It worked - once :)

[raindancer]

This is a small step, I wanted to share.

I've been working through the lessons on communicating, paying attention to "Before you can make anything better, you must stop making it worse", and it worked - once so far.

Last night could have been a repeat of many, many other nights where my pwBPD storms out amidst threats of all sorts of self-destructive behavior. A conversation that took a bad turn, loaded with triggers and could have ended up anywhere ended up not so bad. It ended up with us sleeping in separate areas - but at least we slept, and in the same house. That would not have happened 3 weeks ago... .  

3 weeks ago it would have been much different... .  

Today, we actually talked about it in a different way, a rational sane way that was much more productive and positive than we've ever talked.

It worked - once

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[zaqsert]

Congrats, Raindancer!  Very glad to hear!   

It's great how well the lessons can work.  Great job applying them!  Just keep in mind that the same approach will not always work in the same way with pwBPD.

Wishing you many, many more of these with good outcomes!

[Chosen]

Great to hear, raindancer 

[charred]

Excellent.

That is one more than anything worked with my pwBPD.

[briefcase]

Great News! And thanks for sharing it.  Not making things worse is a great place to start.  Once you can see the triggers and get a feel for it, you can start adding in some emotional validation and using the other communication techniques.  Good stuff.

[raindancer]

Thank you, it's nice to have support. I'd appreciate comment or direction on the following - if anyone has any insight, it would be helpful.

My pwBPD often plays the "other woman" card - it's been an ongoing theme in this relationship. After knowing him as long as I have, I start to recognise cycles. This week we did take a step forward and things moved forward, then the down cycle began. The start of the down cycle is the "other woman".

I know when this is starting by the music he listens to - songs about the woman he can't have but wishes he could. He has a set playlist, one that he doesn't listen to at any other time. It's very recognisable for me because we've been through this a few times. The songs will start and he'll detach and sink into depression over this imaginary woman.

This cycle usually starts after things between us have been very good for a while, which they have been lately.

Most of the time we weather the storm and it passes. I have to admit, it can be invalidating to me to be compared to a woman that lives in music. He knows that it's one of my triggers - I was cheated on in my marriage before this and he knows this is a soft spot for me. Lately I've been working on my triggers. I have a lot of work to do on that... .  

Sometimes, in the past, the cycle has resulted in very self-destructive behavior on his part - heavy drinking, binge eating and acting out. He's not a violent person and he rarely yells at me (otherwise I'd be gone). Usually he leaves and then I find out later he got in trouble or drank himself into oblivion at family or a friend's place.

We've broken up twice so he could go look for her. Then he comes back saying it's me he wants.

Right now, we live together in what we are calling a "non-relationship" that has all the characteristics of a relationship. Confusing to me, so I don't expect anyone else to get it.

This imaginary woman is unlike me. This "other woman" he describes as needing a hero, needing saving. At times it's as though he wants me to sink into this image. Before we were together he went through periods of life-threatening addiction, alcoholism, suicidal thoughts, and other extremely self-destructive behavior including ending up in jail. He was in a relationship that included the drugs, the cheating, the hero factor and it reduced him to a shell. He says he never wants that again, but when the down cycle starts, that's what he seems to be looking for... .  

I've never used drugs, I drink if/when the mood strikes and I've never had a speeding ticket - things that he clearly identifies as being what he wants/needs in a partner. He openly calls me his "rock", he openly says he clings to me because I have strength he doesn't have.

So I guess the question is how do I deal/cope with having a third person in this when the third person doesn't exist? Part of me wonders if when things get too good, he uses this "other woman" to pull back... .  he has been talking about going to a therapist - he's been talking about the things that happened when he was young. Is it overwhelming him?

Is that a possibility? And how do I help him through it? A lot of questions... .  

Last night I sat through part of the playlist, and then when it started bothering me I went to bed... .  no problem

   

[Grey Kitty]

Hmm... .  suggestions:

Keep up the good work, not being invalidating!

As you get consistent with this, start working on validation as well. It will help a lot.

Now for this fantasy "other woman" thing... .  I don't know that you can actually DO much about it directly... .  but here is something that can help you understand it more:

A pwBPD is trying to find a balance between their fear of abandonment and their fear of engulfment (intimacy). They often deal with them by going way overboard running away from one fear... .  then switching directions and doing the opposite next! Since both these fears live in their own head, you cannot change either one... .  but if you start to understand it a bit better, you can avoid doing things that would unnecessarily trigger one of these fears, and you can sometimes validate the actual feelings.

This topic deals with those fears, especially the fear of intimacy/engulfment

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=79300

So doing something like this after things have been good (intimate) is somewhat typical.

