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Author Topic: Is there a genetic component to BPD?  (Read 477 times)
mermaid8
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« on: December 29, 2011, 07:44:36 PM »

Hi  Hi!, I am wondering if anyone has had experience with their pwBPD whose family members were also mentally ill, possibly with BPD?

My exuBPDbf has a younger sister who is on total disability for mental illness, possibly BPD but definitely diagnosed as bi polar. She cannot hold down a job etc... .I also suspect that my ex's children suffer from depression, possibly eating disorders (one is overweight and the other is likely bulimic or anorexic).

The more I read about mental illness in my attempt to "understand" what happened in my r/s, the more I want to know. Thanks for your input!   
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« Reply #1 on: December 29, 2011, 08:05:58 PM »

I'm fairly convinced that my ex's Mother is BPD. I think her father is possibly autistic if not then he has aspergers

She (the mother) has her own lap dog (co-dependent) running around after her. He's a nice guy, It's sad and I've always wished he would find someone (else).

But he won't. He's addicted to the crumbs he gets. (my ex also knows this but reframes in a different way)

Her sister is the only high functioning character in the family.

I doubt she's escaped unscathed.

I'd rather not speculate about her family. SHE was definitely anorexic, depressed and f***ed up.

Edit to add, Oh I'm not bitter at all am I?  LOL
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OverandDone
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« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2011, 09:12:18 PM »

Great question.  I think we've all asked ourselves whether that is possible.  I certainly believe that there is a slight possibility, though, I do believe BPD is more on the "nurture" side of the argument.

In my case, my future in-laws (no longer... .woo hoo!) were extraordinarily controlling.  They had a major factor in destroying all of her past relationships (including with me) via stalking, intimidation, "him vs. us" mind games, etc.  How do I know this?  I heard it straight from a prior ex's mouth and experienced it myself.

Case in point:

About a month prior to the end of our relationship, my ex and I went out of town for a business trip of hers and to have a nice weekend to make up for a rage session that recently happened.    Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)   Before we left, her parents asked if I was going with her on the trip to which she replied "no".  So we went on our trip, checked in to the hotel, and she of course had to check in with her parents to let them know she was okay.  The following day her parents called my place of employment and drove past my house (lived in the same town) to see if I was in town.  When they determined that I was not, they called the hotel room hoping to bust us... .and they did.  They screamed at me for being there with her, etc, etc.  Keep in mind we're in our mid-20s at this time.  The rest of the weekend was spent together trying to enjoy it but was consistently interrupted by phone calls and texts from her father claiming he was soo hurt, never had his heart destroyed like this before, was depressed, etc.  After getting back from our trip her parents had a "pow-wow" with us to which I cannot begin to describe in full detail here.  But to sum it up, it was an extremely verbally abusive assault primarily dealt by her father.  This session lasted about 1 hr and consisted of 30 min of aggressive name calling/demeaning comments (to which I sat there and listened to), followed by 20 min of "I've been victimized by this ordeal and am such a bad father... .pity me", and the final 10 min of him cracking jokes and going off on tangents.  Yes, that is correct.  In 1 hour... .verbal abuse, pity, and playful ribbing/avoidance all occurred.

The only proof I have of what that family lifestyle is like is the recording I made of the entire session.  (Don't worry, it's legal in my state.)  I played it for my therapist and she was petrified with what she heard.  Her conclusion... .if this was a common theme, he more than likely had a PD of some type but felt he leaned more toward NPD.  If he did in fact have a PD, it's difficult to know whether she was born predisposed biologically or not.

One more point:

My mother was diagnosed with BPD and given that my therapist has known me and my brother since the mid-1990s (and never diagnosed us a PD), I feel fairly confident in saying that being exposed to abusive behavior at a young age has more of an impact than being related to an abuser.  Had my father not obtained custody of us, who knows the type of people we could be today.  Sadly, my close relationship to her as a child set me up to fall for a borderline when I got older.  Good thing is, I now know my fault/weakness and what to do to avoid a repeat in the future.   Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2011, 09:14:00 PM »

I recently read somewhere (doing so much reading, can't pinpoint where, sorry) that the reason it's called borderline is because the boffins couldn't decide whether the condition was psychological or physiological - and compromised between the two by calling it on the borderline of both.

I do think though that in many cases PDs are a learned behaviour from trauma/negative parental characteristics from childhood, but even so if there are say three children and only one goes on to also suffer a PD and the other two remain Nons, then perhaps there is a physiological component at play as well.

