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Author Topic: new to forum - 17 yo running out of time  (Read 736 times)
2girls3canines

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« on: October 24, 2013, 03:32:56 PM »

I am already relieved to be a part of this community. We have an amazing 17 year old daughter (senior in HS) who does have ADHD, but has struggled for so many years with something that we have never been able to diagnose or treat. We meet yet another psychiatrist Monday and are currently in DBT counseling, but since I came upon BPD - i would bet my life that this is what we have been missing all these years.

Looking back, she has all the signs and symptoms. Looking back, we did everything wrong in trying to help her and manage her on a day to day basis.

I feel horrible about the mistakes we have made - even though they were not done knowingly - and pray that there is time to help her live the life she so desparately wants but does not know how to live.

The things she does not exhibit are the self mutiliation and suicidal thoughts - which I am thankful for but now fear.

From my reading, she seems to have what is called high-functioning BPD in that she totally keeps it together everywhere but at home. She has no friends to speak of - she has alienated or just totally given up on trying to have a relationship with any girls or guys her age - she says they will all just hurt her eventually, so she is better off and prefers to live alone. Having moved many times during her childhood, she has either moved away from or had friends move away from her - those precious few that she was able to learn to trust. SHe has also had one boyfriend that was able to earn her trust and then he crushed her several months later by ending the relationship without warning or reason. She really rarely tries to maintain a relationship with her dad and I - she only interacts when she needs something. She never wants to talk to us about anything and cringes if we ask to talk with her - stating she is sure we are angry or disappointed with her so she avoids all but essential communication. She trusts no one.

I really am looking for insight into how to help her, knowing that she wants to go off to college next year out of state. We want her to feel like we are on her side and she can talk to us. We want her to experience dating and friendships at home so she will know how to handle them when we are not around - yet she refuses to entertain them.

We want her to see that choosing to live "alone" forever isnt really an answer and wont give her the happiness that she ultimately needs.

We want her to see that there are people that genuinely care about her and can be trusted.

I would appreciate any help you can offer with relationships, DBT therapy, medications, etc... .Thanks so much!
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Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders
crazedncrazymom
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Relationship status: Married 19 years
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« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2013, 05:46:51 PM »

Hi 2girls,

Welcome to the board!  We have so many parents who know exactly how you feel.  I know what you mean about doing everything wrong with the best of intentions.  I'm going to let you in on a huge secret.  Beating yourself up for your past mistakes won't get your daughter better.  Not even a little bit.  If that worked we wouldn't even need this board because we've all beaten ourselves black and blue with shame and guilt.  I hope you're ready to work through your FOG (fear, obligation, guilt) so that you can better help your daughter.

I started this board feeling scared for my daughter and wanting just to fix her.  I learned that by fixing myself a lot of her issues fell away.  Validation is my favorite skill.  S.E.T (sympathy, empathy, truth)  (I know you've been hurt by a lot of your friends and I'd feel really scared too but if you don't put yourself out there and find some new friends you're going to be very lonely) statements help facilitate a lot of talks that wouldn't have happened before.

Anyway if you saw the mess I was when I showed up here you probably wouldn't recognize me today.  This site has given me so many skills to communicate effectively with my dd16.  I hope you keep posting and get to know us and let us know more about you and your family.

-crazed
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2girls3canines

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« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2013, 05:49:42 PM »

thanks so much! We are hoping this DBT will even allow for such discussions as right now - she says she is alone and want to stay alone - that way - no one has the opportunity to hurt her ever again
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crazedncrazymom
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« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2013, 06:42:26 PM »

That's great that she is letting you know how she feels.  What a wonderful chance to validate her feelings!   I know it must be really painful and overwhelming to hear how much she's hurting.  How did you react when she said that?

-crazed
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pessim-optimist
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« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2013, 10:14:03 PM »

Hello 2girls3canines,

Welcome to our board!

You sound like a loving mom. BPD is a complicated mental illness that can be very puzzling and confusing to people who are not familiar with it. The communication skills that are needed are often counter-intuitive, and furthermore, the person w/BPD is usually VERY sensitive.

And like you have said about yourself; it is the experience of so many people here on the board that they tried and tried things that work with other people, only to see the situation get worse... .

I know, it makes you feel horrible but crazed is right: beating ourselves up is not productive. Instead - use those experiences to make a list of thing that do NOT work. As you learn the new skills and tools, your list of things that DO work will start growing too!

It is great to hear that your daughter is in DBT (as it is one of the frequently used therapies for persons w/BPD)! You can benefit from learning about it too - to better help your daughter.

May I give a couple of pieces of advice? As persons w/BPD (pwBPD) are sensitive and often very perceptive, they easily feel hurt, and misunderstood. They also often detect it very well, if we have an agenda.

1. It helps me to remember that I need to focus on making her feel heard (validating her feelings) as much as possible. She will feel understood, and will be more likely to open up, and we can build emotional closeness.

2. If I use the skills and tools to push my agenda (even if it's well meant), it is likely to back-fire.

The other piece of good news is that you still DO have this year to build that closeness and trust. She may leave your home, but if she feels like she is safe with you, and that you understand and truly hear her heart's troubles, she will keep calling/coming back... .

Let us know how the DBT goes, ok?
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2girls3canines

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« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2013, 07:44:25 AM »

thanks for the advice... it has def been a struggle for me - i have spent so much time "talking" and trying to get her to see how irrational she is, not realizing that she just doesnt see things like I do or even like most other people do. In my efforts to help, I pushed her further away... .I have spent alot of time online and reading to find better ways to approach her and get her to open up... She is stubborn girl though and I am sure is watching to see how long it lasts...

