The echo of her presence...

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

Hello again kind people,

Most of you know my trials and tribulations in wavering between wanting my exBPDgf back and wanting her to stay away for ever.

I'm in a dark place and what makes it worse are the echoes of her presence around my house. Every room has her identity indelibly printed on my heart.

I've toyed with selling up and moving somewhere as far away as I can - as it happens, she only lives three miles away and I don't want the heartbreak of either seeing her alone and either engaging/hiding with/from her, or worse, seeing her with her new love. If I saw her and engaged in conversation I would break down in floods of tears if she had a ring on her finger, and everything that I've tried to maintain during these past weeks of NC would come full circle and the cycle would start again. I don't want that, I really don't. I'm in a permanently drugged up state from wine, sleeping tablets and valium. I'm in a place that I never thought possible to be, through simply breaking up with a woman. Hell, I've been there before with a non, and the pain and hurt was nothing in comparison to how I feel about this break up.

Call me hypersensitive if you like, but the thought of just seeing her again would be almost too much to bear. I know she doesn't care for me or is even remotely concerned about my well being, and that knowledge helps to a point. She's with someone else who is ten years younger than me, has money and a car (see posts passim), and that she's loved-up and everything is rosy in her garden, whilst I am slowly breaking up under the strain.

I have this horrible thought that she'll just turn up at my house (with Mr New in tow), returning all my belongings - belongings being my paintings that I gave her, plus all the little gifts (just because... .) that she's had over the years, and her saying that she's either moving in with Mr New or just wants to get rid of any memories she has of me. I can't allow that to happen. It tears at the very fibre of my being to say or think that I can't stand the emotional thought of seeing her again.

What are your thoughts about me sending a letter, telling her how much I loved her (even if it is misplaced love), explaining in detail why it would be impossible for us to remain friends (at her suggestion), and that she is welcome to everything that I've ever given her?

I really do welcome your input. This forum has been a lifeline for me 

[houseofswans]

Hello again kind people,

Most of you know my trials and tribulations in wavering between wanting my exBPDgf back and wanting her to stay away for ever.

I'm in a dark place and what makes it worse are the echoes of her presence around my house. Every room has her identity indelibly printed on my heart.

I've toyed with selling up and moving somewhere as far away as I can - as it happens, she only lives three miles away and I don't want the heartbreak of either seeing her alone and either engaging/hiding with/from her, or worse, seeing her with her new love. If I saw her and engaged in conversation I would break down in floods of tears if she had a ring on her finger, and everything that I've tried to maintain during these past weeks of NC would come full circle and the cycle would start again. I don't want that, I really don't. I'm in a permanently drugged up state from wine, sleeping tablets and valium. I'm in a place that I never thought possible to be, through simply breaking up with a woman. Hell, I've been there before with a non, and the pain and hurt was nothing in comparison to how I feel about this break up.

Call me hypersensitive if you like, but the thought of just seeing her again would be almost too much to bear. I know she doesn't care for me or is even remotely concerned about my well being, and that knowledge helps to a point. She's with someone else who is ten years younger than me, has money and a car (see posts passim), and that she's loved-up and everything is rosy in her garden, whilst I am slowly breaking up under the strain.

I have this horrible thought that she'll just turn up at my house (with Mr New in tow), returning all my belongings - belongings being my paintings that I gave her, plus all the little gifts (just because... .) that she's had over the years, and her saying that she's either moving in with Mr New or just wants to get rid of any memories she has of me. I can't allow that to happen. It tears at the very fibre of my being to say or think that I can't stand the emotional thought of seeing her again.

What are your thoughts about me sending a letter, telling her how much I loved her (even if it is misplaced love), explaining in detail why it would be impossible for us to remain friends (at her suggestion), and that she is welcome to everything that I've ever given her?

I really do welcome your input. This forum has been a lifeline for me 

[allweareisallweare]

Hi Houseofswans -    I know how you feel since you and I are at the same stage - it's nearly five weeks NC, right?