My uPDexh's mother displayed most of the PD traits he 'inherited' - yet his brother is a Non.  That said, exh was the spoiled favourite youngest, and his bro the determined and control-defying 'rogue' child.

Bit like the chicken and the egg, really.
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Robhart
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« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2011, 09:56:24 PM »

I think people may have a genetic propensity to have a type of reaction to certain situations.

A dysfunctional childhood  for some people could trigger BPD.If they are fortunate enough to not

have been  in these abandonment scenarios they could go through life without BPD.

Other people don't have these propensities or sensitivities  and even in childhood with abandonment they will not have BPD.
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« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2011, 10:03:53 PM »

Yeah my exgfwBPD whole family I reckon. Dads co-dependant if not more, totally under the thumb, Step mums prob NPD, Sister either NPD or BPD and like overandone said i'm certain they destroyed our relationship. Saw me as some sort of threat to there dysfuntional way of living. They're all crazy but have some how made me out to be the bad person in there minds.  

Its so sad, because they all have some sort of problem its like they think thats the norm and dont realise the whole lot of them need to get to family therapy.  
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OverandDone
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« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2011, 05:04:23 AM »

Saw me as some sort of threat to there dysfuntional way of living. They're all crazy but have some how made me out to be the bad person in there minds. 

It's interesting you mention that.  During that verbal assault, my ex's mother said to me verbatim, that "All of the past guys have tried to destroy our relationship as a family."  Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post)   All of them?  Needless to say, I wasn't the first guy to experience this nightmare family and sure as hell won't be the last.  Sadly, with every good (or bad) guy run off by her and/or her parents it will be a living hell for her when they pass away one day.  I'm just happy I won't be one of the people on the path of destruction when that day comes.
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« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2011, 05:25:39 AM »

I think my exBPDgf mother is a H/F NPD or BPD or both Laugh out loud (click to insert in post) but her father was a great humble man but the mother controlled him and from what I heard of her story was that the mother would control him to beat the oldest sister and the sister ran away when she was 17 so my ex at that time was 10 and she felt that she abandoned her so I think that is why she is a BPD. I dont know if its all true but I have met the sister and was very close to her. I felt bad for what she had to go through and I can tell that she is very uncomfortable about her past and being around the mother. Also my ex knew she had eating disorder and depression and I always wanted to get help and have her have therapy to help her but she never had enough money and her mother and father always said "you're fine... .we don't have a sick child and it's all in your head." 

I rarely got along with the mother because she was very controlling and was all about herself and very mean to my ex and it ticked me off. I have stood up to her in front of my ex. my ex feared for me as she was hiding behind my back but I wasn't afraid of her. I don't take bs every easy and I always stand up to people who try to hurt people that I care about.
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« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2011, 08:47:07 AM »

Also my ex knew she had eating disorder and depression and I always wanted to get help and have her have therapy to help her but she never had enough money and her mother and father always said "you're fine... .we don't have a sick child and it's all in your head." 

I can relate, my ex definately has PTSD and uBPD and I know for a fact she has the former and 99.9% the latter, my ex told me she knew she had a problem with these though didn't know a lot about either disorder. She said to her step mum she wanted to see a T and got told there was nothing wrong with her and it was me causing all her stress by continuing to contact her after we split up.

Bear in mind whenever I tried initiating contact with my ex usually to sort finances I never got a response so gave up after a while and instead she'd be the one who was calling me everyday during her most down moments usually at exactly the same time in the evening telling me she still loved me and stringing me along and messing with my emotions. She's 25 and her mum would shout at her if she knew she called me. In the end I think my ex must have been saying one thing to me and something totally different to her parents because they made me out to be some sort of stalker!

Her step mum hated all her ex b/f's, though I know myself and all her ex's got on very well with her dad who was the lap dog & codependant on the step mum. Her step mum wouldn't lift a finger around the house. He'd cook, clean, do the gardening, decorating go out and earn the money. Her step mum continually kept being made redundant from her job but was the one who decided what all the money would be spent on usually herself.

Her dad never goes out and sits in playing computer games, he's 50. Her step mums the only one who goes out and socialises and is a complete flirt, she'd even mildly flirt with me sometimes which I found very odd and repulsive.

My ex once told me her dad had many times wished she wasn't with her but was to scared to leave because he didn't want to be lonely and probably wouldn't find anyone else.

