How do I respond?

[Emhain]

So... .my uBPD husband and I split about 2 weeks ago. He was absolutely out of control for several days- suicide, firearms, police, crisis, etc. I took the kids and hid until he settled and I'd met with a lawyer. Eventually, he decided he missed the kids too much and we needed to sort out custody NOW, so we mediated through email and I resented the schedule to my lawyer. Papers were drawn up. I allowed visits to start. Now... .papers were served on him Friday. They have not yet been returned. He lives 6-8 blocks from the law office.

Throughout this, he pings wildly back and forth between you are evil and heartless and horrible and I will do everything in my power to make you miserable and destroy you" to "I'm so sorry, I'll get better, give me another chance, you OWE me another chance". Today, he is hateful.

So... .I had zero contact for many days, then opened email contact so that we could handle custody. During the kids visit with him, I disclosed that my number had not changed and he should use it to contact me if necessary. Since then- constant texts to beg, plead, insult, demean. Last night he informed me that he would be claiming our daughter on his taxes for the rest of her life. I didn't resoind. Today I got another text - "Wow, you still don't understand how text messages work or still being a child about it.Let me know that u understand that I am claiming (daughter) from this point on. My reason is, I feel like it's for the best and I don't have to give a ___ how you feel about it. Answer me" immediately followed by another text "Next open enrollment I'm adding (daughter) on my insurance, I need her SSN".

While he has every right to her SSN, she is already covered by my insurance and this is one of the things we agreed to in our emails- that I would continue to cover her and my other daughter. I feel he is using that text to get me to respond- to remind him we already discussed that- so that he can fire off about me refusing to answer the other. The thing is, he has no right to claim our daughter on taxes- he has her only 2 nights each week. It's many months away, I'm not dealing with it now. He is pushing for an argument for no reason other than to argue. The comment about "I feel it's best and don't care how you feel"... .yeah, that's his honest opinion about why I'm divorcing him. According to him, I have no good reason to leave. This is revenge.

Do I resopond? How? What should I say?

He still hasn't returned the custody papers and I think he might refuse to until this is settled.

[Matt]

Some suggestions - what has more-or-less worked for me... .

First, no texts or phone calls.  See if you can block his number on your phone.  You can either tell him you're doing that, or - what I did - just quit responding to texts and phone calls.

E-mail only.  Respond only to appropriate stuff.  cc: your lawyer - no need to tell your husband you are doing that - he will see it and he will understand that everything he sends to you will be seen by your lawyer.

You can tell your lawyer "No need to take action on these, I'm just copying you for your records." so she won't bill you for dealing with e-mails between you and your husband.

Anything inappropriate - begging, threats, etc. - don't respond.  Keep everything.

Let your lawyer deal with the legal stuff.  Keep it simple so it won't take too many of her expensive hours.  Deal directly with your husband only on daily matters related to the kids - "S4 has a runny nose so when you pick him up I'll give you the medicine.  1 tablespoon every four hours." for example.

Who claims who on taxes will be negotiated by the attorneys.  Usually it alternates - you get the even years and he gets the odd years for example.  Not something to argue about now.

It's sensible to have the parenting schedule worked out in the papers, but you can't withhold contact to force him to sign the papers.  If you and he are in agreement about the temporary schedule - and if it's super-clear and has been put into e-mails so there is a record of what exactly was agreed - not just dates but times and where exchanges will take place - you should go ahead with that even if he isn't signing the legal papers for whatever reason.  Using contact with the kids as leverage to get him to sign all the papers - or if that is how it might be seen - won't make you look good to the court.

Keep in mind what you genuinely believe is best for the kids, now and for the future.  Don't get so caught up in the other parent's hijinks that you make decisions by reacting to his behavior.  Think about what is best for the kids, and do that.

[Nope]

You have to think about all of this like you are in a "training phase" with him right now. He is clearly trying out different approaches and subjects to see what will and won't get a response. If demanding information and threatening to go back on what was already discussed in emails will get him a response, then he will just keep doing it. Right now try to think of it as training him to understand what will and won't be discussed, and how.

