Wow... Weight off my chest? or maybe more added on?

[Beware of Junk Psychology...]

Strap in folks... . probably gonna be a long post.

Most of you know my story, but as a QUICK synopsis on my story:

-dated BPDex for 9 months

--she was cheating throughout, dating multiple people, etc

-we end the first day of may because we are apart for the summer and I find her cheating again

-I decide no more recycling ~May 18th or so

-We are LC (meaning I am trying to stop texting her, I fail here and there) until June 14th

--In that conversation I find out from her that:

---she got a dog with the new guy (one she was cheating with)

---they are looking at moving in with eachother (they have KNOWN eachother less than 2 months)

---"I would she shocked if this doesnt end well. He and I balance eachother out really really well"

---10 days prior to this convo, i had a text from her saying "I love you and want you back"

-NC except for one email she sent ~June 25th containing a picture that was an inside joke


I have been very depressed for the past 2 months... . Both dealing with the loss of her (which I initiated, but meaning the knowledge that the relationship was really over) and dealing with the pain and hurt of all that happened in that relationship. I had been painting her black myself, only focusing on the bad and the hurtful things for the past month or so. This came to a head two days ago when I found an email from her (See my thread "Today was a Hard Day".

I have not been keeping tabs on her at all, not checking her facebook or checking up on her any other way.  The most I knew I found out 2 days ago from a mutual friend who had her on FB still and said "yeah she is still working at the bar and seems to have made a lot of friends there".

I have had a lot of anxiety concerning her... . about "oh are things better with the new guy?" and "what am I going to do when I see them out around town next year?" and "will she show up at my Fraternity house?".  Most all of my free time is spent thinking about her and those things.  When there are not specific thoughts like those listed above, she is just "there".

Through all of it though, I was set (and still am) that I DID NOT want her back or that relationship back.

A major point that I have not found myself able to give on in the healing process is not blaming her... . Holding her accountable, yes, but not blaming her.  She didn't chose to have BPD.  I guess the defining line for me is if someone gets genuine pleasure out of or otherwise enjoys hurting people.  I firmly believe and know that she does not, its just a product of how she knows how to live.


So, to the ACTUAL content of this post then  


I have been going out and partying on the weekends the past two months as I have been dealing with all of this, and really have not had a problem.  I was wary that when drunk would be when I would think of her the most, and I just really did not find this to be the case at all.  If anything, she was gone from my mind, which was nice.

Last night, it didn't work.  I got pretty drunk, and she was all I could think about.  Well not really missing her, but just that feeling of being close like we were.  Feeling free to be who I was around someone, have someone love me for me, not the face I showed people.

I did well for awhile, and handed my phone to a friend. Later on that night, after a lot of deliberation (I literally sat there for 2 minutes looking at the send button, trying to map out consequences in my head), I sent her a short text saying "I hope you are well" and got back "I thought of you today".

I never could have imagined what I would get back in the conversation that followed.  In no particular order:

-She is leaving.  Moving towns.  Because "everything here reminds me of you"

-Additionally, she has been diagnosed with some issue involving ovarian cancer and is going to seek treatment in another town

-She DID get the surgery for her knee, which was something she had put off many times and that I was concerned about.  She has been running a lot which was always her release, is down to 115 lbs (more her normal weight) and is still eating regularly and healthily (which was an issue in the past).

-She and the new guy split 2 weeks ago.  He supposedly proposed, she told him no, and then a little while after she caught him in bed with another woman.

-Her "best friend" who I was constantly telling her was a bad influence and used her, who also came inbetween our relationship, broke into her house while she was gone and stole 8 Grand in tip money, admitted it, and told her "you deserve it because you are a bad friend" and blocked her number.

-She has started neurofeedback therapy once more because she "wants to fix this, and move on with my life and be happy".

-She was in the process as we spoke of moving all of her things out because she had given her 30 days notice and her landlord( a 19 yr old girl who also seems a little nuts) pulled some BS and wanted her out that night (who knows the real story).

-According to her, she never slept with the new guy (it was a LDR) and hasn't slept with anyone since me.  She said it felt really good and that she was proud of it.


I had about an hour long conversation on the phone with her (I found out the stuff above in the phone call and via text).  It was a very easy, casual conversation.  I was surprised how natural it sounded to hear her voice.  I was still drunk, but less so, and it was about 3AM... . I was strangely calm.  I spoke very frankly and very candidly about things.  I made it clear that I was not pointing fingers or assessing blame, just speaking the facts as I saw them, and at no point did she flare up indignantly or in self defense.