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findingmyselfagain
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« Reply #9 on: December 30, 2011, 08:48:56 AM »

My ex's family was definitely quite unhealthy. Her brother suffered from a rare growth problem... .often suffered with depression. Her mom also had depression. The dad seemed hermit-like, histrionic... .ended up losing his job after he and his boss kept getting into it. He would often come home in a rage/stressed out. Is all of that genetic? I don't know. Neither her mom or dad had healthy families. His mom was kind of crazy and the dad was a traveling salesman. The mom had some drama in her life where she ended up practically being raised by her grandmother. The family spent time in Macedonia as missionaries. Missionary kids often tend to have problems with stability from what I understand.

I don't know if it's really genetic, or something more like "generational sin". When unhealthy is the only model you've ever seen, how are you supposed to know the difference? Maybe there is some genetic pre-disposition, but if "hell" is all you've ever known, how can you be comfortable with stability? My feeling is that her parents were very distant and invalidating. Growing up the parents NEVER let the kids eat a restaurant they wanted... they only got 1/2 a vote. How cruel is that? Many times each member of the family was in their own separate room on their own computer. How is that healthy? I doubt very much that her dad comforted her at all while she was breaking up with me... .I bet he never hugged her or told her things were going to be ok. He just was on his computer doing his thing. If you already were prone to be emotionally sensitive and feel abandoned, how could growing up with that kind of father make you feel?

I'm still not quite comfortable with healthy girls. I'm used to borderline-like mom. Healthy girls shouldn't be threatening to me, but they just don't feel familiar. I've always had an attraction for waify/temperamental girls like my mom, but didn't realize it or how deep it ran until therapy. So in a way I can understand how pwBPD have such a hard time breaking their habits. Out of her family, my ex seems to have the worst problems so maybe there is a genetic component, but I think it can often result from an unnhealthy family history.
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mermaid8
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« Reply #10 on: December 30, 2011, 06:41:24 PM »

I recently read somewhere (doing so much reading, can't pinpoint where, sorry) that the reason it's called borderline is because the boffins couldn't decide whether the condition was psychological or physiological - and compromised between the two by calling it on the borderline of both.

Sealie, that is quite interesting! I had not read that anywhere... .it does make sense though. I have read that it is not usuallly treated with meds the same way that Bi Polar, Depression, Anxiety and other mental illnesses are, because it is not linked specifically with a psycho-psysiological aspect. Thanks for the information.  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #11 on: December 30, 2011, 09:35:06 PM »

Some of us are born with genetic predispositions to a host of things... .I tend to think that the nurture argument for BPD holds a slight edge. I have mental illness in my family. I also deal with societal issues because of my ethnicity. I also deal with issues within my ethnicity due to an assumed favoritism in society. I have a problem with people assuming things about me because of this.

My exBPDh knew these things. I was exploited. Every hurt, exposed.

On the other hand, he has mental illness in his family. He deals with societal issues because of his ethnicity. He deals not with an assumed favoritism, but an assumption of inefficiency in society. I've always tried to encourage him of his worthiness, while hoping that he could appreciate mine. Each one, teach one, right?

Generally that's what I experienced. More personally, his mom also dealt with an assumed inefficiency... .so did mine (although in different ways. My mom was an overachiever while his was just the opposite). Who knows how far the rabbit hole goes... .You, as someone with a bit more self esteem, try to merge worlds. Some things can't be fixed... .

Whatever it was, nature or nurture... .the bottom line is that we must live authentic selves. I'm talking a lot tonight. I guess that it was so built up in me that I had to set it free... .

I think that psychic hurts can span generations. I never wanted to rescue him, while putting myself on the backburner... .but I understood his pain. I wanted him to understand mine. Maybe it does become a part of your DNA over time. Who knows? All I know is that I want my children to have a better life. The dysfunction must stop somewhere and if I can't stop it, at least my kids will have more options with their lives, as children growing up with better a sense of self awareness and worth... .than I did. I do know that my family tried their best, but the pressure can be intense regardless.
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« Reply #12 on: December 31, 2011, 03:13:15 AM »

ExBPDh was diagnosed ADHD, bi polar and BPD - high functioning. His mother never diagnosed because she never went to a doctor but had all the same symptoms except low functioning and no ADHD. I have 1 D ADHD and mild OCD but very well adjusted, other D bi polar, epileptic, speech language impaired (autism spectrum) but NO BPD. She's doing pretty ok as well.

