Will I always be painted black?

[gallerykey]

My ex BPD had gone away to his mums/friends to sort him self out and see a hypnotherapist for his pathological lying. He was in therapy and on meds but wasnt really engaging with support worker. He had gone off to his mums many times before to calm down so this was no different, i thought.

While he was gone we were talking and messaging as normal, was getting the usual messages of miss u, love u etc... . i thought we were good and sorting through things. he was planning on coming back so we could be together again. Then i found out he had lied to me again and was very angry with him. I then found out he had ben on dating website and met a new girlfriend without telling me it was over. I found her on fb and warned her. Luckily she listened to me,questioned him and saw for herself the liar and cheat he was. Obviously i got the backlash and to be honest would do it again as i helped one person. It has been nc for 8 days now and im surprised how strong ive been. For him, he couldnt care less what hes done or how i feel and i know thats normal in these cases. As hes the one who left and im the bad one i have read he wont try to make contact. This im not sure i like or not, one part of me doesnt want anything to do with him but the other part cant get my head around the fact i will never hear or see from him again. Will i always be painted black and be held bad in his eyes or in time will i be white? Dont know why it bothers me but dont like the thought of him hating me when it would be easier for me to think if nothing else im not hated for always doing my best and some. Think in this case i wont need to worry about him ever trying to recycle, sad and happy thought there too. Not a good day with thoughts and emotions today. Just the thought of him being with yet another new girlfriend all happy and loving and im suffering

[Scout99]

Will i always be painted black and be held bad in his eyes or in time will i be white? Dont know why it bothers me but dont like the thought of him hating me when it would be easier for me to think if nothing else im not hated for always doing my best and some. Think in this case i wont need to worry about him ever trying to recycle, sad and happy thought there too. Not a good day with thoughts and emotions today. Just the thought of him being with yet another new girlfriend all happy and loving and im suffering

Hi imj72!

I am so sorry that you are going through such a hard time right now.  

Being betrayed by a loved one is always painful, and to also experience the seemingly lack of guilt and empathy from the one who has hurt you doesn't help. This is I think one of the things most of us have the hardest time with trying to wrap ourselves around it... . There is simply no logic to it. And also it is just not fair, to you or anybody finding themselves where you are now... . But as you already know, you are not alone in your experience. So many people who have been in r/s's with pw BPD go through the same thing, many of them over and over again... .

But when we learn and understand more and more about the disorder, we can see that things are not quite what they seem... . The lack of empathy usually doesn't run very deep, but instead is a defense mechanism for them to cope with the immense pain, shame and guilt that these people harbor in the inside all the time... . They feel hurt themselves all the time. And therefore cannot cope with the facts that they also cause pain and suffering in others. So they lie to themselves and project their blame for themselves and their actions onto the people they have around them... .

However under the surface they do understand that they cause pain... . In an way, at least this is my experience, they know that they do it. But they don't know how they can do it... . And they don't want to be this person who does these things... . But since they lack self control they still do it... . And their price for that is shame and guilt and a warped belief that they get abandoned because of it... . It is like a devilish dance... . And they just can't make it stop... . And neither can we... .

I know from my ex BPD bf that he often talked about his ex with a lot of fondness and also still a year after they split, at times felt a lot of pain for loosing her, and he was showing remorse too at times for the things he had done to her. However I never think he has ever said that to her... . Frankly I don't think he could... . Going there emotionally is just too painful to him. So my guess is her perception is much like yours, that he just painted her black... .

The instability in their selves and their constant struggle with their changing moods does however also reflect on these things... . It was only at times, when he felt depressed that he could reflect in this fashion about his past. At other times he just blamed their ending on "made up" circumstances that showed no implication of wrongdoing on his part... .

And that is the sad truth about what it is like to go through life with such a severe personality disorder... . They just can't sustain their feelings, whether it being remorse or painting someone black... . And since most people with this disorder don't receive the proper help they so desperately need, most of them go through their lives making the same choices over and over and over again... .

