Getting used to feeling uncomfortable and living less of a life

[guitarguy09]

Another relational fallout happened yesterday, between my uBPDw and our Pastor/church. We have met with the Pastor a few times to talk about our relational difficulties with my family. Though things have gotten better since we started (we are getting together with my parents again), yesterday's meeting did not go so well. Apparently my wife has talked to too many women at the church. She has a habit of seeking out a sympathetic ear, then constantly dumping all her problems out and talking about them. The problem is, a lot of the women have talked to the pastor are were concerned that she was constantly harping on this problem. The Pastor brought this up in the meeting yesterday, along with the strong recommendation of counseling. He basically made us commit to it on the spot, though there is approximately 0% chance that she will go. I am perfectly willing to go to work on my codependency issues as long as she is willing to go and work on her anxiety issue and other issues. She loves to just tell people what they need to hear to get out of a situation.

I think the Pastor was tired of hearing about everything going on, mainly because he and others give out advice but my wife only listens to the voice in her own head telling her what to do. Now, she has basically sworn off the church and everyone in it because they are "talking about me behind my back". There may be some gray area there since it is a Pastor and they weren't talking to each other about it hopefully. But on Sunday we have a small group that meets in the evening that just so happens to be for married couples. So I'm not sure if I should go alone and say she was sick, or something like that, or what to do.

I'm starting to get very used to the idea that these fallouts or episodes seem to happen about once a month. I am working on a list of all the people she has had a problem with since she met. I expect it will be about 15 people or so, which is astronomical compared to a normal person.

I feel (and I'm sure many others do too) like I'm living less of a life than I would if I were married to a non-BPD person. My wife has torched so many relationships, including ones in the family (on a side note, I'm not all that close to anyone in my family, especially my sisters who I don't see much anymore). I know it's pointless but I imagine life with intact relationships, and not having to meet with different people or having my wife run out to the bar when she's pissed off with me (usually happens once a month along with her rage).

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[Stalwart]

Hey guitarguy   A bit long but it might be worth the read.

I've always experienced the same difficulty with my wife in the past. Quit a government job with a DB pension at 28 years rather than waiting two more years to pension because she finally found one person who said she was right, "... . you shouldn’t have to put up with those other girls in the workplace – it isn’t right." Imagine! 28 years of work and quitting two years early so you have to cash out on a DC pension and no benefits. She had the best protected pension and benefit package a  person could hope for that remained with her pension. Wow. Not a darn thing I could say or do to stop her. Her FRIEND told her it was the right thing for her to do. Probably also told her just to shut her up and get her out of her face as well.

Every time she would come up with an outrageous want, or do something that really made no practical sense or someone confronted her with an opinion she felt slighted by she would seek out validation from ANYONE who just agreed with her. No matter who it was or how many people she had to go through. The bum on the corner begging cigarette butts, their opinion was one hundred percent right because they said yes to her for token amount of money for smokes a two minutes of listening and mine or someone in conflict with her was absolutely wrong. "The bum on the corner said so... . "

Please don’t misunderstand; my wife is neither simple nor lacking for intelligence. She is probably one of the highest functioning people I know when she applies herself. There are no screws missing, just a few that are loose.

I've been able to change that over time now that she's more aware of her condition and so am I.

She's learned to trust my opinions, but I've really learned a lot as well in treating her with the type of respect she requires. Validation, SET all those tools are wonderful tools if you can apply them with indifference and accept radical acceptance of understanding that her feelings are all real to her - warped sideways or not, they're her feelings and understandings. I should also say that doesn't mean I agree with anything she says but she learned to put enough trust in me to listen to my opinion and I'm careful and mindful of how I put them out there. I'll also help her seek validation in other places if she seems to need it. I’ve always found now that her feelings are generally based on real perceptions of situations but she seems to just blow every anthill into a mountain with a virtually unstoppable need to resolve the issue in her mind. The further it goes unresolved the more deregulated she becomes until it can be resolved. Then there’s always the roller coaster of bringing up past issues again because god forbid she ever forget anything that’s negatively affected her. I’m not saying this sarcastically, if it wasn’t so serious it would almost be humorous. It just comes down to being what it is, chronic in nature and a condition that will probably always need to be attended and nurtured with her.

I can sympathize with your parishioners, it is so taxing to continuously have to hear the ramblings of a “crazy” person time and time again on the same subject with no resolution until SOMEONE – SOMEWHERE will just say Yes! It becomes worse when those who said no have to be readdressed because she did find someone to say, yes.

I found the key to really solving the outside interference affecting others was to take the role on of having her trust MY opinions. That’s a lot harder said than done, it isn’t accomplished through a lot of words but through a lot of action and proving to her that I do value her opinions,  that I’m there for her, I do understand recognized and am concerned about her concerns, to protect her, to care for her and that her interests are the most important things to me because they are the most important things to maintaining and working toward our own futures together. It really takes time to build that relationship but if you can successfully accomplish it and maintain it, it’s worth every bit of the effort.

I takes the ball away your friends court and puts it back into your court where basically you really need it if you’re ever to build a better relationship with her and maintain friendships as well.

Anyway, just wanted to say that I can certainly sympathize with you on this one and that there is hope and there are solutions if you can manage them.

Best of luck.