Her neurologist says the genetic chemical imbalance is inherited on a 50/50 basis but whether this turns into anything - bi polar, schizophrenia etc depends as well on environmental issues. This was also confirmed by my Psychology 101 textbook. My BPDexh doctor says that upbringing has a lot to do with BPD - so if the tendency to mental illness is already there BPD is modelled or becomes a coping mechanism. Given the family history you can be 100% certain that parenting was cr*p, in fact a lot of what I saw was straight out of Over and done's experience - only my exuBPDmil. FIL was ADHD and co dependent. They used to take turns at times to verbally abuse.  So you have a very manipulative mother, an overpowering father who wants to "balance" things out by beating it out of him, but who is kept in line by BPDw's tantrums and behaviour because according to her, her one and only precious is pure as the driven snow (I don't think he was ever anything but white). No wonder he is a mess.

No my D has a lot of problems but we have a household with a fairly structured environment and consistent rules (much harder to implement at first that it sounds) including rules for no tantrums will be rewarded, ever.  She has problems but definitely is not BPD and in fact went NC with her father when she was about 10 - she doesn't play games just sees things very black and white. If you upset my sister I won't talk to you. Simple really. Both girls have a great relationship with their step father and hopefully have had at least some exposure to a normal family, but for 15 years we were a single parent household - tough at times but worth the effort.

So yes, definitely inherited but maybe modelled coping mechanisms or learning how to get your own way by watching. In other cases - similar but childhood abuse is also in the mix.

Rose
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mermaid8
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« Reply #13 on: December 31, 2011, 10:47:56 AM »

Everyone's input is extremely interesting and valuable here. Thank you for the insight... .

My exuBPDbf grew up in a household where the dad was a man of few words, but from what I understand was very strict and put a lot of pressure on my ex to excel in ALL sports because of his natural ability. He did not want to play the sports in school but his dad made him... .He played football, baseball, golf, basketball... .can you imagine the pressure? His senior year, he rebelled and quite ALL of them. I am sure there was much disappointment from his father.

The other thing he shared with me is that his dad used the "belt" as a punishment. Whether people are for or against physical punishment, is beside the point... .but personally from what I learned from his experience, it was a devastating form of punishment for him. I happen to believe that there may have been some abandonment issues with the mother formed as him, as a child/teen viewed his mom as "non protective" against the dad by allowing that punishment to take place. Is this not a possibility? Even though he was a positive r/s with his mom and she was not abusive, she also did not "protect" him and she permitted the abuse to take place... .Just a thought. Especially since all 3 children in the family seem to have some mental issues possibly as a result of their upbringing, part physiological perhaps.
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« Reply #14 on: December 31, 2011, 11:55:36 AM »

Exw udBPD ... .From how she described her father he also has BPD. The mother seems to be treated like a dog from all family members from what I've witnessed (sim to how I was treated in marriage). Never met her brother but from how she describes him he is a duplicate of exwife. My exwife daughter is 7 yr old whom can't even talk yet. Bad parenting + possible BPD outline?

Once I started putting the pieces together I no longer wanted a child from my ex. Her last attempt to suck ne back in was claiming she was pregnant. Prob a lie like how she suckered me back in before
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« Reply #15 on: December 31, 2011, 04:17:14 PM »

Borderline is a belief. It is taught.
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« Reply #16 on: January 01, 2012, 01:14:26 AM »

Borderline is a belief. It is taught.

I wouldn't say it's a 'belief'.  They are trapped in their childhood coping mechanisms of manipulation, tantrums (dysregulations) and ego centricity.  Having been in a close business relationship with one for 6 years, I very much wonder if it's nurture over nature, but believe overall from what I've read that it's mostly environment (could be wrong here) & I guess that's what you mean by 'taught'.  Something in their upbringing 'triggers' it and unfortunately, I now have such bad dynamics with my uBPD business partner that I trigger where I once was the 'white' one.  But fortunately, I know how maniupative she is and can't even listen to her for more than 30 seconds without suspecting  turmoil in her  head is leading her to 'control' the situation.
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« Reply #17 on: January 01, 2012, 02:26:05 AM »

My ex was very unlucky to be born to a woman who had absolutely no regard for anyones welfare, accept her own.

