I've seen her.

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

140,000 people. I avoided her at all costs, left my mate who's her brother when he went to meet her just so I didn't have to see her. But, low and behold, who walks along the path we are going... . her. It was the most awkward conversation, it felt like we didn't even know each other. It was brutal. It's amazing how you can love & care for someone as much as I did her, for it now to all mean nothing & you no longer know that person.

I think the alcohol as played a part but I'm now feeling pretty depressed.

[Eric1]

140,000 people. I avoided her at all costs, left my mate who's her brother when he went to meet her just so I didn't have to see her. But, low and behold, who walks along the path we are going... . her. It was the most awkward conversation, it felt like we didn't even know each other. It was brutal. It's amazing how you can love & care for someone as much as I did her, for it now to all mean nothing & you no longer know that person.

I think the alcohol as played a part but I'm now feeling pretty depressed.

[OutOfEgypt]

It's ok, man.  It will pass.  And you survived.  Next time (whenever that is) it will be easier.  And easier.  And easier.

[LettingGo14]

It's ok, man.  It will pass.  And you survived.  Next time (whenever that is) it will be easier.  And easier.  And easier.

I'm with OOE, Eric1.   Focus on your feelings, not the story of the past.   You can go through the feelings as if you are going through a storm.   It will pass.

[OutOfEgypt]

Yup, in fact the only way out is THROUGH.

I think it was Winston Churchill who said, "If your're going through hell, keep going... . "

[Forestaken]

Don't look back, you're not going that way

[Eric1]

I know doing my best to avoid her is self preservation. But, it's not the type of person I am. Yeah, she walked all over me & treated me like dirt, but to this day, I still care about her.

I won't be able to avoid her all the time because I'm best mates with her brother, hopefully I'll be in a better position tho.

I feel like called her, just to say that I'm not avoiding her because I hate her or anything like that, as I still care about her, it's just I have to move on like she has, and that's the only way possible. If we do see each other, I don't want things to be awkward because it's worse than anything.

[OutOfEgypt]

I hope you don't take this the wrong way, but let's be real.  If that's not the kind of person you are, then what kind are you?  The king of peson who repeatedly hands his head over to someone who just wants to cave it in?

There's nothing wrong with avoiding someone out of self-preservation.  She's certainly not thinking about what is good for you, so someone's gotta.  But I understand that you have to see her (well, in your case you may not "have to", but it is likely because of your relationship with her brother).  I share kids with my ex.  So, I know how that goes.  So, yea... . getting past this is paramount.

I know you care about her, but I also know that I (and everybody else here) has said over and over, and obsessed over and over, about how much we "love" them and how much we "care" about them... . but its really just sentimental fantasy-land stuff that keeps us from living in reality.  It is entirely possible, and often necessary, to truly care about someone and yet have a very clear picture of them that is stripped of all those gooey sentimental "aww... . but I love them" stuff.  That ooey-gooey stuff is not love.  Its the drugged haze we run back to because living in the "awww, I love them" sentimental haze paralyzes and numbs us and is therefore preferable (for some reason) to having to face the pain and emptiness of both losing them in particular and being alone in general.  We don't want to learn to just be alone with us, either.  But we will never find a life for ourselves if we continue to drink the ooey-gooey koolaid.

I'm not trying to make you feel badly.  I'm trying to encourage you to wake up and snap out of it -the same thing my therapist did for me.  

[strong9]

and is therefore preferable (for some reason) to having to face the pain and emptiness of both losing them in particular and being alone in general.  We don't want to learn to just be alone with us, either. 

I do not know about you Eric but that fits me to a T. It may also explain why I was a Co dependent doormat for the last 2  years once her behavior became apparent.

Just because she treats you like a stranger doesn't make the past any less real. It is her illness. In fact because she is ill at some poi t you will be happy the past is just the past and not your present or your future.

[Eric1]

Ok, I'm really struggling now. I was doing ok, but seeing her has completely f**ked me up. I'm gonna be honest, but I've now cried twice. It's absolutely mental. And the person that brings me this pain is the one I want to talk to.

[OutOfEgypt]

It's okay, man.  Cry.  Let it out.  Facing that pain is very important.  It hurts.  You wish you could have this person you know, deep down, you'll never have.  That is a painful loss.  The only way past it is through it.

[strong9]

We've been there man and still go there. But it beats being recycled in the long run.

[Forestaken]

Ok, I'm really struggling now. I was doing ok, but seeing her has completely f**ked me up.

After a session with my T, I saw my abusive Xw walking in a parking lot.  I felt chills

I've only seen her in court for almost 3 years. 

[Eric1]

I want to talk to her. I miss talking to her.

