Why Do They Hate?

[ScotisGone74]

I realize they paint us black for a couple of reasons, but what I don't get is why they Have Soo Much Hate for us?  How can you confess for years to a person how much you love them, and then without any provacation whatsoever just totally hate them? -as in want to destroy them, ie as in punish them into dust?   Frankly it is the part that puzzles me the most of out of all of it.  Why needlessly punish someone who has never done anything to you on this Earth except Love you immensley? I guess thats the question that haunts my soul.   

I appreciate all the replies. 

[mango_flower]

Personally my logic is this.

They hate because otherwise they love.  And they see love as scary, it will abandon them.

If they choose (subconsciously) to hate us, they are protecting themselves from hurt.  After all, if you hate somebody, you don't miss them, right?

Its interesting to read about reaction formation (one of Anna Freud's Freudian defence mechanisms).

Also, I believe they hate because it's a way of controlling how they feel about themselves.  They feel such guilt and shame deep down, so hating is a way of justifying it in their own minds - like "see, they DESERVED it, they're awful, I am not a bad person!".

Hmmmm just my thoughts. x

[healingmyheart]

ScotisGone,

My counselor said that if I start understanding the BPD craziness, they I am becoming crazy myself so don't try to understand... .   it just doesn't make logical sense.

Obviously, us "normal" people would never hate to that degree after so much love was shared at least on our end but hey, they aren't normal... .   bottom line.

We don't think in black and white.  We can see the gray area.  They can't and never will.  Part of the reason I'm having a hard time totally letting go of my ex and all communications is because I know that if and when he totally understands that its over, he will start the smear campaign and I'm not ready for that.  As long as he thinks he might at some point still have a chance, he will be nice.  I just keep hoping he finds someone else to latch on to real soon... .  

[mango_flower]

Ouch, Healingmyheart!  I "get" everything my BPD ex does - on a gut level, but not on a logical level.  I feel like I should be a bit worried haha... .   oh well! 

[jaird]

Mango is right.

If they split you, you are bad. They cannot love you anymore then, no matter what they said to you in the past, no matter how right the r/s was, no matter what you did  for them. If they can split you, they can hate you. And if they hate you, they can push you away, and if they succeed in pushing you away once and for all, you can never hurt them again, disappoint them again or abandon them.

[jaird]

Ouch, Healingmyheart!  I "get" everything my BPD ex does - on a gut level, but not on a logical level.  I feel like I should be a bit worried haha... .   oh well! 

I know my ex and her behaviors like the back of my hand too. But yes, I cannot comprehend why she does things, I can just see them coming and sometimes see in retrospect what she hopes to accomplish.

[PM10]

ScotisGone74, I posted something very similar to this, but you expressed it better.  His hatred is the thing that I really struggle with. 

Healingmyheart, I can relate to you in that I too had the same issue with letting him go.  He pushed it to a point though where I HAD to let him go. I had to do it in a way too that I am sure made him hate me even more.  So I now live in anxiety over what kind of smear campaign (or worse) I am about to experience.

[BradyK]

Hi ScotisGone74 -- you've gotten some great replies about the hate question and I hope it helps. I remember when I was so terribly hurt when my ex painted me black, too.

But I have a question about the punishment part. In what way are you being "needlessly punished'? This sounds like you feel like an innocent victim. You may indeed be blameless, but you don't have to be a victim; you are not a child, you are not powerless. Are you tolerating something that you have the power to refuse to tolerate? I ask this in the spirit of concern only! I don't know your story and could be way off base, here.

[findingmyselfagain]

They must *HATE* us partly b/c they are in so much turmoil and so ashamed of themselves. They simply can't think of themselves as having any flaws (splitting). They would then be totally worthless, so we get pushed away b/c we remind them of their wrong-doing. It's either to find another band-aid than it is to deal with the work of a relationship. It's really sad what they deal with, but we must live our own lives. That's the only way they have a chance to hit rock bottom and heal. We can't rescue them. It's helped me a lot to realize that.

