Home page of BPDFamily.com, online relationship supportMember registration here
March 29, 2024, 03:24:46 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Board Admins: Kells76, Once Removed, Turkish
Senior Ambassadors: Cat Familiar, EyesUp, SinisterComplex
  Help!   Boards   Please Donate Login to Post New?--Click here to register  
bing
Experts share their discoveries [video]
99
Could it be BPD
BPDFamily.com Production
Listening to shame
Brené Brown, PhD
What is BPD?
Blasé Aguirre, MD
What BPD recovery looks like
Documentary
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Can you ever regain a BPD's respect?  (Read 1870 times)
711guy

*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 13


« on: April 29, 2013, 10:14:50 PM »

Hey everyone, im relatively new to this forum that i am so thankful for.  To make a long story short i have been involvled with a BPD woman for 5 years 4 that we were together.  Things started out great as usual, but shortly after time i began to get painted black and white.  She manipulates, Plays push pull better than anyone i have EVER seen anyone do, flirts with any guy who will give her attention. 

Logged
AllyCat7
***
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 145


« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2013, 10:28:11 PM »

I have a weird suspicion that the answer is that the only way to gain their respect is to dump them, after which you may have the respect, but have totally lost their trust. It's a lose/lose, it seems! I could be wrong, though. Setting clear boundaries may work, but sometimes that involves dumping them when they cross certain lines, and then you have the aforementioned trust issues to deal with. So frustrating.
Logged
711guy

*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 13


« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2013, 10:30:16 PM »

sorry im new  my message cut off prematurely but i really need help with finding a way to cope with the Push/Pull ways and how that whole mind set works.  And is there  anything you can do to regain respect in there eyes or is it forever gone?
Logged
711guy

*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 13


« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2013, 10:31:58 PM »

I would never hurt her even after what she put me through, I would love to hear or learn  ways i can set boudaries ?
Logged
AllyCat7
***
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 145


« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2013, 10:39:53 PM »

Ok I will try to add a constructive tip that doesn't involve dumping or threatening to dump Laugh out loud (click to insert in post).

One thing that helped me when I was more in touch with my BPD was to NOT react to his antics. And when I say not react, I mean REALLY not react... .  at all... .  not even on social media. Don't play their games back on them or show that they bother you. Just act calm, consistent, and steady at ALL times. That will require a lot of self-control on your part and also a change of mindset. You have to become a master at detachment and learn how to be a little selfish.

Boundaries help, too, but I'm not so good at communicating those, so maybe someone else can help you with that! Smiling (click to insert in post)
Logged
711guy

*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 13


« Reply #5 on: April 29, 2013, 10:48:12 PM »

Thanks AllyCat7!,

That was a big help to me, me being very logical i end up trying to get answers and asking why she is acting this way.  In return she tests me and takes in her mind the games further.  The more i react the more she trys to get away with :'(... . My question to you after you started doing this did you see a change in your relationship?

Logged
AllyCat7
***
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 145


« Reply #6 on: April 29, 2013, 11:08:35 PM »

Thanks AllyCat7!,

That was a big help to me, me being very logical i end up trying to get answers and asking why she is acting this way.  In return she tests me and takes in her mind the games further.  The more i react the more she trys to get away with :'(... . My question to you after you started doing this did you see a change in your relationship?

You're welcome! Well it's hard to know how much it changed the relationship because my doing that coincided with some other issues, which made the relationship deteriorate. BUT, I think it did help. It made the relationship less dysfunctional in some respects. But I did notice, however, that he seemed a little bored and detached after I did this, though. I think part of him thrives on the dysfunctional games, even though they do hurt him and end up ruining the relationship. It's really weird. It's like the healthier I would act, the less he seemed to want the r'ship and he would go play games with dysfunctional girls (one after the other, b/c they would die out quickly) and then come back to the stability I provided. But I didn't like that and I eventually set a boundary, which he didn't like.