I'm fighting the urge to call, but it's tough.

I doubt she would awnser & she probably wouldn't want to hear from me.

But, what if she would like to hear from me?

[OutOfEgypt]

I'm sure somewhere in there she would love to hear from you... .to know that you are still firmly planted on her hook.

Her reasons for wanting to talk to you, if she does, are not the same as yours.

Or maybe they are... .both reasons involve destroying you... .yours and her's.

[OutOfEgypt]

It's like having an addiction to drinking Drano.

You know it will kill you, but you get one whiff of the chemical aroma and suddenly you're dying to take a big swig.

But you know what will happen, or do you really think by some miracle everything would be different and suddenly Drano will be good for you?

I get it.  I really do.  But you've done exactly what she's wanted you to do by putting her on this ridiculously high and fantastical pedestal.  She'll take being adored or feared -makes little difference to her.  Either way, she knows she gets a reaction and is the center of focus.  Time to tear down the pedestal and walk in reality.  She's really *not* "all that."  I don't even know her, and I know that is true.

[Eric1]

My friends hate her & she treated me like an absolute piece of crap. And yet, here I am, still caring about her. I would probably go for another recycle, but I know that it will never happen. She's moved on, and I'm still on here, still thinking about her.

I have a date tomorrow. I met her on pof & she seems really nice, she's pretty, ambitious & likes all the things I like. But, I know I'm not going to give her the chance she deserves because she's not my ex. Yeah, she probably isn't as mental, but she's just not her.

[OutOfEgypt]

My friends hate her & she treated me like an absolute piece of crap.

Of course... .because they can see the truth without all the ooey-goeey sentimental feelings attached.  I've looked back on this and in my own healing, and I really don't think that is us "loving" or "caring" about them.  I really don't.  Which is scary in a sense, because it reveals that we confuse love with worshipping someone.  In others words, if the only time we believe we "love" someone is when we hand complete control of ourselves over to them, then that is NOT good nor healthy.

Good for you for going out and dating.  I hope the experience helps you heal, and let's *pray* she is not as "mental."  However (and I mean this truthfully yet gently), a woman worth her salt will sense after talking to you for a while that you are still obsessed with your ex... and they won't want to compete with that.  I wouldn't.

Have you ever read or watched the Lord of the Rings?  You have a choice here.  Your ex is "the ring", your "precious."  You can either be Gollum or Frodo.  You can have the ring consume you until it kills you, or you can experience some loss but ultimately let the ring go.  It's very similar.  The idea of having your "precious" back makes you feel alive and powerful and like "somebody".  But that is NOT love.  That is more like addiction and idolatry.

[HighwaytoHell]

It's amazing how you can love & care for someone as much as I did her, for it now to all mean nothing & you no longer know that person.

I know exactly what you mean man. I was driving down the street two days ago and saw her driving right passed me. God the impact it had. I knew she saw me because when I happened to glance, her face looked like it had seen a ghost... pure terror. I can't believe that the connection, closeness, togetherness that we once shared is all gone. Like it never existed. Just mind blowing. Kinda left me with the shakes the last couple of days... .but I'm getting through it just focusing on my own feelings and recovery. I even made a quality decision to stop using Mary Jane to better be in touch with my own feelings. I'm 17 months no contact and on this journey of recovery with you bro. Hang in there.

[Eric1]

Drinking for 5 days at the festival hasn't helped. I always get depressed after I drink, which I need to start controlling.

She's gone back to my replacement & obviously everything is going well. She looked good at the festival, looks like she's lost weight , she was happy and smiley. I tortured me.

I know I can't call her. She won't want to hear from me, and if I do speak to her or she doesn't awnser or call back, then it will set me back even further.

I'm in a rough place at the moment.

[OutOfEgypt]

Hey man,

Completely understandable.  But yeah, as you already know... .the alcohol won't help.  Alcohol *is* classified as a "depressant", after all.  Plus, you feel ashamed about acting like a moron.   Becomes a vicious cycle.

Not shocking that she lost weight and looks good.  My ex looks good, too.  Cleaned herself up quite a bit.  But its all by design.  It really is.  Maybe it isn't specifically designed to punish you (though, maybe it is, too), but I do believe this is common and part of their dynamic.

Check this out if you haven't already:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=228076.msg12453874#msg12453874

I know it is hard.  Time to take a break and start realizing what she actually is.  And then focus on building good things for your new life. 

[Changingman]

Yup, in fact the only way out is THROUGH.

I think it was Winston Churchill who said, "If you're going through hell, keep going... . "

Love this!

[Changingman]

Eric,

You are heading over the edge, Outofegypt  is right about this, you are asking for more humiliation.