I know this may not be of much comfort to you at the moment when you are still in a lot of pain. But the only good thing in all this is that you will be able to find balance and happiness again. And unlike your ex bf, you do have what it takes in you to sustain it too... .

Best Wishes

Scout99

[Gaslit]

imj72 - It is worth noting that you are wondering if you will always be painted black, almost saying, "will he ever forgive YOU."

All the while, it was him (proactively seeking and) carrying out with a new relationship behind your back. He is at fault. Clearly.

I just point this out so that in the fog, this is not lost on you. He did bad, and you are wondering if he will forgive you.

That deserves a huh? Don't you think?

Unfortunately, we all have been in a similar place. Kind of messed up how we allow them to 180 our brains like this. Definitely not your run of the mill deal.

Save a little thinking time for yourself. He undid your relationship.

Regarding your initial question. Sure, tell him you are super okay with everything, that he was not wrong, and that you were wrong to tell his new girlfriend about you. Lay it on thick. He likely will paint you white.

How does that sit with you? Deep down, does it tear you up? It would me. Also, he will do this again.

[Clearmind]

It’s very natural to miss them and lament about a lost relationship. Right at about 8 days NC I wanted contact from my ex – met up – then wish I hadn’t. Now I don’t care whether I see him or not.

imj72, my fear of forever being black was because I felt I would never have the opportunity to tell him how much he hurt me, how he through away the best thing that ever happened to him and that he will be forever miserable for his decision. I never got that opportunity and now I simply don’t care.

When we work on detaching and seeing the facts of the relationship, we gain back self worth. With self worth comes the actualization that this person was not good for me. You are not there yet – grieve, cry, be angry – these are all valid emotions.

Be kind to you.

[Siamese Rescue]

I'm glad others have pointed out the way that they do wrong and then their partner worries about being in trouble for calling them out for it. I've been there myself over many years.

These people are masterful at turning the tables and putting the blame on the other person. It's almost an art form to them. I'm not sure what it is in our personalities that cause us to accept the fault for doing the right thing. It's almost as if the borderline installs a guaranteed wall that no matter what they throw at it, it bounces off and hits us! Then it's our fault that the wall has a mark on it, when they were the ones who threw the ball to begin with.

As far as whether you'll be painted black for a long period of time, perhaps forever, is obviously not something you should be concerned with but I feel your need to feel acceptance from him once again. It's a tragic side effect of being involved with them. Most everyone will say he should worry you're done with him, not the reverse! Yet our hearts are so addicted to them, so tied up in them, it's almost impossible.

I've lived this and I'm still marginally living it. Each borderline seems to be a little different. Some seem to recycle while others do not. Yet the one thing I've learned the painful way is not to beg or plead or anxiously wait for forgiveness. My borderline ex feasts on his partner graveling and begging. It empowers him to be even more mean and nasty.

The more independent you are and the stronger you are the more likely he'll notice that. It puzzles them, intrigues them. At least mine is a bit nervous when I don't crawl and try to make amends. Frankly the best thing you can do, and it's usually the most difficult, is to detach. It's an eye opener to the borderline who has grown accustomed to having his rear end kissed.

I have 7 years under my belt. Recently there was a three month period of NC. He resurfaced for my late July birthday bearing gushy heavy lovey cards stuffed with cash (3 mos earlier he told me to stay away, he threatened me with a restraining order) and his puppy dog eyes and his fragile feelings asking if it was okay to drop more gifts off on my porch. This was after I finally froze him out for three months.

Well, stupidly, I let him get one leg in the door and guess what? He's the same double talking, secretive, evasive, hot and cold, up and down, mood swinging borderline with nonsensical behavior, womanizing ways, illogical actions that never match his words and empty promises.

This never gets better. They never change. I have zero hope that this man will ever EVER grow up or be consistent or predictable or reliable.

Try with all your power to start a fresh life for yourself away from him. Just the phrase "away from him" usually stirs pain and fear for us, but you can and will survive and the longer you're away the more clearly you will see how incredibly psychotic these people are and how dangerous they are to the mind and emotional well being of a non borderline partner.