I was spent 3 months living in her house and it was a ride. I strongly suspect she is a Queen BPD - her demands were outrageous and my ex was boundary-less. He was walked over emotionally.

And every baby photo was him crying!

I have no doubt that if he was born to a more emotionally mature and a less emotionally subsuming mother he would have had a very different life.

A parent has to earn the trust of a child - its never a given just because you gave birth.
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« Reply #18 on: January 01, 2012, 07:36:21 PM »

Borderline is a belief. It is taught.

My apologies for the length here… this thread really has me “wondering” about the genetics of Personality Disorders… Great thread! I have been thinking it over and typed what I know of my exBPD/NPDbf... .I realize that this cannot be my "focus" in recovery. But, I am genuinely interested in this topic... .

Yes, my exBPD/NPDbf seems to have some “history” of Personality Disordered family members. I had not ever so much as heard of a “PD, BPD, etc... ” prior to my being dumped. I had known the term “narcissism” but never honestly understood the gravity of its disturbing manifestation in mental illness. I had no idea what “NPD” as a diagnosis truly involved…

My ex was born into a family of unprecedented wealth and privilege. He is a so called, “trust fund baby” that would never have had to work a day of his life. I did not know this until I was well into the r/s. They attended only private schools and were given the gifts of “all expense paid” Ivy League college educations and amazing indulgences.  My ex was the middle child (only boy) with a sister “H” about 18 mos older and another sister “A” about 18 mos younger…

Their Dad died suddenly after a brief illness when my ex was not quite 2 yrs old. His younger sister “A” was in utero at the time of Dad's death from a rare form of blood cancer. His older sister, “H” was a toddler at the time… Apparently Dad fell ill just after younger sister “A” was conceived.

Mother was understandably devastated by the Dad’s death, didn’t handle it well and NEVER remarried or even had any boyfriends from that point forward. She remained dedicated to preserving the memory of her husband. Still playing tapes of his voice and reflecting back to his memory. None of the 3 children ever knew their Dad, sadly… but his “legend” certainly lives on… he sounds to have been a wonderful man. I was a bit “taken” with how much they still speak of the Dad who died in 1957… such a heartbreaking event…

Mother was a working Mom (by choice, as she was and is extremely wealthy) and raised the children telling them (according to my ex and his younger sister “A”) that they were “better” than others because they were an “international” family of wealth and fame… Dad was a very wealthy and prosperous man from another country. Mom, from a very prominent, rich American family.

Younger sister “A” was/is formally diagnosed with BPD. She is low functioning (has learning disabilities), acting out type and also a problem drinker (as is Mom). Sister “A” has never lived apart from Mom? They are totally enmeshed. The children have monthly therapy sessions to discuss the mental health and “situation” of youngest sister “A” and Mom. Interestingly, sister “A” does have a long time boyfriend but Mom disapproves. So sister “A” has remained living with her mom all of her life…

Mom is now 93 years old, older sister “H” is 56, my exBPD/NPDbf is 54 and younger sister “A” (w BPD) is 52.

The family therapist worries that sister “A” will not survive the death of Mom. Sister “H” is brilliant and a famous philanthropist who has served appointments in the White House just to name of few of her impression credentials. I suspect that older sister “H” is NPD… for reasons I won’t go into now…

Mom (a brilliant and well educated woman, especially for her day!) had many bizarre behaviors (including heavy drinking) while the kids grew up. One example, she would punish the kids for not getting themselves dressed in time for church on Sundays by driving like a maniac, skidding tires and terrorizing them on the ride to church services. My ex and his sister “A” shared that story with me more than once…

Sister “A” had a child (from a rape) when she was 15 yo. Her child was adopted out and no one knows anything more about the fate of that offspring…

Sister “H”, (the older famous and highly educated sister) has 2 daughters from different marriages. The eldest daughter was a “cutter” in high school. Don’t know any more about this? Sister “H” is a career woman like her mother …was married and divorced… and happily (?) remarried again…

My exBPD/NPDbf is a brilliant lawyer and has 2 daughters… The oldest (now 16) who is diagnosed with ADHD and younger daughter (now 13) shows signs of BPD type behaviors. She has been “in and out of therapy” since she was around 5-6 yo? She cannot ever be “alone” or have any “unscheduled time”, she cannot “soothe” herself and acts out by throwing herself against walls during tantrums, etc… She is very smart in school but emotionally very “immature”. Dad (my ex) has no boundaries with this child. My ex was constantly worried about this child “liking him” and consumed with “panic” when this child became “angered” at him… which was/is quite often?… This particular child seems to have some form of “hold” on my ex… Never quite understood this lack of boundaries… something always felt “off”… like the child was the “parent” and my ex was the “child”? My observation only…