I told her all of the fears I had been having concerning her (the new guy, seeing them, etc.).  I told her my greatest fear was seeing her ride off into the sunset with him, which would mean that it was ME who was the problem, and not her or the BPD.  She straight up told me "Octoberfest, you are a smart guy. You know the truth about that". On the same note, I told her how when I asked when I found out about the most recent cheating incident how she could still be doing that stuff, she told me that she was just "too far gone" in the relationship and had been most of the  time we were together (due to some issues of mine and how I treated her for the first 2.5 months), but that she just didnt want it to be over.  I had believed her and felt tremendous sorrow for my actions (which were a result of me being scared to show someone the "real" me, to take the fratty face off) until I remembered that she had started dating ME as cheating on her boyfriend in her old town ( I didnt find this out until the very end).  I told her that it gave me comfort because it proved it DIDNT START with me, and she agreed.

I told her the biggest thing that got to me was the injustice of it all.  Not of specific instances between her and I but that she has BPD and has to deal with it.  I told her about the email I found two days prior, and how it reminded me of the part of her that I loved.  I reminisced with her about how good it was when it was just her and I behind a closed door.  How we were so free with each other, could love each other.  She agreed, and said "it was real".  I also established that as soon as that door opened, and the rest of the world was there to deal with, she didn't have the capacity.  I told her it wasn't a snub, and she agreed that she just wasn't able to balance everything.

It was odd to have such a candid conversation with her... . It was almost like we were talking about a third person.  I told her how frustrating it was to be able to see the real her (meaning the kind loving her, the one I fell in love with), and have her be able to understand things and see everything so clearly at times like she did in the email, for her to be so self aware of the BPD, and then at other times with a snap of the fingers be totally overtaken by it.

I shared a little about my work in therapy, on myself.  About how right she was when she told me I had a "fratty face" (a term she coined for the cool guy face I put on at parties and around other people, in contrast to how I was with her behind a closed door) and that I was working to close that gap.  I told her how much I loved the person I was with her, how I could let go of all restraint and be the cute playful person that I was with her that rough housed and cuddled and whatever else that we did.

Not really important, but I told her that I had been back in the gym much more regularly and that I had been running a lot more and ran just shy of 6 miles a day earlier, which is great for me considering I started running 2 months ago.  I am in the best shape of my life and she was pleased to hear it.

I told her, very emotionally, that while I had said in the past I wanted her to find happiness, above that, I want NOTHING more for her than to be able to find peace.  With herself.  That I was rooting for her to make it.  That I was very proud of her for trying to confront her issues and that she had a big step up in the game because she was diagnosed and aware of her problems.  She was very appreciative.

There was really no talk of reconcile or recycle. She is going to Ireland for 6 weeks and then moving towns (to about 2-3 hours away from my college town) after that.  She will be taking a semester off of school to do her treatment.

She told me to keep in touch.  Not to vanish or disappear.



This morning, at the offset of things, I feel like the luckiest guy in the world.  I feel like I was given a great gift... . I am able to put some of the crazy creations of my imagination and fear to rest.  I feel more at peace myself.  I do not have the anxiety or anticipation I have had in the past when I have seen an opportunity for recycle.  I know in my heart that that is not possible or smart, and not a course of action I can take or even want to take.  I guess I just feel at peace about the whole thing.  I will be honest, it is a burden lifted that she is leaving town, albeit temporarily.  I think it is best for all parties involved... . It will give us both time to get our heads right so that we can see each other out and not have it be the end of our worlds.  It gives me enormous satisfaction to know that she is still trying to beat BPD and get better as opposed to just diving head first back into the quagmire she has been in her entire life.  To know she is trying to walk the path to being better gives me enormous peace of heart... . Because my soul aches for and one of my biggest fears is that she won't find peace and happiness in her own life.

I don't know guys.  I think I may have gotten really lucky here in how this turned out.  I saw in another post here just an hour ago someone saying that closure has to come from within us, it has nothing to do with them... . I think they are right to a degree.  I could have been told all these things 3 months ago and I would be right there trying to fix all of her problems. I definitely needed the 2 months we have been apart to detach and process and grieve.  But just the knowledge that she has given me is a great gift.

I wish everyone to find the peace that I have right now, and for the peace I feel now to stay with me.

We can do this.

[Octoberfest]

Strap in folks... . probably gonna be a long post.

