did it before, and well, yes, it didn't mean much, since she actually devalued me even more once I was back , but do they get better, or just wishful thinking, like I can come back, and things woudl be better.  Yes, I know I would have to change quite a bit regardless and real apply SET and other tactics to gain peace. 

Gee, then again, even writing this seems awful to even try, like so so risky to be chopped up again. but she , like others I heard made us feel so alive.  It's probably due to the BPD, the good & bad parts.  I know it could never be a normal relationship. 

It's been 2 months N/C and 14 months not seeing her.  But I guess, I am having a weak moment or rationalizing or hanging on.  Not good!  I guess at age 61 if she could control herself then , 62 not going to be much better.   

[Tater tot]

Outside9x to be honest, I'm following this for selfish reasons, because I am curious to hear if there are any stories of people getting better with age. You may want to ask this question on the "staying" board however, as I'm sure most of us on this board aren't around long enough to see any change or progress, not that I'm sure most us (well I should only speak for me) would like to desperately think they can get better over time.

What I've read however, is that even with serious commitment to DBT therapy, that people with BPD can improve their day to day coping, but that the do and will continue to struggle with relationships. They may get better (to a degree) but it seems that even trying to maintain a healthier version that what they've had, still is a lot of work, and requires a lot of patience and acceptance from a non, and that the emotional depth, trust, mutual respect, not feeling like you are walking on eggshells, etc will never be to the capacity that someone who does not have BPD can achieve.

I've also read that studies where there is improvement as pwBPD improve, they often end up isolating themselves as relationships are just too hard to maintain, and that accounts for a decrease in the stress triggered by intimacy.

I'm not sure that this helps. I think sometimes it's hard to accept that they are the way they are, which so many of their actions and reactions are just to illogical for us to wrap our brains and hearts around.

[outside9x]

tHANKS TATER-TOT, WILL POST THERE AS WELL. 

Tater-Tot.  IS that from Roy White the comedian?  Just wondering. 

[Raybo48]

There are various opinions on whether they get better with age, but out of all the material that I have read over the last two plus years about 85% say they absolutely do not get better with age.  In fact they can get worse in the case when a female goes through the change of life etc.  Their core trauma occurred when they were between the ages of 1-5 and they have been this way their entire life so the notion of them suddenly mellowing with age with no therapy is not good logic.

[Infern0]

I've heard they can become histrionic too as they age. Wonderful.

[Raybo48]

My ex  appears to be histrionic already at the age of 43.  She definitely has some of the major traits of that disorder as well as nearly every single trait of BPD including massive alcohol abuse.  The only thing I've never seen her do is 'self-harm'.

[Blimblam]

One of my exs has improved in some ways but she just found healthier addictions as her outlet.  She is still as BPD as ever though. I don't think for most the BPD really goes away but they may learn healthier coping mechanisms. The one I know in old age has gotten worst but has learned to communicate needs better.

[Tater tot]

tHANKS TATER-TOT, WILL POST THERE AS WELL. 

Tater-Tot.  IS that from Roy White the comedian?  Just wondering. 

I know what you are referencing regarding Ron White and his stand-up... .but no, I was thinking of the most generic non identifier and that popped into my head first. Funny I don't even like tater tots... .I'm a french fry kinda gal!

[Chasing_Ghosts]

I've heard they can become histrionic too as they age. Wonderful.

Yes I can verify in both the cases of my mother and my exes mothers. Instead of raging its just constant crying and drama. Its hard for me to watch somedays. Its weird because this is how my ex is starting to become at a younger age she told me of how she used to rage and be aggressively mean at past boyfriends. I read a few of the facebook conversations and they were so vindictive.   Rarely did I see this in her shes become the perpetual victim and just ignores/avoids instead of conflict. She has actually convinced herself that she hit her rock bottom and has since "changed". *sigh* What an existence...  

[outside9x]

For my two cents and limited knowledge.

As far as her hitting bottom at age 62 not likely yet.  

Maybe someone can overcome their BPD as they get old if they seek help and see the need, but I think of course with her many countless enhancing surgeries and most recent ones, Face, chin, neck, and eyelid lift , she still can demand a good supply so for her, probably no need to change, because there is no bottom yet.   Sad

Yes, rages , but lots of crying and plays the victim, still was crying to me over money, though she has plenty and that's when we were broken up.  Oh yes, Drinking, pot, Xanax, and her regular meds.  I am not against some of that, really, but all of it, at once is not good, and that side came out too,  Gee, it's amazing how I forgot that all.  


Lastly, at her age I heard enough stories from her about hatred for her father and family and I believe that probably both parents were unable to give her unconditional love, her Mom has mental problems.  Never met her, she wouldn't let me, and she would only see her twice a year .    She hates all her sisters, too, her only brother so I never met anyone from the family except the daughters.  The whole family, including uncles, aunts etc she says hates her.   Its a shame and her one sister was trying to reach out and she would tear her up on the phone, and then cry and accusing her of being jealous and wanting to just get information out of her to tell the family? Huh?

She does blame her parents and probably rightfully so, (one of the reasons I stood I guess) but she does nothing to correct the problem only to point the blame .  She as many has no idea I think that she BPD and I never told her, but I am sure someone has and I gave strong hints at the end and really wanted too but was warned that's not my call.  

Also when I first met her she was donating her time to Loaves & fishes, going to church, in a support group, carrying a rosary everywhere.  That all dropped after 5-6 months.  After we broke up, and I visited her FB page (I no longer do) You would though you were reading from Mother Theresa FB page.  

