Rough, rough time right now

[Changed4safety]

Been on these boards for a while. Wrestling with ending it.  Last year at this time my father died.  Ex was on a bad combination of meds for his bipolar and tried to be supportive but didn't.  We had decided to part by that point--there had been tons of cheating, violence to objects and, when his meds were out of kilter, on me.  Last year after Christmas, he got his meds straightened out and decided he really wanted this to work.  I was too shell shocked by my beloved father's death and at one point moved out while he was out of town.  We recycled, and I moved to another state. He really improved so much, but I just couldn't commit.  Something kept stopping me.  Finally went on a retreat to do some spiritual thinking and realized this:  If we were to have any chance, we needed to break up and fix ourselves.  I had much codependent stuff going on and I needed to work it out.   We had a loving, tearful, beautiful breakup on AIM a week ago.  Felt that this was right, and was at total peace.  We decided to stay loving friends, and stay in touch.

Spent the week with my widowed mom, who is a wreck and a recovering alcoholic.  I know that my situation with her in my childhood is part of why I am so codependent.  Missing my father terribly. Dealing with family and missing ex so much.  He is hosting an Xmas party at his place and it's him, 4 guys and this one girl.  During our times apart I know he was interested in someone, I think it's her.  He's been posting pics of her and him (separately) all evening.

After a coule of days of peace, I am plunged right back into obsessing about him, fretting, imagining things going on... .all the things that were eating me up from the inside.  I'm struggling not to text him right now and beg him to let me come back. 

I know this isn't a good thing for us now, and I  know so much of how i am feeling is being in the house where i grew up with a domineering mother who knows just how to break me.  My father ran interference; losing him was terribly painful.  My career is stalled (I'm a freelancer) and I have only one family of friends where I live.  I feel alone, and I know that makes me vulnerable.  I guess i am asking for support in my decision while I wobble here.

[pinkpeony]

Hi Changed4safety,

Woke up this morning soo happy with myself for fighting the urge to text my ex a Merry Christmas.  I spent yesterday morning crying and posting to try to get through it.

I'm so sorry about you losing your Dad.  That's such a huge loss, I feel for you. 

You said you felt at total peace with your breakup-that peaceful feeling I think was relief, actually.  I know that when my ex finally drove off with a packed van, although I cried ALOT, and still do everyday, I knew his leaving was the right thing in the big picture.  That was six months ago, we've recycled twice since then and although things seemed better for a bit, nothing at all changed, and we are now NC for over a month because I just could not bear yet another rage over me petting the cat on the bed, watching him punch the dresser in anger, waiting an hour for him to come out of the bathroom with his laptop (?), accusing me of having an affair because I put rollers in my hair for work, etc,.  Life and love just should not have to be so completely miserable.  All the good memories don't make up for him threatening to punch me in the face because I expressed my opinion. 

Only you can decide what is best for you.  I'm just sharing my two cents-my father had heart surgery last week and I can only imagine how losing him would feel.  You're dealing with so much emotion, don't make any big decisions in a hurry, either way.   

Wobble towards happiness! 

[Surnia]

Hi Changed4safety

So sorry to hear about feeling alone these days.

x-mas is for many of us a trigger, we are not so busy as usual, there is so much focus about family.

What you can do: Try to remember also the bad things in your relationship, the cheating, the violence. Perhaps there is also some confusion between reality and wishes. Could it be that you are missing an idea about relationship, about closeness? Something that you did not have with your FOO or only partly, and not with your ex?

This can hurt badly, I know! 

[Changed4safety]

Thank you for your replies, I will be rereading them I am sure. The pics continued last night... .this girl snuggling a stuffed toy of his, then falling asleep with stuffed toy... .next to a package of VERY expensive bourbon fudge I bought for him for Xmas.  He never posted pics of just me doing things, and only a few of him.  Once, while we were still together even, he posted for his FB profile pic a pic of both of us on Valentine's day... .with me cropped out! 

It hurts so badly.  SO badly.  Ten days ago he wanted to marry me.  I know this is the illness, he cannot be without someone but... .I had hoped, really hoped, that this time apart would eventually bring us back together.  I'm considering blocking him on  FB because I really can't bear to be a witness to this unfolding.  Relationships have changed so much with the advent of the internet, smart phones--that instant being in touch.