Cry, rage, run, do push ups, shout, roar, find your inner father, express it, feel it and protect yourself, care for yourself.

Strength to you.

This pain is just weakness escaping the body, let it scream.

Good luck on the date, treat her with the respect you deserve.

[Eric1]

I will look weak & needy if I call her, I know.

Whatever the reason is to call her, it's just an excuse to reach out.

I'm finding it so difficult not to. I just have dialed her number 20 times, just to delete it again.

Speaking to her will only set me back further, she won't say what I want to hear even if she answered.

But it's hard not to.

[Eric1]

Still really struggling. I'm not expecting any response, because i've been told all i need to hear. This is probably more of just a vent.

You know i always thought & at times, still do, feel like it's me with the problem. But, i haven't been able to switch off my feelings for her like she can with me. She jumped straight back to my replacement and hasn't looked back. I should hate her, dispise her & have the self respect to never want to speak to her again. But, i still want to talk to her, make her laugh etc It's never going to happen as she has moved on. I know i have to move on too, its so hard.

[Forestaken]

My friends hate her & she treated me like an absolute piece of crap. And yet, here I am, still caring about her. I would probably go for another recycle, but I know that it will never happen. She's moved on, and I'm still on here, still thinking about her.

I have a date tomorrow. I met her on pof & she seems really nice, she's pretty, ambitious & likes all the things I like. But, I know I'm not going to give her the chance she deserves because she's not my ex. Yeah, she probably isn't as mental, but she's just not her.

Eric1: I'm not going to sugar-coat this:

Your X isn't worth your time, emotion or love.  She had it, didn't appreciate it and threw it away.  You need to realize that you are valuable, but you couldn't make her recognize it - you never will.  She had her chance & blew it - forget about the your past with her and move on with your life.  Until you value yourself, no one will value you.You deserve to be happy.  

Good luck on your date.  This person isn't your X, she's a totally different person.  Have fun, breathe the air, and live for you!

My favorite quote "You were born with wings, why crawl through life?"

Peace Braw!

[enlighten me]

You know i always thought & at times, still do, feel like it's me with the problem.

Sorry to say it but you do have a problem. You care.

How many times did I sit there thinking Im leaving. Knowing full well that no matter what she did she would only have to show me some form of affection for me to be back at square one.

You have to realise that she isn't who you fell in love with. That person was a character in the play that is their life.

It takes time to get over them. You need to use every weapon in your arsenal to get through it.

Try to remind yourself about the reality of the relationship. Where the good times really that good? What ratio of good to bad times did you have? How did she make you feel? Would you have put up with any of this from your boss or a co worker?

You need to comprehend that BPD means they don't think the same way as you. You cant understand what has happened if you don't understand how they think and how they think is about instant gratification and not being emotionally connected.

[Eric1]

Appreciate the replies.

I do know my value & there's lots of it. If I were to start dating now & noticed the red flags, I would walk. But, there was something about her that made me totally look passed them when we started dating. Maybe it was because I hadn't been long out of a relationship or it more likely that she, in my head, was the girl I've been waiting for. I didn't rush the relationship, but she did, and slowly she broke me down. We've all let it happen to us, otherwise we wouldn't be here. Yeah, I've still got her on the pedestal. My head knows I can't ever contact her again or return there. I don't trust her, she doesn't offer me what I expect from a relationship & she was abusive & manipulative. The problem is my heart does still love her & care about her. The good times were great , the bad times were hell. It takes time, it's just really hard.

Part of me feels like a failure too, because if this other chap makes her happy & they live happily ever after , well, what does that say about me?

[enlighten me]

Does he make her happy and if so how long for.

She is damned to repeat the eternal cycle of BPD. Trust me both my ex wife and exgf have followed the same pattern all of their adult lives and will continue to do so.

Im still getting over the exgf but have long since reached indifference about the ex wife. Looking back I kick myself as to how gullible I was and then laugh at how pathetic she was.

It does get better. The hardest part is realising who they really where. Once you accept that they are not the person you love then you are a lot further along the healing process and it will speed it up.

[Eric1]

She broke up with the other lad twice & obviously came back to muggins here. Could it work if she actually made the effort?

[enlighten me]

I hate to say this Eric but I very much doubt it.

We trigger guilt in our exs. We are a constant reminder of how they treated us and they don't like to face up to that.

If you think about a normal relationship where one party had an affair then the only way it can get resolved is if the person who cheated was remorseful and sought forgiveness.

With BPD they never admit their mistakes, wont show you remorse and don't want you to forgive them as that will show that they were wrong and they cant deal with that.