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VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?" Parental alienation is when a parent allows a child to participate or hear them degrade the other parent. This is not uncommon in divorces and the children often adjust. In severe cases, however, it can be devastating to the child. This video provides a helpful overview.
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Author Topic: still not totally convinced my ex had BPD...  (Read 423 times)
Weird Fishes
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« on: December 26, 2011, 12:28:32 PM »

It's all armchairing from my part anyway, and does coming to a diagnostic conclusion solve anything from a relationship that ended in the worst way four years ago?

I don't know.  I feel the urge to figure things out, to come to a likely conclusion even if I don't know for sure.

Just got done reading the new DSM 5.0.0 BPD criteria and still it doesn't fully fit. 

Maybe he was just very depressed and this severe depression caused BPD-like behavior.

He seemed very capable of empathy.  His abandonment issues were not the same across the board.  Things seem inconsistent.

Yet he talked of a traumatic childhood and chronic feelings of emptiness, his narcissism was very high... .his inflated sense of entitlement... .

Why does it matter so much to me?  It's like I finally have a possible lead to explain what happened... .
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MaybeSo
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« Reply #1 on: December 26, 2011, 01:26:12 PM »

I think the label is more important for clinical, professional, And research purposes. For the purpose of understanding r/s issues, we know what hurts and what causes dysfunction and instability, regardless of it's clinical purity or origins. I often have to remind myself that many folks break up or have failed unions w/out anyone pulling out a DSM or even knowing what the DSM is. It is also possible someone might leave me or not want to be with me without it necessarily being indicative if a serious characterlogical defect, and vice versa.
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loveisblind
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« Reply #2 on: December 26, 2011, 01:39:45 PM »

The label of BPD doesn't matter. The abuse is what mattered. Don't doubt the pain you were endured.   
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SmileAnyway
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« Reply #3 on: December 26, 2011, 02:13:16 PM »

Wanting to know is normal and regular response for someone who has experienced disordered character from someone they love/d.

Unfortunately a solid diagnosis is only possible where the sufferer is in front of the professional and you/we are made privy to the conclusion. Short of this BPD is the best guess for most of us here.

I don't think many have the experience of knowing their loved one meets the criteria 100% partly because some of the criteria is subjective and only known to the sufferer.  But as has been said - we all know when we have been the recipient of abusive/unloving behavior.  Plus all the cluster B personality disorders are a little mixed up, so you may have a SO with BPD, NPD, OCD and a mix of each of these with depression, PTSD, SAD, PND etc thrown in for good measure.  Even the pros struggle to make a definitive diagnosis.  That said ill is ill!
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mermaid8
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« Reply #4 on: December 26, 2011, 04:18:52 PM »

I feel the urge to figure things out, to come to a likely conclusion even if I don't know for sure.

Just got done reading the new DSM 5.0.0 BPD criteria and still it doesn't fully fit. 

Maybe he was just very depressed and this severe depression caused BPD-like behavior.

He seemed very capable of empathy.  His abandonment issues were not the same across the board.  Things seem inconsistent.

Yet he talked of a traumatic childhood and chronic feelings of emptiness, his narcissism was very high... .his inflated sense of entitlement... .

Why does it matter so much to me?  It's like I finally have a possible lead to explain what happened... .

I can relate to what you are questioning. I think that there was a reason you were brought to this board. People who experienced a normal break up do not just stumble upon this site. I think it's because we all have lacked a sense of closure with regards to the ending our r/s. Part of the healing process occurs when we can have "closure" and begin to go through the stages of greif and loss but with a mental illness, we have to accept that often times we do not get clear answers which can cause us to question ourselves and our part in the reason for the r/s demise.

Even if your ex did not have BPD, he still experienced some disordered mental illness. That in and of itself is enough to cause a strain on a r/s and its ultimate demise. My guess is that the reason you seek the answers is so that you can finally begin to heal after "knowing" that you were not to blame.

Until I found this site 4 months ago after my sudden break up with my exbf of 3 years, I thought my ex was a sufferer of major depression  only and, perhaps bi polar, yet it always seemed that it was "more" than just depression... .and this site allowed me to put a label on the behavior that he exhibited. I have a feeling that he may have been diagnosed officially as BPD by one of the T's that he had been to but he never made me aware of it... .

