How prevalent is cheating?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Just how common place is it for BPs to cheat?  They are such talented liars than it is probably easier for them to cover their tracks than most people.

Has your BP cheated and did you see it coming?   

[Perdita]

Just how common place is it for BPs to cheat?  They are such talented liars than it is probably easier for them to cover their tracks than most people.

Has your BP cheated and did you see it coming?   

[woodsposse]

Cheating, unfortunately, is a human condition. It isn't reserved for someone with a PD. But in terms of BPD, they may not consider it cheating in the same regard as a non would.   well, at least the pain and devastation associated with. A non being hurt they may not see it the same way.

is there something going on in your world you could share to give some background to your question? 

[mace17]

I know my uBPDh threatened to but I have no idea if he carried out his threat or not. 

[WisdomSeeker]

Hi Perdita. I didn't realize it until my last relationship, but I have dated three different ex BPD gfs. And all three cheated on me. Prior to these gfs, I had been treated very well by women. Coincidentally, all three of the cheating BPD gfs were Asian. But, I didn't know they were BPD at the time.

My last one, actually had an affair with a guy for a month while I was living in her house. It was very difficult to see her lie and come home at 4 AM with disheveled hair. She is a very high functioning/successful BPD. Ironically, she was a horrible liar. She was very transparent. After living with her for 3 years, I knew her pretty well and could tell if she was lying. The biggest indicator was when she started showing signs of guilt or shame. She always wanted me to take her out to expensive dinners. Then when her birthday came around, she wanted to downgrade where I was taking her. What the heck? As a result, I knew something was wrong and I started to pay attention. Everything became obvious thereafter. She didn't even use any of the nice Christmas presents I bought her that she asked for.

What I have noticed is that they will try to argue with you on a very trivial issue to justify their cheating.

Best wishes. Be well.

[Perdita]

What I have noticed is that they will try to argue with you on a very trivial issue to justify their cheating.

I agree. 

BTW, my gifts to him have all been accepted yet tossed aside or simply left lying somewhere else for months until I would end up collecting it in humiliation. 

[Perdita]

is there something going on in your world you could share to give some background to your question?

The latest is that he left on a business trip by car on Monday morning.  This after telling me on Friday that HQ wants him to go, but that there is no way that he will and he will simply delegate instead (is in a position to do so if he wants).  Then suddenly I get a call early Monday morning to say he is in a rush to leave.  So I go over and help him pack as usual. When I expressed my surprise about it, he simply said that he told me about it on Friday.  I didn't bother to argue.

Tuesday morning he calls and mentions he is not sure yet if he will take the obvious route back to the city when returning or if he will be returning via his very sleazy ex-housemate's hometown (where she now lives).  Her hometown is a 3 hour drive out of his way.  He said he might stay over there! Suspicious to say the least even though he naturally didn't mention her name.  I didn't say anything, but was so upset that I put his calls on "reject" for the rest of the day and ignored his messages.  He knows how I feel about that alcoholic slut who has done nothing but use him financially and caused me a whole lot of pain.

Yesterday (Wednesday) afternoon he started the drive back here.  He send some text messages along the way and called once while on the road.  I thought it was very odd the times he was making, towns he claimed to be at.  Said he was driving back directly.  No mention of her town.  It worried me a bit that he was going to be driving 9 hours, most at night.  Yet, I must admit, I was eager to have him back where I can see him.  He got back at midnight.

I spend this afternoon with him.  The usual signs were there that he had seen her.  The 1st was that when he took me for lunch he said that we must share a meal at the restaurant.  I know from experience that this means he has been spending money on her.  She is shameless in this regard (amongst other things) and like a fool he just spends whatever money she wants him to on her.  So there I am not only sharing a meal with him, but it also happens to be the cheapest thing on the menu.  Deja vu.

