I messed up or did I

[laelle]

As I have been telling you lately my bf is chronically unhappy and stuck in his situation.  Granted his situation is tough, but he never has any viable goals or plans to see himself through it.  He totally lives in the moment.

This morning he emailed with his normal im fed up, stuck and unhappy.  I tried to validate and got his rant about his situation, oweing landlord, no money for food, etc etc.  He was becoming hostile towards me so I told him that we can talk about it later when he has had a chance to think about what he wanted to do.  That if we continued it would end badly, that I didnt want that.  

He came back a few hours later and was actually coherent and talked to me about his needs rather than shouting at me about them.

I agreed to help him a little but I told him that as we arent engaged and no immediate plans of it, I was not going to commit to sharing rent with him for an apartment I dont live in.  I told him that I would always help if I could.  He seemed ok with that and told me yeah, we couldnt get married right now as his situation is bad.

While we were talking some money came in for me that I was planning on helping him get "unstuck" with.  I emailed him telling him that he needed to think carefully about what he chooses to do because I could only do this once and he is responsible for the outcome, not me.

That again, I was not going to be financially responsible if he decided to take an apartment asking more financial obligation when he is fed up every single day of his life from not having money to pay his rent.

He didnt like this much.  He told me that it hurt him alot and who was I to talk to him that way.  I told him that I was sorry I hurt his feelings but that is the situation.

I am now being ignored.  I know I didnt do the best at this, but I tried.  Its important to me to keep control of my own money in this relationship.

We are not living together (it was the plan to do so but didnt work out) and he has made it clear that while he will live with me he will not marry me.  To live legally in Spain we have to be married... .  so its an easy out for him.  I will always help him but in the current situation im not going to pay half the rent.

Please tell him that im not a horrible person.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[patientandclear]

Laelle--you are a wonderful person -- and partner! You've got to hold that line. No, he doesn't like it, but if you keep reiterating that you're doing it with love, you've done what you can do. You're being very generous already. It doesn't help him or your relationship if you let him take advantage of you, or if it feels that way to you.

[laelle]

I was a little rough on him because I had already told him earlier in the month I wasnt going to help with rent, I would instead help him get out of there, which was what he is Fed up about.  He was triggered this morning about money and how there was nothing he could do about it and I really felt like he was putting pressure on me to fix things.  I wanted him to know I was helping but I wasnt going to be his "fixer" the way things are.  I would fix things if I could, but I know thats not possible.  I think he took it as I was calling him inept in some way.  It wasnt my intention, but I do have the right to control what I will and wont do.


thank you Patient.  I dont feel I was such a good partner today, or maybe being a good partner sometimes means being honest about how I feel.  I love him and dont want him to sink, but I also dont want to sink with him.

[patientandclear]

Right.  Sounds like where you have some room to take a different approach is how you talk about this -- not the underlying decision, which seems right & important. Seems like a good time to validate whatever dissatisfaction he feels with his situation, his wish for rescue ... .  while explaining why rescue isn't something you feel you can or should do.

[laelle]

I emailed him and told him that I was sorry that I made him feel bad, that I understood his situation and that his worries, concerns and frustrations are valid, and that I know its difficult for him.  I told him that he has been very sad and frustrated the past couple of months and sometimes its hard for me to handle because I dont like for him to be unhappy.  I told him that I didnt think he was inept as he said I did.  I mentioned again that we had an opportunity to make our lives better and I wanted him to really think about it as I didnt want him to end up over his head.

I will probably get an ugly response when he finally does respond (I pissed him off royally), but at least I told him I understand that he didnt want to talk to me, and that I would be here for him when he decides to.

[coworkerfriend]

Good luck and good job.  As I continue to find, I do not know what I am doing in regards to my own relationship.

I wish you strength and friendship.

[laelle]

Thank you Coworkerfriend 

I'm going to go out and eat Indian.  Someone ignoring another person is really immature.

[coworkerfriend]

Good for you.  I am sitting next to someone who is breathing heavy, sighing, moaning and playing songs with meaningful lyrics.

I wish I could run away and never come back.

[laelle]

I know exactly what you mean! 

[briefcase]

Way to maintain your boundaries around the money issue!     And yes, ignoring someone, especially someone who wants to give you money, is very immature.   

[laelle]

Way to maintain your boundaries around the money issue!     And yes, ignoring someone, especially someone who wants to give you money, is very immature.   

I know, right 

Thank you Briefcase.

[hithere]

You are doing a great job! Keep your boundaries in place and you will have a much better chance of long-term happiness.

[Rockylove]

I do have the right to control what I will and wont do.

... .  I dont feel I was such a good partner today, or maybe being a good partner sometimes means being honest about how I feel.  I love him and dont want him to sink, but I also dont want to sink with him.

It is important for us to establish and hold our boundaries.  I have to keep reminding myself of that.  For the record, I don't think you messed up... .  he just didn't like your boundary.  It's kind of like a young child... .  he's pouting because he didn't get his way~~oh well.