Last night as I tossed and turned between logging in for updates on FB >< I told myself, anything that hurts this bad cannot be good for me.  It's not that you never hurt in a relationship--if someone you love is ill or in an accident, or if a major affair has happened (and you both want to make it work again--i believe you can)--but just this ongoing, sick, "I don't feel safe" thing... .no. 

I can't tell you how gut punched I felt when he snapped that pic of a sleeping woman and said, "Sleepy So and So is sleepy."  Public flirting right when you know your ex of a week can see it, and you know she's in hell with her family and missing her dad, for the lose.

[pinkpeony]

I dislike FB.  I always have specifically because of it's downside-the secretiveness of who and what can be lurking on the other end.  My ex is my "Friend" (good grief, whatever... .) and if my little niece wants me to see her page because of a prom dress or such, I have to see him, and the women on his page that we are "mutual frineds" of.  It's like opening a box and spitting cobra flies out at your face!  If I block him or unfriend him or anything of this nature, I could start trouble that I don't want. 

I toss and turn too-tormented by thoughts and questions and can't sleep much at all.  It shows in my face too, dark circles of misery under my eyes.  I check the phone for texts, I hear the email bell ding and run over to see if there's an email I don't want.  (so why do I check?)  It's torture, and the last thing you need to see is another woman sleeping with a bear and your fudge.  It sucks. 

You are right-anything that feels that bad cannot be good for you.  My ex asked me to get married the week he disappeared.  He wanted to have unprotected sex, and said "let's have a baby!" and then disappeared.  He posted pics that I took of us at an event we went to together and cut me out too!  It's a major slap in the face, I know.  There is no mention of me at all on his page, like I'm just an apparition.  Meanwhile I'm on the verge of tears at least every hour.  It all hurts so much, and it's all so confusing.  Don't try to "get it", you won't.  Try to stop letting that cobra out.   

You know, I quit smoking 5 years ago New Years Day.  I loved smoking, and I still see people smoking and it brings back good memories and sometimes I even wish I still smoked.  I know I always have that option, too, so it is my choice.  I just know that it would have eventually killed me one way or the other and thought of dealing with all those consequences would not have been worth a cigarette.

My ex is now in that same category.  It's a dreamy sweet memory thinking about those good times, but

it's not reality.  I love only a part of him, very much, and greatly miss just that part.  The other part is a ranting, raving, blaming, nasty, vindictive man who I know I cannot help.  It's a package deal.  Life is challenging enough with grown up responsibilities and obligations, I just can't take that atomic bomb in my purse with me everywhere I go, never knowing if it's gonna blow. 

[Changed4safety]

Ugh, now she is having a party this weekend, and he might not make it because of the weather... .he will "definitely need crash space."  She assures him there is plenty.  He "likes" this.

Why do I keep doing this?  Letting the cobra spit on me, practically inviting it?   Oh I know, because this was how I survived during the years of online cheating.  I am hyper trained now, like some kind of dog, to be on high alert with conversations with other women.  I feel like I am going to throw up.  We parted so sweetly--another romantic ideal, I guess--but I can't bear this.  I think I will have to tell him I'm going to unfriend him for a while.  I just cannnot watch this unfold like some kind of made for tv movie.  

Pink Peony, your name makes me laugh, exBPD is into "My Little Pony" and his favorite is Pinky Pie... .Pink Pony .  

I know I know I KNOW I will come out of this OK.  I will.  But for now... .it's almost unendurable.  

[Changed4safety]

Well, I took a step for me.  i sent him a loving note reminding him that we agreed to talk about our level of contact/interaction if it changed, and that I felt it would be best for me if, for now, we were no longer FB friends.  I keep going back to his page and making myself sick.  Be nice to no longer be able to torture myself that way.  

I ended it, he is in no way doing anything wrong.  Tacky, yes, but he is breaking no promises or lying or anything like that.  So I'm focusing on me, and what's going to make me feel better.  No response thus far, we'll see how it goes.  Thanks to those who have posted.  <3

Edit: Great.  His response is "before I send any snap reactions, or make any hasty judgment, I would prefer to talk to you first, preferably via IM of some kind.  Please let me know when you are available."

Trying to wrest control back.  He knows I don't like IM conversations. 