I don't believe he will ever be truthful or up front or voluntarily honest. You will be in pain for long years. I know they always seem to get away with everything they can. It's sad. We are always living a life of uncertainty and surprise pain and wondering why he's behaving a certain way, is it over? No? Oh it's not? phew ok, that's what I was worried about!

There's always curiosity and a desire to spy when involved with these people! It's only natural.

Try to live without him. Live your life.

Not his. His is chaotic, crazy and always going in circles.

((Hugs))

[Gaslit]

I have 7 years under my belt. Recently there was a three month period of NC. He resurfaced for my late July birthday bearing gushy heavy lovey cards stuffed with cash (3 mos earlier he told me to stay away, he threatened me with a restraining order) and his puppy dog eyes and his fragile feelings asking if it was okay to drop more gifts off on my porch. This was after I finally froze him out for three months.

Well, stupidly, I let him get one leg in the door and guess what? He's the same double talking, secretive, evasive, hot and cold, up and down, mood swinging borderline with nonsensical behavior, womanizing ways, illogical actions that never match his words and empty promises.

This never gets better. They never change. I have zero hope that this man will ever EVER grow up or be consistent or predictable or reliable.

Exactly.

All of the has happened before, all of this will happen again.

Until we stop it. They never will. They are content in continuing this forever. We can stop it. And hopefully, eventually, we do just that.

[gallerykey]

i dont understand why I need to feel he would try and recycle again. I know itsnot what I want, what I need and wouldnt be good for me but i still have that need to know hes thinking of me. Why do i want what is so wrong? Reading the posts has made me question why i feel i need to be forgiven when ive done nothing but love,care and support him, working on that one.

I cant help but look at his whats app status and he is doing what i have read is classic, putting up "never been so happy" "good to better to great" which at first upset me but now i find myself laughing as i know it isnt real as in the sense of our real. Does he believe he is this happy?

[Lao Tzu]

Dear IMJ,

     Think of this as if it were a heroin addiction.  Those people are, generally, not stupid; they know very well that their relationship with the drug is very, very bad for them, but they really "want what is so wrong".  It's a tremendously powerful compulsion in both cases and most recovering addicts admit that even years after they "quit", they want what is wrong every day.  Give yourself a break about this, as this problem you have is, even physiologically, extremely close to that situation.  Like them, you can beat this down to the point where it becomes a minor part of your life, but it takes some time and generally benefits from counseling if that's possible for you. 

     Remember, you may be a bit of a puppet on a string at this point, but letting go is a process rather than a decision.  It's also a marathon race rather than a sprint.  Give yourself some time and recognize that you can't expect yourself to just hop along your way without any time and effort.  You'll get there and everyone here will help.

LT

[Learning_curve74]

imj72, it's natural to feel the things you feel about your ex. You are still attached and somewhat enmeshed. His feelings and subsequent actions are affecting your feelings and making you want to take actions that may not be in your best interest. Your ex is somebody you loved and felt you needed (and maybe felt he needed you too). That can be hard to turn off, and I'm only saying that because that's what I struggle with too, so I know what you're feeling.

Hang onto yourself and take care of yourself instead of torturing yourself. You felt your ex was happy with you but he was really a crazy person who was lying and cheating. He obviously hasn't changed, so without changing how can he be happy with a different gf? It's like saying he was unhappy yesterday because it was Monday but now it's Tuesday which is a TOTALLY different day so now he's going to be happy. We all know it doesn't work that way. 

[Lucky Jim]

Hi imj72, Whether you are painted black or not is beside the point, in my view.  My uBPDxW continues to rant and rave to anyone who will listen about what a terrible person I am.  So what?  What a pwBPD thinks of you is irrelevant, as hard as that may be to accept.  The bottom line is that those w/BPD have a serious personality disorder and it is pointless for you to seek approval from someone who is emotionally unstable and unable to accept responsibility for his/her actions.