While I was at his place, I checked out his online history.  He Googled the distance from the town he was in for business to her hometown (did it yesterday morning).  He also Googled to see the distance from the town he was originally meant to drive through and it's distance to here.  I also went as far as to check his dialed calls and saw that he called her at least 4 times yesterday and once on Tuesday.  I didn't have time nor the stomach to look into that in detail. 

I am just so sick of this.  No regard for my feelings whatsoever.  Last year when he was in a bad accident (almost bled to death), I was the one that nursed him 24/7 for 3 weeks.  Put everything in my life on hold.  At the time she was still living with him and believe me she didn't lift a finger nor offered to do anything to help out.  Didn't even express concern for him.  Not only that, but she laughed so much when she saw him in his wheel-chair, she was in the fetal position on the couch, slapping her knee while tears ran down her face.  Never mind that he was in pain and frustrated.  She thought it was just the funniest thing.  After 3 weeks I had had enough of his rudeness towards me while being so concerned about her, that I took my stuff and left him to recover further on my own.  At that point he had to ask her to go buy some food for him.  She agreed, but only if he paid for her week's groceries - which he did. While I was still there she went with me one day to the shop so I could get food for him.  She wanted me to put her groceries on his credit card.  I refused and her claws really came out. She is a rotten to the core slut.  Yes, I am mad.  She never does anything for him yet he always treats her with all the respect while I am taken for granted.  I am so upset by the latest that I am so close to getting on a plane and flying out to see an ex.  Yet at the same time I don't want to run into something else. 

I am just so mad.  I believe he did go see her.  He also installed Skype on his laptop since she moved out in January.  Never bothered with it before. I am so tired of the lies.  When he gets caught out he makes me out to be the bad guy in the story which I know I am not.  I'm really tired of this nonsense.  Thanks for reading.

[Perdita]

Just did the math.  It is a 6 hour drive from where he went for business to here.  Not 9 hours like he claimed.  I just spoke to an ex for 30 minutes.  I feel I need to start cutting the emotional cord with my BPbf.

[Veronykah]

My uBPD exbf cheated on me. I had NO idea, he said he had never done it before (probably a lie) and the only reason he was caught was the girl emailed ME to tell me. I was completely blindsided, never expected that of him.

We eventually reconciled and were together for the past 8 months without any huge incidents. Then he had a freak out and disappeared and for 3 weeks. We were speaking and hanging out for 2 (meanwhile he reactivated his facebook after not having one for over a year) and he kept bothering me about adding him on FB. Well he freaked out and broke up with me 2 weeks ago, then of course a few days later sends me "this sucks... . I miss you" on FB. At that point I was done and went to block him there too and looked at his friends, who did I find?

The girl he cheated on me with. When I said something all I got was "we are friends, she is a family friend, my brothers friend. she knows we are broken up and that I still have feelings for you."

Say WHAT? I am really trying to end this relationship after that. I can't EVER trust him, and really couldn't again after the initial cheating. Too painful.

[Perdita]

My uBPD exbf cheated on me. I had NO idea, he said he had never done it before (probably a lie) and the only reason he was caught was the girl emailed ME to tell me. I was completely blindsided, never expected that of him.

I never would have expected it of mine either, but as time has gone by my eyes have opened up.

Well he freaked out and broke up with me 2 weeks ago, then of course a few days later sends me "this sucks... . I miss you" on FB. At that point I was done and went to block him there too and looked at his friends, who did I find?

The girl he cheated on me with. When I said something all I got was "we are friends, she is a family friend, my brothers friend. she knows we are broken up and that I still have feelings for you."

It is exactly this kind of don't care attitude that upsets me.  He shouldn't have kept her on his FB if he was sorry about cheating on you and serious about fixing things.  Do BP people ever compromise or is it always us that have to give in to them?

The "friends" thing is such bull.  Mine likes to pull the "sister" thing and also uses family connections to justify hanging out with her even though they usually hang out alone together.  I have asked so many times why I am not alllowed to join them on their outings.