Most of you know my story, but as a QUICK synopsis on my story:

-dated BPDex for 9 months

--she was cheating throughout, dating multiple people, etc

-we end the first day of may because we are apart for the summer and I find her cheating again

-I decide no more recycling ~May 18th or so

-We are LC (meaning I am trying to stop texting her, I fail here and there) until June 14th

--In that conversation I find out from her that:

---she got a dog with the new guy (one she was cheating with)

---they are looking at moving in with eachother (they have KNOWN eachother less than 2 months)

---"I would she shocked if this doesnt end well. He and I balance eachother out really really well"

---10 days prior to this convo, i had a text from her saying "I love you and want you back"

-NC except for one email she sent ~June 25th containing a picture that was an inside joke


I have been very depressed for the past 2 months... . Both dealing with the loss of her (which I initiated, but meaning the knowledge that the relationship was really over) and dealing with the pain and hurt of all that happened in that relationship. I had been painting her black myself, only focusing on the bad and the hurtful things for the past month or so. This came to a head two days ago when I found an email from her (See my thread "Today was a Hard Day".

I have not been keeping tabs on her at all, not checking her facebook or checking up on her any other way.  The most I knew I found out 2 days ago from a mutual friend who had her on FB still and said "yeah she is still working at the bar and seems to have made a lot of friends there".

I have had a lot of anxiety concerning her... . about "oh are things better with the new guy?" and "what am I going to do when I see them out around town next year?" and "will she show up at my Fraternity house?".  Most all of my free time is spent thinking about her and those things.  When there are not specific thoughts like those listed above, she is just "there".

Through all of it though, I was set (and still am) that I DID NOT want her back or that relationship back.

A major point that I have not found myself able to give on in the healing process is not blaming her... . Holding her accountable, yes, but not blaming her.  She didn't chose to have BPD.  I guess the defining line for me is if someone gets genuine pleasure out of or otherwise enjoys hurting people.  I firmly believe and know that she does not, its just a product of how she knows how to live.


So, to the ACTUAL content of this post then  


I have been going out and partying on the weekends the past two months as I have been dealing with all of this, and really have not had a problem.  I was wary that when drunk would be when I would think of her the most, and I just really did not find this to be the case at all.  If anything, she was gone from my mind, which was nice.

Last night, it didn't work.  I got pretty drunk, and she was all I could think about.  Well not really missing her, but just that feeling of being close like we were.  Feeling free to be who I was around someone, have someone love me for me, not the face I showed people.

I did well for awhile, and handed my phone to a friend. Later on that night, after a lot of deliberation (I literally sat there for 2 minutes looking at the send button, trying to map out consequences in my head), I sent her a short text saying "I hope you are well" and got back "I thought of you today".

I never could have imagined what I would get back in the conversation that followed.  In no particular order:

-She is leaving.  Moving towns.  Because "everything here reminds me of you"

-Additionally, she has been diagnosed with some issue involving ovarian cancer and is going to seek treatment in another town

-She DID get the surgery for her knee, which was something she had put off many times and that I was concerned about.  She has been running a lot which was always her release, is down to 115 lbs (more her normal weight) and is still eating regularly and healthily (which was an issue in the past).

-She and the new guy split 2 weeks ago.  He supposedly proposed, she told him no, and then a little while after she caught him in bed with another woman.

-Her "best friend" who I was constantly telling her was a bad influence and used her, who also came inbetween our relationship, broke into her house while she was gone and stole 8 Grand in tip money, admitted it, and told her "you deserve it because you are a bad friend" and blocked her number.

-She has started neurofeedback therapy once more because she "wants to fix this, and move on with my life and be happy".

-She was in the process as we spoke of moving all of her things out because she had given her 30 days notice and her landlord( a 19 yr old girl who also seems a little nuts) pulled some BS and wanted her out that night (who knows the real story).

-According to her, she never slept with the new guy (it was a LDR) and hasn't slept with anyone since me.  She said it felt really good and that she was proud of it.


I had about an hour long conversation on the phone with her (I found out the stuff above in the phone call and via text).  It was a very easy, casual conversation.  I was surprised how natural it sounded to hear her voice.  I was still drunk, but less so, and it was about 3AM... . I was strangely calm.  I spoke very frankly and very candidly about things.  I made it clear that I was not pointing fingers or assessing blame, just speaking the facts as I saw them, and at no point did she flare up indignantly or in self defense.

I told her all of the fears I had been having concerning her (the new guy, seeing them, etc.).  I told her my greatest fear was seeing her ride off into the sunset with him, which would mean that it was ME who was the problem, and not her or the BPD.  She straight up told me "Octoberfest, you are a smart guy. You know the truth about that". On the same note, I told her how when I asked when I found out about the most recent cheating incident how she could still be doing that stuff, she told me that she was just "too far gone" in the relationship and had been most of the  time we were together (due to some issues of mine and how I treated her for the first 2.5 months), but that she just didnt want it to be over.  I had believed her and felt tremendous sorrow for my actions (which were a result of me being scared to show someone the "real" me, to take the fratty face off) until I remembered that she had started dating ME as cheating on her boyfriend in her old town ( I didnt find this out until the very end).  I told her that it gave me comfort because it proved it DIDNT START with me, and she agreed.

