Why don't you run?

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

I've been on this site a few months... .on the staying board there are the occasional "why do we stay" topics.

On the undecided board, why do you stay if you're not married yet?  If I could set my "way-back" machine I would not call my uBPDw for that first date 4+ years ago.

So now I'm married... .the "better or worse" aspect keeps me here to try and work through the problems BPD creates. 

I just don't understand why anyone would knowingly stay in a relationship with a BPD... .Help me understand here... .

[IsItHerOrIsItMe]

I've been on this site a few months... .on the staying board there are the occasional "why do we stay" topics.

On the undecided board, why do you stay if you're not married yet?  If I could set my "way-back" machine I would not call my uBPDw for that first date 4+ years ago.

So now I'm married... .the "better or worse" aspect keeps me here to try and work through the problems BPD creates. 

I just don't understand why anyone would knowingly stay in a relationship with a BPD... .Help me understand here... .

[Cipher13]

I have to agree. But I to did not run. There were signs but I thought I was being too dramatic.

Now I want to go back in time and not go to college. Or at least the one I went to.  I think the whole for better or worse thing is a hang up that keeps me but it isn't the main reason... .I stongly beleive that it is how over time the pwBPD conditions you. I've let it happen to me and no patter how 'crazy" the situation seems... I do not run from it. Even though I should be long gone.

[pieceofme]

i'm not married, but i have stayed and am trying to work things out with my exBPD. i agree it is how they condition us.

my ex broke up with me nearly two weeks ago and went running back to his ex (who spent our entire relationship trying to break us up). he says he still has feelings for me, but doesn't want to work on things. i said that i will respect his new relationship (yuck) and will walk away. this infuriated him. he said i don't need to walk away and that he doesn't want me to leave... .even though he already left me.

i know i need to get out, but i can't find the strength in my heart.

[seeking balance]

Having watched this topic over the years, people tend to stay based on their values, their codependency, their own abandonment issues and guilt.  Oh yeah, there is that thing called love too 

Seriously, everyone stays until they cannot any longer - nobody here has made a leaving decision easily or without pain.

Isither - do you see yourself moving to undecided these days? 

[Forestaken]

Me: just divorced a low-functioning uBPD+dOCDw after 24 years of marriage

Why I didn't run?  

Fear-of failure, of the courts, of the stigma.

Low self-esteem.  Even though it's over, my T tells me I need to value myself

Plus the hope that she would see that she was destroying her r/s with me and the kids.  

My advice: Leave.  No one can change them but them and they alter their reality so they never see the damage they are doing.

[Proud_Dad]

I tend to reside on the Staying Board myself due to my current commitment. However, I do feel like the Undecided Board fits my frame of mind better at this time.

We are not married but engaged. We do have 2 children together.

I can say that I feel my main reason for staying resides within my children. I could not live without them... .yet I hate that they are raised around such strife. I have been told that children are better off in 2 homes rather than 1 unstable and volatile home, but I know I would be in for a hell of a battle if I were to initiate the end of our current relationship. This is a battle that in my situation and state of the Union I would more than likely come up on the loosing end.

In the end I do still love my fiancé, not the same love that I once felt, but the pain of staying has not yet eclipsed the pain of leaving and losing my children. So I stay. It is a greedy decision I know.

[refusetosuccumb]

I stayed because I took our vows seriously.

I left because he didnt.

I ask myself if I would have stayed if he did not cheat on me. I stayed for 15 yrs. I dont know the answer to that.

My kids are thriving in the peace. They stay with their dad 2 days during the week while I work. I no longer trigger him as much so the kids do not hear much arguing.

I wish you all luck and peace.

[ziniztar]

Would you consider staying knowing he is in therapy, progressing, but still sucking the life out of you with only 1 year together, and no kids?

[Forestaken]

I can say that I feel my main reason for staying resides within my children. I could not live without them... .yet I hate that they are raised around such strife. I have been told that children are better off in 2 homes rather than 1 unstable and volatile home,

How old are your kids?

My kids now 20 & 24 - both wanted me to divorce their uBPD mother (my X) while they were in middle school.  They did approach me together.  They told me their feelings independently, separately.  Their thoughts was based on what they experienced, not influenced by the other.

BTW: We traveled to Grand Canyon and Niagara Falls this year.  Did it on the cheap.  But did it. Couldn't have done it with X in the picture.

