When Reality Meets Perception: Silent Treatment

[Loveofhislife]

As my picture shows, I identify with cats--especially wise, old cats who continue to imperil themselves with their curiosity.  I KNEW I was being devalued.  As I've said on other boards, this is not this cat's first rodeo.  I have lived through NPD and BPD first with a father then with a husband and since divorce; with two significant NPD's:  one who I would characterize as a malignant narcissist, one who was a Peter Pan-type narcissist, and now: a CLASSIC BPD, who I really thought was the kinder, gentler version of the other two but with some real needy/clingy issues.  UNTIL (supposedly) last Tuesday night, after ten months of a tumultuous relationship that has included my getting him through evictions, a halfway house, two terminations, a child support case, and NEVER ENDING financial crises.  It hasn't been boring to say the least.  Throughout these ten months, I have scarcely been able to take a breath (much less put my phone down for more than two minutes)--he has insisted on being with me nearly every waking moment, though I have three children and an amicable relationship with their father.  After a typical confrontation with him Tuesday night when he threatened to "break a bottle over his head, and shove it up his ass,"--he was referring to a gentleman who was a wine vendor at a friend's wine tasting, he ended his text by saying, "you'll have to find somone else to fix up things around your house."  That triggered me--the sweet little kitten in me was instantly mobilized into an angry cat.  However, AGAIN--our verbal jousting was at a restaurant where he now characterizes that I was "YELLING" at him and even grabbed his arm.  I cannot begin to describe the verbal and psychological abuse I have endured these last ten months.  He has literally melted down about things and people:  real and imagined, on at least a daily basis.  I had to call the police twice, thinking he was suicidal.  After nearly a week of his first ever giving me "the silent treatment," he tells me calmly and cooly over the phone that he has never been suicidal or violent in his life--that it is I who has verbally abused him.  It sounded like another person over the phone, as it has sounded like a different person on the few texts I've received from him over the past week.  Is the silent treatment my punishment or the demonstration of devaluation?  And most certainly, a path to a discarding of me?

[Mutt]

Wow. You've had a lot of PDs in your life.   It's emotional blackmail. Do you have kids with him? Is this why there's contact due to children?

[2010]

As my picture shows, I identify with cats--especially wise, old cats who continue to imperil themselves with their curiosity.

I'm fairly certain that "wise" and "continue to imperil themselves" exclude each other. At a certain point, being wise means learning to stop certain behaviors.

I had to call the police twice, thinking he was suicidal.  After nearly a week of his first ever giving me "the silent treatment," he tells me calmly and cooly over the phone that he has never been suicidal or violent in his life--that it is I who has verbally abused him.  It sounded like another person over the phone, as it has sounded like a different person on the few texts I've received from him over the past week.

There's no need to call the police anymore. He has made that clear.

Is the silent treatment my punishment or the demonstration of devaluation?

The silent treatment is his protection from you. It is not a "demonstration of devaluation" but a demonstration of engulfment. You are certainly calling the shots in his life and while that may be reasoned by you as necessary, to a person with BPD, it can be a self fulfilling prophecy that they cannot trust anyone.

It should also signify to you that your upbringing with a narcissistic Father, a Husband, two boyfriends, and now... . a Man you think is needy/clingy demands your participation in such a way that you "continue to imperil yourself with your curiosity."

You see, this is really about dynamics and finding these Men means you have some trust/control issues of your own to work through. Perhaps it's time to find a counselor, one who can address the possibility that you've now exchanged roles in the power struggle, similar to NPD/BPD.

And most certainly, a path to a discarding of me?

If you keep trying, it's a path of back and forth, not going anywhere. It is a swinging pendulum, from clinging to hating, with the silent treatment being the detached protector that exists in all people with BPD who are engulfed.

The detached protector shows you that you are controlling, and rather than suffer through the pendulum swings, they have shut down.

Your "verbal jousting" restaurant scene brought out the angry child, the "insisting on being with me nearly every waking moment" was the abandoned child. Now, that both child states have been triggered after they failed to attach to you (as they should,) the detached protector comes in and lets you know that you (as the failed attachment) are persecutorial- perhaps in response to your calling the police.

Dysfunction rules and the end result is chaos because BPD is an attachment disorder.

The way out of this is to understand your own reasons for having this drama in your life. If you've been raised by a Narcissist, you probably have never had your voice heard. Finding a person without a self, who is clinging and needy may have allowed you to finally be reflected in such a way that you felt heard-perhaps for the first time in your life. Now, with the silent treatment, your voice is gone and this is devastating to you. This is what you need to work on in therapy.

Hope this helps. 

[Loveofhislife]

Dear 2010:  I'm going to go out on a limb (as cats also do to imperil themselves) and guess that we do not share the same sense of humor nor the same sensitivities to people suffering--especially a suffering someone whose name clearly has NEWBIE written above it.  This was my first post (other than my introduction), and yes, I thought you were a bit harsh.