I told her the biggest thing that got to me was the injustice of it all.  Not of specific instances between her and I but that she has BPD and has to deal with it.  I told her about the email I found two days prior, and how it reminded me of the part of her that I loved.  I reminisced with her about how good it was when it was just her and I behind a closed door.  How we were so free with each other, could love each other.  She agreed, and said "it was real".  I also established that as soon as that door opened, and the rest of the world was there to deal with, she didn't have the capacity.  I told her it wasn't a snub, and she agreed that she just wasn't able to balance everything.

It was odd to have such a candid conversation with her... . It was almost like we were talking about a third person.  I told her how frustrating it was to be able to see the real her (meaning the kind loving her, the one I fell in love with), and have her be able to understand things and see everything so clearly at times like she did in the email, for her to be so self aware of the BPD, and then at other times with a snap of the fingers be totally overtaken by it.

I shared a little about my work in therapy, on myself.  About how right she was when she told me I had a "fratty face" (a term she coined for the cool guy face I put on at parties and around other people, in contrast to how I was with her behind a closed door) and that I was working to close that gap.  I told her how much I loved the person I was with her, how I could let go of all restraint and be the cute playful person that I was with her that rough housed and cuddled and whatever else that we did.

Not really important, but I told her that I had been back in the gym much more regularly and that I had been running a lot more and ran just shy of 6 miles a day earlier, which is great for me considering I started running 2 months ago.  I am in the best shape of my life and she was pleased to hear it.

I told her, very emotionally, that while I had said in the past I wanted her to find happiness, above that, I want NOTHING more for her than to be able to find peace.  With herself.  That I was rooting for her to make it.  That I was very proud of her for trying to confront her issues and that she had a big step up in the game because she was diagnosed and aware of her problems.  She was very appreciative.

There was really no talk of reconcile or recycle. She is going to Ireland for 6 weeks and then moving towns (to about 2-3 hours away from my college town) after that.  She will be taking a semester off of school to do her treatment.

She told me to keep in touch.  Not to vanish or disappear.



This morning, at the offset of things, I feel like the luckiest guy in the world.  I feel like I was given a great gift... . I am able to put some of the crazy creations of my imagination and fear to rest.  I feel more at peace myself.  I do not have the anxiety or anticipation I have had in the past when I have seen an opportunity for recycle.  I know in my heart that that is not possible or smart, and not a course of action I can take or even want to take.  I guess I just feel at peace about the whole thing.  I will be honest, it is a burden lifted that she is leaving town, albeit temporarily.  I think it is best for all parties involved... . It will give us both time to get our heads right so that we can see each other out and not have it be the end of our worlds.  It gives me enormous satisfaction to know that she is still trying to beat BPD and get better as opposed to just diving head first back into the quagmire she has been in her entire life.  To know she is trying to walk the path to being better gives me enormous peace of heart... . Because my soul aches for and one of my biggest fears is that she won't find peace and happiness in her own life.

I don't know guys.  I think I may have gotten really lucky here in how this turned out.  I saw in another post here just an hour ago someone saying that closure has to come from within us, it has nothing to do with them... . I think they are right to a degree.  I could have been told all these things 3 months ago and I would be right there trying to fix all of her problems. I definitely needed the 2 months we have been apart to detach and process and grieve.  But just the knowledge that she has given me is a great gift.

I wish everyone to find the peace that I have right now, and for the peace I feel now to stay with me.

We can do this.

[schwing]

Hi Octoberfest,

Here is my feedback... . for whatever it is worth... .

A major point that I have not found myself able to give on in the healing process is not blaming her... . Holding her accountable, yes, but not blaming her.  She didn't chose to have BPD.  I guess the defining line for me is if someone gets genuine pleasure out of or otherwise enjoys hurting people.  I firmly believe and know that she does not, its just a product of how she knows how to live.

You don't have to blame her for having BPD.  It is perfectly reasonable for you to be angry at her for any hurt she has caused you because of her actions, regardless of whether or not her BPD had anything to do with it.  It would be unreasonable for you to deny yourself the right to feel such anger, and it is unwise as it is part of our healing process, so long as we work past it towards acceptance.

... . Feeling free to be who I was around someone, have someone love me for me, not the face I showed people.

As an aside, why not simply be you for you and not just the face that you show people?  If your friends are more comfortable with your show, it wouldn't hurt to make more friends, friends who can interact with you for you.