[ScotisGone74]

Thanks for the replies all.  In response to Brady-needlessly punished is when someone contacts you asking you how much you loved them and asks you to show them how much you loved them repeatedly while they are involved in

another relationship with someone else -ie living with someone whom you did not know about.  Needlessly punishing someone is setting up a smear campaign of lies and gossip about someone when you've supposedly moved on with another person in a relationship. 

I never said I was an innocent victim by any means, we all have our faults.  My fault was tolerating the emotional and verbal abuse for too long and being an enabler.  I'm out and away from it now, but it doesn't whipe off easily. 

[Mightyhammers]

Mango is right.

If they split you, you are bad. They cannot love you anymore then, no matter what they said to you in the past, no matter how right the r/s was, no matter what you did  for them. If they can split you, they can hate you. And if they hate you, they can push you away, and if they succeed in pushing you away once and for all, you can never hurt them again, disappoint them again or abandon them.

so why do they often come back?

[ScotisGone74]

They come back because of a couple reasons:   1-they need a new supply of emotional well being and self esteem because more than likely they have sucked the life out of the current supply.   2-Their current fairy tale is beginning to crumble, their all white partner has flaws they have seen or imagined and the partner is not able to cater to their every unobtainable whim.   3 they want to keep as many potential fish on the hook as they can so they can be the center of attention. 

[BradyK]

Hi ScotisGone74 -- I see what you are saying. It sounds really painful. It does seem like gratuitous punishment. My ex did a few things like that, but only after we split -- not as extreme as yours -- but I don't think he thought about what he was doing or had any thought of the effect it might have on me. He was just reacting to his feelings, and trying to get what he needed, I think. I don't really know and it doesn't matter to me anymore. But at the time it was tough.

[dogpirate]

I know this all too well, and I feel that mango_flower has pretty much hit the nail on the head with this one. It is about devaluation, so that they can separate their feelings from you. There's less fear of abandonment if they hate you, because it makes them feel they're not losing anything. They're not going to let themselves think they're missing out on a 'good' thing, so they paint you black so they can think "They're the wrong ones, I am better off without them in my life, I abandoned them because they were bad and it was their fault". It is nothing more than a defensive guise, and we can't take it personally.

My ex actually painted me black a little over a year ago when she cheated on me with someone else. A best friend of mine had died at the time, and even in my grieving she was still stone-faced and went so far as to tell me "Thank you for ruining something that made me happy." when my relationship advice for her with her new boyfriend didn't go as planned, even though -she- was the one who asked me for help because -he- was being confrontational with her. Imagine, playing Dr. Phil to your ex who left you for someone else! (Funny how crazy we let things get... .   )

Anyways, he didn't turn out to be the 'saving grace' she so desperately needed from me, so after a month or two she went from idealizing him and devaluing me to the exact opposite! These feelings are not set in stone, and depend on their perceived predicament. It is unfortunate because it makes me feel like our entire relationship and the 'love' she had for me was circumstantial, but it's just one of those things you can't let yourself dwell on.

[jaird]

Mango is right.

If they split you, you are bad. They cannot love you anymore then, no matter what they said to you in the past, no matter how right the r/s was, no matter what you did  for them. If they can split you, they can hate you. And if they hate you, they can push you away, and if they succeed in pushing you away once and for all, you can never hurt them again, disappoint them again or abandon them.

so why do they often come back?

I am not sure they do often come back. That is conventional wisdom on these boards. Some others say once you're black, that's it.

I guess it depends on the individual and their situation. I believe my ex recycled or tried to recycle a guy she was with like 12 or 14 years ago. But maybe she never painted him black. Last she told me, he was married now. But maybe he's not now. Or maybe he is. Might not matter if all she wanted was sex with someone she knows.

[Dave44]

Mango is right.

If they split you, you are bad. They cannot love you anymore then, no matter what they said to you in the past, no matter how right the r/s was, no matter what you did  for them. If they can split you, they can hate you. And if they hate you, they can push you away, and if they succeed in pushing you away once and for all, you can never hurt them again, disappoint them again or abandon them.

so why do they often come back?

I am not sure they do often come back. That is conventional wisdom on these boards. Some others say once you're black, that's it.

