Could this be a recycle after 9 months of NC? Or genuine friendship request..

[lilybear14]

Hi, this is my first time posting... . I spent a lot of time reading last year when I was going through the final break up stages with my ex BF - this place really helped me to recognize his BPD nature and make that final break.

I have been NC for almost 9 months now, but all of a sudden, the contact has started again... .

I went NC in the first place, after countless make up break up cycles (easily 30 times), but he then decided to go back to his ex GF, who he repeatedly told me he still loved while we were together, but he "couldn't be with her" even though she was "so special and changed his life" and "got him like no-one else does"... .   (they stayed friends while we were together). That was the final deal breaker for me and enabled me to make a clean break... .

Well now he has contacted me saying he could really do with my friendship and support as he has hit rock bottom this year, being diagnosed with depression and attempting suicide multiple times, the last time he nearly didn't make it. He has now broken up with his ex (I am guessing within the last 6-8 weeks), so am highly suspicious that this contact is his attempt at setting me up for a recycle.

I called him on this, suggesting he is only contacting me now, because he has broken up with her, but he denies this, saying he just wants friendship because he can't be in a relationship right now.

The crazy thing is, that he has started seeing a therapist (for maybe 6 months?) and actually seems to be very different in his conversation with me etc. I have strangely had the most mature conversations with him that I have ever had, despite the topics of discussion (things that would normally result in massive rages and drama). He said his therapist has suggested for him to try to be friends with the people he is estranged from.

Is it possible that he is actually being genuine? Talking to him has been so different from before that I have actually had the thought cross my mind that maybe things could be different and somehow, despite the hell we went through, I still feel like I love him and this normal conversation and emails over the last few weeks has brought back all the memories of the good stuff.

It is kinda easier to keep distance and NC when I am still harboring the resentment etc over what happened, but for the first time, I have actually been able to tell him how I feel about how much he hurt me and it is like he understands and is listening to me, rather than invalidating how I feel... . It is almost un-nerving as it feels like I no longer need NC. Maybe I can be a mature adult about it and talk to him without it being an issue.

Maybe what has happened to him, going back to the ex he glorified so much and her hitting on him, plus the work he is doing with his therapist, has actually changed him, perhaps things could be different?

I am so confused right now, this contact has kind of blindsided me a bit and brought up so much stuff that I thought was dealt with and locked away...

Any advice from someone who has been in a similar situation would be greatly appreciated

[Emelie Emelie]

Oh Lilybear... . just be careful with your heart. 

[Moonie75]

Oh Lilybear... . just be careful with your heart. 

I second that!

Recycling the girl before you for a while & 6 months with a therapist won't have touched the sides of his BPD yet. Successful treatment takes years of totally committed hard work & effort from the pwBPD.

I'm not saying it's impossible he's seen the error of his ways, but think about this. The girl he's no longer seeing is his trigger now NOT YOU. he can function well in conversation with you, just like he can hold it together with anyone who's not the 'chosen one' that takes the bullets. That's his ex! Do you remember being the one that suffered his bullets while he functioned ok with others?

She's where you were when you were his trigger. Think about what might happen if you get close to him again. Think about being his trigger again & what it will do to you. He can't control his illness. Neither can you. But you can control whether or not you put yourself back there.

Go careful & steady with your decision on this Lilybear x

[Aussie0zborn]

... . for the first time, I have actually been able to tell him how I feel about how much he hurt me and it is like he understands and is listening to me, rather than invalidating how I feel... .

I'm sorry to hear you're in this awkward and painful position.

I'm further sorry to be a naysayer, but this doesn't last long. Before you know it, things will be back to how you remember them. Be careful with letting your guard down as it hurts more when you realise you have been taken for yet ANOTHER RIDE. As Emelie said, just be careful with your heart.

[Ironmanrises]

Oh Lilybear... . just be careful with your heart. 

I second that!

Recycling the girl before you for a while & 6 months with a therapist won't have touched the sides of his BPD yet. Successful treatment takes years of totally committed hard work & effort from the pwBPD.

I'm not saying it's impossible he's seen the error of his ways, but think about this. The girl he's no longer seeing is his trigger now NOT YOU. he can function well in conversation with you, just like he can hold it together with anyone who's not the 'chosen one' that takes the bullets. That's his ex! Do you remember being the one that suffered his bullets while he functioned ok with others?

She's where you were when you were his trigger. Think about what might happen if you get close to him again. Think about being his trigger again & what it will do to you. He can't control his illness. Neither can you. But you can control whether or not you put yourself back there.