Regardless of whether your ex was/is BPD, he is still mentally ill and most likely incapable of having a healthy r/s unless he gets into treatment.

Take care of yourself and find comfort in the positive people here on this board!   
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redberry
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« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2011, 01:14:40 AM »

I agree with Mermaid and the others.  An abnormal pattern of behavior led you to this site, same with the rest of us.  Labels are unimportant.  It's about understanding and focusing on yourself for real healing.
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FindingMe2011
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« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2011, 09:00:25 AM »

It's all armchairing from my part anyway, and does coming to a diagnostic conclusion solve anything from a relationship that ended in the worst way four years ago?

I don't know.  I feel the urge to figure things out, to come to a likely conclusion even if I don't know for sure.

Just got done reading the new DSM 5.0.0 BPD criteria and still it doesn't fully fit.  

Maybe he was just very depressed and this severe depression caused BPD-like behavior.

He seemed very capable of empathy.  His abandonment issues were not the same across the board.  Things seem inconsistent.

Yet he talked of a traumatic childhood and chronic feelings of emptiness, his narcissism was very high.  his inflated sense of entitlement.  

Why does it matter so much to me?  It's like I finally have a possible lead to explain what happened.  

 Its very apparent that this r/s, took its toll. How much did you value this r/s ? Did you feel compelled to fix something that was, upon further review, unfixable ? Did you feel shame or guilt, during or after the r/s ? I did. A better question you should ask yourself is " Why was I attracted to a sick person?" Its typically the voids in your psyche, that others fill, and visa versa. Knowing, respecting, and loving yourself better, will allow you to see things, as they are.

 PDs, are not all the same although most on here, can tell stories, and others could have typed the very same words. So the dx, truly is unimportant, but the behavior is. BOTH YOURS ( most important ) and his. This is a broad statement, and all that do this, will get different results, depending on how far you are willing to take it. All the answers you seek, are inside of you, and truthful (its amazing how we lie to ourselves, and dont even realize it) Self-discovery, is the path.  PEACE
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MuGGzy
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« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2011, 01:01:18 PM »

I'll jump on the "we will never know what it's CALLED but we all know CRAZY when we see it" bandwagon.

when I first started looking into, or trying to figure out WHY my wofe was doing what she was doing, I was approaching it from the lying angle. I thought maybe she was a pathological liar or something and then once I started researching I figured out there was WAY more too it. The first time we went to a couples counselor (well the first time with the THIRD counselor over our 15+ years) I told him outright that I thought she had some level of Anti Social Personality Disorder. She obviously had no clue what I was talking about so she didn't know if she should be offended, sad, or shocked but he obviously had no interest in my "armchair" diagnosis and carried on into what was ultimately a pointless series of visits.

I eventually found my way here because so many of the "OMG that is EXACTLY what she does" moments seemed to fit. There is just something about a "normal" mind that for some reason NEEDS to understand WHY/HOW someone can do the crazy sht these people do. Ultimately, the WHY doesn't matter and you have to GTF away from them to save your own sanity.
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Weird Fishes
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« Reply #8 on: December 27, 2011, 01:34:49 PM »

My sincere thanks to all of you. 

Perhaps it is just my flowering interest in abnormal psychology that leads me to obsess.  Is it interest or rumination or both? 

When I realized this dx might fit it was like all the lights had gone on. 

I never blamed myself for his suicide (as much as he tried to) but I've been working out how I ended up in that ridiculous situation in the first place for a long time.  He was unconsiously predatory but I was naive and eager to rescue. 

I think that I felt responsible for other areas of the relationship and understanding what he might have been thinking/not thinking helped me know there was nothing I could have done, and that no, it's not acceptable behavior to call your "best friend"(w/forced benefits) a ~ because she is out with her friends when you're having a fight with your wife.

 

whoa hello I'm turning this into a pity party.  My point, is that it helps to know he might have been a crazy person with bad behavior, not a normal person with crazy behavior.
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GP44
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« Reply #9 on: December 27, 2011, 02:17:19 PM »

I agree that the label is not important. You experienced something bizarre and cruel and you went looking for answers.

When my ex-ex and I broke up, did I think she might have a PD, was grossly immature, or that there might be some sort of deep-seated psychological explanation for why she wanted to end our relationship? No.

Did I feel the need to google a list of symptoms? No.