The letter from you to her would break that. I have lots I could say to my exBPDgf BUT I know they'll be no letters. I'd detail entirely how she needs therapy, how what she has now (again, 5 weeks no contact, could have ended for all I know) is resultant from her illness and has overshadowed/destroyed our love. She tried to imply we'd still be friends - mentioned a friend of hers divorcing but still meeting her soon-to-be-ex for coffee even though he was meant to be a baddie - but we're not those guys, I can never retain anything, I have no respect for that exBPDgf that vacuumed out the day I learned I had been a victim of a BPD apocalypse.

I genuinely don't think you should break that NC as it could start a whole raft of things again given the stories here it seems to open old wounds. I know how hard it is for you - I feel very sick and low every day and lonely every day too. That's just my opinion. We always get mixed feelings - I know not deep down I despise mine - but occasionally I'll miss the old life, the old country, the five summers... .the people ... .it's all sad and unnecessary. Life doesn't go on, sadly.

Hang in there, be interesting to hear others' advice 

[houseofswans]

Hi allweareisallweare

Yes, we are at about the same stage and I thank you for your comment.

I'd be very interested in what others have to say... .

[numb_buddha]

Hello again kind people,

Most of you know my trials and tribulations in wavering between wanting my exBPDgf back and wanting her to stay away for ever.

I'm in a dark place and what makes it worse are the echoes of her presence around my house. Every room has her identity indelibly printed on my heart.

I've toyed with selling up and moving somewhere as far away as I can - as it happens, she only lives three miles away and I don't want the heartbreak of either seeing her alone and either engaging/hiding with/from her, or worse, seeing her with her new love. If I saw her and engaged in conversation I would break down in floods of tears if she had a ring on her finger, and everything that I've tried to maintain during these past weeks of NC would come full circle and the cycle would start again. I don't want that, I really don't. I'm in a permanently drugged up state from wine, sleeping tablets and valium. I'm in a place that I never thought possible to be, through simply breaking up with a woman. Hell, I've been there before with a non, and the pain and hurt was nothing in comparison to how I feel about this break up.

Call me hypersensitive if you like, but the thought of just seeing her again would be almost too much to bear. I know she doesn't care for me or is even remotely concerned about my well being, and that knowledge helps to a point. She's with someone else who is ten years younger than me, has money and a car (see posts passim), and that she's loved-up and everything is rosy in her garden, whilst I am slowly breaking up under the strain.

I have this horrible thought that she'll just turn up at my house (with Mr New in tow), returning all my belongings - belongings being my paintings that I gave her, plus all the little gifts (just because... .) that she's had over the years, and her saying that she's either moving in with Mr New or just wants to get rid of any memories she has of me. I can't allow that to happen. It tears at the very fibre of my being to say or think that I can't stand the emotional thought of seeing her again.

What are your thoughts about me sending a letter, telling her how much I loved her (even if it is misplaced love), explaining in detail why it would be impossible for us to remain friends (at her suggestion), and that she is welcome to everything that I've ever given her?

I really do welcome your input. This forum has been a lifeline for me 

You said: "I'm in a permanently drugged up state from wine, sleeping tablets and valium. I'm in a place that I never thought possible to be, through simply breaking up with a woman."

If this is the case, you're in no state to enter any relationship at all and have it go well. I mean you may say it's for other reasons, but the only reason you would write such a letter is in an effort to get her back. But why do you want that? You're literally only prolonging the pain and putting off to some later date, as it will only happen again with someone suffering from BPD. Get some help for yourself and get off the wine and drugs.

You said: She's with someone else who is ten years younger than me, has money and a car (see posts passim), and that she's loved-up and everything is rosy in her garden, whilst I am slowly breaking up under the strain.

She's not "all loved up and everything is rosy in her garden." You know well that love is not something she is capable of! She can't feel it, not from herself, not from others, and she can't give it, either. They are filling the void just as you were, and will be suffering in time themselves (if not already). If they care, of course. As my therapist said, some men actually seek out BPD women. They are easy to use for sex and easy to discard if you aren't enmeshed.