Go careful & steady with your decision on this Lilybear x

I will fourth that.

Everything in bold.

That will happen to you again... .

If you allow that person back into your life.

That is what happened to me... .

When i let my exUBPDgf back into my life.

The pain i am experiencing now... .

In the aftermath... .

Is far worse... .

Then the first time she left me.

Stay NC.

You dont want to come back here x amount of time later... .

To reread this post... .

And wonder... .

They did warn me... .

They will only hurt you.

[patientandclear]

Any advice from someone who has been in a similar situation would be greatly appreciated

Well ... . I've been in a similar situation.  It leads me to believe that Moonie's analysis is spot on.

My uBPDexbf went back to his ex after we split (he had just started working with a therapist who advised against any r/s and therefore, I thought, we decided not to try again then ... . only to learn weeks later that he was pursuing a renewed r/s with his ex).  it broke my heart & I started NC.  10 months later, after I learned they'd split, I got back in touch, offering friendship, and with a sincere conviction that unless he'd done a lot of work I hadn't heard about, that was all we should undertake.

But it was immediately rich and intense.  And as you say lilybear, the conversations were really different.  He seemed really different.  I began to think things maybe could be different, that he had really grown a lot (not clear how that could have happened while in the r/s with the exgf and in the two or so months since, but ... . ).

We got closer.  So much so that it seemed impossible we would not end up together again.  Then suddenly, he began to disappear and sort of break down.  Then he'd reconnect.  Then break down.  Then reconnect.  The disappearances were very painful, in part because sometimes he'd announce them with a big hurtful explanation ("I only want to be your friend," when I had put nothing else on the table).  In between the disappearances, we got closer each time.  So it was more painful each time he left.

Finally he moved out of town on very short notice.  We'd been very close & I was really sad.  When I expressed a sense that he was giving a lot up, including me, by leaving here for no particular reason, he was silent for 10 weeks.  When I reached out again he was pretty nasty initially.  But as soon as I indicated I was close to giving up, he snapped into a nicer approach, and things improved.  We've been very close since, very emotionally intimate, traveling to see each other, and so on.  But -- he just started seeing someone else in his new city (I think) and our contact has fallen off dramatically.

I can't emphasize enough that the closer we get, the more triggered he is & the more bizarre his behavior with respect to me becomes.  Very much as you said of your ex, at the outset, he seemed much matured and healed, or healing.  But as we began to lay a real foundation of healing & trust between us, he got ever more fragile and precarious in r/s with me.

It's interesting to read your account & realize that I am presently sort of in the role of your ex's ex.  "They remained friends throughout ... . no one got him like she got him," etc.  And so it is also a cautionary to tale to hear that he got back together with her, only to break up with her months later.  Round and round it goes.

So ... . you will still have BPD on your hands, I think.  Just because he currently seems different, steadier, more solid, wiser, more insightful, doesn't mean that it will continue like that once you get closer.  In all likelihood you will become his trigger, and things will get stranger the closer you get.

[Slowlybutsurely]

I'll fifth that.  

I have a bad feeling about this, especially because you still have feelings for him and have it in your head that maybe he is a changed man and could be a good partner to you.

If he has BPD, it's not going to happen in this decade. You are going to get hurt again, and worse than before, as another has said. It's guaranteed. Just read on here about the poor souls who re-attempted being in contact after a spate of NC, with high hopes that things would be different this time. I haven't read one story where it had a happy ending.

I'd be very very cautious here...

[blurry]

Most of the relationships with pwBPD have ended with the non being totally devasted, heartbroken, destroyed, ect. That's what these people do to us, why in the world would being friends after seem like a good idea? Ill just as soon go be friends with someone who didn't lie to me, cheat on me, cost me jobs, cost me friends, cost me 1000s of dollars, cost me some self respect, call me some of the worst imaginable names that ever came out of someones mouth, I can keep going... .

Lol, yet I'm praying she will come back to me soon. I must be messed up bad. Anyway, being friends could be a constant reminder of all the pain they caused, I don't see the point of it personally, plus BPD doesn't really respect boundaries, friend usually equates to friends with benefits, that way they don't have to feel guilty for leaving you because as "friends" there's no commitment to break, in their sick minds.