I guess it depends on the individual and their situation. I believe my ex recycled or tried to recycle a guy she was with like 12 or 14 years ago. But maybe she never painted him black. Last she told me, he was married now. But maybe he's not now. Or maybe he is. Might not matter if all she wanted was sex with someone she knows.

All I hear on these boards is how they "always come back". I never heard a single word from my ex again... .   ever.

[VeryFree]

All I hear on these boards is how they "always come back". I never heard a single word from my ex again... .   ever.

We have to be in touch for the upcoming divorce, but frankly I don't think I will hear another word from her after that.

[SarahinMA]

I'm 99.9% sure my ex will never recycle me.  He's way too cowardly and avoidant.  I see him often, but he just pretends that I'm a stranger OR he looks at me in disgust.  Although it still hurts a bit, it's become kind of a joke among my friends and I.  How completely socially inept he is around me. 

We dated for two years and he told a mutual friend that he couldn't remember my middle name or birthday.  I'm not sure if that was a lie or not OR that he had compartmentalized me so much in his head that he forced himself to forget. 

[cal644]

Funny - I just posted something on this too.  It's strange how she not only has hate towards me, but to everything she once held (or I thought she held) dear.  Myself, my family, our friends, our church, places we used to go eat out - everything!  My T said if she did have to face the facts and realize what she threw away it would cause her too much pain.

[jaird]

I have a new therapist that has worked with BPD groups. He says you are either all good, or all bad, in their eyes, there is no in between.

I know so many people on these boards talk about recycling, but I'm not sure how true it is. Anyone, BPD affected or not, may get back in touch with an ex lover because something triggered a good memory. I'm pretty sure most of those phone calls or emails or texts are just sharing a moment, and not an attempt at recycling.

[charred]

I didn't get recycled for 27 yrs... . then it happened about 6 more times... . so maybe you haven't waited long enough.  I think the thing that determines it mostly is supply/demand. If your pwBPD has other people handy, then when they paint you black and are done... . that is it. If they don't, and they are alone a bit, they get needy and can want you back... . despite having said and done truly horrible things.

I look at the emails I saved from my pwBPD any time I start thinking I wish I was with her... . rereading them cures me of the longing.

As to why they hate... . its not directly from us in my opinion. Read a book on codependency that explained carried emotions. When someone has bad experiences as a kid, and then protects themselves with some kind of   defense mechanism... . the emotions that they are avoiding, still exist, but get repressed. Later they are carried forward and come out with an intensity that is out of all proportion to what is currently going on. So a codependent person might be suicidal when being rejected for a dinner date... .   or a BPD person might not only split you as bad... . but react to you with the furious anger that comes from some long ago pain (or perceived wrong.)  That is my theory, because... . like many of you, I went back and forth with my pwBPD... . but I was crazy about her and did lots of nice things for her and was civil at all times... . and that was met with a degree of vitriolic anger during the hating phase that defied any current cause, and given that I know she is disordered and it is an attachment disorder, the only other source of such intense pain/anger would seem to be the rage from abandonment.

So, the wacky part... . they are ending it and are furious we are leaving them... .   certainly doesn't make sense for a healthy person, but they are not, so its an explanation, not an excuse for it.

[jaird]

Bottom line-there is no rational explanation. We can theorize all we want about childhood trauma and abuse and fear of abandonment and fear of emotional intimacy, and it could be any or all of these things. Or, they could just be bad people, with no sense of boundaries, sympathy, empathy, or really most of the qualities that make a person good and caring and capable of commitment.

ClearMind said on another thread that my ex is neither all good or all bad, but she has never met her, LOL.

When I look back, other than the idolization of me, and the catering to me, she really has no good qualities. She doesn't do anything for anyone except her children-no charity work, no giving to charity, she views people as objects or meat, she uses men in any way she can, and she is dismissive of almost all other women as "fat", or "ugly". She cannot see that the inner beauty, the goodness in anyone. Indeed, not only does she not see those inner qualities, she does not even acknowledge that they might exist or show any interest in them.