The following post outlines disagreement I have with most of your post with the exception of your closing comment which is brilliant and insightful, "The way out of this is to understand your own reasons for having this drama in your life. If you've been raised by a Narcissist, you probably have never had your voice heard. Finding a person without a self, who is clinging and needy may have allowed you to finally be reflected in such a way that you felt heard-perhaps for the first time in your life. Now, with the silent treatment, your voice is gone and this is devastating to you. This is what you need to work on in therapy."

The opening remark about the IRONY of cats was to make a point:  I am learned and wise; I am talented and am blessed with loving friends and family in my life--that is what makes it so IRONIC that I continue to seek out (note I'm not calling myself a victim here) narcissistic men.  Murry Bowen says we are attracted to people who reflect our own emotional level of development; I believe she is correct.  All of my PD's have literally been able to beckon my "inner child" to come play, and she gladly follows her pied pipers onto the playground of her life. (hopefully that analogy communicates what I am attempting to convey).

As a person who is not only highly educated in the behavior change field but also has been  a national educator on the subject of "marketing" behavior change, we all must acknowledge that if awareness and wisdom were the cures for habitual and addictive behaviors, no one would be obese, smoking, heavily drinking, or abusing drugs.  Again, it is an IRONY that many of us "experts" who are drawn to this field are among the least compliant or recovered from whatever it is we are addicted to.  I, for one, know that I am addicted to NPD/BPD; however, I also have been recovered.  I am seeking a future where I am no longer dependent on the high I get from relationships with NPD/BPD.

No need to call the police?  Again, as a person trained in the area of crisis intervention (I co-wrote a curriculum for law enforcement Crisis Intervention Teams), I would feel culpable NOT to call the police when I feel that a person is a danger to themselves or others.  Very few people who successfully commit suicide have called law enforcement to say, "Hey, I'm really panicked and suicidal, will you please come and pick me up?"

Your assumption that I have not found a counselor was also presumptive; you might have asked.  I have an excellent counselor who agrees with almost none of your observations other than the effect growing up with narcissistic parents had on me.  Her path for me is to learn to be gentle with me; to love my inner child the way that these men have in the idealization phase; and to not NEED anything or anyone external. Your remarks were not inquisitive, gentle, or empathetic.  Hmmm... . who/what does that sound like?

I agree with you regarding power/control issues which have not only helped me to survive a narcissistic father but have caused me a great deal of pain in relationships: ANOTHER IRONY!  Engulfment?  Maybe... . but I've never felt more engulfed by anyone in my life or experienced more attempts to control me than the 10 months with my BPD. And yes, he is quite like my father was. (You might rightfully assume my father is no longer living).

Your insinuations that I have become a BPD/NPD is a manifestation of your lack of understanding of the role that co-dependents play in this dance Maccabre with personality disorders.  We are the opposite side of the same coin.  We love to be needed, and BPD is ALL ABOUT NEED.  Some authors even call us "inverted narcissists."  I strongly disagree, as I know that I am very empathetic, animated, and well grounded in reality.  But we co-dependents do rescue, engulf and can be very controlling:  I'll give you that.

Finally, your description of the "detached protector" is the polar opposite of many authorities I've read on the subject of abuse--that the "silent treatment" is among the cruelest forms of psychological abuse.  Shooting a gun in dangerous neighborhoods might seem very "protective" but it is utterly unacceptable in a civil society, and the risk of carelessly using such an assault weapon can likely damage innocent bystanders.

IRONICALLY, the now "detached protector" has often said he felt very protected by me, and that I make him feel "safe."  He knew and appreciated that I  would not tolerate threats or demonstrations of suicidal intent, and he has not gone there again.  A very painful boundary was set.

Thank you again for your remarks.  I shall relay them to my therapist and further contemplate them myself.

[2010]

This:

As I've said on other boards, this is not this cat's first rodeo.

Then this:

name clearly has NEWBIE written above it.  This was my first post (other than my introduction), and yes, I thought you were a bit harsh.

Loveofhislife, you appear to have been on many "boards" as you said yourself, "this isn't your first rodeo." My apologies if I misunderstood that statement.

Just to re-confirm:

"As a person who is not only highly educated in the behavior change field but also has been a national educator on the subject of "marketing" behavior change... . as a person trained in the area of crisis intervention (I co-wrote a curriculum for law enforcement Crisis Intervention Teams) Again, it is an IRONY that many of us "experts" who are drawn to this field are among the least compliant or recovered from whatever it is we are addicted to.

I am understanding that you consider yourself an expert. You are now on the leaving board and you wish to detach.

Finally, your description of the "detached protector" is the polar opposite of many authorities I've read on the subject of abuse

I'm not saying that this behavior isn't abusive. I'm giving you a behavioral reason why he does it. This is Jeffrey Young's interpretation of the child states in BPD.