Say WHAT? I am really trying to end this relationship after that. I can't EVER trust him, and really couldn't again after the initial cheating. Too painful.

Trust is so huge too.  When I met my BPbf I trusted him 100%.  Had only good thoughts and opinions about him.  Never would have thought he was such an inconsiderate jerk.  Went into the realtionship with nothing but hope and complete trust.  Thought of him as a truly sweet guy.  Now I wonder more and more if he isn't just plain evil.  Feel like such an idiot. 

[Veronykah]

I feel the exact same way.

Oh, no he didn't STILL have her on his FB, pretty sure he ADDED her because he made a new one. F'ing ADDED her. And legitimately thought the "brother" excuse was valid as well as the fact that she somehow knows what's going on in our relationship? WHAT? Yeah, he doesn't get that it's not acceptable to me or anyone to speak with that person, like ever.

I trusted him 100% until I found out about the cheating, now this? Yeah, I am wondering how much other stuff he's done to me and what has REALLY been going on. Sucks. I'm trying hard to leave him... .

[waverider]

Its not so much that they can get away with it. It is that they dont see it as any of your business and immediate gratification of impulses is not tempered by empathy towards how it affects you.  If it does become a problem, the covering up is not about covering guilt. It is about avoiding your "bullying" over the issue. Your stand point can be irrelevant as a consideration.

Not all pwBPD cheat, it depends what suits them best. Its just the checks and balances dont make them stop and think about it if they are tempted. the consequences of the after effects dont matter, as today is all that exists

[Perdita]

Its not so much that they can get away with it. It is that they dont see it as any of your business and immediate gratification of impulses is not tempered by empathy towards how it affects you.  If it does become a problem, the covering up is not about covering guilt. It is about avoiding your "bullying" over the issue. Your stand point can be irrelevant as a consideration.

That is some interesting points.  In my case I just cannot fathom why he is constantly taking the side of a major major user and trashy girl over me when I am the one who has always been there for him while she never has been.  She is forever taking credit for things he did and even things he paid for.  He simply accepts it even when it makes him angry in private and he shouts at me as if I did the bad thing and then just smiles at her (from being furious and throwing things seconds before) and tells her everything is "OK". 

Why does he not see her as a bully and user?  I would think a BP would have huge issues with someone like that.

[Perdita]

Oh, no he didn't STILL have her on his FB, pretty sure he ADDED her because he made a new one. F'ing ADDED her.

I would be upset too.  He knows his cheating on you with this girl caused you a whole lot of pain, but still he insists on having her on FB.  There is no reason why he had to add her again.  None.  If he is friends with others in her family, that doesn't justify it either as she is an individual.  In my case, one of this sleazy girl's brothers actually told me that he does not condone her behaviour and that I need to put her in her place.  It is still a very tricky situation thought because the rest of their family has no idea what she gets up to nor how it affects my relationship.

And legitimately thought the "brother" excuse was valid as well as the fact that she somehow knows what's going on in our relationship? WHAT? Yeah, he doesn't get that it's not acceptable to me or anyone to speak with that person, like ever.

He over stepped and needs to be a big boy and accept that one of the consequences is that he needs to cut her out his life as much as possible.  The part about her knowing what's going on in your relationship ... . well, this makes my blood boil as it is the same in my situation.  What makes it worse is that she is 18 years younger than me, has never had a real relationship (always seeing multiple guys) and yet he is discussing our most private matters with her (even bedroom!). She has nothing of value to share with him that will help our relationship.  If anything she is deliberately trying to break us up especially after I had a few words with her about how she uses him.  Of course, she went crying on his shoulder about how "mean" I am (I was not at that point).  He then informed me that he just doesn't think it is fair to her that he is seeing me as it now makes her uncomfortable after I called her out on her actions.