The best help you can give her is NC.

[Ironmanrises]

Hello again kind people,

Most of you know my trials and tribulations in wavering between wanting my exBPDgf back and wanting her to stay away for ever.

I'm in a dark place and what makes it worse are the echoes of her presence around my house. Every room has her identity indelibly printed on my heart.

I've toyed with selling up and moving somewhere as far away as I can - as it happens, she only lives three miles away and I don't want the heartbreak of either seeing her alone and either engaging/hiding with/from her, or worse, seeing her with her new love. If I saw her and engaged in conversation I would break down in floods of tears if she had a ring on her finger, and everything that I've tried to maintain during these past weeks of NC would come full circle and the cycle would start again. I don't want that, I really don't. I'm in a permanently drugged up state from wine, sleeping tablets and valium. I'm in a place that I never thought possible to be, through simply breaking up with a woman. Hell, I've been there before with a non, and the pain and hurt was nothing in comparison to how I feel about this break up.

Call me hypersensitive if you like, but the thought of just seeing her again would be almost too much to bear. I know she doesn't care for me or is even remotely concerned about my well being, and that knowledge helps to a point. She's with someone else who is ten years younger than me, has money and a car (see posts passim), and that she's loved-up and everything is rosy in her garden, whilst I am slowly breaking up under the strain.

I have this horrible thought that she'll just turn up at my house (with Mr New in tow), returning all my belongings - belongings being my paintings that I gave her, plus all the little gifts (... .) that she's had over the years, and her saying that she's either moving in with Mr New or just wants to get rid of any memories she has of me. I can't allow that to happen. It tears at the very fibre of my being to say or think that I can't stand the emotional thought of seeing her again.

What are your thoughts about me sending a letter, telling her how much I loved her (even if it is misplaced love), explaining in detail why it would be impossible for us to remain friends (at her suggestion), and that she is welcome to everything that I've ever given her?

I really do welcome your input. This forum has been a lifeline for me 

I can feel your pain.

I know the hypersensitivity you are referring to.

It hurts.

In bold.

I almost broke down seeing that.

My ipad flashed in those 2 words.

Hang in there.

You are not alone.

[houseofswans]

@numb-buddha - I realise that my drugged-up state is not healthy. I've never had to resort to using such means before in a relationship. This is a temporary measure to try and help me get some sleep at night. I'm going to start using meditation and yoga to try and bring balance back into my body and help me see things more clearly. Cutting out wine and tobacco will help me relax more as well, as both are stimulants and not good to be taken before bedtime.

Why am I thinking that she's all loved up and rosy in her/their garden? Maybe because of the doubts I have that because of her lack of caring and love for me, it was through some fault of mine. If she is incapable of giving love to anyone (and that is reassuring from my point of view), then what exactly is she feeling that us nons know instinctively as love?

Regards writing the letter, I'll admit that are times when I would like to get her back in my life. But slowly I'm telling myself what would be the point? We tried and failed on so many other occasions, why would it be different next time around. Besides, she went into another relationship whilst we were still officially together (on "a break" in her words), and would I want someone back who would do that? I would forever be wary of her doing it again. And I get angry that despite all the opportunities she had to tell me that she'd met someone else, she never did. Even a 'cowardly' non face-to-face email could have been sent to tell me. And I keep asking myself why wouldn't she tell me? Was she keeping me hanging on for some reason, similarly why did she want to initiate us remaining friends, and yet after five weeks hasn't even sent an email asking how I am and what I'm up to. This is why I'm thinking she's in a happier place than she was with me (the younger man, money and car)*

That was interesting what you said about your therapist saying that some men actively seek out BPD women - I am scratching my head just wondering how they do that? I mean, is there some outward sign of the condition (if they do display signs, I wasn't aware of any).