So when she told me she wanted to be alone - I spent a good while trying to explain to her that God didnt make us to be alone, that she would be more unhappy alone, that college and later jobs would make it almost impossible to be alone and that she needed to learn how to interact with others before she got put into those environments... She would have no part of that...

Looking back, I am sure it wasnt the best way to approach it, but it was the only way I knew to try... i am gonna try to just keep things pleasant until she actually begins to learn some of the applications of the DBT therapy, and see the psychiatrist Monday. Im not a big fan of meds really, and she already takes Focalin XR for the ADHD. But if there is something that can help her control the severity and frequency of the moods - then I am all for trying it. We are all exhausted. We all need a period of time with no major blow ups - and they are very very severe.
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six
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« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2013, 09:27:02 AM »

hi 2girls3

I identify with your post bec my son was a person with so much potential (and still is) and when he was 17 he just was doing everything wrong as far as I could see.

he has never been good at relationships and basically didn't have any for the most part

we struggled at home terribly with his ups and downs and the whole family was on edge

today he is 26, in graduate school, supporting himself, and in a relationship with a wonderful girl who seems to really understand him and see his good points.  I have so much hope for the future and believe that he will have the life he wants. 

I think that validation has been my most important tool.  I really validate his emotion and he often will come to his own conclusion of truth that he would not have been able to recognize in the past.  my validation has helped him to develop the skills he needs.  in the past I used to be mad when he would come to a conclusion that I had been saying for years and never give me credit but would act like he came up with on his own, all the while telling me what an awful mother I am.  now, I look at it that this is part of the mental illness.  the results are what matter, not whether I get credit for being a good mom.

what I would say is this:  don't give up hope and don't try to rush the process.  they need to go thru a certain amount of reality in order to get to the next step.  we cant give them the skills that they don't have.  they need to get there on their own. even though the journey is difficult, there is a light at the end of the tunnel, and we and they need to go through our process to reach it

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2girls3canines

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« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2013, 09:34:22 AM »

i guess I am having trouble with the validation concept. If I try to tell her I understand what she is saying and that I see how she might feel a certain way - she thinks I am either being sarcastic or that it is stupid for me to repeat what she is saying - like I am too stupid to understand it and need to repeat it... What can I do differently?
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crazedncrazymom
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Relationship status: Married 19 years
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« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2013, 12:02:30 PM »

Hi 2girls,

I think I would try meeting her where she is today.  

Radical Acceptance for family members  

Try reading this to understand how to let go of your expectations and just accept that right now she can't reach out to other people.  Maybe she needs an emotional time out.

Validation is really a hard concept to get a handle on.  For the first few months I felt like a fake.  I was saying things that I felt but in a different way than I've said them before.

-crazed
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BioAdoptMom3
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Relationship status: Married for 28 years
Posts: 336



« Reply #9 on: October 25, 2013, 08:46:02 PM »

Please do not blame yourself!  ADHD has a lot of similar symptoms to BPD, especially in childhood.  How were you to know?  You did what you could and it sounds like you have been very supportive of your child!  You are seeking treatment now and she is still young, though I know you want it started before college and I don't blame you.  Our DD14 is in cognetive behavior therapy, but DBT is suppposed to be better for BPD. You are absolutely doing the right thing there!  If you are seeing signs of depression, anxiey, OCT, etc. or the psych is, you might want to consider medication for her.  It has been a godsend for us.  They recently put DD on Respirdal, lowest dose, though we haven't seen it do much for her... .yet.  It may work a miracle for your own DD because everyone is different.  The thing that has been the most helpful, and I am going to ask for it again, was the combination of Prozac (we were at 40 mg.) and Abilify, 5 mg.  Good luck at your visit on Monday!
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pessim-optimist
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« Reply #10 on: October 25, 2013, 08:57:02 PM »

i guess I am having trouble with the validation concept. If I try to tell her I understand what she is saying and that I see how she might feel a certain way - she thinks I am either being sarcastic or that it is stupid for me to repeat what she is saying - like I am too stupid to understand it and need to repeat it... What can I do differently?

I can see what you are saying - when we first learned about validation, my husband said that it sounded stupid and robotic; that it did not sound natural. In a way, he was right, but we were fortunate that it does work for his daughter (my step-daughter) anyway... .

I am guessing that your daughter might see a difference in your response - that it somehow doesn't naturally fit your style. The core of validation is to affirm the feeling that the person w/BPD is having. It can be done in a variety of ways. Even an empathetic "hm... ." with a nod, can be validating. Keep trying and looking for different ways of validating - I'm sure you'll get the hang of it in a way that fits you and your daughter.

Here is a video of Dr. Alan Fruzzetti on different ways of validating that has helped me a lot:

Validation -- encouraging peace in a "BPD family".
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Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders
modafinilguy
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Posts: 51


« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2013, 12:36:15 PM »

Hello!

I have ADHD and BPD (both are severe but have good "control" of BPD these days, well from outside appearances!)

It is important she persists with the DBT, but also if she has ADHD, its important the medication of this condition is looked over in depth. You could say both disorders have the potential to fuel each other.

I know a lot of about ADHD meds, if you ever want to get some advise on ADHD meds, just PM me.

Yes I have these disorders, but I also care for young people with them. That is why I am here.

I am in good control these days.
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