Anyway, I would still recommend it because if your relationship is going to have a chance, it will only have a chance if you are stable and composed. You can communicate to her if some of her games disrespect you. But sometimes actions speak louder than words. Show her through your actions. Other than that, just stay calm. Playing the games back, although having short-term gain, will always lead to the destruction of the relationship. Anyway, good luck!
Logged
711guy

*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 13


« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2013, 12:03:26 AM »

thankyou, you helped alot! Smiling (click to insert in post)
Logged
AllyCat7
***
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 145


« Reply #8 on: April 30, 2013, 12:10:24 AM »

thankyou, you helped alot! Smiling (click to insert in post)

Np. Glad I could help Smiling (click to insert in post)
Logged
turtle
Retired Staff
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Relationship status: I am happily single -- live alone and love it.
Posts: 5313


WWW
« Reply #9 on: April 30, 2013, 05:50:25 PM »

711guy --

You titled this thread "Can you ever regain a BPD's respect?"

There's an assumption there that you had their respect in the first place.

IMO, pwBPD don't respect ANYONE (including themselves.)  They might make you feel that they do, but they really don't.

I think what you might really be asking is "how can I get her to stop the push/pull and the manipulation?"

These are things that are at the very core of someone with BPD, so getting them to stop is likely not going to happen.

You have to ask yourself how YOU can deal with it when it happens or if you are even willing to try.  Many of us (myself included) are no longer willing to try (we've tried until the cows never come home.)  You'll find that group on the leaving board. Others of us are still in the "trying" phase and you'll find that group on the staying board.

It sounds to me as if you are in the "staying" camp.  Read what people say there.  They have lots of coping skills and communication skills that they have tried.

Eventually, you have to decide if you're willing to do all of that without knowing if it will help or not.

Respect?  JMO... .    it doesn't exist in a pwBPD.

turtle

Logged

waverider
Retired Staff
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: married 8 yrs, together 16yrs
Posts: 7405


If YOU don't change, things will stay the same


« Reply #10 on: April 30, 2013, 09:10:35 PM »

I wouldn't say that a pwBPD cant respect anyone, but I do believe that the respect is only available as long as it does not clash with their immediate needs, which seem to act like an override switch.

I have reached a place in my RS where most of the high conflict and instant defensiveness is much reduced. With constant use of boundaries and loosing the fear of saying no has allowed  a great deal of respect for me to return (subject to that neediness override switch).

But you will have to say no and learn to assert yourself in a non aggressive way to achieve this. Pandering to neediness will not achieve it, only make it worse.
Logged

  Reality is shared and open to debate, feelings are individual and real
turtle
Retired Staff
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Relationship status: I am happily single -- live alone and love it.
Posts: 5313


WWW
« Reply #11 on: April 30, 2013, 09:20:50 PM »

I wouldn't say that a pwBPD cant respect anyone, but I do believe that the respect is only available as long as it does not clash with their immediate needs, which seem to act like an override switch.

Hmm... .  not sure true "respect" comes with these kinds of conditions.  Either you respect someone or you don't. It shouldn't clash with any kind of an override switch, but that's JMO.

I don't think they respect themselves, therefore respect for anyone else is VERY hard to achieve.

turtle

Logged

seeking balance
Retired Staff
*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Gay, lesb
Relationship status: divorced
Posts: 7146



« Reply #12 on: April 30, 2013, 09:46:24 PM »

Well - the definition of RESPECT via wikipedia:

Respect is a positive feeling of esteem or deference for a person or other entity (such as a nation or a religion), and also specific actions and conduct representative of that esteem.

By BPD definition - we know that feelings dictate actions... .  actions can lead to poor coping skills that may or may not be aligned with actions you deem respectful.

Hey everyone, im relatively new to this forum that i am so thankful for.  To make a long story short i have been involvled with a BPD woman for 5 years 4 that we were together.  Things started out great as usual, but shortly after time i began to get painted black and white.  She manipulates, Plays push pull better than anyone i have EVER seen anyone do, flirts with any guy who will give her attention. 