[Changed4safety]

Didn't go well.  He responded by saying that I was putting "terms and conditions on our friendship," and then proceeds to say if I unfriend him on FB, he's never going to talk to me again.  I tried to stand up for myself, and I think I did, but he was adamant that I was "jerking him around."  To be fair, I was leaning on him heavily while with my mother over Christmas, was missing Dad terribly and was totally miserable and was actually considering going back to him.  I owned that what I had done was inappropriate.  Just some examples of his phrasing: 

"So let me start off by saying that I am going to attempt to keep myself i na place of calmness but there are things that need to be said, and if I get emotional, we're both just going to have to deal with that."

"You're asking for terms and conditions on our friendship and that's just not okay." 

"I'm now telling you how it's going to unfold from here."

"You automatically assume that since you and I are no longer together, suddenly I'm out on the prowl.  Thanks. Let me tell you how good that makes me feel."  (There were 16 infidelities in 4 and a half years.  After our first recycle when I was still planning to move and we discussed the future, I said I thought I couldn't object to him dating. I was thinking after my move when we were no longer sleeping together.  He called a girl and got a date lined up two days afterward, and when I dared be hurt by that, he had a major freakout adn I spent two hours talking him down from suicide.  A few months later, I asked for some time to just be alone and thing... .ten days later, he informs me he's met a girl he wants to date and his put his dating profile back up on an online site.  So yeah... .him being "on the prowl" is NOT an illogical assumption.) 

He had a good point... .I was making up stories... .but most of the time when my imagination "ran away with me" I was absolutely correct. 

I sent him a text the next day and he didn't respond, then he sent me an email apologizing profusely and saying "he wasn't trying to be an ass." 

I replied with "Honestly I didn't even give it any thought--I just figured you were busy (thought you were at work) and the comment was nothing that really needed to be replied to.  I think that's the way we both ought to look at contact from each other.  Get back to me when you can, and if it's no big deal like "I had a cool meal for dinner!" you don't even really have to reply unless you want to.  That's how I interact with most of my friends when texting, and I think a lot of pressure will be taken off us if we look at texts and

emails and such like that.  I actually kind of dislike the "implied immediacy" of the technology.  Miss the good old days you never knew of short phone calls ("This is a long distance call!  Keep it short!" and long letters sent in the mail.   If it's important, we can say

"I'd like to hear back from you ASAP, please," otherwise let's be relaxed and assume nothing's wrong." 

Later I shot him a friendly text about seeing a favorite actor of ours on TV.  He was very distant and said, "Neat. Oh, I got your email.  Put things in perspective."

I had no idea what he meant by that and my warning klaxons were going off.  I replied with " Are you feeling better?  Sounded like you have been pretty sick."

Him:  "I'm hanging in there."  Very terse, for him.

Me:  "Curl up with some TV and some hot tea."

Him:  "That's the plan."

He was definitely upset and hurt, and now I feel terrible.  Yet I look back--hell, I have it all documented--and I've done nothing wrong.  I gave in and didn't unfriend him, replied to his email, and texted him, and I'm the one who feels guilty.

I hate this so, so much.  Going to need something to help me sleep.  As my therapist said years ago, "You're taking anti-anxiety drugs in order to continue in this relationship... .doesn't that tell you that something is wrong?"  I am fighting an urge to tell him I love him, I'm sorry for hurting him.  But not doing so. 

[pinkpeony]

Hey Changed,

Glad to hear you tried anyway!  You made the attempt, that's what counts.  At least you can claim a small victory in taking a stand.  It reminds me of the days I got up the courage to say how I felt and it all just went downhill so quickly, the outcome not even close to what was intended.  I know how mixed up and unsatisfying it feels.   

I am feeling just grumpy right now, not strong at all, sad, a bit lonely thinking of him too.  It feels so unfair at times that I had this good friend, lover, someone I had a lot in common with when things were up, a hope for the future, and that man just disappeared out of my life.  Forget about all the BPD stuff for a sec, sometimes I just feel like I got the raw end of the deal.  I can't help but feel selfish saying that since I know he's not happy inside that head of his, but I can't help but imagine he's out right now having fun and starting over with someone else.  (I hate the thought.)

ugh. 

Pink (not pony, )

[Tausk]

Hey Change:

Congrats on the actions.  It's difficult.  We are trauma bonded and the effects of the abuse are real.  Below is from a poster named 2010.  It helped me.