I guess what I am trying to say, is that it probably won't get better.  My bf already lost his ex in huge part because of this tramp.  He and his ex are no longer in contact (she married) and aren't FB friends anymore yet I see from his online history that he goes to her FB page every day.  They broke up 4 years ago. She felt it was time for them to move in together after 2 years.  He told her he can't share a place with someone else and really likes his space.  This was a huge thing between them.  Not 3 months after she last asked that they move in together and he again said "no", he went and moved in with this trashy girl and was housemates with her for 3 years.  This was a mere 2 weeks after his ex finally said "enough, goodbye".  As soon as he moved in with the tart, photos appeared on his FB of the 2 of them hanging out on different occasions.   Having the time of their life.  About 2 months he later realized she had led him on and begged his ex to take him back.  He still can't understand why she ignored his long e-mail.  It's like he is blind to the pain it caused her to see him move in with another woman.  No wonder she unfriended him.  He allowed another woman to have the life with him that his ex wanted.

I can't believe he is willing to throw not one but 2 women aside for a trashy drug using alcoholic slut that lies pathologically at every turn.  Why is he such a coward when it comes to her yet shouts down anyone else he feels is being even in the slightest unfair to him?  I even found porn on his laptop involving naked housemates and videos of men having sex with girls that have a similar appearance to hers.  What the heck?  Like a "sister"?  REALLY?

I trusted him 100% until I found out about the cheating, now this? Yeah, I am wondering how much other stuff he's done to me and what has REALLY been going on. Sucks. I'm trying hard to leave him... .

I currently feel like I am walking through a house (our relationship), slowly going from room to room and switching off the lights (my emotional connection to him). 

[waverider]

Why does he not see her as a bully and user?  I would think a BP would have huge issues with someone like that.

pwBPD often fail to see people as they really are, more like vessels for the persona they are projecting onto them. They are not paying that much attention as to who that person really is. When it is finally that person is obviously not who they think they were, pwBPD feels betrayed, turns on them and paints them black.

Its one reason they often make poor choices of partners.

[Perdita]

pwBPD often fail to see people as they really are, more like vessels for the persona they are projecting onto them. They are not paying that much attention as to who that person really is. When it is finally that person is obviously not who they think they were, pwBPD feels betrayed, turns on them and paints them black.

Its one reason they often make poor choices of partners.

Yet after more than 3 years and many many incidences, he still doesn't want to see her for what she is.  Part of him knows full well she is no good and I have picked up on resentment towards her.

     

Now that she is no longer his housemate and back in her hometown, he is idealizing her even more.  I should have known when I first started seeing him, instead it took me 6 months to piece things together.  The second time he and I went out together he told me that she is "every guys dream".  I wrote him a letter much later telling him that his "dream" is in fact nothing but a nightmare.  She is very narcissistic and I agree with friends who say her behaviour is sociopathic.  I think she is just much better at toying with people than he is and I don't know what to do about it.  Hopefully people are right when they say her lies and double life will eventually be exposed.  She already lost her job as a teacher at a Christian school due to her behaviour (yes, she is one of those sickos that goes around pretending to be a huge Christian in order to throw people off further)

Do I keep pointing out to him how she uses him or simple let it ride and hope he wakes the heck up?  He seems absolutely clueless about how his moving in with her contributed to finally ending his relationship with his ex.  I have never mentioned it to him before, but think if I do it might start to plant that seed that will eventually grow and result in him realizing how much he has lost over this user already.

[Veronykah]

Do I keep pointing out to him how she uses him or simple let it ride and hope he wakes the heck up?"

I say continue what you said before and keep going to the rooms in the house and turning out the lights. It won't get better, he won't change and it will all just keep hurting you.

Who cares about him and what this girl is doing to him? He's a grownup and as I told my ex in the last email "you've made your bed".

I am trying to be very serious about NC now, spoke with my T today and she led me through the scenario of talking to him like he wants and I was thinking I wanted.

It will just turn back into the same fight and/or recycle that it has seriously, more times than I can count.