Is it the flirting and manipulating you find disrespectful?

Look at this from a BPD lens - flirting and manipulating may be actions that are justified to alleviate the feelings of not having a stable sense of self... .  is this disrespectful to you or simply a means of coping?

My guess is your pwBPD would say she respects you, but her survival skills lead to actions that may not be aligned with your definition of respect.  I know this is not a great feeling when watching it and I remember watching similar behavior myself, I felt disrespected too; but the fact is - this is not a respect issue - it is mental illness. 

Now, you can set boundaries around behaviors that you find not tolerable - but be clear on your boundaries as they are for you and not to gain respect or manipulate someone else.

This is a really good question - one I probably had early on but didn't realize it because I certainly would complain in MC about respect.  Learning more and more about the disorder reframed this for me.
Logged

Faith does not grow in the house of certainty - The Shack
Kunoichi
**
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 94


« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2013, 09:51:56 PM »

In my experience with my H of 18 years he has never respected me. He will turn on the charm when he wants something but when I say no his whiny 2 year old comes out and when that doesn't work he starts with the accusations that I don't love him, I'm cheating on him, I really just want to leave him and when I ignore that he becomes a demon from hell.

I'm with Turtle, they certainly have no respect for themselves so in turn they have none for anyone else. I don't believe they know what respect even means.

My husband is a big time manipulator. He lies, he withholds information, he withholds affection (not that there is a thimble's worth to begin with), he will hit me, accuse me of things I have never even thought of much less done, twists everything I say to fit his agenda and put words in my mouth. If I didn't know better I would swear he lies awake at night plotting ways to get what he wants and to make everyone around him as miserable as he is.
Logged
waverider
Retired Staff
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: married 8 yrs, together 16yrs
Posts: 7405


If YOU don't change, things will stay the same


« Reply #14 on: April 30, 2013, 11:44:34 PM »

pwBPD lack consistency in anything, including respect, in the moment it is genuine, but in a different moment it is nowhere to be seen. Much the same as any feeling or emotions they have no matter how "real" they are, it is not cemented in place regardless of which way the wind goes. 100% consistency means you are no longer in a BPD relationship

So it comes down to what you can accept, eg 95% of the time respect with 5% of the time it goes out the window, or 100% indifference at best. You can live with the former but not the latter.

Most who come to this board start off in a place of the latter or even worse, to achieve the former is quite an achievement.

Bottom line is what can you live with, and that is different for everyone. The most important thing is you can work on is to respect yourself 100%. If you can achieve that then total respect from others is less crucial, and easier to accept as part of the disorder without taking it to heart.
Logged

  Reality is shared and open to debate, feelings are individual and real
Newton
********
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 1548


« Reply #15 on: May 01, 2013, 03:55:16 AM »

I would suggest that if I have respect for someone... .  it is because of who they are, not what they can provide for me (ie/ alleviation of abandonment fears or a required desire for enmeshment)... .  

PwBPD's feelings are transitory and rather fluid by nature ... .  agreed,... .  but due to the very nature of the disorder I would struggle to identify any of their as feelings as "respectful" of another human being... .  

Surely we have utility for them... .  on an emotional level, to ease their discomfort... .  

In addition to this... .  some of the DBT texts I have read (about 3 years ago so I will add a caveat that this is anecdotal before the powers that be call me out on it!   )... .  are coaching how to ACT respectfully towards others in order to have better social skills... .  that is not, however, altering their fundamental feelings (or lack of them) towards us... .  
Logged
recoil
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 259


« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2013, 10:15:05 AM »

Excerpt
I felt disrespected too; but the fact is - this is not a respect issue - it is mental illness.  

I definitely felt like I wasn't being respected in quite a few situations.  SB, this really sheds some light on things.

Excerpt
... .  is this disrespectful to you or simply a means of coping?

