Waif-Queen in email

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

In the home strectch of joint custody and my CS with my uBPDx for S4 and D2.

I hired the L and we served her through mail. My CS obligation calculated at almost half of the amount she asked for unofficially. I've been paying her that until we are filed. I told her the calculation over a month ago, and I was surprised she didn't channel Queen, and accepted it... when she was still living with me, and all but throwing her r/s in my face, she was definitely Queen, and by an online calculator, estimated I owed her over twice our unofficial agreement.

She then asked for the unifficial amount, due to guilt mostly,.so I wouldn't "lose the house and could leave it to the kids."

The L said that the extra amount I was agreeing to had to be written into the agreement. I emailed her yesterday asking,

"This is the calculated amount, but I will agree to keep paying you $xxx." (I don't want to post the actual wording here, but I was BIFF). Notice my FOG.

She replied, "I appreciate your offer, Turkish, but I don't want you throwing in my face later that you are taking care of me." A few sentences about her wanting to keep being the ones buying the kids' clothes (realistically, I do buy some too). Then a repeat of her not wanting me to 'throw in her face' that I am taking care of her. I sent the short exchange to my L (with whom I'm trying to educate on BPD because he never heard if it, and also suggesting to him to refer future clients like me who might come in ranting about BPD as I did to.BPD Family). He responded, "what an interesting combination of hubris and humility!" That's Queen and Waif, minus the similies.

I responded with BIFF and S.E.T.. I won't check for a response until the weekend's up. I have my kids. Need to focus on them. Something like,"Thank you for taking care of our children like that. I understand your feeling of not wanting to feel like I'm throwing something in your face, but typically, buying clothes is not written into stiplulations... . " another thank you from me, and, "hopfully we can get this behind us and focus 100% on raising our little angels." Possible mistake in that last sentence, I realized after I sent it. Could be seen as accusatory.

So I'm going to look over the combined stipulation this weekend, and tell him to serve her through mail (again). Having us all legally protected (even her) will help immensely with my detachment.

(Mods: I didn't post to the legal board because I had no question, and I feel guilty my legal issues aren't near as bad as most of the horror stories there, feel free to override me if you must  ;

[Turkish]

In the home strectch of joint custody and my CS with my uBPDx for S4 and D2.

I hired the L and we served her through mail. My CS obligation calculated at almost half of the amount she asked for unofficially. I've been paying her that until we are filed. I told her the calculation over a month ago, and I was surprised she didn't channel Queen, and accepted it... when she was still living with me, and all but throwing her r/s in my face, she was definitely Queen, and by an online calculator, estimated I owed her over twice our unofficial agreement.

She then asked for the unifficial amount, due to guilt mostly,.so I wouldn't "lose the house and could leave it to the kids."

The L said that the extra amount I was agreeing to had to be written into the agreement. I emailed her yesterday asking,

"This is the calculated amount, but I will agree to keep paying you $xxx." (I don't want to post the actual wording here, but I was BIFF). Notice my FOG.

She replied, "I appreciate your offer, Turkish, but I don't want you throwing in my face later that you are taking care of me." A few sentences about her wanting to keep being the ones buying the kids' clothes (realistically, I do buy some too). Then a repeat of her not wanting me to 'throw in her face' that I am taking care of her. I sent the short exchange to my L (with whom I'm trying to educate on BPD because he never heard if it, and also suggesting to him to refer future clients like me who might come in ranting about BPD as I did to.BPD Family). He responded, "what an interesting combination of hubris and humility!" That's Queen and Waif, minus the similies.

I responded with BIFF and S.E.T.. I won't check for a response until the weekend's up. I have my kids. Need to focus on them. Something like,"Thank you for taking care of our children like that. I understand your feeling of not wanting to feel like I'm throwing something in your face, but typically, buying clothes is not written into stiplulations... . " another thank you from me, and, "hopfully we can get this behind us and focus 100% on raising our little angels." Possible mistake in that last sentence, I realized after I sent it. Could be seen as accusatory.

So I'm going to look over the combined stipulation this weekend, and tell him to serve her through mail (again). Having us all legally protected (even her) will help immensely with my detachment.

(Mods: I didn't post to the legal board because I had no question, and I feel guilty my legal issues aren't near as bad as most of the horror stories there, feel free to override me if you must  ;

[livednlearned]

She replied, "I appreciate your offer, Turkish, but I don't want you throwing in my face later that you are taking care of me."

Well, good to have that in writing, I guess! Do you think she is more agreeable right now because she's in the idealization stage of her new relationship?