Anyway, leaving her months before she turned 62, I have to agreed that for the most part they don't change , because she has burned plenty of relationships in her 40's and 50's as well.  .   Sorry I got a bit carried away.  Yet, I still care.

[Pingo]

My uBPD Mom, who is 74, seems to be getting worse with age.  I am NC for several years with her but she wrote me a letter a couple of summers ago and I was really wondering if she has dementia, she seems to have really lost it.  But apparently no dementia.  Very witch-like!  My uBPDexh is "just like his father" according to his family, his father had the same behaviours and patterns that he has so quite possibly a PD. His SIL says the father is getting worse with age.  So I would speculate that possibly things get worse.

[Fluff]

I'm pretty sure my mom, who is 60, has BPD (it also became very clear in my last T session that my ex and my mom are veeeeerry similar). Anyway, my mom has been in therapy her whole life, but she's still raging in that sadistic manner(against everyone but me, including my sister) but by now she's also very hermity like and paranoid. Also a lot of vulnerable narcissism that has grown with age.

[HowCouldYou]

I can say that my BPDW got worse just as the last of children left for college. That coupled with pre menopause, and her getting off of her anti depressant, affected her and she acted out in a major HPD fashion. She had a secret life online getting valued for her sexiness by many, many men half her age in exchange for cybersex.

That was a few years ago and I have been recovering from the betrayal without help from her ever since.

Now I see more and more BPD rages and push/pull than ever before. I hope that it gets better after menopause but I am not counting on it.

[clydegriffith]

I started therapy while still in the relationship and the therapists' exact words were "they never get better". I wish i had listened and ended it then. At that point in time things were bad but what followed was a nightmare.

[Dutched]

NO, no way, it gets worse as from my experiences ( 30+ yrs) and many others on this Board and according to members of my local Group.

BPD is a disorder, not an illness. An illness can be cured, a patient with an disorder can be learned (therapy) to live a more acceptable life for themselves and as result for their surroundings.

Getting a HFBPD into therapy, well that is a different story, as there is nothing wrong with them, as it is you who is totally messed up… They say…

A pwBPD without treatment only learns by experience to behave in a more appropriate way, but as a pwBPD has a partial core of self (normally a whole cores is moulded between an age of 2 – 5) their coping mechanism will be that of a child, for as long as they live.

Further, applicable for me and others over here with a r/s for a 25+ yrs.

Abrupt departures during mid-life are particularly significant, because while she could have been exhibiting borderline symptoms for decades, these may become far more pronounced during marked hormonal changes, such as pre- or peri-menopause… . which can easily catalyze more acting-out behaviorsA pre- or peri-menopause takes up to many years. Add that with BPD and the outcome is obvious.

Don’t let yourself be misguided by wishful thinking.

[peiper]

It gets worse ! Mine went into menopause a couple of months into our RS and man talk about a horror movie !

[Hawk Ridge]

If the condition worsens with age, would it follow that the duration of the relationships shorten as well?  My ex was with a partner for 7 years, cheated on her and was with her next partner for 5 years before that partner left her, was with me for 1.5 years with one break up/recycle in the middle, and has bern with my replacement for 5 months.  She went into menopause while we were together and has been contacting me off and on for the past few months.  My T noticed the change in duration of relationships.  Did anyone else notice or experience that?

[Hawk Ridge]

If the condition worsens with age, would it follow that the duration of the relationships shorten as well?  My ex was with a partner for 7 years, cheated on her and was with her next partner for 5 years before that partner left her, was with me for 1.5 years with one break up/recycle in the middle, and has bern with my replacement for 5 months.  She went into menopause while we were together and has been contacting me off and on for the past few months.  My T noticed the change in duration of relationships.  Did anyone else notice or experience that?

[antelope]

they become more bitter with age, and even use their age as a rationalization for their behavior (the attitude of 'I've been alive this long, so I must be doing something right' coupled with 'you don't know how hard my life has been' boo-hoo-hoo)

I also feel their sense of entitlement surges as they age... .

[Dutched]

If the condition worsens with age, would it follow that the duration of the relationships shorten as well?  My ex was with a partner for 7 years, cheated on her and was with her next partner for 5 years before that partner left her, was with me for 1.5 years with one break up/recycle in the middle, and has bern with my replacement for 5 months.  She went into menopause while we were together and has been contacting me off and on for the past few months.  My T noticed the change in duration of relationships.  Did anyone else notice or experience that?

Hawk Ridge, of what I know by old topics (back to 2007). With every new relationship a pwBPD enters, the duration of that r/s will get shorter. BPD’s jump into the next r/s, expecting to find “you are the best ever happened to me”, discarding the old as garbage.

They are in a life long emotional rollercoaster (objectively seen it must be a empty an sad place to be) searching and searching, blaming any one around them not fulfilling their expectations.

IMO it is then obvious that pwBPD by experience learn to see more and more, so earlier in a r/s, when their finally found soulmate can’t coop with their expectations in the long or short run.

As you are contacted again the last months, it is out of HER need. Please be careful, it migt that her r/s is in trouble. So she needs you as a back up, not necessarily to get back together, more in order to fulfil het emotional needs.

[clydegriffith]

Since it does get worse with age, i am very very afraid of the things the BPDx may end up doing. The things i've documented on various posts here are just the tip of the iceberg and she's in her mid 20s. Although her suicide threats when she was with me where not real and just used as blackmail, i fully believe she will end up commiting suicide.