It's hard, I know, but moving on is for the best.  Lucky Jim

[Scout99]

i dont understand why I need to feel he would try and recycle again. I know itsnot what I want, what I need and wouldnt be good for me but i still have that need to know hes thinking of me. Why do i want what is so wrong? Reading the posts has made me question why i feel i need to be forgiven when ive done nothing but love,care and support him, working on that one.

Because you still have feelings for him, and still remember the good times and the man he was to you in the beginning. We all do this... . After all most of us have not encountered a pw a serious mental disorder before, so we like to think it is the same as things usually are with most "normal" people. That is what we see is what we get... . But with a pw borderline you don't just get the initial person you met, (who in part is not even real but a reflexion of who they want to be and also in part what he mirrors back to you from you). That is, what we fall in love with is an image of them that in part is not true, or at least not the whole truth about who they really are... .

You can't really separate the person from their disorder. Not when the disorder affects their personality. It is a part of them. And usually a very dominating part.

And if that would have been what they showed us to begin with, then we would probably not have fallen in love with them as hard as we did... .

When we become enmeshed with them, which also happens to most of us, it becomes hard for us to see things as they are... . We tend to desperately attempt to get things "back in track" that is to where things were and what they looked like in the beginning... . But that is a loosing battle... .

The only way you can have a relationship with a person with a severe personality disorder is if you choose to totally accept them for who they truly are, and choose to learn to live with all the sacrifices that comes with that choice... .

We cannot help them or change them. Only they can do that. And being in a relationship or in love is not going to do that for them... . They need to choose to seek it help and stay the course throughout an often very tough treatment that will take years. And even if they would choose to do so, which most pw borderline won't... . It still will not mean they will become the person we once met... .

Just as fairy tales are enticing and most women hope to live like in one, one day, they still are fairy tales. And we need to live in reality... . But it takes time for the feelings to adjust to the facts our mind is telling us. That too is the same for everybody... . Usually it is only in times like these we get the full picture of how conflicting our thoughts can be to our feelings... . And how we need to take control of our own feelings to get them in line with our mind... . And that is hard work... .

In a way it gives us a glimpse of what it must be like to suffer from borderline disorder where the feelings never stay consistent, and the mind hardly ever has a chance to take control... .

I cant help but look at his whats app status and he is doing what i have read is classic, putting up "never been so happy" "good to better to great" which at first upset me but now i find myself laughing as i know it isnt real as in the sense of our real. Does he believe he is this happy?

This is typical for pw BPD... . They can't stand the fact that they are not feeling good, so they try in every way to flea from that discomfort. And telling themselves and others they are doing great is a way to do so... . It is part of their coping mechanisms... . They see their discomfort and pain as weakness and either punishes themselves for feeling this way, or deny it with everything they got!

I remember times when my ex BPD bf and I would be having a somewhat minorly heated discussion like when he started to dysregulate and as a consequence always took that out on me and threatened to break us up, and I showed him and told him what he said was hurtful to me. It usually made him want to hang up in a rage... . But at the same time he was afraid of conflict so he always sort of wanted things to end on a albeit disordered but good note... .

So he could say things like:

Well I hope you are not going to let this ruin your evening. I for one will not. I have decided that I am going to be happy tonight, and that's that... .

Now that is in a way a very hurtful thing to say to someone you have just ruined the evening for and have said very hurtful things to... . But if I look away from that for the moment and instead look at what that statement was for really... . Then you can see a lot about how this disorder works in him... .

In essence it was a projection. That is, he is not at all feeling any good or happy. He is miserable and already regrets some of the things he had said. But admitting that would to him be like choosing to drink a vile of poison... . So he would never admit that or apologize in any way... . Instead this works twofold... . One to let me know that if this ruins my evening, then that would be my fault, and not his. And two if he tells me he is going to be happy, he can deflect from showing that he indeed is hurt... .

Usually these types of conversations would develop in such a way that I made a stupid an snappy remark about... . Well good for you that you can feel happy about this... . I am hurt... . Which would make him hang up on me... . Then he would text me a couple of angry messages, that I would not respond to, since that breaks my boundary... . And then five minutes later he would text me: call... . Please!