The other thing you can do is accept that he's going to be like this sometimes.

Radical Acceptance for family members

Hope this helps!

GK

[raindancer]

Thank you Grey Kitty

Me not being invalidating ended up in a non-violent extinction burst over the weekend.

I didn't try to stop it, he went out and got very drunk; and suffered a terrible hangover yesterday, which I also didn't sympathise with - I found other things to do and ignored, ignored, ignored.

(maybe it sounds cold of me but I have little sympathy for self-induced misery like hangovers... .  )

In my introduction I gave a description of his family. About the bombardment of texts and his mother encouraging him to date others. In his haze of yesterday, when he did feel like talking again, he told me it's been getting laid on pretty thick this last week. I've stayed away from his family and so did not know this. He says it's gotten worse since he told them he's looking for a therapist and wants to try to work it out with me. Compounded lately by them showing up at his work and sharing their opinions about me with his co-workers... .  The general opinion being that I'm the root of all evil for encouraging him to go to therapy and not be self-destructive and standing by him through all of this... .  

I read the board about about fear of intimacy - yes, it all sounds like part of this. And it gives me a better understanding of that aspect of this... .  

I think the combination of fear of intimacy and the pressure from his family (1,they do not not not want him to go to therapy and 2,they think if he dates someone else he won't go for therapy) is getting overwhelming. It would have to be a hard place to be for him.

There is a definite pattern of behavior here - when I look back over this. The "other woman" appears when things are going well for us combined with him having a lot of contact with his family. Again it brings up a lot of questions about why they are so against him going for therapy... .  The sooner he does start therapy the better it will be for him... .  

I'm expecting a hurricane from his family once he does - it's becoming very apparent that boundaries mean little to them if they are now trying to bring his co-workers into this campaign to prevent him from getting help. Also they sent someone here to confront me yesterday - I came in, sent him out to deal with it and he sent them away.

I don't know if I handled it well. After he came back in and we started talking, I said some hard truths that maybe he needs to hear - his family isn't doing him any favors, I'm not going to keep letting this "other woman" dictate who I should be and if he really wants someone else to go find her and give me the freedom to do the same... .  Accepting the reality of what is... .  or identify the problem and working on a solution... .  I'm not sure. But he needs to know this - I'm a person too.

[Grey Kitty]

  Good job detaching!

Great to hear you weren't enabling his behavior re: drinking/hangover!

Good for you taking care of yourself while he does crappy things!

And great to hear you are still avoiding invalidating stuff with him!

 Sorry to hear about your partner's family is making things worse for you.

Many pwBPD ended up with the disorder as a result from growing up with parents who were abusive and had BPD/NPD/substance abuse problems/other mental disorders. Whatever the details, whether you know them or not... .  they are obviously kinda messed up! There isn't much you can do about that, but it is something to keep in mind.

What does your partner think of his family? Does he see them as helpful, harmful, or switch back and forth?

Either way, your best bet is to just accept that they are who they are, and do the things they do, and he will deal with it however he chooses to.

[raindancer]

I read two very good articles on here today. "How a Mother with BPD Affects Her Children" and "BPD Behaviors: Problematic Parenting"

https://bpdfamily.com/bpdresources/nk_a108.htm

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=65426.0

I read them because I do believe that, as you said Grey Kitty, this is the result of what he experienced growing up in a seriously messed up environment. There were a lot of similarities between what I read in those articles and what my guy is living - and has been living most of his life.

To answer your question - he has wanted to detach from his mother for years, long before I knew him; there is a high level of enabling and co-dependency in this family relationship and when life gets tough my pwBPD has a history of running home.

I tried to be part of his family for a very long time but ended up seriously depressed by the expectations/conditions they put on me/on our relationship. Since I've not been a part of anything with them, I think his mom is feeling very threatened. She no longer feels like she's controlling this and she feels like he's abandoning her by choosing to stay with me. I really do believe she is uBPD.

My pwBPD has said many times that if his dad left his mom, he'd no longer have anything to do with her. He doesn't want her at his work anymore and he decided to block her from sending more messages (I didn't ask him to, he just did). He's shared a lot lately about what went on in their home throughout his life and I'm starting to have a better understanding of the bigger picture.

I do hope he stays strong and continues to do what he needs to do for himself.

My concern is the health and well-being of the ppl in our home - my daughter's, mine and his. I can't fix his mom, I can't fix him. I can only have a better understanding of it all and learn how to relate with him.

[Grey Kitty]

Well, his wanting to be clear of the crazyness in his family (as opposed to wanting to bring it closer to you!) is a good sign!

Keep up the good work, and it will help for you, your daughter and him.