Almost a Bi-polar episode yesterday

[Turkish]

I went to see a movie yesterday and upwBPDx took the kids on a few miles' walk to her mom's house. Kind of weird seeing movies by myself again, but I'll get used to it... .

I picked them up and we came home in the mid afternoon. She asked if I cold watch the kids for a little bit because she was not feeling well. Took a blanket and then laid down on my bed (the one she abandoned a few months ago) and shut the door. I had to go into the room to get something, and she was under the blanket sobbing. I sat down next to her and asked how she was feeling and what was going on. Her response was similar to what I've heard, "I don't know why I feel so sad... ." I said that she needed help. She said she was getting help, but her next T appointment isn't for a few weeks. I asked if she were thinking of harming herself, and she said no. I reminded of her of the incident two years ago where I found her collapsed on the floor, in what I thought was suicide ideation. She denied this, saying, "I'd never do that, I have my kids to think about." I told her I found the note she left up on the computer at the time and said it sounded like suicide ideation to me (I didn't tell her that when I read the note to my T, whom she saw only twice, that his response was, "she needs to be hospitalized.". I reiterated that she needed help, because this was going to play out either in my house, or somewhere else when she leaves. I left her to rest.

I checked back half and hour later and she was asleep.

About an hour later, she came out of the room like nothing happened, started doing laundry and we were getting the kids ready to go to some outdoor Christmas thing. She thanked me for watching the kids and said that she just needed to reset her brain because she was tired and it helped her. Weird. I've never seen it play out this fast before .

On the way to the function, she said that she knew she was "sick" but felt that I judged her on it and she didn't need to be judged because she was getting help, and finally started opening up to her T about her childhood issues (at this rate, it will be years before any breakthrough, IMO). I don't judge her on being "sick" (her word, I've never called her that), but I feel fully justified on judging her for her behaviors if they wrong me, or our children. I will bring this up carefully later... .My concern, other than feeling compassion for her, despite her betrayal, is that I will not be around as a safety valve when she feels like this. What if she has the kids alone? Lock herself in her room to have a cry while the little ruffians are left to their own devices? S3, D1. They need to be supervised for a few years yet. Or at least someone available to put out fires.

All in all, she said that she knew she was sick, and this was the reason she needs to leave (the r/s). But that she doesn't talk to anybody about these things except me. I said that I could support her from afar on this later, if only because of the kids (truthfully, I'd initiate infinite NC if it weren't for them... no, seriously!). So, that was our day yesterday. Today, I get the kids for most of it, which is my typical Sunday, but that's fine.

[santa]

It's definitely a different situation entirely when kids are involved. I'd happily do NC forever too if we didn't have a daughter.

Just stay on your toes because there's no level she won't stoop to. You can't trust these people.

[santa]

By the way, any of you that don't have children with these people are so lucky. If you've finally gotten free of them... .RUN... .far and fast. Cut your losses before they trap you forever.

[KE151]

Turkish, as a dad x 4 myself, I feel your worry about the children. If you have ANY concerns whatsoever about your kids' safety and wellbeing when they are with BPD, please consider getting full custody, and start the process now. I guess you have enough evidence to show to a judge that she is very unstable and potentially suicidal. She doesn't sound to be in a position to parent in her current state of mind without you being there as back up. Better be safe than sorry when kids are involved.

[maxen]

sorry Turkish to hijack for a moment ... .

By the way, any of you that don't have children with these people are so lucky.

i have been told this by everyone with whom i've discussed my situation. they say so spontaneously: "thank god you don't have kids." but i terribly miss having a child. i got cold feet as the time approached, what with her irresponsible and indisciplined behaviors (inc. alcohol), but in addition to the joys and joyful pains of raising a kiddie and to the social involvement that brings (i'm relatively socially isolated now) would our marriage have been better cemented? or would it have brought only greater stress? maybe you parents can chime in on that.

[santa]

sorry Turkish to hijack for a moment ... .

By the way, any of you that don't have children with these people are so lucky.

i have been told this by everyone with whom i've discussed my situation. they say so spontaneously: "thank god you don't have kids." but i terribly miss having a child. i got cold feet as the time approached, what with her irresponsible and indisciplined behaviors (inc. alcohol), but in addition to the joys and joyful pains of raising a kiddie and to the social involvement that brings (i'm relatively socially isolated now) would our marriage have been better cemented? or would it have brought only greater stress? maybe you parents can chime in on that.

From my experience, it does bring you closer, but only temporarily. Their hormones change through the pregnancy. They become pretty decent people. After giving birth, if they breastfeed, the good times last a little longer. After they stop breastfeeding though, about 6 months later, they're back to their normal crazy selves.

I think the closeness that comes is great, but there is an equal and opposite reaction when they decide they hate you because now the child is a weapon they use against you.

This has given me some insight to why some people with crazy wives wind up having 10+ kids. I think they do it because if you can keep her pregnant, you won't have to deal with her acting crazy as much. You can't just keep doing that forever though.

[Turkish]

sorry Turkish to hijack for a moment ... .