Which to me would be the closest thing to an apology I would get at such times... . And he would be terribly regretful when I called... .

Now what this goes to show is, they are afraid that people will pick up on them being vulnerable. Since that to them is showing weakness. And they don't want to surrender to that fact, because admitting feeling vulnerable also allows for feelings of fear and pain to emerge. And that becomes overwhelming to them... . Therefore the really stepford wife kind of happiness they tend to throw in our face or show to anybody for that matter is a part of their self defense. If they state that they are happy, then people will believe that and then they can deflect the pain a little bit longer... .

It is a false way to self soothe if you will... .

Best Wishes

Scout99

[peas]

I let him get one leg in the door and guess what? He's the same double talking, secretive, evasive, hot and cold, up and down, mood swinging borderline with nonsensical behavior, womanizing ways, illogical actions that never match his words and empty promises.

Siamese Rescue, a couple questions about this:

1) How long did it take the ex to exhibit the old, bad behavior after returning with sweetness for your birthday?

2) How did you react when he started showing that behavior? Did it undo any detachment progress you made? Were you better prepared for it?

[Lucky Jim]

Well said, Scout99!  Very perceptive.  Thanks!  Lucky Jim

[peas]

Scout 99:

Well I hope you are not going to let this ruin your evening. I for one will not. I have decided that I am going to be happy tonight, and that's that... . wink

Now that is in a way a very hurtful thing to say to someone you have just ruined the evening for and have said very hurtful things to... . But if I look away from that for the moment and instead look at what that statement was for really... . Then you can see a lot about how this disorder works in him... .

Yes! When things would get a little to real with my ex BPD bf, like when I let him know if he upset me, his stock reply would be that I had the problem and he was about "peace and love." That would drive me crazy because all I was trying to do was communicate something that maybe required some accountability or acceptance on his part. But his lies and rages and alcohol abuse led him and us to a very unpeaceful and unloving dynamic. 

This guy really believed he was the most tranquil dude around and I was the one bringing the drama.

[gallerykey]

Im just struggling with it all, i dont know how to deal with it,what to do to make it easier for me.

I know hes back at his mums and she really doesnt help him, shes not bothered hes stopped treatment, doesnt encourage him to ring his girls every week like i did (he hasnt rung them in weeks and isnt allowed to see them due to so many suicide threats) its almost like she wants him this way so she feels she can look after him. When i told his new gf all about him and she confronted him i got a text off his mum calling me a b***h, was i trying to push him over the edge? how she knew he had met someone else (so knew he was cheating on me!) Yet his mum when she found out her bf had been cheating contacted every single one of his girlfriends to tell them about her so i dont get how she can allow him to do what he does without her saying anything to him yet this is the kind of guy she spends her entire time moaning about. Is it because she never says anything that he always goes running back home? Is it because she allows him to do what he wants when he wants with who he wants that he has this bond with her? (yet many a time he would call her interfering, nasty, a man eater etc, said he could see she was to partly blame for his disorder) I was the one person who did everything for him emotionally, mentally, physically, financially and yet im THE ONE person who is bad in all this, i just dont get it and its tearing me up inside, i cant stop crying but i know its stupid!

[Siamese Rescue]

I had surgery on 7/24, my birthday was 7/25. I was very incapacitated. He texted one minute after midnight on 7/25. I debated whether to respond at all. Finally at 5:00 pm that day I acknowledged his text with a bland reply thanking him for birthday wishes. (In retrospect I regret this! I wish I hadn't replied at all) He then left gifts in the door, as he was told I was bedridden and temporarily unable to walk due to a back injury.

The card and gifts were heavy with syrup and I texted a thanks that was very watered down, curt, not even lukewarm.

The next day he continued to effort and was using a mutual friend's funeral as the excuse for contact. When I showed emotion and shock about the death he started sending pics of us together from the past. My mother, who justifiably loathes this man, was literally laying in bed next to me. Even if I had wanted to respond with more she would have thrown a fit.