I did well for awhile, and handed my phone to a friend. Later on that night, after a lot of deliberation (I literally sat there for 2 minutes looking at the send button, trying to map out consequences in my head), I sent her a short text saying "I hope you are well" and got back "I thought of you today".

You caught her during a period when she is in all likelihood devaluing her current attachment. 

-She is leaving.  Moving towns.  Because "everything here reminds me of you"

She is leaving, moving towns so that it will be easier for her to be someone else.

-She and the new guy split 2 weeks ago.  He supposedly proposed, she told him no, and then a little while after she caught him in bed with another woman.

Somehow, I question whether this is how it happened.

-Her "best friend" who I was constantly telling her was a bad influence and used her, who also came inbetween our relationship, broke into her house while she was gone and stole 8 Grand in tip money, admitted it, and told her "you deserve it because you are a bad friend" and blocked her number.

Again, I wonder if this is actually what happened.  But so far there is a consistent theme of: look at all the bad things that have happened to me.  Why don't you rescue me?

-She has started neurofeedback therapy once more because she "wants to fix this, and move on with my life and be happy".

-She was in the process as we spoke of moving all of her things out because she had given her 30 days notice and her landlord( a 19 yr old girl who also seems a little nuts) pulled some BS and wanted her out that night (who knows the real story).

Again, who knows the real story?

-According to her, she never slept with the new guy (it was a LDR) and hasn't slept with anyone since me.  She said it felt really good and that she was proud of it.

Does this sound like the same girl who was "cheating throughout" her relationship with you? 

I had about an hour long conversation on the phone with her (I found out the stuff above in the phone call and via text).  It was a very easy, casual conversation.  I was surprised how natural it sounded to hear her voice.  I was still drunk, but less so, and it was about 3AM... . I was strangely calm.  I spoke very frankly and very candidly about things.  I made it clear that I was not pointing fingers or assessing blame, just speaking the facts as I saw them, and at no point did she flare up indignantly or in self defense.

Again, I think you caught her during a moment when she is seriously considering to idealize you.  Of course I could be dead wrong.  But how she may interact with you in the near future will be the proof in the pudding.

I told her all of the fears I had been having concerning her (the new guy, seeing them, etc.).  I told her my greatest fear was seeing her ride off into the sunset with him, which would mean that it was ME who was the problem, and not her or the BPD.  She straight up told me "Octoberfest, you are a smart guy. You know the truth about that".

"You know the truth about that."  What does that mean?  Does that mean you should know better that there is no way she will be able to "ride off into the sunset" with anyone?  Or that you have always been the guy for her?   Or that the truth is, she will always end up looking for someone else because she can't ride off "into the sunset" with anyone for very long?

On the same note, I told her how when I asked when I found out about the most recent cheating incident how she could still be doing that stuff, she told me that she was just "too far gone" in the relationship and had been most of the  time we were together (due to some issues of mine and how I treated her for the first 2.5 months), but that she just didnt want it to be over. 

How do her actions in any way square with "that she just didn't want it to be over"?  How does hooking up with other people, moving in with each other, getting pets together, in any way, communicate "I [still] love you and want you back"?  Or that she just didn't want it to be over?

I had believed her and felt tremendous sorrow for my actions (which were a result of me being scared to show someone the "real" me, to take the fratty face off) until I remembered that she had started dating ME as cheating on her boyfriend in her old town ( I didnt find this out until the very end).  I told her that it gave me comfort because it proved it DIDNT START with me, and she agreed.

How do her actions (of cheating on you), in any way, reflect upon you?  How is it somehow your "fault" what she does or does not do with herself?

I told her the biggest thing that got to me was the injustice of it all.  Not of specific instances between her and I but that she has BPD and has to deal with it.  I told her about the email I found two days prior, and how it reminded me of the part of her that I loved.  I reminisced with her about how good it was when it was just her and I behind a closed door.  How we were so free with each other, could love each other.  She agreed, and said "it was real". I also established that as soon as that door opened, and the rest of the world was there to deal with, she didn't have the capacity.  I told her it wasn't a snub, and she agreed that she just wasn't able to balance everything.

When it was just you and her behind closed doors, you got to be you, but she got to be whomever she needed to be in order to be with you.  How is it that the way she behaved when she was just with you, is considered "real", but the way she behaves with everyone else around demonstrates that she doesn't have the capacity?   She doesn't have the capacity for what?  To be "real?"

Are you sure you are talking about her and not about yourself, as mirrored by her?

It was odd to have such a candid conversation with her... . It was almost like we were talking about a third person.  

You were talking about a third person.  The person she is/was when she is with you.  When she is not with you, she is literally another person.

