Dont' Know How Much Longer I Can Do This

[Learning2Thrive]

Please read and consider this below article (excerpted from the resources section). Again, the article is written from the perspective of a romantic relationship but... .it’s not difficult to see it has applications toward the parent/grown child relationship. You are angry and depressed as you begin accepting that your relationship with your son and his fiancé is not going to be anything like the dreams you had for the future for all of you... .and no amount of trying to understand on your part will fix it to make your dream possible. You are grieving your dream.
————

Anger and Depression
Elisabeth Kübler-Ross, MD., the author of the groundbreaking book On Death and Dying (1969), proposed that there are five stages of grief that individuals facing their own deaths experiences: Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression, and Acceptance. In her book, The Journey from Abandonment to Healing, Susan Anderson DCSW suggests that the grieving of a primary relationship goes through similar stages.

Anderson suggests that the grief from unrequited love is different from other types of bereavement in its ability to leave residual damages to a persons self-esteem. Feeling left behind, excluded, disposable, or deemed unworthy by a loved one can precipitate a collapse of self-confidence and this can contributes to an intense depression, narcissistic wounding and shame.

Anderson DCSW suggests says that the conventional wisdom that you should try to find happiness and solace from within, may not pull you through. "The antidote the rejection" she explains, "is being around people who love you and can give you validation and support. You need to see yourself reflected in their eyes."

Anderson also says that during the mid phase of the grief cycle, individuals may turn their anger about the rejection toward themselves. The process of self-attack can range from mild self-doubt to scathing self recrimination and leave a lasting imprint on individuals’ self-worth, causing them to doubt their lovability, personality-efficacy, and attachment worthiness going forward. In addition to the above, this mental searching can be accompanied by obsessive thoughts about factors leading to the breakup, and possibilities for reuniting with the lost person.

Losing a loved one can lead to an emotional crisis severe enough to resemble a full blown major depression.

Elements of the grief cycle, such as 'feeling deserted' and a sense of personal diminishment, can be aroused by many types of loss, including when a decision to separate has been mutual rather than unilateral or when one’s mate has died.

[Learning2Thrive]

As a mom of adult children myself—and having gone through a similar situation—I submit that the loss of relationship with a living child is DEVASTATING. For me, it was more devastating than grieving the loss of hope for ever receiving validation or love from my own uNPD/sociopathic mother and the divorce from my 1st husband (mirror male version of my mother) whom I stayed married to thru 11 years of emotional and physical abuse.

Angie, letting go of your dream is extremely painful and will take time to heal from. But I am here to tell you, your life can be better than you ever dreamed—in a different way. If you do the work to heal.

No. It’s not fair. At all. But we each only have the hand we are dealt. The question is, how do you want to play YOUR cards? Because you can only play your cards.

Spend time healing and really loving yourself, because you ARE worthy of love and kindness. Your joy of life will return... .in a different way. And along the way, your son may learn and grow and make changes of his own that bring him back to you. Be open to possibilities but focused on your own self-care and boundaries.

Sending you lots of love, gentle hugs and smiles.

[No-One]

Angie59:
I'm so very sorry you had to put your dog down. I can understand how devastating it is for you.  It's best to NOT make any important decision right now.  You are grieving.  You can't magically take that away, by trying  to change your son and his fiance.

At some point, when you are ready, you can bring a new pet into your life.  A new pet can't replace your dog who passed, but can serve as a new companion who can bring you their unique personality, comfort and joy again.

I talked to my son yesterday who has the uBPD fiance and I only hit on the subject of his fiance about sitting down and talking with her, just one on one to come from the heart and use the tools I have read here - to show her that I really want to understand who she is and what her thoughts and feelings are, how she sees things, etc... . What I want is a close relationship with her so we can all do things together and have some fun instead of feeling like I'm going to a funeral every time I go there.  Having more time together and celebrating different holidays, etc together.  Being a real family.  From my son all I got was more defense for her - no understanding toward me - nothing.

I'm sorry you got a disappointing response from your son.  I know that is disappointing for you, but it is an expected response.  Why did you choose to approach your son, while you are dealing with the loss of your dog? Timing is important when you want to discuss issues, and it is best to approach things in small measures.  Also, I'm thinking things need to settle down for your son and his fiance after her trip.

When someone has BPD or strong BPD traits, they commonly won't admit to their bad behaviors. She is a roaring lioness and you want to change her to a domestic cat.  That's not going to happen. I'm guessing that she doesn't understand herself, her own behaviors and emotions.  She is not going to be able to honestly sit down with you and discuss her thoughts, feelings and how she sees things.

When you are anxious and depressed, it can be hard to soak up advice and information that is offered.  For many of us, we reread things to help information sink in. It could be beneficial for you to read through your threads.  A lot of good advice/information has been offered from multiple members about what's typical with someone with strong BPD traits, and what is typical for someone in your son's role.

I think I have come to the conclusion perhaps I should slowly disassociate myself from both of them.  It is causing me way to much pain and sadness.  Something comes up just about every week.  