This brings my heart sadness.  On one hand, it's nice to know she wasn't trying to intentionally be disrespectful to me.  On other other hand, it's very sad to hear that these "coping skills" are what she needs to survive, based on her thinking/condition/experiences.  When I would voice my concern over being disrespected, she wouldn't take any responsibility -- never an apology.  Now I really know why.  

I'd always back down after an incident like this too.  Then I started keeping my mouth shut.  I didn't want to rock the boat so I could keep the relationship.  Not good.
Logged
711guy

*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 13


« Reply #17 on: May 01, 2013, 01:23:40 PM »

Wow, I really wanna Thank everyone on this board for all these amazing responses, I really thought i was alone in this and after a long abusive relationship i was starting to believe it was my fault and that i was the problem.  My therapist that i started to see introduced me to the term "Borderline Personality Disorder" when i told him about my girlfriend. I did research and ultimately ended up on this forum.  I know in my mind leaving and never looking back is the best thing i can do.  But i am stubborn in the sense i unrealisticly believe things are gonna just go back to the honeymoon stage and everything will be perfect, which i know it wont.

This girl is a MASTER seducer im normally a strong person, but when she wants something she will get it.  I am ashamed to admit to everyone on here i am scared of seperating FOREVER from this girl because i am addicted to her and when things are great they are awesome. Its that on top of the world feeling they give you that im sure everyone is all to familiar with.  Im at a loss right now and cant stop the bleeding i wouldnt even know how to set up a boundary with this woman. She tells me one moment she only wants me and i make her feel like no one else does and calls and texts continually when i dont respond. When i do show her affection and love she constantly tests me saying "i dont think we should talk anymore" and she gets angry if i agree with her.  She is a beautiful model that believes she doesnt need any help whatsoever, and i am in disbelief i got myself into this never ending situation. I cant go on like this.     ,711guy

 
Logged
costadelmar

*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 26



« Reply #18 on: May 01, 2013, 02:02:44 PM »

he will hit me, accuse me of things I have never even thought of much less done, twists everything I say to fit his agenda and put words in my mouth.

Bellamina, LEAVE HIM!  Hitting a woman is WRONG!  There is no way to defend that kind of behavior.
Logged
Kunoichi
**
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 94


« Reply #19 on: May 01, 2013, 02:24:27 PM »

I am in the process of leaving and I am taking steps to be safe. No worries, okay?

Bellamina
Logged
Newton
********
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 1548


« Reply #20 on: May 01, 2013, 05:27:09 PM »

711guy... .  so many members here will have walked in your shoes... .  they will understand your situation and could often second guess the next "play" in the dynamic of your relationship... .  (such is the nature of BPD)... .  

It's important you dwell on this next sentence for a while... .  

She may be an amazing seducer... .  but she only gets to have what she desires if you decide to give it to her... .  

Simple to understand... .  yes... .  hard to act on?... .  tell me about it!... .  

We get this... .  you are in a good place  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)
Logged
artman.1
********
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Relationship status: Married, 47yrs
Posts: 2160



« Reply #21 on: May 01, 2013, 05:54:03 PM »

I have been married to my UBPDW for nearly 45 years.  She has disrespected me in the long ago past.  She was told by her younger Sister that was getting a divorce that I was a Male Chauvanist Pig.  She filed for a Divorce and I was served with Papers.  She started partying with her Sis and GFs at night and I would take care of our three sons 3, 4, & 5 years old.  I followed her and saw her cheating in our car at a dance club parking lot.  I counter sued and forced her to Marriage Counceling.  Her Sis got her Divorce and got screwed by the Judge with only $100 per month Child Support and her clothes.  She had nowhere to live and came to stay with us.  My UBPDW and her Sis started fighting immediately and we reconciled.  Now after all these years, I found out about BPD (She Has) and Codependence (Which I have) about 2.5 yrs ago.  I have detached with love and understanding to the point where if she had an affair, I would leave immediately.  I stopped her rages by leaving every time she started a rage.