Finally when I didn't respond the way he wanted, he contacted someone very close to me to express his outrage, frustration, surprise, disgust. He was really upset.

By 7/28, he had sort of disappeared... Then he resurfaced a few days later with calls to my close relative.

It has been a nightmare. He saw me or the first time 8/9. I unloaded and he hated it.

I am addicted to this man, however, during this process I have found a working brain still exists in my head. I will not settle for being mentally tortured the rest of my life.

He, at one point, downplayed the card he gave me, downplayed his words he said, postured me to be the crazy overbearing woman who was spying on him... .

I have stood my ground, but I'm fragile. I have informed him that I'm aware he is trying to condition me into a submissive non questioning role where he can carry on w other women and I'd be afraid to express my curiosity or skepticism. That would be the "rule" if we were to resume our relationship. His sense of confidence was a bit amusing to me.

At this juncture he has asked that we visit a professional therapist together within two weeks to make a decision whether to give it another try.

Yes, there are fleeting, brief, tiny moments when he seems oddly mature and level headed. Then he snaps back to slithery and tossing his word salad.

I'm undecided whether I'll go to a new therapist.

This man only wanted to see if I was still on the hook. He calls daily. He oscillates between wanting to plan a future w me and making specific plans, to saying "if it can't work then it can't work". There is zero consistency - ZERO. If I don't say I brewed my coffee the correct way he gets rude over the phone- his personality is completely illogical. It's different from HOUR TO HOUR.

I am currently making the decision whether I will sit with a new therapies for the first time with him, one who specializes in borderlines, or NOT.

The decision will be made within the next ten days because the part of me that grew during this period of no contact got a taste of the world and it's lovely compared to living in an abusive, crazy crate little box with him.

He would argue he doesn't want to be scrutinized and that I am too watchful of him. My defense is that if his actions and behavior matched his words, I wouldn't question or watch him so closely.

This isn't easy. Some posts find me sounding incredibly stoic and acting as if I have some new degree of "wisdom"... . I'm in the same boat as everyone else and my wounds still have openings mixed with scabs.

What I am most grateful for is my ability to be standing one step back - my vision of him is so clear. I'm no longer deep into his world and blind to who he really is and gullible to his words. He dismissed the birthday card within a week... . so that tells you how bouncy they are.

I now have the ability to see him as troubled, dangerous and manipulative. And I also see my time ticking away. I have made my own bucket list and I have a good support system, so I could go back out and start living life again as I did without him. I'm not kidding myself because there were many times during those three months when I was empty and crying but I now look at my future as either one with good life experiences to be had despite a piece of my heart being damaged, or more of the exhausting, angry, uncertain, suspicious, spy game with him waiting for the rug to be pulled out from under me.

The therapy appointment would have to yield nothing short of a miracle. The danger is my exposure to him while attending it. He gives "love" in buckets on Wednesday and by Thursday night he is cold, detached, icy, unrecognizeable... . Until the other him returns in about 72 hours.

It's preposterous. I hope I will be smart and strong.

[Siamese Rescue]

Oh - in forgot - the only time I've actually seen him was 8/9.

[Scout99]

Im just struggling with it all, i dont know how to deal with it,what to do to make it easier for me.

I know hes back at his mums and she really doesnt help him, shes not bothered hes stopped treatment, doesnt encourage him to ring his girls every week like i did (he hasnt rung them in weeks and isnt allowed to see them due to so many suicide threats) its almost like she wants him this way so she feels she can look after him. When i told his new gf all about him and she confronted him i got a text off his mum calling me a b***h, was i trying to push him over the edge? how she knew he had met someone else (so knew he was cheating on me!) Yet his mum when she found out her bf had been cheating contacted every single one of his girlfriends to tell them about her so i dont get how she can allow him to do what he does without her saying anything to him yet this is the kind of guy she spends her entire time moaning about. Is it because she never says anything that he always goes running back home? Is it because she allows him to do what he wants when he wants with who he wants that he has this bond with her? (yet many a time he would call her interfering, nasty, a man eater etc, said he could see she was to partly blame for his disorder) I was the one person who did everything for him emotionally, mentally, physically, financially and yet im THE ONE person who is bad in all this, i just dont get it and its tearing me up inside, i cant stop crying but i know its stupid!