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@Ironmanfalls - I'm glad that you are able to feel the hypersensitivity that I refer to. Yes, it does hurt. I can understand your confusion with what to do with the ipad. Personally, I'd not be able to use it, let alone see it as a reminder. I cleared my house of all the triggers associated with my ex by disposing of them. The memory would be just too hard to take if I kept seeing them.

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* What I can't stand is the uncertainty. She wants to remain friends, but isn't acting like a friend would. She knows how I felt and must realise the hurt I'm going through. Which is why I wanted to break the NC and send a final letter - closure from me to her, if you like. It wouldn't be a pleading letter, or intimating that I want her back. It's just that I've said earlier, I couldn't stand to see her again and I don't want to risk her just turning up at my house. The letter would hurt so much, but in some ways would give me peace of mind... .

[Escaped 30.Sept.2013]

What I can't stand is the uncertainty. She wants to remain friends, but isn't acting like a friend would.

I know that feeling. For four months in total, all of May, June, July and August, I kept saying, "ok, so you can't be in a relationship with anyone just now, but you love me. I'll work to accept that, and to accept that eventually you'll date other women and I shall work to be fine with that, because we shall be friends who love each other deeply but can't be in a relationship"

what I kept getting was, "I'm not in a relationship with anyone, but if I was, it woudl be with you - I love you - I have always loved you since the day we met - I have never stopped loving you - even when I went with that other woman once, I never stopped loving you - she meant nothing to me, she was dumb and facile - only you are the one woman I can ever truly love - only you understand me"

I was being mirrored, and I still don't understand why. He already had the New Victim, who thinks she has been in a relationship with him since June.

I kept saying, correctly, "ok, we've split, and you'll see other women and I shall learn to accept this, but I still love you" and he kept on saying, "no, no, you've misinterpreted things, it's not like that, you don't understand, you're the only one I love, I'm not seeing anyone else, I'm not even talking to any other women, it's only you, it's only you".

The uncertainty as to what the heck was going on nearly finished me.

All I can conclude is that he needed to have me uncertain, he needed to keep me confused, because if I wasn't clouded by confusion then I might see through to the reality and then I should never speak to him again.

Which I did, eventually, and which I shan't.

[saw_tooth]

I'm in a permanently drugged up state from wine, sleeping tablets and valium. I'm in a place that I never thought possible to be, through simply breaking up with a woman. Hell, I've been there before with a non, and the pain and hurt was nothing in comparison to how I feel about this break up.

The pain and hurt are more intense because we were idealized and made to feel super special like never before while with a BPD.Totally understand how you feel.By being drugged,you are merely procrastinating the act of dealing with your emotional pain.As soon as the effect of these wear off,the gnawing pain shall be back.The only way to deal with it is to accept the fact that your partner was too disordered to 'love' you back in equal measure and focus on your own self there after.

Venting is another way to rid yourself of the pain.Talk to friends and family and post some more in here if you will,sharing sure helps.

As time passes,things will definitely get better.Hang in there.

I have this horrible thought that she'll just turn up at my house (with Mr New in tow), returning all my belongings - belongings being my paintings that I gave her, plus all the little gifts (just because... .) that she's had over the years, and her saying that she's either moving in with Mr New or just wants to get rid of any memories she has of me. I can't allow that to happen.

She has the emotional maturity of a 7 year old.A person she is in a relationship with is like a toy to her,filling her time and the void inside.When she is done with one toy,she finds another to play with.There is no 'attachment' or 'intimacy' fostered during these 'play sessions' like there would be for a non so she is unlikely to have 'memories' and there is a very marginal possibility of coming back which is a good thing because it will make it easier for you to detach.

What are your thoughts about me sending a letter, telling her how much I loved her (even if it is misplaced love), explaining in detail why it would be impossible for us to remain friends (at her suggestion), and that she is welcome to everything that I've ever given her?.

