where are you?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

I'm going between 2 and 3. It has come to my attention that I have codependent tendencies and fear being alone. Acknowledging I was the other half of a toxic relationship has been an eye opener to me. My BPDex projected on me during our breakup, so I'm struggling trying to figure out the line of what I need to work on vs. what she threw on me.

[monsoon281]

I'm going between 2 and 3. It has come to my attention that I have codependent tendencies and fear being alone. Acknowledging I was the other half of a toxic relationship has been an eye opener to me. My BPDex projected on me during our breakup, so I'm struggling trying to figure out the line of what I need to work on vs. what she threw on me.

[Waifed]

Here's the thing... . I'd like to believe I'm in the 5th stage of freedom.  I don't feel like the relationship with my ex affects my current life.  What I will say, though, is that the relationship with my ex was really nothing compared to how I was raised, and the patterns I developed way before I met him.

"The fifth stage is a state of true liberation, which the sage Abhinavagupta describes as the feeling of putting down a heavy burden."

Once you surpass all the questions about BPD, why our ex's behaved as they did, how I let myself stay with them for so long, etc., it all comes down to us - not our ex's... . not by a long shot. 

Are we willing to put down that heavy burden?

That takes a lot of digging, and digging I am doing. 

So, realistically, I am probably more in stage 4. 

"When you have reached the fourth stage of detachment you will want to start something new with real enthusiasm for the doing of it, rather than out of the need to prove something."

I am looking for inspiration and allowing myself to be vulnerable, yet holding onto the knowledge I have gained - daring greatly! 

I moved from PA to TX to to start something new, after researching the area and having a good feeling it would provide the environment I needed to thrive.  Moving from survivor to thriver... . letting go of the victim and the basic survivor - I want to thrive. 

Welcome to Texas

[Allmessedup]

Surina,

That's how I feel when I have just done several miles.  I feel like I am powerful.  That burden is gone for a while.

I also feel freedom when I find something of myself to be proud of.  Increasing my distance or speed at the gym is always a good one.  Successfully doing a yoga pose I couldn't manage before, even a good bout of journaling and introspection will do it.

It has been so very long since I have felt proud of myself for doing something for myself... . it's quite freeing and makes me believe I will get there

[Surnia]

Here's the thing... . I'd like to believe I'm in the 5th stage of freedom.  I don't feel like the relationship with my ex affects my current life.  What I will say, though, is that the relationship with my ex was really nothing compared to how I was raised, and the patterns I developed way before I met him.

Same for me, Want2know. So I would not say I am in 5. I have some 5 moments. Great input about surviving - thriving!

What is important for me: No pressure about a new relationship. When I have thoughts in this direction: Am I normal, I don't have a bf - I am not in 5.

It has been so very long since I have felt proud of myself for doing something for myself... . it's quite freeing and makes me believe I will get there

I can relate with it very much.

[Surnia]

I'm going between 2 and 3. It has come to my attention that I have codependent tendencies and fear being alone. Acknowledging I was the other half of a toxic relationship has been an eye opener to me. My BPDex projected on me during our breakup, so I'm struggling trying to figure out the line of what I need to work on vs. what she threw on me.

Hi monsoon

and welcome here. 

How do you cope with your fear?

[Want2know]

Here's the thing... . I'd like to believe I'm in the 5th stage of freedom.  I don't feel like the relationship with my ex affects my current life.  What I will say, though, is that the relationship with my ex was really nothing compared to how I was raised, and the patterns I developed way before I met him.

Same for me, Want2know. So I would not say I am in 5. I have some 5 moments. Great input about surviving - thriving!

What is important for me: No pressure about a new relationship. When I have thoughts in this direction: Am I normal, I don't have a bf - I am not in 5.

This, I think, is also why I don't feel I am quite yet fully in the 5th stage, although, I agree, I have moments in it, too.

From the 5th stage of detachment:

":)esire, fear, and hopelessness are deeply embedded in our psyches, and we feel their pull whenever any remnant of attachment exists. We know that we've begun to achieve real detachment in a situation when we can contemplate what's occurring without immediately getting blindsided by these feelings."

I still get triggered when it comes to meeting new men and contemplating a relationship.  Recently, I started dating, and find that I can spot behaviors that raise the red flags, so I move on and don't pursue anything more.  What my concern is, is that perhaps I'm still gun-shy from going to any next level with someone out of my fear of what happened with my ex.

So, although I don't see myself getting into another relationship with a pwBPD/NPD, I may also be passing over people too soon.  That hesitancy and lack of confidence/trust in myself to handle the next relationship I enter, is the main reason why I feel I am still at a 4 level.