It doesn't have to be "all or nothing", but it's wise to back off of your efforts for an "all" relationship.  There can be good times, that you will enjoy with your grandson.  Like the Kenny Rodgers song, "You got to know when to hold them, know when to fold them, know when to walk away and know when to run"  It might seem that his song was about a card game, but it was really about life.

Step back from things for now and work through your grieving process for you dog.  The relationship with your son and his fiance won't ever be the relationship you desire, but you don't have to disassociate your self from both of them. Learn to play a good card game.  :)on't set yourself up for disappointment.  You have to examine your own behaviors and actions.  Are you taking actions that are making your more anxious?  Are your expectations realistic?  Is the timing right?

How are things going with therapy?  

[Angie59]

Thank all of you once again who replied to my last message.  Each and every one brought me comfort about the loss of my dog and also wisdom about making important decisions during this difficult period.

Especially to No-One, I loved your analogy about The Gambler song.  It really is truly about life and you brought out to me the all or nothing I'm wanting.  You are right.  I want a repeat of my Italian family and upbringing.  I want all the hugs, kissing, an arm around some one for no reason, holding someone's hand while sitting on the couch just because you want to show them affection.  That may seem too much to some people, and I understand that, and I am willing to settle for less - the less I get is really not less - it is nothing at all and that causes me a great deal of pain. 

I think the conversation I was talking of with my son's uBPD was I am in so much pain now that maybe I just want to end it with my son and with his fiancee before I get hurt once again.  I had at least 10 calls (one of them being my son), from people who know about losing my dog to tell me how sorry they were because he and I were inseparable.  Not one of those was from her.  I just feel strongly that she does not like our side of the family and especially me.  So I guess it was an end it all and don't get hurt anymore than you already have over the last 4 years on top of losing my best friend.  It seems right now that it is all too much; just way too much.

Does that make any sense?  I hope so.  It's kind of hard to explain.

I'm so grateful to have all of you and the education on this board.

Angie

[Harri]

Hi Angie.  I am so sorry to hear about your dog.  It is so hard when we lose a pet.

Have you thought about No One's suggestion to talk with your doctor about an anti-depressant geared towards anxiety?  This is very important, especially now and could make a huge difference in helping you cope with the things that are going on and acceptance of the things you can not control.

Your therapist may not be able to prescribe but they can certainly make an appropriate referral.  Can you commit to at least talking with your PCP or therapist about this? 

[Angie59]

I'm sorry I did not answer this question before, I believe when No-One asked it regarding another medication besides Xanax.  It was purely an oversight on my part.

I have been prescribed Paxil as an antidepressant which also is supposed to have a calming effect to it.  I also take Xanax 1 mg 4 x per day as needed.  If I took 4 a day of those, I would be a walking Zombie or constantly sleeping.  I only take one at bedtime.  I also take Trazodone for sleep.  So medication wise, I think I'm covered.

My view on medication is that it is kind of a bandage for what is bothering you.  Although I do take my doctor's advice and use the above medications, for me it only seems to dull what I am feeling, not solve it.  That has to be done in my head.  I was tempted to take 1 Xanax the morning we had to have our dog put to sleep, but I chose not to as I felt that is only masking the pain and I must go through it. 

Since I was so close to my dog, it is really especially hard because everywhere I go, everything I do, no matter what, he was right there with me.  We were inseparable.  He went through the dying process in my arms and the pain seemed too much to bear. 

I hear your advice about not having any conversations with my son's uBPD fiancee right now or even my son about the whole ugly picture.  I guess it is sort of like my pup's situation.  So much happens that we don't understand and we cannot control it.  Welcome to life, huh? 

Angie

[Harri]

Okay, that sounds better.  No need for an apology Angie, I was just wondering if your meds needed changing or an adjustment.  Sometimes after years you need a change or an increase.  My Pdoc is upping one of mine as after about 3 years I need a bit more.  lots of people feel the way you do about taking meds.  For me and other people, we need the meds to do their work for us.   I know for me it is impossible for me to get a hold on my anxiety, which worsened after some big life changes, without the help of meds.  I still feel the anxiety it is just not out of control any more.  I don't care if it is a bandage... .I need it!     But anyway, I am glad to know you have more than just Xanax. 

About you conversation with your son and his finace.  I am glad you are putting it on hold.  You need time.  You have read the articles on communication strategies but you need practice with them  Practice with your husband, use them with friends, the grocery clerk, your mailman, but practice, get them to feel natural, build your confidence using them.  You are still too angry and distraught for a sit down with your future DIL.  Chances are she is not all that thrilled either.  Give both of you some time.  This can't be fixed NOW.

[Angie59]

Hello everyone!