Even though you are overwhelmed by feelings of true love for her, she will not be able to comprehend how you feel.Her immature emotional realm renders her incapable of adult emotional intimacy and love.Also,she might paint you black at being told 'we can't remain friends' and display a spectrum of negative emotions/try to hurt you now or later.

Hence no contact is your best bet.

[Confusedandhurt]

Hey Houseofswans,

Your story sounds so very similar to mine.  I was with my exBPDgf for 4.5 years.  We went through all of the stages of a BPD relationship... .being idealized, the clinging, then the hating.  It was scary looking back as to how textbook it was. Then she left.  She sent me a text message saying that she needed to move on.  Within days she was dating someone else and within two months she was in a new relationship with yet another.  What was tough was her contacting me to tell me that she missed me while in bed with another guy.  I agree with others that NC is going to be the best for you.  She is truly like a emotional child.  She only thinks of herself and, while she may indeed still care for you, she is filled with toxic shame.  She cannot understand what you're going through, for if she did, she would have treated you much differently as you two were separating.  Sending her a letter will just make the wounds infected.  I broke down and responded to her contacts many times, which I now totally regret.  My ex contacted me when she needed something.  It was nothing more than that.  I was one of the people she was using to help her get through her crises in life. 

This board has helped so many people.  I encourage you to come here often.  It made such a difference to me and still does.  I've been without her for over a year and it is still extremely painful.  But with a T and this board, I'll get past it and find a more healthy relationship.  You can too and you will!  Take good care and work on building relationships with others who can encourage you.

[turtle]

* What I can't stand is the uncertainty. She wants to remain friends, but isn't acting like a friend would. She knows how I felt and must realise the hurt I'm going through. Which is why I wanted to break the NC and send a final letter - closure from me to her, if you like. It wouldn't be a pleading letter, or intimating that I want her back. It's just that I've said earlier, I couldn't stand to see her again and I don't want to risk her just turning up at my house. The letter would hurt so much, but in some ways would give me peace of mind... .

She is not your friend and will probably never be your friend.  Friends are generally people we trust and respect. Is she trustworthy?  :)o you respect her?

YOU might be capable of being friends, but it's doubtful that she is capable of that.  You have to remember she has a relational disorder -- that applies to friendship too!  

Just curious.  :)o you believe that she will respect any request you might put in that letter?  Chances are, if she wants to show up at your house, she'll show up --- regardless of the fact that you've asked her not to.

My experience was that whatever thought process ex had going on had very little to do with me.  I don't think your ex gives much thought to whatever might hurt you.  If she wants something, she'll go after it and whatever you've said in your letter just won't matter.

Closure is a subject that is discussed here a lot.  I wanted it too.  And I wanted it to look the way I wanted it to look.  Nice little package with a pretty bow on top. As you read through the stories of the people on these boards, you'll see that it just doesn't happen with these relationships.

The way your relationship stands with her right now, it's closed.  Maybe you have your closure -- maybe you just don't like the package.  I didn't like my closure package either, but now... .so very many years later... .I'm just grateful closure happened.  I'm no longer concerned with HOW that happened.

There's really nothing you could say in that letter that would make any difference to her.  Sad, but oh so true.

Contact (ANY kind of contact) = pain.

turtle

[ZigofZag]

Your posts heading caught my eye. You really are NOT ALONE feeling like this.

I feel for you, it's a terrible place you are in. We need to go through this pain, and then again, and possibly again and again but we need to go through it.

Stay NC. If you make contact you reset the pain clock and have to go through this again. Booze and drugs will be making you worse not better. Walk, swim, find a sport, other groups, the cinema, bowling or anything.

Please don't sink, we are all fighting to stay above the water line. You will be OK. No, better than that, you will feel the sun on your face, the weight in your soul will lift, you will be stronger, healthier, brighter and loved.

[Learning_curve74]

houseofswans, what exactly is your reason behind writing a letter and sending it to her? Do you want her to understand how much she hurt you and why you can't be friends? Or do you just want the catharsis of putting the feelings down in words that you can read back to yourself? Is there some other reason?

