Love and Abuse.

[harlemgurl]

Question.

Can a person love and abuse you at the same time? I ask this because my ex would always say that he did crazy things (like being controlling, jealous, possessive) because he loved me. He would always say that if he didn't care that he would simply walk away from me without a thought. He actually prided himself on "leaving women" that he didn't care about. In his mind him wanting to know my every move equated to love because he cared.   Now that I'm out of it I see it for what it is: insecurity and emotional abuse. But I keep wanting to believe that maybe that was the best way he knew how to display love... .however dysfuntional it had been.

[C12P21]

Abuse is never about love, it is about abuse and control. What you are describing is the tactics of a controlling, abusive man. Lundy Bancroft wrote a compelling book that describes the abusive man and their tactics of control and abuse.

"Why does he do that:Inside the mind of angry and controlling men"

Bancroft has worked in the field of violence and control for two decades and high lights the various kinds of abusers. Their sense of entitlement is why they abuse.

My hope is you will research and read in order to understand what you have gone through. Abusers do have the kind of skewed thinking you describe-and any man that prides himself on leaving a women he doesn't care about is telling you how easy it is to discard another human being.

No, it is not the best way he knows how to display love. How did he treat his mother, sisters, friends, coworkers? Did he do crazy things to them, follow them around, was jealous and possessive? If not, then why was the behavior targeted at  you? The answer is simple-because he believes it is okay to treat his romantic relationships this way.

My exh and exbf had the same control tactics. My exh eventually lead to physical violence and chronic mental and emotional abuse. The exbf was a controller and mentally abusive. Now that I am in T, support group, and have read the literature to educate myself about violence-in all its forms, I understand better the methods and signs.

They never wear a sign that tells you "hey, eventually I will undermine your self esteem, get inside your head and leave you wondering what the heck happened".

In the beginning they are smooth charmers that somehow lead you to believe you are very special to them, the right woman, the "one". It is a tactic.

Take care,

C

[2010]

Can a person love and abuse you at the same time? I ask this because my ex would always say that he did crazy things (like being controlling, jealous, possessive) because he loved me. He would always say that if he didn't care that he would simply walk away from me without a thought. He actually prided himself on "leaving women" that he didn't care about. In his mind him wanting to know my every move equated to love because he cared.

Narcissists tend to love and abuse at the same time because of the perception of entitlement.

There is a difference between cluster B personalities, namely narcissism and borderline. Narcissism is a grandiose false self that seeks to "subsume" people into their personality while Borderlines have a deficient sense of self that seeks to attach to others. People are objectified as either attachments for finding identity to be safe (borderline) or extensions for maintaining identity to be grandiose and larger than life. (Narcissism)

Objects are controlled in order to offset the insecurity. Narcissists fear that others have a mind of their own and their own power to leave. The narcissist then tries to control that ability to be a self by being jealous and possessive- because the object represents him. Borderlines fuse to the object by mirroring it and then creating a false bond that triggers their fears that they lack a self and are no one in the World.

Abuse is different between the two. One clings and acts out (I hate you don't leave me=Borderline) and the other uses you like a toy and gets angry if you dont represent him properly ( I am King- you are my subject = Narcissist.) If you are being controlled by someone who has "prided" himself on leaving multiple women, I would think that you would be dealing with a Narcissist.

[C12P21]

Abuse is different between the two. One clings and acts out (I hate you don't leave me=Borderline) and the other uses you like a toy and gets angry if you dont represent him properly ( I am King- you are my subject = Narcissist.) If you are being controlled by someone who has "prided" himself on leaving multiple women, I would think that you would be dealing with a Narcissist.

Very well stated 2010.

C

[Really?]

Question.

Can a person love and abuse you at the same time? I ask this because my ex would always say that he did crazy things (like being controlling, jealous, possessive) because he loved me. He would always say that if he didn't care that he would simply walk away from me without a thought. He actually prided himself on "leaving women" that he didn't care about. In his mind him wanting to know my every move equated to love because he cared.   Now that I'm out of it I see it for what it is: insecurity and emotional abuse. But I keep wanting to believe that maybe that was the best way he knew how to display love... .however dysfuntional it had been.

I believe the answer is relative in a way.  Yes, they do love you, but they don't really understand what that means in the big picture sense.  I've been with my recently diagnosed BPD husband for 16 years, leaving this summer.  We have gone through alot (loong story) but basically after years of abuse (i.e. extreme controling, paranoia, severe emotional and verbal abuse and some physical) I thought he didn't love me, hell he threatened to kill me!  I got a restraining order and left.  I was scared.  He had told me thousands of times he didn't care about me etc, etc.  So what did he do?  I left and was NC for a couple months, then let him talk to the kids, then let him see them and take us out (park, beach etc).  And within a year he had convinced me how much he loved me, how wrong he was, stopped the abuse. 

Read "Why does he do that? Inside the minds of Angry and Controlling people" by Lundy Bancroft, it's more about abusive relationships but from then to now (i.e. labeling him abuser and discovering BPD) the cycle and the reasons are soo similar!  Truely enlightening book.

Anyways, after moving back in with him I discovered the difference.  He stopped the outright abuse, but couldn't control his moods, rages, etc.  He no longer crossed that line, but my life is still chaos, I still have to walk on egg shells and he still treats people like crap, but he can't see it because he's able to justify it in his head. 

Sorry so long, but yes they can love you and abuse you, but it's not the kind of love you need and it's not healthy. 

What I've discovered with mine is I can threaten to leave, tell him if he doesn't stop I'll leave, but anything and everything up untill I pack up and walk out the door means nothing.  He'll say he doesn't care, good riddens, about time, Good!  Then as soon as I'm driving, he starts sobbing how it's all him and he's so sorry "Give me ONE more chance, just one!".  So sad, then he'll tell me if only I had told him how bad it was he would have stopped  ?  Really?  I did! Over and over!  ?

[harlemgurl]

My ex is clearly a Borderline Narcissist. In fact all borderlines have narcissistic demands. Can a six year old child really care about the needs of his caretaker? Six year olds are naturally self-centered and self involved. My ex was waaaaaay too emotional (always expressed love, very affectionate, loved to hug, loved to spoon at night) to be fully NPD but clearly had the narcissistic demands of a child.  But I knew something was off when he couldn't perceive reciprocity.  The concept of give and take seemed so foreign to him. He simply couldn't see how much he took and how little he gave. And when he did give he thought it was the biggest fracking deal!  ;p  It was strange but looking back he soo needed me to be his mother and re-parent him. I'm 36 he's 26. Now I really know why he's attracted to older women.  

In my case the violence came because he didn't know what else to do to keep me around. He saw me heading for the hills and tried to "scare me" into sticking around. Of course afterwards he begged, pleaded, and even asked me to abuse him too as punishment!  ? So weird and so sad. :'(


All the red flags were there.  He was molested by a baby sister, neglected by an alcoholic mother, a crack-head father. And pretty much left to fend for himself to survive. In his world I became the perfect idealization of mommy and daddy and he was so afraid that I would abandon him just like all the others.

Towards the end he did it all: violence, intimidation, stalking, triangulation (read definition) ... .all the tactics that abusers use to get their pray to second guess themselves... .but it all backfired. The trust was gone and I no longer knew HIM. He became a child monster to me.