Your assumption that I have not found a counselor was also presumptive; you might have asked.

I did not imply that you have not found a counselor, I simply said, "with the silent treatment, your voice is gone and this is devastating to you. This is what you need to work on in therapy."

As Mutt asked and I'll re-ask, you seem to have been involved with many personality disordered people. What do you need from the board that you haven't received from the other boards you have been on? 

[Narellan]

Thanks 2010 for your post. I learned something about silent treatment I hadn't read before 

Also reading about my unheard voice raised a few questions for me ill discuss with my T further. Very insightful thank you xx

[Loveofhislife]

To clarify, 2010, I am new to BPD Family. I have written an introduction and posted remarks on BPD Family over the past two days. Today, the Newbie, wrote her first, independent post feeling very vulnerable. What do I need? Interesting choice of words: I NEED wholeness, peace, and sustainable recovery; however, that is not my purpose for joining this group. As a thinking, feeling, compassionate human being, I WANT to gain knowledge and support to enhance my recovery with hopes that I will, likewise, enhance others. I put "expert" in quotes as self deprecation, because I don't believe there are truly experts on NPD/BPD except the sufferers themselves. I did not come to this group expecting to find experts but fellow human beings in pain who are seeking help and supporting others' recovery with their learning. Frankly, I'm not hearing anything about you or your story: only critiques of mine. But thanks again for the resource and thoughts on silent treatment.

[cosmonaut]

The way out of this is to understand your own reasons for having this drama in your life. If you've been raised by a Narcissist, you probably have never had your voice heard. Finding a person without a self, who is clinging and needy may have allowed you to finally be reflected in such a way that you felt heard-perhaps for the first time in your life. Now, with the silent treatment, your voice is gone and this is devastating to you. This is what you need to work on in therapy.

Wow, there are times when you just floor me with your insights, 2010.  I think this hits on exactly why my ex's silence has been so agonizing for me.  It indeed arises from my own FOO, and it now makes me feel once again invisible as I often did as a child.  I continue to be amazed at how profoundly these wounds from childhood haunt us long into adulthood.

Hope this helps. 

It helped me.

[cosmonaut]

The silent treatment is brutal, loveofhislife.  You are absolutely right when you say that it can be abusive.  While there may or may not be actual malicious intent from our pwBPD, it is undeniably agonizing for us to deal with.  I went through routine rounds of silent treatment with my ex, usually for reasons inexplicable to me at the time, and ultimately she discarded me entirely.  The only communication we have had since she left, was for her to text me to never contact her again after I had called to reach out.  I don't expect I will ever hear from her again, and I am working on coming to grips with that.  It's hard.  Some members think it is for the best.  Maybe it is, but it's still very hard and it hurts very much.

It sounds like you grew up around PDs.  I did too.  This is something that I have only recently come to realize.  I was never very close with my parents, but had always assumed I had a fairly normal home life as a child.  As my T has pointed out, for me it really was normal.  It was the only family life I knew.  My mother was very likely a narcissist and suffered severe bouts of depression.  My father was a rather cold and emotionally distant man.  I am realizing how much that was the beginning of my codependency issues and primed me for an attraction to BPD.  It sounds like you may have experienced similar.

How are you feeling today?  Have you heard anything from your bf (ex?) or are you still receiving the silent treatment?  If you want to continue the relationship, probably the best thing to do is to continue on with your life and see if he comes around to wanting to talk again.  If you want to leave, then I would use the time to begin detaching.  I never realized it until my ex left me, but BPDs often can feel engulfed and so they can run away and otherwise distance themselves in an attempt to end the overwhelming emotions engulfment causes them.  It's a very destructive coping mechanism, and like so much of BPD causes suffering for everyone involved.  I am not convinced that pwBPD engage in the silent treatment as punishment or sadistic pleasure.  That has not been my experience.  My ex was very much a waif/hermit, however, so perhaps experiences are much different with others (the witch, the queen, etc.).

Anyway, keep posting.  Sorry if you have felt unwelcomed.  I'm not sure that 2010 intended to insult you, but I can certainly appreciate how you might feel that way.  He was being rather blunt.  Sometimes people here can be a bit pointed, but overall it's a very supportive and helpful forum.  I've learned so much here.  Hope you will keep sharing.

Hang in there.  I know the silent treatment hurts.   

[Narellan]

Thanks for your post Cosmo. I love reading your insightful posts.

And yes, everyone on here has been truly supportive and informative in their opinions. We are all going through pain LOHL ( my ex always referred to me as that )

Sometimes our pain and anger comes across as hurtful, especially if people are in a different detachment stage from ourselves. I learn something new here everyday. Sometimes it's confronting sometimes it rips my heart out. But coming here has been my lifeline and I am grateful to all my new found friends.