I understand that you are hurting right now, and I am sorry you are in this situation!

When you describe his mother I get the feeling there is a bit of follies à deux going on here between the two of them... . Follies à deux is a term in psychiatry, is French and means madness consisting of two... . That is two people that together will have a very destructive and even maddening effect in each other... .

The thing with borderline is that it is to an extent somewhat hereditary. Now whether or not his mother also has the disorder, is not for me to say. But regardless of that her effect on him is not helping him, but probably instead validates her... . That is he probably is very submissive to her and she gets validation from that. Hereditary or not, borderline is usually caused by childhood trauma and has a lot to do with attachment psychology. Which often boils down to having one or both parents not showing consistency in loving their children and/or are unable to love their children unconditionally for whatever reason... . That is the child learns early on not to be able to rely on being loved for who they really are, but instead having to fight for their parents appreciation of them. It doesn't take a lot of that, it is enough that is is subtle... . The wounds that creates can easily turn into a disorder.

In this case it seems, based on what you disclose here, that when his mother feels that she has him for herself or se feels in control of him, then she probably showers him with validation and loves him unconditionally and he in turn is addicted to that, so they dance this dance of subtle madness together... . Towards you he pretty much becomes a parrot channeling whatever she may be saying or wanting, to keep him with her... . When she wants him all to herself... . And in that you become a threat to her, since you probably have had a good influence on him making him detach a bit from his mother in the past?

In short she seems to have a pretty bad influence on him. That you also can see in the way he when with her chooses to even neglects his children, for instance... .

That bond is very hard to break, since they both get something out of it, albeit in a very destructive way... .

If borderline was not hard enough to live with, standing as a sound partner in the middle of such a bond, makes getting to a point where a relationship with this man almost impossible - for anybody!

I wish there was something I could say or do to ease your pain right now, or give you a key to a short cut to feeling good again... . But I can't... . All I can do is try to encourage you to stay the course... . That is to keep moving forward and keep listening to the voice coming from your mind telling you that you deserve so much better than this... . He is a sinking ship, and there is nothing you can do to change that... . He needs to pull himself out of the water all by himself... . That is what being an adult really means... .

What I can say however is if you stay the course and choose to detach yourself from this relationship and keep moving forward, you will begin to feel better sooner than you think... .

Best Wishes

Scout99

[gallerykey]

Hi Scout99,  I had to read that several times to make sure i was reading it right. So much of what you said made so much sense. It really is a strange relationship he and his mum have, ive never witnessed anything like it. He would almost agree to anything she said when with her then moan about it afterwards instead of saying to her "i dont agree" or "i dont like it when... . " When he would stay with her he would come back home worse than when he went and would be angry quicker for the next few days, then constantly have to ring her! At first i liked her, until i found out she would have 5 guys on the go at once, lie to all of them but would go mad if they lied to her, yet allow her son to lie all the time in the same ways she was moaning about.

His dad was an alcoholic, gambler, and would physically abuse him, his mum remarried when he was about 15 and he was sent to live in a rented room so they could have time on their own. It was a horrid childhood and i do still feel sorry for him as i know thats the cause of all his problems.

I think when he has split from all his previous exes they have all been painted black and left black (even mum of his children) would he paint the children black for any reason? Is that why he doesnt have contact with them or is it as he is no longer with me encouraging him and having them here and he is now concentrating on his latest gf (im sure there is one since the last gf dumped him after a week!) and doesnt have time for anything else. I wont ever get answers from him so try to reach out here. I just feel so weak at the moment as i crave hearing from him but know i never will. I am actually really pleased with myself for not contacting him at all in 9 days though as i never imagined i could do it, 1 hour at a time, then will do 1 day at a time and it must get easier but will the pain ever really leave me? Im working on me with my T and try to deal with this here. Thankyou to all on here who have helped and supported me, i dont know what i would do without it x