[Turkish]

She replied, "I appreciate your offer, Turkish, but I don't want you throwing in my face later that you are taking care of me."

Well, good to have that in writing, I guess! Do you think she is more agreeable right now because she's in the idealization stage of her new relationship?

Definitely, which is why I want this signed, sealed and done before it breaks down. It could take a while though, but you never know. If she catches him cheating, based upon her previous experiences with the two bfs before me, she will go into Super Clinger mode, so even then I may be safe. The old journal of hers I found last week revealed that her last short term bf cheated on her. My Ex told me that he stole her car one night... . leaving out the details, and she had to get an RO on him. The journal revealed that he stole it to go to his old girlfriend's house. Interesting puzzle piece.

Since she has now, however, posted her luv all over social media (and a lot of people see it was weird, even those who don't quite know what happened), it might trigger her shame and bad behaviors. With no male attachment, she might cling back to the kids, which is what I fear.

I keep everything LC as possible. I'm surprised that she "triggered herself" by projecting that onto me, since we had one argument like that back in October and nothing since, even the previous F2F conversation about the extra money, which was very civil and short. It may be a sign of instability, however, but I'm not going to go crazy trying to figure it out. I have my "moles" which will warn me if things get bad, which she will, of course, post to FB. Not for me (I told them: "tell me nothing unless you think it might affect the kids" and one still didn't tell me about her posting a pic of her, kids and my replacement together until after I told him I got her to admit to me that their behaviors were due to her bf being there all of the time);  rather for me to not be broadsided by something with the kids.

I do also sense (and my T brought this up, too), that she does have a certain amount of respect for me, and is still immensely guilty for what this all is. If I am kind, patient, and don't engage to trigger, then I let her own shame and guilt work in our favor. I was her "Father" after all! The most mature r/s she'll ever have. I fought her emotional immaturity every step of the r/s, which is one reason why we had problems from the very beginning.

[Matt]

I would suggest either doing all the negotiation through your attorney - you can tell him exactly what to offer, but let him formulate the wording - or else keeping it all extremely simple and practical.

All by e-mail of course - not phone or face-to-face.  Keep the e-mails as simple as possible - the fewest possible number of words - all focused on the topic at hand.

Offer what you think is right - use your state's formula - don't think you will be rewarded for giving more than she is due.

If she accepts your offer, great - it's done.

If she makes a counter-proposal that you think is good, you can accept it and you're done.

Otherwise - if she says no but doesn't make a counter-proposal, or if her counter-proposal isn't reasonable in your view - end the discussion and let the court decide.  If your offer was based on your state's guidelines, the court will probably rule accordingly.

No need to stay engaged and go around and around on such a simple matter.  That does nobody any good and keeps you wrapped up in her crazy.

[Turkish]

I would suggest either doing all the negotiation through your attorney - you can tell him exactly what to offer, but let him formulate the wording - or else keeping it all extremely simple and practical.

All by e-mail of course - not phone or face-to-face.  Keep the e-mails as simple as possible - the fewest possible number of words - all focused on the topic at hand.

Offer what you think is right - use your state's formula - don't think you will be rewarded for giving more than she is due.

If she accepts your offer, great - it's done.

If she makes a counter-proposal that you think is good, you can accept it and you're done.

Otherwise - if she says no but doesn't make a counter-proposal, or if her counter-proposal isn't reasonable in your view - end the discussion and let the court decide.  If your offer was based on your state's guidelines, the court will probably rule accordingly.

No need to stay engaged and go around and around on such a simple matter.  That does nobody any good and keeps you wrapped up in her crazy.

I was still surprised that the support came out so low. Good thing I hired a lawyer, because if we had done it ourselves, using the online calculator, it would be a few hundred more per month.

The L let she and I work it out, then we served her the first time. She still was asking about the money, so that is the background on this conversation. I sent a short email back, no reply. I went over the combined custody/support package a few more times (correcting an birthday error he didn't catch), and we served her. I was copied by mail with the papers. If she asks me more questions, I will do what you said, and what my L told me at this point, to let him handle it from here.

The first time, it was like she didn't even read it, and asked me a few basic questions. She is ESL, but isn't dumb, so I don't know what that is about. I sent her the email that said she should have gotten served through mail again, along with some logistical discussion regarding getting our son into school (I took it upon myself to go sign him up tomorrow... . have to show them that there is an involved father, because I get the bias against us in these situations). If she asks questions, I will tell her to communicate with his office. Hopefully, she will not hire her own L, but that is her right if she so chooses. Hopefully this is almost done and we can focus 100% on the kids.