Matt is right that email works best for pretty much everything except emergency situations. Only respond to things that have to do with the here and now and directly impact the child. Everything else can be figured out between the lawyers. If he texts you, and it's something you need to respond to, write him an email saying that you got his text about xyz subject and then write your response. Anything that doesn't require an answer should simply be ignored. But make sure you hold on the everything so you have documentation of his behavior to bring to court.

[Matt]

One thing that happened fairly early in our process was that my lawyer took some of my wife's emails - stuff that wasn't appropriate or relevant but I had copied to my lawyer to show her what I was dealing with - and showed them to my wife's lawyer.

I imagine the conversation was something like, "Here are some e-mails Mrs. Matt has sent over the last few weeks.  If this continues, we will share these with the court, and with the Custody Evaluator, so the judge and the CE can decide if she is capable of unsupervised contact with the kids."

I think my wife's lawyer must have talked with her about these, because they stopped - her e-mails got much shorter, less emotional, and more appropriate - still a little passive-aggressive baloney but not much.  I'm pretty sure her lawyer told her, "Either quit sending crazy e-mails to Mr. Matt, or get yourself a different lawyer."

[Rubies]

That's what I did too, Matt.  I didn't even read many of his rants, I hit save & print.

As soon as papers were filed, I converted the relationship to strictly business.  Best business practices are to be profitable and positive.   I documented, the judge protected DD and I and began training BPDxh.

[Emhain]

Thank you, everyone.

I took your advice and did not respond. He eventually contacted my 15 y/o daughter, asking her to tell me he needed answers. I thanked her and continued to ignore the messages. He texted a friend of mine, she may or may not have ripped him a new one... .but that's between them.

Last week I had told him that email was the only appropriate way to communicate. He did that for several days. But once he had my phone number in hand, all bets were off. I will go ahead and send an email to him now- something like "I will not be responding to text messages from you UNLESS they directly pertain to the immediate care of our daughter. Any and all other communication can go through email."

[ForeverDad]

First, regarding suicide threats and notes.  You are not qualified to handle them or decide whether they are control attempts, cries for help or serious contemplations.  (Even if you were a doctor you could not handle them because of the relationship, you'd have to hand the matter over to neutral professionals.)  Report the threats and notes, let the emergency responders handle it.  Of course, he's likely to deny making suicidal threats, so be sure you get and keep documentation, the texts, notes or recorded verbal incidents.  That way it's not "he said, she said" hearsay.

Generally who files the children with their taxes is handled later in the divorce after custody and parenting schedules are resolved.  Only the younger child is his?  Is that daughter the one he wants to include on his taxes?  Frankly, in many cases the parents alternate claiming the children or the majority time parent claims them.  Unless you're independently wealthy, you should claim your older daughter every year and the younger daughter at least half the time.  (For now, ignore his demands.  This won't be the only demand.  Meanwhile let him huff and puff, it's mostly controller hot air.)  If you're in the USA, the IRS defaults to the majority time parent claiming the children, I think IRS requires Form 8332 for details or deviations.

Many courts prefer joint custody but be forewarned that if you are not seen as the majority time or decision-making parent then you'll be confronted with issue after issue over the years.  Better to address it now than suffer with it for years or keep going back to court.

As for money, if your lawyer will file the divorce case in court then it shouldn't take long for the court to decide child support and spousal support during the divorce case.  Frankly, if you think you will get better results with 'agreements' you are very likely to be disappointed.  Since it sounds like he's a controller, he will continue making unilateral demands.  No amount of pleading and offers will get a reasonable response from him.  Odds are, you'll get a better deal from a judge than you would ever get from him.  Should I repeat that last sentence?

Do you have a proactive lawyer, one who is more than just a form filer, paper pusher and hand holder?  Does your lawyer have a strategy?  Remember, this will not be a 'normal' divorce case.  Do you have Splitting: Protecting Yourself While Divorcing Someone with Borderline or Narcissistic Personality Disorder by Bill Eddy and Randi Kreger?  It's an essential handbook for both you and your lawyer.