I HAVE to leave because even when I start thinking of that "what ifs" if he got better/got it together/etc I realized the cheating will NEVER go away and I can't be with someone who has done that to me. I will NEVER get over it and continuing to talk to that girl just proves I am right in not getting over it.

I'd think about that if I was you.

For me the cheating is the only part of all the abuse he has doled out on me that I can't take, at all. I tried but I was always always angry about it and it felt like a dagger to my heart whenever I thought about it. To be rid of him and never have to think about that again and let it lose that pain, will be the best part of all of this.

[waverider]

For me the cheating is the only part of all the abuse he has doled out on me that I can't take, at all. I tried but I was always always angry about it and it felt like a dagger to my heart whenever I thought about it. To be rid of him and never have to think about that again and let it lose that pain, will be the best part of all of this.

This is important. It has nothing to do with what is fair and reasonable. Some can get over things, others cannot. If it brings out this anger no matter what you do then it needs to distanced

[peiper]

Ive been wondering this myself. Mine is a flight attendant so I have no idea. I just always trusted her. Now Im wondering.

[Love Is Not Enough]

Ive been wondering this myself. Mine is a flight attendant so I have no idea. I just always trusted her. Now Im wondering.

Stop wondering. Ignorance is bliss... .

At least this is what I try to tell myself... .

[Veronykah]

Ignorance is bliss, trust me, you don't want to know.

If you're in a relationship with a pwBPD you've been tortured enough, finding out about infidelity is the proverbial icing on the cake.

[JohnLove]

Ignorance is bliss, trust me, you don't want to know.

If you're in a relationship with a pwBPD you've been tortured enough, finding out about infidelity is the proverbial icing on the cake.

Amen to that Veronykah. 

[refusetosuccumb]

If you're in a relationship with a pwBPD you've been tortured enough, finding out about infidelity is the proverbial icing on the cake.

Truer words have never been written.

My exPBDh, as far as I know, never cheated on me for the first 14 yrs of our relationship.  I say "as far as I know" because I trusted him completely NOT to cheat on me.  He's a musician and loves the attention but I married him because he seemed so very much in love with me and trustworthy.

Last year (15yrs together) he up and left, telling me he found a roommate (we had communications about seperating in the previous few weeks before he left).  I discovered this "roommate" was actually his girlfriend.  I found out via Facebook, she had put up a pic on his wall calling him "the best boyfriend ever".  So humiliating.  Two months later he was begging me for a second chance and stupidly I gave it to him.

Discovered in March of this year he was still sexually reaching out to at least 6 other women.  He claims it was only talk but after he actually left me for another woman, reaching out is just as bad to me.

I took care of him for the past 3yrs he's been off of work, all while working full time, taking care of the house, the kids and the 2 dogs.  My own health suffered because I was trying to make him happy.  In the end, I chose my own happiness.

But I echo someone else's sentiment that cheating is a human condition and not necessarily tied to BPD.

My ex still claims that his affair was my fault.  I wasn't "loving and spontaneous" enough.  How I was supposed to be spontaneous without help was beyond me and opened my eyes that I'd never be good enough in his eyes.

Good luck!

[enlighten me]

I have to disagree with the ignorance is bliss statement.

Take it from me that if you ever find out about infidelity it knocks you right back in the healing process.

I never believed my ex wife would cheat and at the moment I was on the point of feeling better I found out she cheated. I was knocked back and almost had to start the healing process from scratch. Once again I started to heal and found out more and back I went.

Remember that part of the healing process is blowing away the delusion of the relationship. If you cling onto any part of that delusion you leave yourself open to have the whole healing process undermined.

With my exgf I examined our relationship and spotted opportunities and behaviour that was similar to what I had had with my ex wife. I realise that there is no evidence of infidelity but I have to go with my gut feeling on this. My gut says she cheated so I am ready for it when it eventually comes out that she did. And believe me it always comes out at some point. Whether they admit it (highly unlikely) or they fall out with a friend who spills the beans or whether one of your friends tells you it will come out.