Did I feel the need to tell my story to almost everybody I knew because I was desperately seeking some sort of explanation for what I experienced? No.

Did I have a hard time letting go and finding closure? No.

Did I end up at bpdfamily.com? No.

Did I feel traumatized by the experience of dating her and the relationship ultimately ending? No

When my ex and I broke up, did I think she might have a PD, was grossly immature, or that there might be some sort of deep-seated psychological explanation for why she wanted to end our relationship? Yes

Did I feel the need to google a list of symptoms? Yes

Did I feel the need to tell my story to almost everybody I knew because I was desperately seeking some sort of explanation for what I experienced? Yes

Did I have a hard time letting go and finding closure? Yes

Did I end up at bpdfamily.com? Yes

Did I feel traumatized by the experience of dating her and the relationship ultimately ending? Yes
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2010
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« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2011, 03:20:51 PM »

Excerpt
helped me know there was nothing I could have done, and that no, it's not acceptable behavior to call your "best friend"(w/forced benefits) a ~ because she is out with her friends when you're having a fight with your wife.

This isn't about him anymore. It's about you.

Find a trusted counselor and begin the work. Ask yourself the hard questions:

Why did I feel "forced" into having sex to keep my friendship intact with my "best friend" who was married and betraying his Spouse with me?

Why did I believe he would not value the friendship unless I had sex with him?

Why did I think that his betrayal of his Wife would not apply to me? 

What did I want from the relationship and why did I fight for it in spite of the overwhelming odds that it was never going to be a healthy relationship based upon triangulation (read definition)?

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captainkirkz
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« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2011, 06:07:21 PM »

I agree that the label is not important. You experienced something bizarre and cruel and you went looking for answers.

When my ex-ex and I broke up, did I think she might have a PD, was grossly immature, or that there might be some sort of deep-seated psychological explanation for why she wanted to end our relationship? No.

Did I feel the need to google a list of symptoms? No.

Did I feel the need to tell my story to almost everybody I knew because I was desperately seeking some sort of explanation for what I experienced? No.

Did I have a hard time letting go and finding closure? No.

Did I end up at bpdfamily.com? No.

Did I feel traumatized by the experience of dating her and the relationship ultimately ending? No

When my ex and I broke up, did I think she might have a PD, was grossly immature, or that there might be some sort of deep-seated psychological explanation for why she wanted to end our relationship? Yes

Did I feel the need to google a list of symptoms? Yes

Did I feel the need to tell my story to almost everybody I knew because I was desperately seeking some sort of explanation for what I experienced? Yes

Did I have a hard time letting go and finding closure? Yes

Did I end up at bpdfamily.com? Yes

Did I feel traumatized by the experience of dating her and the relationship ultimately ending? Yes

Some posts just sum the whole thing up perfectly! This is one of those posts! Thanks
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Weird Fishes
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« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2011, 06:30:16 PM »

Hey 2010, yep just got my insurance referral # for a T... .

I totally just tapped out answers to all your questions but then thought better of it, not sure I was supposed to answer them here, heh.
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bluesclues
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« Reply #13 on: December 27, 2011, 07:35:39 PM »

I agree that the label is not important. You experienced something bizarre and cruel and you went looking for answers.

When my ex-ex and I broke up, did I think she might have a PD, was grossly immature, or that there might be some sort of deep-seated psychological explanation for why she wanted to end our relationship? No.

Did I feel the need to google a list of symptoms? No.

Did I feel the need to tell my story to almost everybody I knew because I was desperately seeking some sort of explanation for what I experienced? No.

Did I have a hard time letting go and finding closure? No.

Did I end up at bpdfamily.com? No.

Did I feel traumatized by the experience of dating her and the relationship ultimately ending? No

When my ex and I broke up, did I think she might have a PD, was grossly immature, or that there might be some sort of deep-seated psychological explanation for why she wanted to end our relationship? Yes

Did I feel the need to google a list of symptoms? Yes

Did I feel the need to tell my story to almost everybody I knew because I was desperately seeking some sort of explanation for what I experienced? Yes

Did I have a hard time letting go and finding closure? Yes

Did I end up at bpdfamily.com? Yes

Did I feel traumatized by the experience of dating her and the relationship ultimately ending? Yes

Omg, thank you. I often wonder if my ex was really BPD/what else/maybe not? and I just went though this checklist and answered all the same things.
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