No contact is a *process*

It rarely takes the first time.

It doesn't stick the second

It becomes painful and blameful on the third

It becomes angry and frightening on the fourth

and on and on until... .  You decide that enough is enough.

And when you do you surround yourself with hard copies of past abuses, transgressions, emails- whatever it takes to remind you that this person is toxic and given a chance- will ruin your health.

When the dust settles, you have silence. And in that silence is a black cloud of self-doubt, self- loathing and fear that you might have given up too quickly. This is when a wise counsel should tell you that this person you loved, who could not understand love- was there in your life to help you realize that you (and I) need to see ourselves as good people- but with a mission to help and keep helping someone who mistreats us. Our cycle of return to this person has created an endless struggle for peace in the relationship. The peace that never comes has to be found in the letting go.

If it were as easy as just saying goodbye- we would be done with it. But this dynamic is a habit- and the habit has kept us away from ourselves and turned our attention to someone else. That's also true for your partner, who needs attention in a big way. She's not going to want to give that up too quickly and will do whatever it takes to keep you involved.

Placing physical blocks against access is the only way to enforce the mental blocks.  Start by doing everything you can to limit exposure to the toxicity. When the roaring silence begins to deafen your eardrums and you can hear the pounding of your heart- it's just your old habit coming out and wanting a fix.  That should be the time you do something new- drive a different route- see a movie- go someplace else- anything to get you out of the habits of old.  Be aware that this relationship is like withdrawing from a drug- so there maybe times when you drive by, pry or otherwise involve yourself out of curiosity and need. Each time that you do this you'll get a jolt of adrenalin and later, depression.

The brains' pathways begin to change after about 90-100 days. There's always intense longing at 80 days and most people break NC at this point- but that's already after the first 4-5 tries at placing no contact boundaries. The first attemtps at NC can sometimes only last a week, then a month, then two months and panic sets in. It's not a cut and dry process. The disengaging process can take years out of you if you dont have a good support network.

Do what you can. The relationship is like an addiction and even with the best of intentions it can be a back and forth. My only salvation was to block every access I could- even fantasizing about leaving the country. Do whatever it takes.  In the end, you'll start to turn the attention to your own feelings rather than your partners- and that's the best gift the relationship might ever bring. 

[Blazing Star]

I am feeling your pain Changed, and sending you a big hug  .

Finally went on a retreat to do some spiritual thinking and realized this:  If we were to have any chance, we needed to break up and fix ourselves.  I had much codependent stuff going on and I needed to work it out.   

It's great that you would like to remain friends, but be easy on yourself! It might be in your best interest to have a period of No Contact while you focus on YOU, and then start a friendship from a healthier place.

It is OKAY, totally okay to put terms and conditions on the friendship, you need to do what you need to do for Your mental health.

What work have you done so far on the Codependency stuff so far?

Love Blazing Star

[Changed4safety]

I am feeling just grumpy right now, not strong at all, sad, a bit lonely thinking of him too.  It feels so unfair at times that I had this good friend, lover, someone I had a lot in common with when things were up, a hope for the future, and that man just disappeared out of my life.  Forget about all the BPD stuff for a sec, sometimes I just feel like I got the raw end of the deal.  I can't help but feel selfish saying that since I know he's not happy inside that head of his, but I can't help but imagine he's out right now having fun and starting over with someone else.  (I hate the thought.)

Oh man, this is so true.  :/  Too bad you and I can't go out for a cup of coffee and commiserate.  We'll have to do it here. *hugs*


Piano... .I think I will print this out and put it where I can see it daily.  


I go back and forth like a crazy pendulum.  One minute, I'm thinking, "I don't even want to know someone who could drop my friendship like that," and then I think, "Maybe, if we just get through this--truly have time away--we'll change enough to be together."  We had a nice little chat today, very casual, via text, then I just couldn't help it and told him I loved him and missed him.  He said that made him feel uncomfortable.  I apologized, and he said he loved and missed me too, and it was OK, and we are going to have bumps along the way as we progress.  Toward what, neither of us really knows.