Bottom Line:  :)etach and protect yourself with boundries and limits.  These are for you, and not for her, so I did not even tell her what my boundries and limits are, I just carried them out.

She has refused all Intimacy for the last 36+ years and I am not sure I will stay.

Art
Logged
711guy

*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 13


« Reply #22 on: May 01, 2013, 08:45:17 PM »

I agree she can only manipulate me if i let her and Artman i feel your pain that is devastating seeing the one you love hooking up with someone you have so much time invested in, i have witnessed that myself actually with one of my best friends. My failed suicide attempt was not successful, thankfully it wasnt im here talking with people that walked this same road. I just dont know how im gonna seperate i almost feel like im the abandoning her! Thats how messed up my thinking is      711guy... .
Logged
goldylamont
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 1083



« Reply #23 on: May 01, 2013, 09:21:52 PM »

Excerpt
I felt disrespected too; but the fact is - this is not a respect issue - it is mental illness.  

I definitely felt like I wasn't being respected in quite a few situations.  SB, this really sheds some light on things.

Excerpt
... .  is this disrespectful to you or simply a means of coping?

This brings my heart sadness.  On one hand, it's nice to know she wasn't trying to intentionally be disrespectful to me.  On other other hand, it's very sad to hear that these "coping skills" are what she needs to survive, based on her thinking/condition/experiences.  When I would voice my concern over being disrespected, she wouldn't take any responsibility -- never an apology.  Now I really know why.  

I'd always back down after an incident like this too.  Then I started keeping my mouth shut.  I didn't want to rock the boat so I could keep the relationship.  Not good.

i just wanted to say that, i "respectfully"   disagree with these statements  Smiling (click to insert in post) i feel as if it's very easy to use BPD as an excuse for disrespectful behavior. even though they act like children, these are adults we're talking about, and i think it may be going to far to say that they are unaware of their behaviors or actions just because they aren't feeling well.

sure, you could say that a pwBPD flirts with someone, flaunting it in front of you (and prolly your friends too) and understand a slew of reasons about how they may be fearing abandonment or feeling engulfed, and make the mistake of saying this is the only reason behind it. but i'm sure in many instances they are FULLY aware that what they are doing is having an affect on their partners, in fact, they are probably doing it purposefully, consciously being disrespectful to you in public, to manipulate and control you, put you in your place. so, sometimes they may be unaware, but let's be real here, many times not only are they aware but they are using as a tool to control you.

i feel it's very important 711guy at this point to honor your own feelings more than your perception of hers. we can never know what people are truly feeling, although we can perhaps understand some. but, don't make the mistake of throwing away truly what you felt. you felt disrespected because you were
Logged
goldylamont
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 1083



« Reply #24 on: May 01, 2013, 09:35:51 PM »

One thing that helped me when I was more in touch with my BPD was to NOT react to his antics. And when I say not react, I mean REALLY not react... .  at all... .  not even on social media. Don't play their games back on them or show that they bother you. Just act calm, consistent, and steady at ALL times. That will require a lot of self-control on your part and also a change of mindset. You have to become a master at detachment and learn how to be a little selfish.

Boundaries help, too, but I'm not so good at communicating those, so maybe someone else can help you with that! Smiling (click to insert in post)

AllyCat7 i want to jump up and down and clap my hands you've reminded me of something very important i discovered also in dealing with my ex. i had to learn the art of self control and not reacting--this revealed SO many things to me during the most heated debates with my ex.