[Learning_curve74]

I went NC in the first place, after countless make up break up cycles (easily 30 times), but he then decided to go back to his ex GF, who he repeatedly told me he still loved while we were together, but he "couldn't be with her" even though she was "so special and changed his life" and "got him like no-one else does"... .   (they stayed friends while we were together). That was the final deal breaker for me and enabled me to make a clean break... .

The crazy thing is, that he has started seeing a therapist (for maybe 6 months?) and actually seems to be very different in his conversation with me etc. I have strangely had the most mature conversations with him that I have ever had, despite the topics of discussion (things that would normally result in massive rages and drama). He said his therapist has suggested for him to try to be friends with the people he is estranged from.

It sounds like you are feeling very vulnerable, lilybear. Take care of yourself. 

My apologies in advance if it sounds like I am lecturing you. Remember we need to trust actions over words, especially when dealing with pwBPD. He repeatedly told you that he could not be with his exgf, but what did he do: his exgf is exactly who he got back together with.

I'm not saying this is happening for sure, but it is very possible that your BPDex is mirroring his therapist. Right now his T may be one of the most important people in his life, so he may be idealizing the T and may be trying to be on his best behavior. But once the cracks start to show in their relationship (and the relationship between a patient and T can seem close as you discuss the most personal matters that you might never tell any other soul), as no human is perfect, he may very well quit therapy. My BPDex has told me that she was able to "trick" therapists and counselors in the past, and she has quit them before. I'm not saying this is the case with your BPDex, but it is good to know all the possibilities before you make any kind of decision, right?

Regardless of any of the above, what is it that you want, lilybear? Can you be "just friends" and can you enforce strong boundaries if he tries to cross them? What does "just friends" mean to you? What will you do if he crosses the line beyond "just friends"?

[lilybear14]

gosh this is frustrating, I just typed out a huge reply and lost it all, so will try again... .

thank you so much for your words of wisdom... . reading that, plus really looking at the situation more objectively today, I am leaning more to the recycle side now and doubting the genuine nature of the requests... . the timing of his breakup and contact with me, seems exactly in line with when he would recycle. The ex gf must have shut him down in terms of a recycle, so it is on to me, the good old sucker who took him back so many times before

The therapist thing is scarily spot on - he idolises his therapist, I thought it was a bit weird when he said they "just clicked" from the first session and it makes complete sense that what he is doing, is putting on his best behavior for her... .

It is weird to think that it is now his ex gf that is now his trigger instead of me and the more that I think about it, so completely insulting that he would come back to me, just 4 weeks after she broke it off with him... .

I think I need to hold back for a bit, to see if doing that brings up any red flags... . I've already seen some neediness and self esteem issues come up, so if that keeps happening, I think I should go back to NC. I am at the point in my healing where I don't *need* him in my life, not to say I don't idealise the thought that maybe we could have worked it out if we had worked harder at it, done couples therapy etc.

I don't know if I could be friends with him - he has very loose friendship boundaries and for some stupid reason, the physical attraction I have for him, impairs my sense of judgement, so the risk we could end up back together is high.

There is a whole lot of guilt tied up in how I feel as well, especially given his suicide attempts this year - what sort of a$$hole would I be to turn away someone who has been in that frame of mind and tells you they are at rock bottom and has no-one else to turn to. I know it isn't my responsibility, but I do care and I am a compassionate person... . no doubt I have some rescuing issues as well :/

Thanks for the help, I really appreciate it

[fiddlestix]

I will offer a stark warning: do not venture back in!  After nearly a year of no contact from my estranged BPDw of 23 years, she began to approach me.  Her latest affair has crashed and burned, with him going to jail.  I ended up comforting her via text... .   Soon she was flirting and being very loving and suggestive.  She wanted to try again and see if I could "win her back" (what a grandiose ego on her!).  Alas, I took the bait, believing that her counseling and visits to the rape and abuse crisis center (as a result of her criminal boyfriend's abuse) had "opened her eyes."  We agreed to "date."  No sooner did she have me in her clutches again when she threw me overboard (without an explanation) for a man 14 years her junior. As I write she is 250 miles away with her new boy toy at a music festival.  This slayed me worse than all the previous ruptures.  My wife is a marriage and family therapist, sharp as a tack and a diagnosed bipolar with borderline traits.  The perfect storm.  Listen to this 47 year old wise man: stay away!  The next breakup will hurt far, far worse than the previous ones... .