[Matt]

First, regarding suicide threats and notes.  You are not qualified to handle them or decide whether they are control attempts, cries for help or serious contemplations.  (Even if you were a doctor you could not handle them because of the relationship, you'd have to hand the matter over to neutral professionals.)  Report the threats and notes, let the emergency responders handle it.  Of course, he's likely to deny making suicidal threats, so be sure you get and keep documentation, the texts, notes or recorded verbal incidents.  That way it's not "he said, she said" hearsay.

Yeah, this is the right thing to do, though it isn't easy.

Here's my experience along those lines... .

Several years ago my son, then in his mid-20s, was struggling with alcohol and drugs.  He had tried to commit suicide once - he told me about it later.  I was advised by people who knew the situation to call 911 if he said or did anything suicidal.

One night he had been drinking and was very upset, and started joking about committing suicide, and he picked up a knife.  I decided I could not wait til I knew if he was really going to do something or not, so I called 911 and told them what was happening.

What was supposed to happen was, a police officer was supposed to come and take him to the jail, where he would be put under observation for 24 hours - "suicide watch".  The officer showed up but didn't take him - my son talked him out of it.  The officer used poor judgement.  But a few months later my son was put on suicide watch - 24 hours in a cell with no clothes, mattress - literally nothing in the cell.  It was a very unpleasant experience!

(Now, several years later, he's doing much better and I have no concerns about him hurting himself.)

What I learned from this is that I don't have to be emotionally manipulated by someone I care about, who is going through big problems.  I have a way to handle the situation which will keep him safe and away from me and my other kids.  I think that may apply to you and your ex too.  If he says or does anything which you believe is suicidal, you can call 911 and report it, and they should know how to handle it.

[Emhain]

I do report his suicide threats to the crisis team. Every time. He gets mad, but I figure if it bothers him that much, he could always stop making the threat.

Our agreements are simply written communications that I use to guide the legal forms. As in, we agree by email to visitation on X, Y, Z days and I submit that to the lawyer who turns it into custody papers to be signed and filed. It's mediation without the mediator.

The divorce... .all we have are kids. Well, one kid. We own nothing and we owe very little. The divorce will be simple regardless of his antics. This state does not require a reason for divorce. If he refuses to sign, he will be subpoenaed to explain himself to a judge.

I guess I was just feeling extremely anxious... .ignoring people is not something I do-it-yourself ever. It's hard for me to do. So sometimes I just need to hear that it's okay to do so. His insistence that I discuss taxes is irritating. There's no need to discuss that in July. It is, in my opinion, a way to goad me into a conversation so that he can remind me of how horrible I am. Yet, I feel bad ignoring his texts.

[trappeddad]

Odds are, you'll get a better deal from a judge than you would ever get from him.  Should I repeat that last sentence?

I agree with that, but how do you balance that with the costs to go in front of a judge?     Can this be done on a budget?    Maybe this question is best for a separate thread.   

[livednlearned]

The divorce will be simple regardless of his antics.

BPD divorces don't tend to be simple. Even the simple ones aren't simple. 

It is, in my opinion, a way to goad me into a conversation so that he can remind me of how horrible I am. Yet, I feel bad ignoring his texts.

When custody is involved, a lot of us have to walk this razor thin line between managing a mentally ill ex spouse and the court system. A lot of times, the best way to deal with one jeopardizes everything with the other. It's not easy. Plus, a lot of us are so worn down by years of dealing with abuse and whatnot, we're not always in great shape figuring out where the healthy boundaries are.

During the first year you split, I think the healthiest thing to do is to scale way back -- that means parallel parenting. Hide behind a lawyer if you have one. Put up some serious boundaries and stick to them, no matter how guilty you feel. Then start working through the guilt and build up strength. Things will start to look a lot different in a year or so. You get your head out of the FOG (fear, obligation, guilt) and realize you aren't this guy's mother. You're a good person with a child to raise, a kid who has a shot at growing up healthy and whole. Look after yourself and if you're concerned about something your ex is doing, pop back in here and ask people if they've experienced anything like it. Chances are, it's something pretty common with BPD divorces.

I don't know if this will apply to your case, but my ex was way more interested in making the threats than following through on them. Or if he followed through, they were so half-hearted and lame that nothing came of it. He still managed to obstruct every little thing and create a lot of headaches, but he wasn't very effective at follow through.