I told her how frustrating it was to be able to see the real her (meaning the kind loving her, the one I fell in love with), and have her be able to understand things and see everything so clearly at times like she did in the email, for her to be so self aware of the BPD, and then at other times with a snap of the fingers be totally overtaken by it.

I shared a little about my work in therapy, on myself.  About how right she was when she told me I had a "fratty face" (a term she coined for the cool guy face I put on at parties and around other people, in contrast to how I was with her behind a closed door) and that I was working to close that gap.  I told her how much I loved the person I was with her, how I could let go of all restraint and be the cute playful person that I was with her that rough housed and cuddled and whatever else that we did.

I think it is right for you to love the person you are when you are with her.   You should give yourself the license to be that person all the time, not just when you are with her.  But don't confuse her to be a person that she is not.

I told her, very emotionally, that while I had said in the past I wanted her to find happiness, above that, I want NOTHING more for her than to be able to find peace.  With herself.  That I was rooting for her to make it.  That I was very proud of her for trying to confront her issues and that she had a big step up in the game because she was diagnosed and aware of her problems.  She was very appreciative.

There was really no talk of reconcile or recycle. She is going to Ireland for 6 weeks and then moving towns (to about 2-3 hours away from my college town) after that.  She will be taking a semester off of school to do her treatment.

She told me to keep in touch.  Not to vanish or disappear.

I do hope she is able to make progress in her recovery.  But I want you to prepare yourself in case the next time you interact with her, her behavior is very different from what you might expect.  Or in case she is the one who vanishes or disappears.

This morning, at the offset of things, I feel like the luckiest guy in the world.  I feel like I was given a great gift... . I am able to put some of the crazy creations of my imagination and fear to rest.  I feel more at peace myself.  I do not have the anxiety or anticipation I have had in the past when I have seen an opportunity for recycle.  I know in my heart that that is not possible or smart, and not a course of action I can take or even want to take.  I guess I just feel at peace about the whole thing.  I will be honest, it is a burden lifted that she is leaving town, albeit temporarily.  I think it is best for all parties involved... . It will give us both time to get our heads right so that we can see each other out and not have it be the end of our worlds.  It gives me enormous satisfaction to know that she is still trying to beat BPD and get better as opposed to just diving head first back into the quagmire she has been in her entire life.  To know she is trying to walk the path to being better gives me enormous peace of heart... . Because my soul aches for and one of my biggest fears is that she won't find peace and happiness in her own life.

It is a gift, to be able to communicate with her (perhaps one last time?) and be heard and empathized with.

Maybe she is committed to working through her difficulties and issues.  But as far as I'm concerned, you still have to work through your own grief process.  This interaction with her, I fear (and maybe I'm completely wrong about this), has deferred your acceptance that this relationship is over.  That now you are entertaining the possibility that you two can transition into a more mature, meaningful friendship.  And this possibility is incompatible so long as she is truly dealing with BPD.

I don't know guys.  I think I may have gotten really lucky here in how this turned out.  I saw in another post here just an hour ago someone saying that closure has to come from within us, it has nothing to do with them... . I think they are right to a degree.  I could have been told all these things 3 months ago and I would be right there trying to fix all of her problems. I definitely needed the 2 months we have been apart to detach and process and grieve.  But just the knowledge that she has given me is a great gift.

I wish everyone to find the peace that I have right now, and for the peace I feel now to stay with me.

We can do this.

I'm glad you feel lucky.  You got to interact with your BPD loved one in a really rare moment, and I'm glad that means a lot to you.  I hope your feelings of peaces stays with you, but remind you that if it doesn't, just continue with your grief-work, and continuing taking care of yourself regardless of what she is, or is not doing with herself.

Best wishes, Schwing

[Octoberfest]

yes, I have myself questioned the truth in some of the things she has told me... . and you are right to say "be careful what you believe here"... . But I think it is ok for me to take what she says here at face value.  Because it isn't going to affect the decision on getting back together with her.  All of this information just serves to put my mind at ease a little bit.  Maybe it isn't the real truth.  Maybe she cheated on HIM and he found out and broke it off.  Who knows.  The main thing is that I am taking this information for ME, not for US.  I am not arguing that "she is magically cured of BPD and all better".  I know that I could ABSOLUTELY, an hour, a day, a week, a month down the road suddenly find that the switch has taken place again and all of these incredibly rational thoughts she has had are gone... .   What is important for me I guess is that the last thing I have now of her and my knowledge of her is good stuff, the things I secretly wanted to hear.  And for my sake, I am going to believe what she has told me, that she is working on getting better, she is taking steps to move forward in life more healthily than when she was with me.  I am going to believe in order to put to rest my own insecurities and worries concerning her and our past relationship.