My ex had been in and out of therapy throughout his 20+ marriage (possibly T before this?). He tells me that they nearly split before making the decision to have kids… Then, after having kids things became "terrible" btw them again. He tells me that they did “couples therapy” for many years with no success… He (my exBPD/NPDbf) tells me that his ex-wife never felt "taken in" by him and he was forever "blindsided" by her endless lists of his "insensitive" behaviors... .Ex-wife refused to continue therapy and they decided to divorce in 2008.

My ex continues with the same therapist (same T as used in couples therapy) for nearly 7-8 years that I’m aware of? He has never told me his “diagnosis”… But, these boards and my therapist (and other mental health professionals that I have spoken with about my r/s) tell me that he is both BPD and NPD… with strong NPD traits…



So, a question for 2010 and others (MaybeSo?) who know this illness so well?– I would love to hear your thoughts on this? You say that BPD is “taught”? I am so grateful for your knowledge sharing, insights…

Do you believe that there is a genetic predisposition at least?

I find that the more I understand about PDs, the easier it is for me to “trust” that my ex was/is BPD and NPD… and the easier time I have at not blaming myself for his bizarre moods swings, cruel devaluation, abrupt discard and rapid replacement of me… Again, I realize that I need to focus on "me" and I am working very hard in my own therapy... .But would greatly value your input on this topic... .


WhiteDoe

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mermaid8
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« Reply #19 on: January 01, 2012, 08:56:05 PM »

Excerpt
She is very smart in school but emotionally very “immature”. Dad (my ex) has no boundaries with this child. My ex was constantly worried about this child “liking him” and consumed with “panic” when this child became “angered” at him… which was/is quite often?… This particular child seems to have some form of “hold” on my ex… Never quite understood this lack of boundaries… something always felt “off”… like the child was the “parent” and my ex was the “child”? My observation only

White Doe,

I think that your post brings up my point that I raised when posting the genetic disposition question... .While there definitely seems that there was a fair amount of dysfunction in your ex's upbringing, it is very clear that there also seems to be a very strong genetic component to other related mental illnesses within the family... .I do not think that this is coincidental.

I wanted to also comment on your ex's relations to his kids as it is strikingly similar to my ex and his kids. There were absolutely NO rules in his household with his two teenage kids 15 and 17. No chores, no responsibilities, no boundries whatsoever! He was very concerned that his kids would "stop loving him or liking him" if he had to reprimand them for anything. It was a case of the "tail wagging the dog" in the household and very bizarre that he was more like a big kid and friend tohis kids than their dad. But what popped in my mind as an a-ha moment was that maybe this is related to the pwBPD's inability to emotionally rlate as an adult. Therefore, he only knew how to relate to HIS kids, as another KID himself. Just a thought... .My ex was petrified that his kids would not like him or think he was not cool at the expense of depriving them structure and stability of a mature parent figure.

As you mentioned, my ex's kids both have problems that I can see resulting in years of therapy somewhere in thier lives. The teen daughter has probably suffered an eating disorder from the time I met her at 12 She was significantly under weight and very preoccupied  with food and her size double zero... .the son on the other hand is very over weight and eats a LOT. He plays video games ALL day and sometimes all night long. I think there is an addiction with that.  It is obvious that both kids are depressed and have problems relating. The son is a genius, literally. He is MENSA smart but has a maturity of a toddler. Very socially inept.

I will be interested to learn more from 2010 and their post about BPD being a belief that is taught... .
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MaybeSo
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« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2012, 05:09:56 PM »

Last year I took a training on PD's by Greg Lester (this is all he does, he treats people with PDs).

His handout indicated the following:

Strengths of genetic theory are:

Accounts for chronicity and stability of the disorders

Accounts for the early appearance of PDs

Accounts for the difficulty of traditional "talking therapy" to alter PDs

Scattered data have shown neurological abnormalities in SOME pateints with severe PDs.

Problems with genetic therory:

Identical twins do NOT have 100% concordance rates, the rates are:

Schizotypal 69%

Borderline 63%

Histrionic 70%

Dependent 69%

APD 68%

Average 58%

No reliable genetic markers have yet been found.