711guy i can say with my ex, even before i knew what BPD was i learned that i could not react in a way even close to the level of anger/shame/disrespect she was laying on me at the time. this is b/c she could do something *really* bad, like a level 10, but if in response i did something at level 2 she'd use this as her excuse to go to level 11 and then the whole conversation would shift to how bad a person I was. aaaaaaaah, the technique of a master manipulator my friend--don't try to win it, she's better than you at that, but, if you can keep your wits and not participate you can side-step giving them more ammo to blast you with.

i've got specific stories if your interested in hearing let me know. but yes, AlleyCat7 is so right, if you can keep calm this will give you great powers of clarity and avoid worsening the situation. only one thing i would point out is that i don't like using the term "detaching" here as i feel like in a heated argument such as this, you do need to be non-reactive, but not detached, rather you need to be non-reactive and Grounded, fully there, fully aware, albeit non-reactive. i can give you some grounding techniques too if interested

Logged
hellnback
**
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 68



« Reply #25 on: May 01, 2013, 10:51:12 PM »

Would it not be better to respect yourself? Maybe that is how to gain their respect? I don't know, but it's a start
Logged
waverider
Retired Staff
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: married 8 yrs, together 16yrs
Posts: 7405


If YOU don't change, things will stay the same


« Reply #26 on: May 01, 2013, 11:22:49 PM »

711guy i can say with my ex, even before i knew what BPD was i learned that i could not react in a way even close to the level of anger/shame/disrespect she was laying on me at the time. this is b/c she could do something *really* bad, like a level 10, but if in response i did something at level 2 she'd use this as her excuse to go to level 11 and then the whole conversation would shift to how bad a person I was. aaaaaaaah, the technique of a master manipulator my friend--don't try to win it, she's better than you at that, but, if you can keep your wits and not participate you can side-step giving them more ammo to blast you with.

Dont try stopping an avalanche by throwing rocks at it.!

In a BPD relationship disrespect can be expected to one degree or another, that does not mean it should be accepted. How you handle and deal with it is the hard part as you are unlikely to completely eliminate it.
Logged

  Reality is shared and open to debate, feelings are individual and real
711guy

*
Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 13


« Reply #27 on: May 02, 2013, 09:31:04 AM »

I'm very new to this board and I have spent a couple hours reading topics and articles and one thing I have really noticed is there are NO SUCCESS stories on here about cures or people doing great in there relationships.

Goldylamont, I would be interested in hearing more stories from your experiences. Thanks for the help

Hellnback, ultimately I believe you hit it on the head I need more respect for myself so I can eventually get strong enough to be able to walk away.

artman.1 , the line "but she only gets to have what she desires if you give it to her" has been running through my head thanks.

Waverunner, thanks I know she has a serious problem and I will never eliminate the disrespect and I need to stop my fixing ways. The ultimate decision is can i eventually get strong enough to leave.
Logged
goldylamont
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 1083



« Reply #28 on: May 02, 2013, 12:26:20 PM »

711guy, this story is from a posting i wrote a couple of months ago, something that happened about a year ago. i'm realizing by re-reading that i still feel the same way and am expressing these opinions again here in this thread. to summarize, i feel like some would say a pwBPD is unaware of what they are doing, of how it is making you feel, that they are just on auto-pilot. well, while i agree that they most def are on auto-pilot, and their behaviors have nothing to do with you, i know myself that not just are they aware of the effect of their actions on you, but that they are consciously using their actions (for example, being disrespectful in public or private) to control and emotionally abuse you. i'm sure things are different for different couples so take it all in and decide for yourself what applies to your situation.

you'll notice in my posting below i mention waverider--b/c he's an awesome moderator and was there for us back then! i may have some different viewpoints from waverider but he's constantly bringing up valid points so understand this when reading.

also, 711guy, and this is just from my perspective--i feel some people devalue their own feelings about being emotionally abused, invalidate what they felt, with the excuse that the pwBPD just "wasn't aware" of what they were doing. ultimately, i don't think whether they were aware or not matters... .  if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck... .     perhaps you will find that you were insecure and that you weren't being disrespected when you felt as if your ex were flirting with other men, this could be true. personally though, i don't give this power to them, i'm able to look at my past r/s with women and r/s after xBPD to see that my senses were not off. it was her and her condition, not me. i do have issues, but it's worth getting to the truth and not taking responsibility for others issues.

so, let me know what you think. i have some other stories too of remaining calm to get to the truth amongst the storm, but this for me takes the cake:

Excerpt
waverider, thanks for the comments they are always insightful. and thanks others for sharing their stories also. there's only one time i can think of where i figured out what my ex was up to during an argument, and i have to say that i don't believe for a second what she was doing was projection or her really thinking she was the victim, she was just being plain evil and manipulative (this is the way i see it, you decide). much of the worst stuff for me happened after we broke up but still lived together. after a couple of weeks breaking up she (of course) started seeing another guy, even though i've told her this hurts and i don't want to hear about it she's going on and on and on while i'm washing dishes telling me how great he is, how she can trust him, he's great, blahblahblah, all lies, which i knew, but still hurtful. i was calm and told her to leave me alone but of course she doesn't stop until i reacted, even a little bit (i never exploded or anything), then she uses my reaction to berate me more.

but here's the clincher, and something i'm proud of myself for--at least 3 or 4 times in the previous year my exBPDgf would drop into this frantic/terrified mood, bottom lip trembling, body shaking, acting as if she were scared i were going to hurt her, then she'd beg me to leave "just leave! [crying] please, just stop!". and i would. i would never be able to stick up for myself or say my viewpoint b/c i never wanted to cross that line (and i thought she was dealing with some ptsd? issues). but something inside me told me this was fake. she came into my space, showing off about her new b/f and as soon as i speak up about it here comes the trembling and the "just leave... .     pleeease!". first thing i did was calmed completely down. instinctually i didn't want to give her an excuse to be afraid. second thing i did was calmly walk around her so that she was closer to the door than me and could leave if she wanted to (we had a small kitchen). then i calmly said something like "you're not afraid of me, you're faking it, if you're really scared then you can get the hell out of the kitchen. i was washing dishes and i'm not going to leave. if you're really scared, then you get out." she stayed her ass right there and finished making her coffee or whatever and i went back to the dishes. she went from her faux panic attic to being quietly hateful in a split second. see, i knew she didn't want to be told to do anything by me, least of all to leave the kitchen, that was her job to do to me.

it was unbelievable and it still hurts to know that my ex was consciously acting terrified of me, faking ptsd to control me, to stop me from expressing any rebuttal to her abuse. i think about all the times where she used this tactic against me and how i was forced to hold things in, thinking i had to b/c she was afraid. she wasn't afraid she was laughing at me. i'm saying all this for a couple of reasons--yes waverider i think it's an excellent point you make about BPD'er being angry when you take their victim role, but never put it past them that not only are they angry but consciously manipulating you when they are berating. the second reason is that, during this moment of clarity, i realized that if i were able to stay calm and not give her an excuse i could access my own instincts to challenge what i knew to be true about the situation.

i don't so much like the term 'detachment' in this regard as i feel in these situations you should not detach, rather i think it's important to be fully grounded, and present/surefooted/at attention, and most important calm yourself as best you can to parse through what is happening to you.

also i think while it's important to try and understand things from their point of view, at the end of the day you have to judge people by their actions. i know that much of the behavior of my ex had to do a lot with unconscious issues she had (victim/perpetrator/ptsd/etc), but even in the heat of the moment i realized at this point that sometimes people are just being cruel b/c they want to. look at what they are doing, judge that, it's impossible to know what someone else really feels

Logged
Can You Help Us Stay on the Air in 2024?

Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Our 2023 Financial Sponsors
We are all appreciative of the members who provide the funding to keep BPDFamily on the air.
12years
alterK
AskingWhy
At Bay
Cat Familiar
CoherentMoose
drained1996
EZEarache
Flora and Fauna
ForeverDad
Gemsforeyes
Goldcrest
Harri
healthfreedom4s
hope2727
khibomsis
Lemon Squeezy
Memorial Donation (4)
Methos
Methuen
Mommydoc
Mutt
P.F.Change
Penumbra66
Red22
Rev
SamwizeGamgee
Skip
Swimmy55
Tartan Pants
Turkish
whirlpoollife



Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2006-2020, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!