I hope with all of my being that what she told me is true.  I recognize it may not be.  But I want nothing more for her than to be able to move past all of this stuff and be happy and at peace.

[Octoberfest]

Aaaaaaand the hammer has dropped.


I am right back in the throes of depression which I had been steadily escaping for the past month and a half.

My heart just breaks all over for this girl.  That on top of all of her other issues she has to deal with cancer now... . when is she going to catch a break? I know that with a lot of the hurt in her life it has been in part due to decisions she has made (usually BPD fueled).  Not to say its her fault she has been abused, abandoned, etc, but she made a choice in being with these partners.  Cancer?... .

There is also some scary finality in her moving towns.  We have been in separate towns all summer, but I guess that didn't seem so weird because I was back in my hometown while she was still in our college town.  It's odd to think that "real life" (school) is going to start back up and she won't be there (dating me or not).

Why am I hurting so badly for someone elses problems?  They literally do not affect me at all, yet I am miserable and crying over them.

I just keep asking why things have to be the way they are.  Why BPD, why her family, why her past, why the cancer, why the cheating, etc, on and on and on... .


sigh.

[schwing]

My heart just breaks all over for this girl. 

Your heart is broken.  Respect that, and try to limit how much vulnerability you expose yourself to.

That on top of all of her other issues she has to deal with cancer now... . when is she going to catch a break? I know that with a lot of the hurt in her life it has been in part due to decisions she has made (usually BPD fueled).  Not to say its her fault she has been abused, abandoned, etc, but she made a choice in being with these partners.  Cancer?... .

Do not underestimate her ability to take care of herself and to get the help that she needs from others.

Why am I hurting so badly for someone elses problems?  They literally do not affect me at all, yet I am miserable and crying over them.

Maybe you are not hurting because of her problems.  You are hurting for your own reasons, reasons that you are in denial over?  Reasons that you don't respect, such as your broken heart?  She hurt you.  And you continue to seek her out for a more pain?

I just keep asking why things have to be the way they are.  Why BPD, why her family, why her past, why the cancer, why the cheating, etc, on and on and on... .

It is fine to ask.  This is bargaining.  Just don't let your bargaining get in the way of doing what you need to do to take care of yourself.  Don't let your bargaining lead you to more pain, causing you only more grief.

[Octoberfest]

My heart just breaks all over for this girl. 

Your heart is broken.  Respect that, and try to limit how much vulnerability you expose yourself to.

That on top of all of her other issues she has to deal with cancer now... . when is she going to catch a break? I know that with a lot of the hurt in her life it has been in part due to decisions she has made (usually BPD fueled).  Not to say its her fault she has been abused, abandoned, etc, but she made a choice in being with these partners.  Cancer?... .

Do not underestimate her ability to take care of herself and to get the help that she needs from others.

Why am I hurting so badly for someone elses problems?  They literally do not affect me at all, yet I am miserable and crying over them.

Maybe you are not hurting because of her problems.  You are hurting for your own reasons, reasons that you are in denial over?  Reasons that you don't respect, such as your broken heart?  She hurt you.  And you continue to seek her out for a more pain?

I just keep asking why things have to be the way they are.  Why BPD, why her family, why her past, why the cancer, why the cheating, etc, on and on and on... .

It is fine to ask.  This is bargaining.  Just don't let your bargaining get in the way of doing what you need to do to take care of yourself.  Don't let your bargaining lead you to more pain, causing you only more grief.

Just in the past few hours, I have seen that you are right... . I am having a grieving night.  Locked door and lots of crying  .  You are right, I am grieving for my broken heart... . that for how much I loved her and cared it didn't work out.  And that there is no "next time", no way to take back the past, to make it all alright... . It feels like the loss of a loved one, like she has died.

[recoil]

Just in case you haven't thought about this (and you probably have) but she may be distorting the truth about having cancer.

[Peabody]

Octoberfest,

Take care of yourself first man, how can you continue to put this girls emotions and feelings in front of your own? I know you care but these are her issues and problems and are issues she needs to directly sort out herself. You are not in her life currently and have had a tough past that has left you mentally in the mud. Like I said in my messages and Schwing is saying: do not put yourself out there too much and make sure to put yourself first because that is what matters. I know she has told you she has some tough issues going on but to me it is a little fishy she is talking about the negative instead of the positive (my life is going great, got these great things going on.) I find it typical with all the BPD stories i've read so far that they will guilt trip you to hell and back and use these as hooks whether they are genuine or not so this is why I say keep your guard up. Just know that you cannot solve her problems, you got your own problems to solve so take care of those first.