One of the first things she told me is "I am not like anyone you ever met, I'm selfish. It's all about me."

What a way to live, and her life, as far as relationships, has been a story of one mistake after another.

[Dave44]

I didn't get recycled for 27 yrs... . then it happened about 6 more times... . so maybe you haven't waited long enough.  I think the thing that determines it mostly is supply/demand. If your pwBPD has other people handy, then when they paint you black and are done... . that is it. If they don't, and they are alone a bit, they get needy and can want you back... . despite having said and done truly horrible things.

I look at the emails I saved from my pwBPD any time I start thinking I wish I was with her... . rereading them cures me of the longing.

As to why they hate... . its not directly from us in my opinion. Read a book on codependency that explained carried emotions. When someone has bad experiences as a kid, and then protects themselves with some kind of   defense mechanism... . the emotions that they are avoiding, still exist, but get repressed. Later they are carried forward and come out with an intensity that is out of all proportion to what is currently going on. So a codependent person might be suicidal when being rejected for a dinner date... .   or a BPD person might not only split you as bad... . but react to you with the furious anger that comes from some long ago pain (or perceived wrong.)  That is my theory, because... . like many of you, I went back and forth with my pwBPD... . but I was crazy about her and did lots of nice things for her and was civil at all times... . and that was met with a degree of vitriolic anger during the hating phase that defied any current cause, and given that I know she is disordered and it is an attachment disorder, the only other source of such intense pain/anger would seem to be the rage from abandonment.

So, the wacky part... . they are ending it and are furious we are leaving them... .   certainly doesn't make sense for a healthy person, but they are not, so its an explanation, not an excuse for it.

They end it and are furious we're leavin them? ? Once again, just another thread that makes me think I'm totally in the wrong place. My ex brutally dumped me like a sack of potatoes and didnt give a RATS ASS that "I was leaving her". She was MORE than happy to end it and I have never heard a single word from her since... .   ever.

[bt2461]

Funny - I just posted something on this too.  It's strange how she not only has hate towards me, but to everything she once held (or I thought she held) dear.  Myself, my family, our friends, our church, places we used to go eat out - everything!  My T said if she did have to face the facts and realize what she threw away it would cause her too much pain.

This is exactly the way my estranged wife is treating me and everything associated with our life of almost 27 years together. I was far from the perfect husband and am coming to terms with my faults and in the whole matter, but we were together nearly 3 decades with no infidelity, no domestic violence, no substance abuse, financially secure, 3 kids, etc.

Hardly the gruesome house of horrors life she now claims she, the victim, silently endured for all those years. Before she got involved with her new man, she was still pretty complimentary of our lives, relationship and family to other around us. Once she made the choice to replace me, absolutely everything about our lives, our family, our church, our business, our house, our town, our vacations, the birth of our kids, the raising of our kids, our sex life, my integrity, everything became horrible and pure forced torture of her by me.

Any mutual friends (most) that did not go along with what she was doing, etc., became horrible, abusive, judgmental brain washed-by-me evil robots trolls sent by me to torment her.

The hardest part is trying to make sense of the pure insanity of it all. I think the explanation of my wife's extreme need to demonize me in order for her to justify her affair and divorce, which would have been unthinkable a short while ago, comes about as close as anything I have heard yet. Thanks.

[charred]

They end it and are furious we are leaving them... . perfect nonsense. But it fits my experience. She would be a hater of extraordinary magnitude... . end things, and be posting about how she was a victim, and painting me black... . followed a week or so by contacting me wanting to get back together... . but clearly still mad that we were apart. It made no sense at all.

My pwBPD is still doing stalking behavior, got a text from my sister telling me her posts on FB were being copied minutes after they were posted by my pwBPD, and that her friends that knew my pwBPD... . were being contacted by her trying to find out anything on me.

I guess we don't really know why they hate... .   can verify that they do, and mine was really good at it.

[ScotisGone74]

I think Charred hit on it at well-at least in my case-mine actually ended it by cheating and living with someone/moving someone in with her, but had some real issues when I started to do other things.  It was like to her it was okay to cheat, have sex with different people,   but if I ever considered moving on after her that was Not allowed-like she wanted me to be some muppet/pin cushion that followed her around or tolerated the abuse. 