If she didn't have BPD then it is unlikely you'd have to write a letter for her to understand because she would already understand. And because she does have BPD, it is unlikely she will understand any letter you write. So in either case sending this type of letter will not achieve anything in terms of changing her or making her understand how you feel. If she understood how you felt, then she never would've done all the hurtful things she did!

Remember pwBPD have a disordered way of thinking and dysfunctional behaviors when it comes to close interpersonal relationships. Just because they don't look "crazy" upon first glance and many are "high functioning", we make the mistake of believing they think and feel as we do. The simple fact is that they do NOT.

To understand why somebody does something weird or strange, then you have to think like them which invariably involves thinking weird and strange things. You cannot change their ingrained crazy way of thinking and feeling with a simple letter. Heck, it is almost impossible to change with years of therapy! Sending her a letter is like trying to put out a raging forest fire with a teaspoon of water: useless.

If you need to write out your feelings, then do so. But I would suggest you seriously consider just writing this letter but never sending it because it won't be understood the way you want her to and could backfire on you.

Do it for yourself. Take care of yourself because she will not and cannot do that for you. 

[houseofswans]

As I thought - the consensus being that I should not send the letter of closure.

So I won't... .

But it will be alright, because I trying to heal myself from something I knew was illusory.

She didn't love me in the traditional, healthy sense of the word. Despite the countless times I told her that all I wanted was a hug or gentle stroke now and again.

I never got either.

And now I console myself with the fact that it wasn't just me that was at fault (we, as individuals should share responsibility for the countless breakups, but it was always me) - she will never be able to have a healthy relationship with anyone (which figures after she's had two failed marriages and countless partners).

She stayed with me for 4 years, because I allowed her to. Because of my own co-dependent issues.

I feel used and taken advantage of. She is selfish, self-centered AND (after much research) NPD to add to the BPD - what a mixture, huh?

If she really cared about me, she would have at least have sent an email after five weeks to say "Hi"... .

Who knows what's going on in her head? I still struggle to understand why she would choose someone to be with who is so unlike me (and her, really). It's like all the things she holds dear are absent from the new man.

It will be hard to really let go, but let go I must.

I weep for myself and for her

[Ironmanrises]

As I thought - the consensus being that I should not send the letter of closure.

So I won't... .

But it will be alright, because I trying to heal myself from something I knew was illusory.

She didn't love me in the traditional, healthy sense of the word. Despite the countless times I told her that all I wanted was a hug or gentle stroke now and again.

I never got either.

And now I console myself with the fact that it wasn't just me that was at fault (we, as individuals should share responsibility for the countless breakups, but it was always me) - she will never be able to have a healthy relationship with anyone (which figures after she's had two failed marriages and countless partners).

She stayed with me for 4 years, because I allowed her to. Because of my own co-dependent issues.

I feel used and taken advantage of. She is selfish, self-centered AND (after much research) NPD to add to the BPD - what a mixture, huh?

If she really cared about me, she would have at least have sent an email after five weeks to say "Hi"... .

Who knows what's going on in her head? I still struggle to understand why she would choose someone to be with who is so unlike me (and her, really). It's like all the things she holds dear are absent from the new man.

It will be hard to really let go, but let go I must.

I weep for myself and for her

In bold.

She is doing that to fill a void.

Since she painted you black... .

That new person... .

In her eyes... .

She thinks... .

Will fill that void... .

The same way... .

She thought... .

You would too.

I know it hurts.

I dont know if mine cheated... .

Or is with someone else... .

I just remember... .

All of her attention... .

That was once directed at me... .

Shift to lesser people... .

People who did less for her... .

Combined... .

Then me.

For me to try and understand that... .?

Has been utterly... .

Futile.

Only one thing makes sense... .

She is disordered.

As is yours... .

Unfortunately.

And that realization... .

Sucks.

Hurts... .

Beyond.

But that is radical acceptance.

That is all that is left at the end.

Hang in there.