I know you have a good heart and want to help her, exactly like I wanted to with my exwBPD, but in reality its help that they CHOOSE to get themselves. She is a grown woman and can handle the issues herself. Start taking the steps into getting your life back together man, she will find happiness within you doing that and you will be happy by choosing to do so. Learn to love her without the attachment and you will live in bliss my friend.

[clairedair]

g12281994#msg12281994 date=1373764520]Just in the past few hours, I have seen that you are right... . I am having a grieving night.  Locked door and lots of crying  .  You are right, I am grieving for my broken heart... . that for how much I loved her and cared it didn't work out.  And that there is no "next time", no way to take back the past, to make it all alright... . It feels like the loss of a loved one, like she has died.

Octoberfest,

Sorry to hear that you are feeling broken-hearted. Tough when it immediately follows a spell of feeling positive/feeling that you had peace. 

You sound healthier than me.  You are clear that you will not reconcile.  I reconciled with my exH several times and when I read your post, it reminded me of the way a lot of these recycles would start - with an 'out of the blue' conversation or even just a few text messages that had me thinking that he had some clarity about his behaviours and their effect.  His vulnerability would encourage me to be vulnerable and tell him how I had been feeling - I would spill everything just enjoying the honesty and trust between us at that time.  I'd jump from the natural process of grieving the 'death' of our marriage right back into the relationship. Did this for years and it has not ended well.

I knew after our last break-up that I would not reconcile but it doesn't mean that our hearts don't break.  I keep telling myself that the only way for me to have a long-lasting sense of peace is to try to work through my grief properly this time.

Do not underestimate her ability to take care of herself and to get the help that she needs from others.

Schwing makes a good point.  I still worry at times for exH; still cry when I think of the pain he is in at times.  However, when I think more widely about this, I realise that he has always had someone to look after him (he doesn't always want them around, but there is always a woman wanting to take care of him).  He has friends who are always willing to help him out and family. 

Continue to look after yourself as much as possible so that you are ready for your studies again.

[Lao Tzu]

Dear Octoberfest and all,

     I just want to underline recoil's comment,  This cancer stuff is more garbage meant to manipulate you.  I don't want to betray my background here, but is she has Ovarian cancer at her age I will eat my keyboard.  I would bet my bottom dollar that she has been found to be HPV (Human Papilloma Virus) positive on screening and has been told there is a relationship between that and Ovarian Ca.  There is, but HPV infection is actually (sorry) just a sign of having multiple sexual partners, and all the bugs one gets from that lifestle is what actually correlates over time with the cancer. 

     As far as my much less officially expert status on BPD behavior (only 30 years of experience), this quite successful effort at recycling you (especially since she has prevented you from even seeing it as such) would suggest to me that  ***SURPRISE*** she isn't going to leave after all. Telling you this baloney just got you to put your guard down, son.  Pretty effective, as usual.

LT

[pari]

Octoberfest,

I still very strongly for my ex. I have so many questions I seek answers for. But I don't know if I will ever get answers from him, or a closure that I am looking for. He will point out some more negativity in me, make me feel more guilty. And it's a loop that's never gonna end.

We can't understand their psyche. They can't think straight. I am still struggling, but I know I will find peace when I stop looking for answers and accept the reality/facts. Hope you find peace too.

[Octoberfest]

It's official, whereas I thought contacting her and finding out that info would make me feel all sorts of better, it only dragged me right back down into the depression I fought so hard to get out of.  We talked for a few days following the exchange in the OP but we are back to not talking. Evidently, she hoped we could be friends, but she doesn't need such a negative person in her life... . I called her out on a lot of the stuff she told me and basically reminded her of all of the wrong she did in our relationship.

No contact is going to be the save all end all here I think.  There is no getting around it.  I can only hope that she actually does go on her 6 week trip to Ireland and then move towns afterwards.

I am going to our college town this thursday night and friday for the weekly downtown music show.  They shut down the main street and its a street festival type thing.  She works at a bar right on that drag and I am hoping I won't see her... . I just really want to have a good weekend with the guys.

I think the part of me that actually considered being friends with her was the part that is still trying so desperately to hold on to her... . I was thinking though, I cut loose my best friend and another really close one this past year because one slept with her and the other made out with her.  They didn't show the loyalty, honor, honesty, or integrity that I value so much in my life, so I got rid of them.  She doesn't have any of those things.  So why would I have her as a friend?  An important question.

I am finally starting to see what a branch I was out on being with her... . she is a party girl, never in one place for too long.  That IS NOT what I want.  I want someone who can return the love and respect that I give them.  It is hard however having seen the potential in her to be that person but seeing it lost in her destructive patterns and actions.