He is at the girl's house tonight, she is hosting a party, and he'll be crashing there unless he got a ride there.  He says he's not interested in her at all, but... .well, my instincts got so screwed up by constantly being lied to I don't know what's what any more.  I think it's waiting for the shoe to drop that's really hurting me. 

It really is like an addiction--you feel it in your body when you want them and miss them.  I've really, truly, got to focus on me, not just for me, but for my freelance career.  All my energy is pouring out into this situation and has for nearly five years.  I'll go to bed tonight and get up tomorrow, and just keep trying.  I know myself too well to think that I won't look online to see if pics are posted... .but maybe in the new year, I can be stronger. 

Star, I've been working with a therapist for some time now, and also reading up a lot.  My visit home really showed me how much my FOO damaged me (my dad was my protector, and I adored him--he ran interference between me and my mom when she was drunk but he traveled a lot.)  I grew up with an alcoholic mother who constantly told me I was a disappointment when she was drinking.  When sober, I wasn't pretty or thin enough, so I ended up being bulimic in college.  I was worthless without a man, but I wasn't attractive enough to get one, and I also needed to pretend not to want one.  Oi!  I am wondering if Mom might not be BPD. 

I've come to much peace with her, but being around her for ten days, especially after losing Dad last year (they were married 68 years!) has been incredibly difficult.  So, working on that as well.

[elemental]

I don't know if you unfriended him yet, but logging out of facebook puts you in the position of having to log in if you want to look at his page. Log out for a day, and give yourself a break from it. No one will really be clued in that you stepped away for a bit.

It is usually easier for me when I tell myself that I may not be done with things with my BPD, but I need some down time from him and he can be dealt with later.

Part of this is taking care of yourself. I wouldn't think of it as NC forever, but making a plan for you for yourself to heal and learn ways of repairing your injuries, recovering and figuring out the best ways to keep yourself strong in the future no matter what contact you may have with this guy.

He can take care of himself He really can. Time apart will give him time to calm down, too, wind down, process things.

This upset back and forth interrupts this process. Let yourself have the process. Let him have the process. It's a good thing for you. You will have space to clear your head and clarify your thoughts and emotions. When they are sorted, you will be able to think and feel in a more productive way.

[Changed4safety]

After posting more pics of this girl cuddling toys than he ever did of me (okay, an exaggeration... .he posted 3 pics of her in one night and was tagged in a bunch she took, and he posted about 7 pics of me in four in a half years of dating) he went completely silent.  Someone else at the party (a girl, who also looks very much like his type) posted "Sex, Drugs and Rock and Roll in the Suburbs" with him and the rest of the gathering tagged.  He didn't even "like" it, though the hostess girl did. 

I realize I am like an addict in the later stages--addicted to him and more broadly, relationship drama.  In the beginning, I liked how the heroin made me feel, and now, I just need a hit in order not to be in agony. 

Took a long walk and realized a few things:  That many of my previous relationships involved cheating on the guy's part, and I always knew in my gut, and then I always forgave when it came out.  Because I didn't think I was worth anything.  I remember my mother saying "What did you do now" when someone broke up with me (What did I do?  I loved and focused on him and endured being treated like dirt until he got bored) and even my beloved father calling me "The Dumpster" because I kept using the term, "I got dumped."  (I am certain he didn't think through the fact that he was calling his favorite child--and I was--a trash can.)  I am highly successful in my field by anyone's standards, but it's not enough.  I gravitate toward relationships that cannot work because I am used to being devalued.  I don't even know HOW to value myself.

I broke down, crying for my dad, and realized that I am clinging to this relationship because I don't want to be alone.  I can't turn to exBPD because he is part of the problem, not the solution.  The task before me--to go from thinking I'm completely unworthy to loving myself--seems impossibly daunting. 

[Mupetto]

Changedforsafety,

When I read you posts it appears that you know your behaviours are not helpful or beneficial to you - but you do them anyway?

There is a difference to being alone and being lonely.

Give the FB a rest and spend some time alone. You might get to know yourself. If your self talk is bad. Do something that makes you feel good. Music helps me – happy up beat music. Make your favourite meal. Simple things. Healthy things.

Stay off FB. It’s for others – not for self. Horrible thing. I don’t have a FB account.