Consclusion about the Genetic Theory: Biological factors are invovled, but they are insufficient by themselves to explain the cause of the disorder.

Current prevailing theory is:  Biopsychosocial; Predisoposing biology combines with "other" factors to create a "functional biological structure" in the brain which produces disorted experience and dysfuctional behavior.

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Clearmind
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« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2012, 05:59:49 PM »

The brain is pretty complex. It was all news to me – but after reading “A Journey from Abandonment to Healing” (Susan Andersen) there is a chapter in it that explains the link between the Limbic System within the brain and our emotional life and formation of memories. Given BPD is an emotional disorder the link is an interesting one.

I found this book interesting because I was still needing to heal from my own abandonment trauma from childhood as was my ex.

Two areas of the limbic system: amygdala and the hippocampus were discussed in the book.

The amygdala, stores our emotional memories from the moment we are born (maybe conceived – not sure!). It controls our flight/fight response and triggers our responses to pain, fear etc. BPDs core trauma from childhood as with everyone, is stored and is re-enacted in adult life – and will continue to do so until they/we seek T.

These memories are stored forever but can be rewritten – which I guess is what I am doing in T. I bounce normal everyday upsets off my T all the time – in essence my own amygdala is being retrained because my own emotional memories are a little distorted due to my own core trauma.

The amygdala is known to be more hyper sensitive (core abandonment trauma from childhood) in those with BPD. Less of an ability to return to normal following a trigger – over emotionalise.

The hippocampus part of the brain records facts (contextual memory). My ex revised facts to fit his emotions – which were heightened to begin with.

These two parts of the brain maybe at odds with another – the emotional v factual sides are mismatched – part of the reason why my ex saw things differently from me. We would have numerous disagreements about simple things and with anything complex – he would disconnect with himself.

Coupled with these bio factors, my ex’s parents did not parent – his mother was a Queen BPD and his father NPD.

I had a huge issue with not being worthy! This was a carry over from my childhood – uBPD alcoholic abusive father and enMother – stands to reason my own amygdala needs some re-wiring.

A simplistic explanation of something very complex. SWOE also writes about these bio and environmental factors.

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« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2012, 06:06:58 PM »

Excerpt
Yes, the bizarre relationship with my ex and his daughters always felt "unhealthy" to me. Dad was a "playmate" not a parent! He absolutely lived for these 2 beautiful girls and it was truly wonderful to see him be so loving with them but - There were no boundaries? Dad had NO privacy at all. Everything was "free game". The girls played with his personal laptop and iPhone getting into "personal" information... .I had to worry when sending texts to him because he may have given them his iPhone to play games on? The girls had there own laptops and mobile phones? Why didn't Dad have any boundaries?

I had given my ex his iPhone as a gift so we could communicate when we were apart... .It was hurtful to me that he would not respect "our" boundaries as a "couple"... .

WhiteDoe

WhiteDoe,

That certainly IS a big boundry buster... .It sounds like your ex was just like mine in that respect, except that he did not allow them to use his phone... .heck, he probably had too much to hide on HIS phone! Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)... .but he bought his kids all of the latest gagdets. I think his daughter had a blackberry when she was 13 and then advanced to an iphone. At one point, his kids had gone through 3 updgrade phones in 2 years... .while I had the same one. It was ridiculous!

Another thing my ex would do is tell me that we were not "allowed" to mention to his kids if we had gone to a certain restaurant, or to the mall etc... .because his kids would be jealous. I never spoke up but Iwanted to tell him that it was time he grew a pair and told the kids that "dad was going to do some adult stuff with his girlfriend". They certainly were not deprived. But to expect me to hide such things made me feel as though we were doing something wrong!
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« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2012, 06:17:39 PM »

Clearmind, that was VERY informative! Thank you for that.  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

That truly explains the reasons that my ex would "perceive" certain simple issues as monumental and could not cool down from the responses. The first time I really saw him dysregulate it was quite disturbing to me and I knew in my gut that something was really off. He said to me during that time, that he "was not like normal people" and that "he was like a blowfish, and it took him a long time to cool down from something when he got disturbed". I found that analogy quite interesting, as it was so different from anything I had ever heard of... .He used the analogy a few more times during such times and it spoke volumes. So your post explains why he was unable to cool down from his distorted perception and how he blew incidents out of proportion in his mind and revised the facts to match his emotions... .
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