[JohnLove]

Would you consider staying knowing he is in therapy, progressing, but still sucking the life out of you with only 1 year together, and no kids?

This is my question too. I am almost 2 years in. BPDgf in a pathetic (in my opinion) therapy as a support when released from hospital earlier this year. It is unbearable at times and with the projection and devaluation triggering my issues I wonder what will be left of me in the end?. Will BPDgf just use me up and then move on?

Sigh.

[JohnLove]

I tend to reside on the Staying Board myself due to my current commitment. However, I do feel like the Undecided Board fits my frame of mind better at this time.

We are not married but engaged. We do have 2 children together.

I can say that I feel my main reason for staying resides within my children. I could not live without them... .yet I hate that they are raised around such strife. I have been told that children are better off in 2 homes rather than 1 unstable and volatile home, but I know I would be in for a hell of a battle if I were to initiate the end of our current relationship. This is a battle that in my situation and state of the Union I would more than likely come up on the loosing end.

It is a VERY personal choice. I was with the uBPD mother of my children for 20 years.

I spent the best part of $100,000 and 6 years fighting for the right to be my children's father. I eventually won primary care. That prevented alienation or parental alignment. My eldest child was not so lucky.

Make this decision VERY carefully Proud_Dad as you will live with the consequences and so will your children. I did not know at the time she was BPD but I have come to realise she has all the traits and this is why she couldn't agree on any level of care and I ended up in court all the while expending $$$. My eldest daughter was not so lucky. She has been aligned, displays traits herself, and we are trying to reconnect, she is 19.

I have a new relationship, new life, new home, my children are doing well, we have adventures, a lot of fun and good times. This has sent the ex into a bit of a tailspin.

She has wanted to reconnect (recycle) and we have been in court ordered mediation to help with conflict over parenting issues. uBPDex's alignment attempts have not left.

She apologized to me and cried for her behaviour in the relationship several months ago when I had to visit her home to drop the children off.

IT WAS EXTREMELY VALIDATING. It was a HUGE recognition... .on her part, but as time progresses I am beginning to feel cheated as the negative behaviour, undermining, and alignment has returned. I am feeling like it was only a desperate attempt to recycle on her part but I am still processing this to gain deeper understanding.

[MissTajo]

I just don't understand why anyone would knowingly stay in a relationship with a BPD... .Help me understand here... .

I'm not married to him or will I ever be. I don´t want his children. So, I guess my reason to stay is a mix between Stubbornness, love and care.

Once I realize I can do better. Once I realize he has been cheating. Once I realize I have been lied to too much, I will turn my back and never come back. For now I have my house, my job and my independence and I choose to stay. He has potential to be a wondefull person.  

[Proud_Dad]

How old are your kids?

My kids now 20 & 24 - both wanted me to divorce their uBPD mother (my X) while they were in middle school.  They did approach me together.  They told me their feelings independently, separately.  Their thoughts was based on what they experienced, not influenced by the other.

Forsaken,

My children are both toddlers and becoming young men by the day. I have the hardest time imagining missing just a single moment in my children’s lives that it makes me sick to even think about the possibility. I will never have more children and these two are my life. As I said before, I know it is selfish of me to stay out of fear of loosing them, but I do hope they are not the ones suffering in the long run.

JohnLove,

Thank you for the advice. I am usually the one handing out life lessons, yet this is one that comes at such a great cost I don't even know if I am capable of making a decision of that magnitude at this time. I am constantly second guessing  my decisions on the matter and it is taking its toll.

It is a VERY personal choice. I was with the uBPD mother of my children for 20 years.

I spent the best part of $100,000 and 6 years fighting for the right to be my children's father. I eventually won primary care. That prevented alienation or parental alignment. My eldest child was not so lucky.

Make this decision VERY carefully Proud_Dad as you will live with the consequences and so will your children. I did not know at the time she was BPD but I have come to realise she has all the traits and this is why she couldn't agree on any level of care and I ended up in court all the while expending $$$. My eldest daughter was not so lucky. She has been aligned, displays traits herself, and we are trying to reconnect, she is 19.

IN BOLD. This is my greatest fear in life. My father never wanted to be in my life so I have always held my children VERY tight, and this may very well be my downfall.