Regarding meeting new possible relationship partners, the 'freedom' level looks like one where I am not as conflicted over a new potential relationship, and instead can accurately see it for what it is and move with confidence.  My guess is there are few people that are still posting on the boards that are in the 5th level, otherwise, they probably wouldn't still be posting here.

Good thread, SB, and thank you for the welcome, Waifed.  

[Cimbaruns]

Want2know

I guess I haven't fully detached because I still have a fear issue in regards to divorcing my ex... . the fear creeps in when I know I have to have a conversation with her... .

I had to have that conversation and it went badly at first... . with her blasting me as to why I wouldn't respond to her emails (she doesn't know I had blocked her)... . then saying goodbye... . then her proceeding to barrage me with texts telling me how hurtful I was ( I had unblocked her to arrange a time to call)... .

She still I stills a feeling of fear... .

Fear of her raging... . her off the wall remarks... . her putdowns

I guess I'm still attached

[Want2know]

She still I stills a feeling of fear... .

Fear of her raging... . her off the wall remarks... . her putdowns

I guess I'm still attached

Hi Cimbaruns... . I think many people here still have that fear.  In the 2nd stage of detachment 'self-inquiry' it asks that we probe the feelings we are experiencing.  The fact that you are able to admit this fear is a good start.  

"Self analysis is also a very complex process as we are encumbered by our own self image and feelings."

If you are still in contact with her regarding your divorce, working through these feelings poses a challenge.  It takes some time to get to the processing stage where you can take what you've learned from your experience and start feeling more in control of your life.  Give yourself some time and be kind to yourself.  It might be good to start a new thread about your fears if you are up for it.

Thanks for sharing.  

[seeking balance]

Gosh, thank you all so much for sharing, so much "self-inquiry" in this thread.

So - this next part is only my opinion/view of all this - not really based on any one thing... . not saying it is right or wrong, just my thought process and where I am today.

Looking at attachments and detachment (whether from our pwBPD as in this thread or other) this is really a practice in Radical Acceptance.  "it is what it is"

Courage is a requirement for all of these phases.  Brene' Brown had an interesting quote regarding Courage:

“Courage is a heart word. The root of the word courage is cor - the Latin word for heart. In one of its earliest forms, the word courage meant "To speak one's mind by telling all one's heart." Over time, this definition has changed, and today, we typically associate courage with heroic and brave deeds. But in my opinion, this definition fails to recognize the inner strength and level of commitment required for us to actually speak honestly and openly about who we are and about our experiences -- good and bad. Speaking from our hearts is what I think of as "ordinary courage.”

Levels 1 - 3 are very core and the first few times we do this can feel big.  I remember feeling "gutted" during the deep parts of this.  What I have come to learn now, is I still have certain triggers in certain circumstance, but those first 3 are a way of thought for me now, so it happens rather quickly and the pain is less of a suffering.

I live levels 4 and 5 daily.  Fundamentally, I think level 4 - Creative Action - is truly a characteristic necessary for living a "full" live.

Marsha Linehan has a goal from DBT for BPD patients - "to create a life worth living".  For me - Creative Action is the birth of that process... . it is scary to try, but it is rewarding.

Detachment is an emotional, spiritual, physical process requiring discipline, courage and patience - the skills developed from this process, I believe, rebuild a sense of our own self that is much more sturdy.

Ok - off my soapbox... . sharing from this thread has really helped me put into words so much of my process - thank you so much for sharing everyone!

Keep sharing your stories folks.

[Stjarna]

I feel I am still hovering between 2 and 3 right now, though I have done a number of activities that could be considered Creative Action.  I do yoga classes regularly, something I had always wanted to do while married but never had gotten around to.  I took a class in Soul Collage, which is self-discovery through images.  I am an introvert, yet I have gone out to have a drink or a meal in our neighborhood pub a few times. 

I have a horse, an Icelandic mare that I adopted a few years ago as a yearling from an overrun farm in our area that needed to give away over 100 Icelandic unhandled, untrained, unmarketable horses.  She just got to the age where she could be trained to saddle last year, and she was a huge source of comfort and focus when I felt like I was going to spin down into absolute depression.  I did get her saddle trained, and this year she just needs miles and experience.  I do Competitive Mountain Orienteering rides, work on natural horsemanship techniques in the arena with her, and this year I have a goal of doing an endurance ride on her.  We had horses during the last 10 years of our marriage, mostly due to our autistic daughter and her need for horse therapy.  I do feel a sense of freedom now with my horse activities.  I noticed that it was nice to just hook up my trailer and go, without having to be home at a certain time to have dinner on the table, for instance. 