[Changed4safety]

The thing is, I live alone, and I work out of my home.  I have also moved and know exactly seven people (five of them in one family) and I've lived here since August.  I like being alone, but this is too much, and I find it hard to make friends (obviously.)  Being alone simply means having no distractions.  And yes, I think I will give FB a rest.  I am finding the gap between knowing what to do and doing it very hard to cross.  Can't wait for my therapist meeting on the 2nd. 

Went for a walk, which I enjoyed, am signing up for yoga classes, trying to start meditating and journaling regularly.  Heading out now to shop for healthy food.  I left exBPD in May, literally fleeing while he was out of town.   Shut down my FB and had NC, left the apartment I was paying for, rented a place with just my cat, focused on work... .it was actually a good time.  Going to see what I can do to recreate the positives of that.  Of course I was still in my old city with all my friends. 

My job, which is freelancing, is wildly up in the air, so finances are scary right now too. 

Found something I had done a few years ago, going to do this again this year--get started in the right direction:

https://www.bestyearyet.com/

[Changed4safety]

Did not attempt to contact him.  It's something. 

I have a friend whose first wife had BPD.  He did not know about my partner, but tonight I texted him and asked if we could talk.  He was more than willing to.  You all here help so much I thought maybe talking to someone who actually has been through it AND knows me and my partner could help as well. 

[letmeout]

Sadly, in my experience, you can not stay friends with an ex BPD. I had to totally cut mine out of my life because the longer he was in it in any way at all, just made him act crazier and more bizarre.  Sure it is rough, but in time you get better. The trick is to focus on anything, except the ex.

[Changed4safety]

Oh man... .  the last song of "ours" came on the radio... .  I just broke down and am crying so hard missing him now.  I'm wondering if I'm making a mistake.

[elemental]

You are holding on to a live wire. You will need to distract yourself in some way so you can get enough distance to let go of the immediacy of this and detach enough to stabilize yourself.

Step back from facebook and go watch a movie, anything. It will really help you.

[Changed4safety]

I have found there are two "mes," the highly emotional one that is almost crazy and the calm rational one.  The second one was of course fed by my BPD, who put SO much urgency on confronting things right now, regardless of whether or not we were rational or dysregulated.  The last straw for me actually was when he insisted that if we got into a fight/argument, I could not walk out of the room or take any kind of break because it would trigger his abandonment fears.  What about MY fears that he would hurt my property or me?  What about the fact that every expert including our therapists said taking a break to calm down was beneficial?  He had to control the situation, and so now I have this artificial sense of urgency.  My rational self tells me that it's OK to have some NC time, that all I would accomplish if I don't is returning to the Bad Place.  The other part of me is screaming, you walked away from someone who wants to marry you, you've made strides, you can make this work but you have to do it RIGHT NOW. 

It's... really exhausting. 

We never spent New Year's together, he was always with his family.  We would always call at the first "midnight" depending on the time zone.  I know I'm going to miss that terribly.  I don't think I can refrain from at least texting him or sending him an email.  :/

[Changed4safety]

He beat me to it... .  I posted I was heading off to be with friends for the evening and he texted me to say he hoped I had a good time, he loved me, and he hoped I had a happy new year.  I replied with the same, then dropped him a quick text at midnight in my time zone.  He replied in his.  It was... .  calm and pleasant.  Both yesterday and today I woke up feeling calm and at peace.  Making new thought pathways?  I sure hope so!

[Changed4safety]

After a couple of good days, the downswing comes.  A friend lost her father yesterday and it brought back memories of my dad who died a year ago Dec. 14.  Usually I would text my exBPD when I felt down, and I forced myself not to do so.  Other things came up that I wanted to share with him, and it feels so lonely not to do so.  The brief chats we have had have been good.  He's not posted much on his FB recently, and I've been the one to initiate contact.  He may be handling this better than I am, and I'm the one who made the decision to break up... .  

[ExTreme]

A difficult, sobering, and empty feeling I've been having since NC has been as I stop myself from sharing by phone, text, or email, bits of good news, inspirations, pictures, realizations, humor, etc... .  all intimately relevant to me, him, us- all positive. The kind of communication that was representative of the good times evoking that smile, that chuckle. To have to quell the sharing of life's little landmarks with my best friend and lover is deflating my world.

It feels like even the good things in my life have lost their meaning since they cannot be shared with him. Codependency served its purpose, is no longer needed, and just seems to hover awkwardly above.