[laelle]

Thank you hithere.  Some days it seems there is no long term.  today is one of those days.

Rockylove - I had already reinforced my boundary and he accepted it.  I went over and beyond I think.  The thing is one minute he was doom and gloom about not being able to pay his rent, and an hour later, he was ready to go get an apartment that will cost a little more.  Which is it?  Is it really that bad or is he making it up to get me to help him ?

[arabella]

I think you did the right thing. He wasn't making sense (i.e. not being able to pay rent but wanting to a more costly apartment) and you called him on it in a firm and considerate way. Refusing to enable someone does not make you a bad partner. It sounds to me like you detached with love and stuck to your boundaries. Frankly, I think I could learn a lot from you!

I am sitting next to someone who is breathing heavy, sighing, moaning and playing songs with meaningful lyrics.

Coworkerfriend - I'm going to have to apologize, but this made me laugh. I know how hard it is to be there, and I've read your other posts, so I completely understand that his is not funny... .  But omg, really? His behaviour is so ridiculously immature that it's comical. The "meaningful lyrics" bit really did me in!

[laelle]

I think you did the right thing. He wasn't making sense (i.e. not being able to pay rent but wanting to a more costly apartment) and you called him on it in a firm and considerate way. Refusing to enable someone does not make you a bad partner. It sounds to me like you detached with love and stuck to your boundaries. Frankly, I think I could learn a lot from you!

OMG, dont learn from me, I may be less one bf in the morning.  Its a tough call sometimes to have to invalidate your partner so you can protect your own best interest.

[coworkerfriend]

Laelle - No apologies necessary.  It sounds so riduculous and it IS riduculous.  It would be funnier if I could step back from the manipulation of it.

ok - you are a genius - I need to step back and look at it from an outsider.

Thank you 

[elemental]

Well if you are one less boyfriend tomorrow, then join me because I am probably going to be one less boyfriend, too.

I told mine today that no, I will not do as he is asking. He is currently ignoring me, too. I think, in the course of 7 years, that is the first time I ever directly said to him, no I will not do that.

What a shocker for him  

[arabella]

laelle - Nope, you're the perfect person to take lessons from! Having no SO is better than having one that tramples all your boundaries and leaves you feeling bad.

coworkerfriend - I think your note was for me, in which case, I'm really glad you weren't offended! Sometimes it's really hard to get perspective on these things, isn't it?  

[LetItBe]

It is important for us to establish and hold our boundaries.  I have to keep reminding myself of that.  For the record, I don't think you messed up... .  he just didn't like your boundary.  It's kind of like a young child... .  he's pouting because he didn't get his way~~oh well.

Good job, laelle!  It takes a lot of strength and self-assurance to uphold your values.

Rockylove, you said what I happened to need to read right now, too.  My uBPDbf withdrew from me all last week after I told him about my boundary.  It was either state it, let him know, and give him a chance to see if we could come to an agreement, or just leave... .  or just keep things like they were with me remaining an anxious mess. 

And good point, hithere, keeping boundaries in place will enable more long-term happiness.

[laelle]

Ele- I hope your ok.  I know its really rough to ruffle their feathers.  I think what your doing is very important tho.  Standing up for yourself and your own wants and needs, boundaries is a great step in healing yourself.  You may find that once you have personally progressed you will outgrow him.

Arabella- I would much rather be with him.  To lose him would be devastating for me.  This boundary is so important to me that I cant continue the relationship unless it stays intact, and I want this relationship to continue.  Its a life or death thing for me and I guess I wanted him to see how important it was for me.  What he got out of it is that I want to control him with money.  :'(

NonGF- Do you feel my boundary and value is fair?

[patientandclear]

Laelle -- I am going to jump in before nonGF and say: your boundary and value is not just fair, it's essential.  I think anything more would be you being taken advantage of pretty enormously.  You need your money too, for your own reasons.  It's not his.  Your generosity needs to be seen as such.  Not dismissed because it is not even more.

You are caretaking.  You see that, right?  Some of that is OK in a r/s if reciprocated.  Are there ways he takes care of you?  If not, you might consider whether you even want to do be doing this much caretaking.  When you journeyed for your surgery, he didn't seem to do a lot to take care of you.  His contribution was to not completely dysregulate and lose his grip.  But he wasn't taking care of you.

I'm not saying he isn't a good bf either!  He has his idiosyncratic ways and his great points and you love him and you are willing to accept him as he is.  That's all good.  But when it comes to caretaking, you seem to carry much more of the load.

So I definitely, definitely don't think you should worry that you are not doing enough.  Possibly you might consider that you are offering more than you can really afford and doing it for someone who is not acting very appreciative.  If I were you, I would find that hurtful.  :)o you?