Fiddlestix

[fiddlestix]

Oh yeah, when I finally"manned up"and filed for divorce, my wife said she was glad we had "reconnected" and hopes we can remain friends.  She even sent a hug my way through my daughter.  I saw this as h o o v e r i n g and I did not reciprocate.  Then the day after she actually received the divorce notice she texted me about a totally unrelated issue regarding our son's car.  She is probably trying to see if I will still be nearby when, and if, "boy toy" becomes her latest annoyance (as I had become to her).  A friendship with her is not possible.  Maybe your situation will yield different results Lilybear, but I doubt it. 

Fiddlestix

[Ironmanrises]

I will offer a stark warning: do not venture back in!  After nearly a year of no contact from my estranged BPDw of 23 years, she began to approach me.  Her latest affair has crashed and burned, with him going to jail.  I ended up comforting her via text... .   Soon she was flirting and being very loving and suggestive.  She wanted to try again and see if I could "win her back" (what a grandiose ego on her!).  Alas, I took the bait, believing that her counseling and visits to the rape and abuse crisis center (as a result of her criminal boyfriend's abuse) had "opened her eyes."  We agreed to "date."  No sooner did she have me in her clutches again when she threw me overboard (without an explanation) for a man 14 years her junior. As I write she is 250 miles away with her new boy toy at a music festival.  This slayed me worse than all the previous ruptures.  My wife is a marriage and family therapist, sharp as a tack and a diagnosed bipolar with borderline traits.  The perfect storm.  Listen to this 47 year old wise man: stay away!  The next breakup will hurt far, far worse than the previous ones... .

Fiddlestix

That.

The inevitable outcome.

:'(

[fiddlestix]

We are kindred souls, ironman.  I spent 25 (foolish, self indulgent, but often wondrous) years with my beloved BPDw. Many days I am a zombie, roaming the world in disbelief and shock that she is gone.  I sense you can process your grief through your writing.  I can see you have a flare for creativity and poetry.  I know your drawing is in remission, but use your writing to work things out.  I am an ordained United Methodist minister (MDiv) and I know how writing can flush our streams clear. A long dose of NC will also help.  Be in touch with me if you want to bounce your pain around.  A wise man once said, "If you are feeling bad, I promise you that if you help another person, you will feel better." 

Peace and Love,

Fiddlestix

[LetItBe]

actually seems to be very different in his conversation with me etc. I have strangely had the most mature conversations with him that I have ever had, despite the topics of discussion

Is it possible that he is actually being genuine? Talking to him has been so different from before that I have actually had the thought cross my mind that maybe things could be different and somehow, despite the hell we went through, I still feel like I love him and this normal conversation and emails over the last few weeks has brought back all the memories of the good stuff.

It is kinda easier to keep distance and NC when I am still harboring the resentment etc over what happened, but for the first time, I have actually been able to tell him how I feel about how much he hurt me and it is like he understands and is listening to me, rather than invalidating how I feel... .

perhaps things could be different?

I am so confused right now, this contact has kind of blindsided me a bit and brought up so much stuff that I thought was dealt with and locked away...

Please be very very cautious.  I was in a r/s with my BPDxbf for 10 months, he broke up w/me, it was heart-wrenching, and I didn't communicate with him for 6 1/2 months, even though he wrote me a couple of letters and left a voice message during that time.  I felt like I had dealt with the break-up pain and even tried dating after a few months (oops, another likely pwBPD).  Then, the really tough anniversary of my mom's death came up, and I contacted my BPDxbf for comfort (shaking my head now).  He was amazing!  Like everything you described above!  The conversations we were having were so loving, compassionate, and he really sounded like he'd been doing well with his therapy and had come such a long way.  It was all so enticing, and like you, my judgment was also clouded w/the physical attraction I had toward him.  I thought we had a shot at a better relationship.  I was SO hopeful!  It was wonderful for about a month, then all hell broke loose, and the downward spiral began.  He spent the next month dysregulated, back to thoughts that I was trying to trick him, him pushing me away, withdrawing affection, silence, and setting up no-win communication traps (i.e., trying to use me as a pressure release valve for his building emotions).   It became impossible to continue.  I was devastated.  Here I am, almost 6 months later, and I'm still on these boards -- after "only" a 2-month recycle!  So, yes, I agree with others here that each time is more difficult.  

[Ironmanrises]

Fiddle,

I am so sorry you experienced 25 years of that.

I don't think I would have lasted another month of what I endured.

You are strong.

Thank you for your kind words.

Saddens me to no end to read account after account of these ordeals.

My words are my way of letting it out... .

All my visuals... .

Same purpose... .

It is how I see things... .

Hang in there.