I think that I have glimpsed a few times of feeling like I'm in a state of Freedom, but I'm not totally there yet, obviously, as certain things can still trigger tears.  I'm still grieving the illusion of what I always envisioned a relationship of 40 years should be. 

[seeking balance]

I feel I am still hovering between 2 and 3 right now, though I have done a number of activities that could be considered Creative Action.  I do yoga classes regularly, something I had always wanted to do while married but never had gotten around to.  I took a class in Soul Collage, which is self-discovery through images.  I am an introvert, yet I have gone out to have a drink or a meal in our neighborhood pub a few times. 

These are really big Stjarna - pat yourself on the back 

  I'm still grieving the illusion of what I always envisioned a relationship of 40 years should be. 

Yeah, that takes time to do - letting yourself process it is very important.   

[myself]

Courage is a requirement for all of these phases.  Brene' Brown had an interesting quote regarding Courage:

“Courage is a heart word. The root of the word courage is cor - the Latin word for heart. In one of its earliest forms, the word courage meant "To speak one's mind by telling all one's heart." Over time, this definition has changed, and today, we typically associate courage with heroic and brave deeds. But in my opinion, this definition fails to recognize the inner strength and level of commitment required for us to actually speak honestly and openly about who we are and about our experiences -- good and bad. Speaking from our hearts is what I think of as "ordinary courage.”

Great to read this, thank you. So much courage on this site! Thank you all.

[Conundrum]

Detaching is a dynamic process. It is lifelong. The expiry of the process is shared by all, because we are flesh and bone.

I believe achieving a state of grace is born from this process and offers salvation--which does not necessarily require a theistic interpretation. To transcend suffering and accept that we are both one with all, and separate from all. That our feelings are the very same feelings felt by a multitude of beings, yet still remain personal to us.

For me, all five stages remain relevant, and sometimes I concurrently experience them. I think there is a risk in both 2 and 3, to compartmentalize--attempting a false sealing away of that which we consider painful. It eventually bubbles up from that inner sanctum and attacks its host.

I would describe myself as being simultaneously detached and attached. I am detached from the expectation/desire that our 7 years living together will repeat itself in a committed manner, but I am attached to the reality that she remains in this world, and we have ties that run deep. We are experientially attached, but have distinct and disordered perceptions concerning those experiences. I am detached from the burden of desiring to control and order her perceptions while accepting that all things change. Compassion springs forth from detachment affording comfort to those in need.   

[fromheeltoheal]

I'm detached from her, free from her, she's no longer a part of my life or thoughts, although I just woke up from a nap during which she made an appearance in a dream, the first one in a long time.  She'd gotten a lot of new tattoos, something about Winnie the Pooh and cunnilingus, don't know what that's about, bet Freud would have an opinion.

But my own self-inquiry and processing go on.  The pain I went through in that relationship opened a floodgate of older emotions, and it's become clear to me that the running I've been doing for years, justified by telling myself I was just working hard and playing hard, was me outrunning things I should have been processing and grieving.  I've stopped running now, it seems to be the only option left, running was killing me, and my perceptions of myself, other people and the world are all changing.  I don't know who I am or how I fit in the world right now, although I'm positive I'm no longer maintaining a false self, I'm living my real one, as uncomfortable and new as that is, but refreshing in a way.  Self inquiry and processing, day after day... .

[Conundrum]

I just woke up from a nap during which she made an appearance in a dream, the first one in a long time.  She'd gotten a lot of new tattoos, something about Winnie the Pooh and cunnilingus, don't know what that's about, bet Freud would have an opinion.

LMAO, in the history of this board I bet those two things have never before been combined in a sentence.

[Surnia]

Conundrum

Detaching is a dynamic process. It is lifelong.

Yes, I think this too. For me it goes often in circles. 




fromheeltoheal

The pain I went through in that relationship opened a floodgate of older emotions, and it's become clear to me that the running I've been doing for years, justified by telling myself I was just working hard and playing hard, was me outrunning things I should have been processing and grieving.  I've stopped running now, it seems to be the only option left, running was killing me, and my perceptions of myself, other people and the world are all changing.

Do you have some daily routines helping you stop running?

[fromheeltoheal]

Do you have some daily routines helping you stop running?

Yes, I've had to work on it and it's still a process, but exercise, meditation, having a schedule and a routine that is healthy, and most importantly setting boundaries so I don't allow people to overload me with commitments, a rebuke of my people pleaser tendencies.