Thank you Harri for your reply.  My view of medication is probably not a healthy one.  I do agree with you that if you need it, take it.  There is no shame in that at all!  Sometimes though, I would find myself wanting to take a Xanax simply to sleep awhile and give my mind a break - turn off the noise and chatter always going on in there.  It exhausts me!  So then I say to myself, no these are just for anxiety, not sleep and escape.  I am so afraid of its addictive properties.  I can take up to 4 one mg tablets a day, have never done that because it does say p.r.n. also, so I just take it when the anxiety is really bad.  I am on the maximum dose right now of Paxil which is 60 mg a day.  I'm not at all ashamed of my meds, just over-cautious, which my doc told me was a part of the anxiety disorder. 

Thank you for making your statement about my dog.  It's been very difficult but I'm sure it will get better in time.  I miss him so.

I agree with you that now is not the time to talk to my son's uBPD.  I'm not really sure, Harri, if there ever will be.  Perhaps it is something I should just simply forget about.  Any conversation of any length that I have tried in the past has never turned out well.  One big one we had was when she was 2 months pregnant with my grandson and she shut me out the remaining 7 months and then "allowed" us to come to the hospital to see the baby.  That hurt deeply. 

My son just told me last night that she really loves you and dad and our other son; she just doesn't know how to show it.  The way I see that statement is a pacifier for my son and not a true statement.  The way she acts towards us would be one of the oddest ways to show love - and this is the way she always is.  It is just one huge ball of confusion for me.  How do you love someone when you don't even want to have a conversation with them?  That sounds ridiculous to me. 

Okay, getting off track - just wanted to address my thank you about my losing my little buddy and the medication.  Sorry about that!

Angie
 

[Angie59]

Hello everyone,

I think the advice given to me regarding a conversation with my son and his uBPD fiancee was spot on.  I know I cannot (and perhaps never will) be able to sit down one on one or even with both of them and explain my feelings about everything.  So, I've made a box in my mind's eye and said - nude photos of uBPD, blonde wig, bondage photos, trips with other men, never being home except for short periods of time - all go in this box and close the lid.  My son is aware of all of these things and it is not my place to try to discuss them with him and I do realize that it is their relationship - their business. 

One thing I am struggling with, and that I don't believe belongs in that box, is the children.  I have mentioned this before, I know.  It was always a pleasure to go babysit our GS2 for 2 days a week and always great to see GD4 after she would get back from daycare.  Not so much now.  GS2 is exhibiting bad behavior - the exact kind we already have been through and are still going through with GD4.  Lots of running through the house yelling just for fun, not taking no for answer regarding doing things, throwing things when told no to something, drawing on walls with crayons and they just leave it there without cleaning it up and correcting the behavior, and even hitting you when told no.

This is no longer enjoyable.  My husband and I do correct this behavior during the time with GS2; but it does scare us because even though some of this may seem "normal" behavior for a 2-year-old (terrible 2's), this is the exact same pattern GD4 went through.  We were so concerned about her, we asked my doctor (psychiatrist) if the behavior she exhibited was "normal," and he said no it is to the extreme and she needs professional help.  When conveyed to my son what was said, and he discussed it with his uBPD fiancee, she said absolutely not to professional help and then wanted to know if I was going to call CPS on her! 

No help to my knowledge has been given to GS4, and for awhile it seemed she was getting better, but it is rearing its ugly head again and our GS2 is mimicking. 

What really disturbs me is Monday my son's uBPD had the day off.  However, GS4 was with her grandmother.  That is not in keeping with what her grandmother was always adamant about - "I will watch the kids only when you are working."  I don't know where GS2 was.  Maybe with uBPD, maybe not.  The point is, unless my son is around and they do something as a family (very rare), she cannot seem to be at home with both of her children at one time.  This concerns and disturbs me.  I am not saying all of the behaviors GD4 has exhibited but they are very disturbing, and some are exhibited towards GS2, which really scares me. 

Again, this is their relationship and their family - BUT, when it comes to children, I am afraid for them because of this behavior and lack of time and attention that their mother gives them.  She suggested that day (Monday when she had a day off) that our son bring both kids to our house that night because she had a bad day.  Well, moms and dads sometimes have bad days, and she didn't even have to work or have GD4 and maybe not even GS2 with her. 

Your thoughts, ideas, etc., are welcome. 

Thanks!
Angie

[Panda39]

In my opinion what you can do is set another example when the Grandkids are with you.  Most likely the Grandkids have inconsistent if any boundaries at home so they run-a-muck.

Again you can't tell your son and his fiancé how to parent, but you can parent in a different way when the grand kids are with you.  You can show them boundaries (children as much as they might protest like to have boundaries) and you are able to be consistent which is also something kids need.  You can teach them that their are consequences to our actions... .timeout etc. I would take every opportunity to spend time with them that you can.  

There are many adult children of BPD parents that have shared what it meant to them to spend time with other family members, friend's families, a special teacher etc. that was supportive of them. Be that person for your Grandkids show them another way.

We have a Co-Parenting Board that you might want to post on for tips working with your Grandkids.  A therapist might be able to support you in this as well as things with your son and his fiancé too.


Panda39