By the way, any of you that don't have children with these people are so lucky.

i have been told this by everyone with whom i've discussed tuation. they say so spontaneously: "thank god you don't have kids." but i terribly miss having a child. i got cold feet as the tiI  e approached, what with her irresponsible and indisciplined behaviors (inc. alcohol), but in addition to the joys and joyful pains of raising a kiddie and to the social involvement that brings (i'm relatively socially isolated now) would our marriage have been better cemented? or would it have brought only greater stress? maybe you parents can chime in on that.

hijack ok.  I'm used to having Stockholm syndrome anyway 

it's much greater stress.  her first  suicide ideation was during the second pregnancy.  She pretty much said that she couldn't handle the stress of having two children,  despite enormous support from me and her family.  everyone one is different,  but when I focused on the kids more, I  grew to resent her detachment,  which she picked up on as emotional abandonment, so she did it to me in reality. shes just not mature enough to handle the constant responsibility, whereas i take it as a challenge to grow and learn to love as well.

[maxen]

thanks to both of yiz.

when I focused on the kids more, I  grew to resent her detachment

i "joked", "i know what'll happen if we have a child. you'll take to your bed and become the world's biggest queen." she answered, "heh-heh." i firmly believed that her main motivation was to be a mother, by which i mean, not to share the work of childrearing, but to achieve a certain life-position (she even gave suggestions from time to time that her interest in me was less in me than in having a husband). i grew to resent her detachment from, for example, housework, or indeed almost any type of activity at all, so yes it could have been much worse with childrearing.

i read your OP of course and Turkish you continue to be a saint of patience. does she have a place to go if she goes?

[Turkish]

From my experience, it does bring you closer, but only temporarily. Their hormones change through the pregnancy. They become pretty decent people. After giving birth, if they breastfeed, the good times last a little longer. After they stop breastfeeding though, about 6 months later, they're back to their normal crazy selves.

I think the closeness that comes is great, but there is an equal and opposite reaction when they decide they hate you because now the child is a weapon they use against you.

This has given me some insight to why some people with crazy wives wind up having 10+ kids. I think they do it because if you can keep her pregnant, you won't have to deal with her acting crazy as much. You can't just keep doing that forever though.

Same experience. I told mine she was the nicest to me when she was pregnant, except for a few episodes. I joked that we should have been Mormon or Catholic (she is the latter, though lapsed). Then she fixed herself after D1, to never go through the pain again. I don't think she was just talking about the physical pain. So inside, she was still in turmoil, but maybe it was more directed at herself rather than me. She still doesn't get that despite the flaws of our r/s, she'll never have the intimacy of raising kids together, which knows no equal, with anyone ever again. Told me yesterday that she needed someone to "lead" and "guide" her. I told her that was a loaded r/s, and not mature. She thought I was talking about us. I let it go. Only so much breath I have to waste. Let her go find her guru. It certainly won't be some college age jock, because that idiot will only put up with so many depressive episodes like the one she did yesterday (which was severe, but short in duration before he bolts.

[Turkish]

thanks to both of yiz.

when I focused on the kids more, I  grew to resent her detachment

i "joked", "i know what'll happen if we have a child. you'll take to your bed and become the world's biggest queen." she answered, "heh-heh." i firmly believed that her main motivation was to be a mother, by which i mean, not to share the work of childrearing, but to achieve a certain life-position (she even gave suggestions from time to time that her interest in me was less in me than in having a husband). i grew to resent her detachment from, for example, housework, or indeed almost any type of activity at all, so yes it could have been much worse with childrearing.

Mine still wanted me to do at least half of the housework, despite her not lifting a finger to do the outside work in 3 years (she cut the roses all of twice). Of course, that was my job as "a man" and also my job to help inside because if I didn't, I was a "typical man!" (useless), heh. Can't win!

i read your OP of course and Turkish you continue to be a saint of patience. does she have a place to go if she goes?

NO. She can always go to her parents', but won't. I can't really force her unless she starts getting out of line again, in which case I'll call a family meeting, lay out all her bad behavior and tell them that they need to "encourage" her to get out. She's stubborn and prideful.

We were outside watching the kids today and started throwing the football around. After a while, S3 got bored, so she and I were tossing it back and forth. It almost felt normal, then I felt myself getting attracted to her again and got angry at myself.

Still undecided on forcing the custody issue. Still undecided (90% of me says "no" on me trying to recycle and "save" things. Based on yesterday's conversation, I'm still the trigger for her pain and "failure" in relationships. She thinks she'll do better next time, but I know she'll do much worse. I know her history. She didn't have much as a 26 year old woman when I met her, but it was enough (they end it/she ends it in dysfunctional ways, based on the unnamed BPD, and she knows it). But that's only my problem insofar as it might affect the kids.

I feel like the 6'+ walking carpet now, and trying to tread between co-dependency, enabling and being firm and direct.

[Ironmanrises]

She thanked me for watching the kids and said that she just needed to reset her brain because she was tired and it helped her.

Her turmoil within. She knows on some level that reality will come knocking on her door and she will not have you to "save" her from herself so to speak. Her dysregulation, which is what that sounds like(mine made similar comments about "resetting her brain" so goddamn eerie) is probably intensifying. And you are watching it unfold. Hang in there my friend. I fear the waters that surround her will only get more choppy and turbulent.

[Turkish]

She thanked me for watching the kids and said that she just needed to reset her brain because she was tired and it helped her.

Her turmoil within. She knows on some level that reality will come knocking on her door and she will not have you to "save" her from herself so to speak. Her dysregulation, which is what that sounds like(mine made similar comments about "resetting her brain" so goddamn eerie) is probably intensifying. And you are watching it unfold. Hang in there my friend. I fear the waters that surround her will only get more choppy and turbulent.

I quoted my conversation above. It was my nice way of saying, "you need MEDS, and probably HOSPITALIZATION, do you get it? But according to her, I'd be "judgemental."

Oh why oh why did I choose to not onlyhave one kid with a child, but two?