[guitarguy09]

You're right, it was long but worth the read. I appreciate your own experience of this, and probably you have a lot more experience than me at dealing with it but I have learned quite a few lessons (some of them the hard way) on how to deal with her the past several years.

I think that's a great idea to get her to trust my ideas and opinions more by using SET. I was actually amazed because last night I was doing just that by telling her that I thought she felt rejected by my sisters. I was sure she was going to have an extinction burst but because I let her vent out her feelings, and also validated the ones I found to be true, she actually told "no matter what, you're always good to me." We had a nice evening, where a year ago we might have argued all night and she might have just stormed right out.

[waverider]

Hey guitarguy   A bit long but it might be worth the read.

I've always experienced the same difficulty with my wife in the past. Quit a government job with a DB pension at 28 years rather than waiting two more years to pension because she finally found one person who said she was right, "... . you shouldn’t have to put up with those other girls in the workplace – it isn’t right." Imagine! 28 years of work and quitting two years early so you have to cash out on a DC pension and no benefits. She had the best protected pension and benefit package a  person could hope for that remained with her pension. Wow. Not a darn thing I could say or do to stop her. Her FRIEND told her it was the right thing for her to do. Probably also told her just to shut her up and get her out of her face as well.

Every time she would come up with an outrageous want, or do something that really made no practical sense or someone confronted her with an opinion she felt slighted by she would seek out validation from ANYONE who just agreed with her. No matter who it was or how many people she had to go through. The bum on the corner begging cigarette butts, their opinion was one hundred percent right because they said yes to her for token amount of money for smokes a two minutes of listening and mine or someone in conflict with her was absolutely wrong. "The bum on the corner said so... . "

Please don’t misunderstand; my wife is neither simple nor lacking for intelligence. She is probably one of the highest functioning people I know when she applies herself. There are no screws missing, just a few that are loose.

I've been able to change that over time now that she's more aware of her condition and so am I.

She's learned to trust my opinions, but I've really learned a lot as well in treating her with the type of respect she requires. Validation, SET all those tools are wonderful tools if you can apply them with indifference and accept radical acceptance of understanding that her feelings are all real to her - warped sideways or not, they're her feelings and understandings. I should also say that doesn't mean I agree with anything she says but she learned to put enough trust in me to listen to my opinion and I'm careful and mindful of how I put them out there. I'll also help her seek validation in other places if she seems to need it. I’ve always found now that her feelings are generally based on real perceptions of situations but she seems to just blow every anthill into a mountain with a virtually unstoppable need to resolve the issue in her mind. The further it goes unresolved the more deregulated she becomes until it can be resolved. Then there’s always the roller coaster of bringing up past issues again because god forbid she ever forget anything that’s negatively affected her. I’m not saying this sarcastically, if it wasn’t so serious it would almost be humorous. It just comes down to being what it is, chronic in nature and a condition that will probably always need to be attended and nurtured with her.

I can sympathize with your parishioners, it is so taxing to continuously have to hear the ramblings of a “crazy” person time and time again on the same subject with no resolution until SOMEONE – SOMEWHERE will just say Yes! It becomes worse when those who said no have to be readdressed because she did find someone to say, yes.

I found the key to really solving the outside interference affecting others was to take the role on of having her trust MY opinions. That’s a lot harder said than done, it isn’t accomplished through a lot of words but through a lot of action and proving to her that I do value her opinions,  that I’m there for her, I do understand recognized and am concerned about her concerns, to protect her, to care for her and that her interests are the most important things to me because they are the most important things to maintaining and working toward our own futures together. It really takes time to build that relationship but if you can successfully accomplish it and maintain it, it’s worth every bit of the effort.

I takes the ball away your friends court and puts it back into your court where basically you really need it if you’re ever to build a better relationship with her and maintain friendships as well.

Anyway, just wanted to say that I can certainly sympathize with you on this one and that there is hope and there are solutions if you can manage them.

Best of luck.

This pretty much matches up to my experiences too. To this I would add that these random yes/agreements that she elicits from various sources, even if that agreement was only 5% of what they say, are all cut and pasted together to give their own reconstructed "truth". This may not even have any similarity to the "agreements" from others.

In truth no one really agreed with what she is actually proposing now. But a "conclusion' is required to end the obsession. The less she feels the need to justify to you then the less wide the net is thrown to gather these "truths".

Validating her right to her reality and the less you try to convince her of yours, the less she feels the need to seek outside validation.

Keep up your own life and interactions with others, and she will just have to get used to it. There will be some give and take, but make sure you are not doing all the giving and not taking.

[guitarguy09]

Wow, I totally agree with your point about having pieces of truth from here or there and putting it all together. It's hard to know if what she is saying is 100% true most of the time. Mostly there are partial truths here and there.

Exactly, she needs to find a conclusion/answer to her problem. But since it's such a complex issue there's not really a solution, at least not until the other party will come forward and be willing to apologize whether they feel like it or not.

Usually the more she argues a point, the less I will push back on her. I like to just let her vent her frustration, and I agree with the points that I believe are correct. I have found in the past that pushing back, or I guess invalidating just makes things worse.

I plan to keep attending church there regardless as I also play on the worship team. If I didn't play on the team so regularly, it would be a lot easier for her to try hard to get me to stop going there too. But I think she has also realized that I have a life of my own. She and our son may look at a couple different churches. Since he is so little, I am not overly concerned but I'm glad she will take him somewhere.