I saw the hate on my expwBPD's face and it was palpable the last time I saw her, this was after she already had my replacement handy.  I geuss what I don't get is if they have already supposedly replaced us and living such a great new life with their new Savior and white knight, why continue to hate/blame/throw mud on us?

My hypothesis is that It is easier for them to Hate/Blame us than it is to Hate/Blame themselves for anything-if they constantly believed they were this bad all the time there would probably be more BPD's that committed/attempted suicide. 

Dave44-I spent two and half years with the expwBPD-which is a drop in the bucket to what alot on here have spent with their exBPD-but I want to say that I'm  at 5 months NC and am beginning to feel better-I have not heard one peep out of her-she knows where I live/work/ but I've blocked everything from her contact, I 'd like to be able one day speak to her-for numerous reasons-but I'm at peace if that never happens.  I always thought she would contact me to say something at least, but I don't need her to put her batchit stamp on it to know she was crazy. 

[charred]

What keeps me from going back is something I realized... .  

They act different ways, clearly idealizing, clingy and hater, as well as other ways.

My pwBPD... . when she was idealizing me... . seemed a bit phony, my mom and sister thought she was phony, I wanted to believe it despite the  .

When she was clingy I didn't understand why, she had nothing to worry about... . but it was semi-believable, there was something real about it.

When she was hating... . 110% real, in fact I have never seen such vitriolic hatred spew from someone in my life. If her attitude were put in to action, I would be stabbed 29 times, shot a few more and left for dead.

So the only time I am sure she wasn't manipulating/acting with me, where I felt in my bones she was telling the truth... . was when she was so angry she was scary. I was with my exwife for 22 yrs, and she had plenty of reason to be really mad at me during that time, and never once did she attack my manhood, or hate with the unbridled passion of my pwBPD, there was always some reserve due to loving me that held her back. If she did anything mean, she would feel terrible about it and want to make up for it later. The difference between her and my pwBPD, is the difference between a normal loving person and a psycho. I have seen loving actions from my pwBPD... . but it always seems like an act, doesn't last and anymore clearly strikes me as a manipulation.

After having been in many normal r/s, and just this one horribly dysfunctional one... .   I am in therapy and value my life too much to ever have my self respect, my very core blasted with unbridled hate from someone I have gone to great lengths to show love. I am on these boards to help cope with the feelings, but the decision is done and was the right one.

Why do they hate... .   who cares, if you love them and get hate back for it... . value yourself and find someone that will give you love for love.

[BradyK]

Why do they hate... .   who cares, if you love them and get hate back for it... . value yourself and find someone that will give you love for love.

Thank you, Charred. Really helpful to me.

[cal644]

Great great advise - why give them love when all they give back is hate - give love to someone who can give love - I love it!  Makes me ask myself - why does she deserve the love I gave her and still kinda do - why do I reach out only to be hurt - why shouldn't I give love to someone who can love me back!

[jaird]

Great great advise - why give them love when all they give back is hate - give love to someone who can give love - I love it!  Makes me ask myself - why does she deserve the love I gave her and still kinda do - why do I reach out only to be hurt - why shouldn't I give love to someone who can love me back!

Good points all. I stopped reaching out. My ex called me a few days ago, but she can't even have a normal, civil conversation. She can start out sounding normal and fine, but goes into a degrading rant within minutes. I'm not sure why, since she broke up with me, but she wants to know all the details of any relationship I have. I have told her more than once that it is none of her business. She is dating and I really don't care who she sees. She found a replacement for me, and that works for her on some levels. She claims to be so happy and calm now, but all I hear from her is abusive comments towards me and whatever behavior she THINKS I'm involved in. I really don't see her making any progress towards getting better. I'm not sure if she's like this with anyone else in her life, probably not. But I am no longer allowing her to be like this towards me. I think it frustrates her that I have told her a few times that I can no longer be manipulated by her. She has no control over me anymore, and her "threats" are pretty juvenile and pointless.