Now Im not saying everyones partner has cheated but by reading this post you must have concerns.

So all Im saying is prepare for the worst and if it never comes then what have you lost. If you don't prepare though you will be going through a whole lot of pain that you could have at least softened the blow.

[ATLandon]

According to what I read on these boards it seems more common within this community than any other subculture I belong to. With that said though, my wife has never (to my knowledge) even attempted to cheat on me, though her insecurity and fear of abandonment lends itself to her always being around me when I'm not working. Honestly though, my wife has been lying to me since day one about her sexual past (before we started dating) and she sometimes says things about her sexuality that shoots off that   feeling in my gut, so I also wouldn't be surprised at all if I ever found out that she has cheated on me. At this point in our relationship I could not care less if she cheated on me. In fact, I'd welcome it as a "Get Out of Jail Free Card!" The thought of hiring someone to solicit an affair with her has crossed my mind more than once over the years. I know, its messed up.

[woodsposse]

At this point in our relationship I could not care less if she cheated on me. In fact, I'd welcome it as a "Get Out of Jail Free Card!" The thought of hiring someone to solicit an affair with her has crossed my mind more than once over the years. I know, its messed up.

I totally feel where you are at with this.  I wish I had better advice to give on the topic, but as you know, there are a lot of resources here which can help you decide on a direction. It is a very difficult spot to be in not knowing if to go left or right.  Ultimately, of course, it is a decision you will make for yourself and whatever you choose - we are here to support you.

I will share with you one thing my T asked of me one day... .it took me a year or two to actually hear it - but it goes something like this:

Two co-workers were talking and one of guy was saying how much his brother who lives with him is driving him crazy.  The other co-worker asks why does the brother drive him crazy, to which he responded "because he thinks he is a chicken.  He keeps walking around acting like a chicken... .it's driving me crazy!"

The co-worker asks "So why don't you ask him to leave your house?"

To which he replied "Because I need the eggs."

So the question my T asked me was "What are my eggs?"

[bobcat2014]

Ive been wondering this myself. Mine is a flight attendant so I have no idea. I just always trusted her. Now Im wondering.

Peiper,

Trust your gut... .if something seems wrong find out the facts. Keyloggers are a wonderful invention. Be prepared when you learn the truth.

My wife is a solid 9 on a 10 scale... .so she has no shortage of attention. She has cheated with two different douch bags in 20 years of marriage... .that I know of. Is it my opinion that she will cheat again? Yes. I believe that cycle will come around again. It is my final boundary. Since learning about BPD I feel more prepared for this event to come.

[bobcat2014]

The thought of hiring someone to solicit an affair with her has crossed my mind more than once over the years. I know, its messed up.

Its not that messed up

[Veronykah]

I have to disagree with the ignorance is bliss statement.

My point was end the relationship before it gets to the point where he finds out the extent of the betrayal that is likely to be there. Yes, for me especially, it took finding out about the cheating to get me to really want out but if I could have never had that experience I would be happier. To have the emails and photos the "other" girl sent me seared in my brain really sucks. BUT it also is ever present and I try to remember that part when I start romanticizing and thinking maybe we could work it all out.

The cheating will never go away, and I will never trust him. It is just something I can't get over.

But wow do I wish I could Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless mind all of it... .

[peiper]

For me its that its hitting home. I adored this woman, kissed her butt and did all I could for the marriage to work and she finds it so easy to just walk away and file for a divorce. So yes I do wonder what else she was capable of. It might make it easier to walk away from this mess.

[enlighten me]

The cheating will never go away, and I will never trust him. It is just something I can't get over.

You will get over it. You wont forget it but you will get over it. I never thought I would. Finding out my ex wife had a man living in my house for a week just before the wedding devastated me. Finding out everything else she got up to tore me apart. Now I only feel indifference towards her and the same goes for her infidelities.