Being berated when everything I offered, all the loving assistance and support, was not enough, was a hallmark of my very unhappy marriage (before I met my pwBPD -- different guy).  THAT is truly the hamster wheel to hell.  There has to be a stopping point --  you cannot pour endless help into the pit of despair, because it doesn't work, and you don't have an infinite amount to give.  None of us do.

Your-boundary-and-value-are-fair.  

[laelle]

Thank you Patient  

Its so great to have such a great group of people here to offer their support.

I know I am a caretaker, this is why that boundary means so much to me.  It keeps me from becoming bitter by giving too much.

It would be easy if he got angry because I would not give him money, but it never plays out that way.  He is angry because I have hurt his feelings with either what I said or how I said it.  He said I was rude.  Maybe I was, but I had just spent the past hour trying to validate that he wasnt going to die from being screwed to no avail.  I was told to stop trying to tell him things were going to be ok when they werent.  I put off getting my passport for a few more weeks and gave him the money so he could eat.

I dont think I was rude, but I was strictly firm.  It doesnt mean I didnt want to do it, but he pushed me and then he didnt like my attitude about it.  tough

He was great while I was in the hospital. 

[LetItBe]

This boundary is so important to me that I cant continue the relationship unless it stays intact, and I want this relationship to continue.  Its a life or death thing for me and I guess I wanted him to see how important it was for me.  What he got out of it is that I want to control him with money.  :'(

NonGF- Do you feel my boundary and value is fair?

Your boundary sounds very fair and reasonable to me, but more importantly, it is true to YOU and your values.  You are being authentically YOU, and that is just perfect. 

It says in the Lessons that some people will interpret our boundary-enforcement as controlling or manipulative, even if we're going about it in a healthy manner.  That's just the way it is.   That's how my uBPDbf interpreted a boundary of mine last week.  I've had times of questioning if I could have handled things differently since then, feeling a bit insecure, and also feeling like I might have at least partially contributed to his dysregulation last week.  The truth is that I honored my truth by deciding the price I was paying by not setting the boundary was too high.  I am finally learning how to set healthy boundaries, and I think it's natural that I will second-guess myself sometimes while I'm learning.

I admire your strength.  You are doing GREAT! 

[laelle]

Sometimes I feel like maybe im not seeing things accurately.  Why is he so hurt by what I said?  I know it was a bit harsh, but nothing in what I said was not the truth of the situation.  I can help, but its up to him to do something good with it.  I cant do that for him.  Yes, he worries about having a roof over his head, but what about a roof over mine?  Does he worry about that?

[Sincere]

I'm experiencing issues as well.  I seem to alternate either "being the ~" or "being a piece of it".  I've learned from the help on this board that reminding yourself that it's not you and to not take it personally is a huge help.  So stick to your guns.  You are a good person and partner, don't let them make you think otherwise.

[TigerEye]

Sometimes I feel like maybe im not seeing things accurately.  Why is he so hurt by what I said?  I know it was a bit harsh, but nothing in what I said was not the truth of the situation.

Different situation, different boundary, but that's exactly what's going through my mind. I possibly could of handled things differently, but I didn't, I did the best with what I had at the time, yet I'm still happy with what I asked for, I feel it is fair, just like I feel your ask is more than fair. They're our values and we're standing by them because they are who we are.

I know I am a caretaker, this is why that boundary means so much to me.  It keeps me from becoming bitter by giving too much.

I'm going to pin that to my wall where I can see it everyday.

Stay on your path, your doing good laelle, I'm taking notes 

[arabella]

Arabella- I would much rather be with him.  To lose him would be devastating for me.  This boundary is so important to me that I cant continue the relationship unless it stays intact, and I want this relationship to continue.  Its a life or death thing for me and I guess I wanted him to see how important it was for me.  What he got out of it is that I want to control him with money.  :'(

I would much rather be with my pwBPD too. But there has to be a limit. I'm wondering where mine is atm... .  But back to you - I agree with what others have already posted. Just because he interpreted it as you trying to control him doesn't make that the reality. And it certainly doesn't mean that you did anything wrong! You did the right thing and you did it well, he just didn't like it.

[laelle]

Thank you Sincere.  I have made sure that I did not JADE this time or agreed when I disagreed. I think it baffled him a bit because when he is angry at me and ignoring me he is use to me kissing his butt with apologies.  How are you getting along with yours?

TigerEye, thank you.  I wonder if there is a school I can attend that will make me good at the boundary thing.    I feel I am in way over my head.

Arabella, thank you. My bf contacted me yesterday and told me he loved me but was still angry.  I told him that I understood and that I wasnt going anywhere.  Within an hour he was talking to me again.  I guess the "outraged" reaction wasnt working well for him.  Maybe today we can actually talk about the issue maturely.  It is my right to control what I do with my money.  We do make some purchases together, but that does not make his money mine or mine his.  I know that he is strapped for cash and the extras will come from me.  I dont mind that as long as he is able to deal with his main expenses himself.

 to everyone.