Thank you again for the advice. I wish you well in your new found peace... .it sounds amazing.


We are in the short lived "good time" right now. It is almost more difficult during the good times waiting for the S to hit the fan, you can't even enjoy the relative peace. At least when she I am black I know where I stand... .

[Forestaken]

It is easy for me to tell you to leave with small children.  I endured years of abuse because I was afraid.  My uBPD+dOCD-Xw threaten to falsely accuse me of child molestation. My D20 was 18 when I decided to divorce.

Waiting avoids this but creates a bad environment for the whole family.  When my kids were teenagers there were knock-down drag out fights every weekend.  Now the only problem is leaving on the lights and not putting dirty dishes in the sink.  My S24 has problems with over analyzing people's actions/reactions toward him.  I believe it's part of the coping mechanism he learn living with his momster. 

If you read the posts on the legal board, it tells of woes in regards to child custody cases.  I wish I could give you clear advice but with small children, it could become an ugly custody battle.  I didn't have to deal with it.  My kids are with me.  My Xw took their college fund and wonders why they have NC with her.

In the meantime, learn her triggers.  My Xw hated single moms. Her mother was her father's mistress.  My Xw loved her mother but theirs was a strange r/s.

Be prepared to answer the absurd.  My Xw would suddenly complain about not having enough money after we've gpne out to dinner 3-5 times a week because she wanted a certain type of food.  Getting it was easier than fighting her.

Good Luck

[Proud_Dad]

It is easy for me to tell you to leave with small children.  I endured years of abuse because I was afraid.  My uBPD+dOCD-Xw threaten to falsely accuse me of child molestation. My D20 was 18 when I decided to divorce.


If you read the posts on the legal board, it tells of woes in regards to child custody cases.  I wish I could give you clear advice but with small children, it could become an ugly custody battle.  I didn't have to deal with it.  My kids are with me.  My Xw took their college fund and wonders why they have NC with her.

This is sums up my fears pretty well. I don't want to spend years in conflict, yet I KNOW that the custody battle that would ensue would most definately break me a human being. Things seem so much more clear during times of rages. Like I said before, we are in the trough of the rage cycle. I guess I have learned to live for these short periods of relative peace (always have little things to deal with), even thought they cannot be completely enjoyed. It is at times like these that I am usually just sad and less angry.

I have read the Legal board as i do have a feeling that one day I will be posting there and on Co-parenting. It scares the hell out of me to even think about loosing my children... .but there is life after the breakup... .

[Boss302]

I've been on this site a few months... .on the staying board there are the occasional "why do we stay" topics.

On the undecided board, why do you stay if you're not married yet?  If I could set my "way-back" machine I would not call my uBPDw for that first date 4+ years ago.

So now I'm married... .the "better or worse" aspect keeps me here to try and work through the problems BPD creates.  

I just don't understand why anyone would knowingly stay in a relationship with a BPD... .Help me understand here... .

Oh, a couple of reasons in my case. I can say I was trying to honor my marriage vows (and I was), and I was scared about the prospect of raising two young kids on my own (and I was), but when it boils down to it, you stay because you're co-dependent. when you live with a BPD, the only way to "cope" is to make their disorder "your new normal."

It's only when you realize just how horrifically twisted "normal" is that you come to a place where you have to make a decision - save yourself or your marriage. I saved myself.

[Proud_Dad]

I've been on this site a few months... .on the staying board there are the occasional "why do we stay" topics.

On the undecided board, why do you stay if you're not married yet?  If I could set my "way-back" machine I would not call my uBPDw for that first date 4+ years ago.

So now I'm married... .the "better or worse" aspect keeps me here to try and work through the problems BPD creates.  

I just don't understand why anyone would knowingly stay in a relationship with a BPD... .Help me understand here... .

Oh, a couple of reasons in my case. I can say I was trying to honor my marriage vows (and I was), and I was scared about the prospect of raising two young kids on my own (and I was), but when it boils down to it, you stay because you're co-dependent. when you live with a BPD, the only way to "cope" is to make their disorder "your new normal."

It's only when you realize just how horrifically twisted "normal" is that you come to a place where you have to make a decision - save yourself or your marriage. I saved myself.

Boss302,

Can i just give you a high five or something?

One day... .

[Boss302]

I've been on this site a few months... .on the staying board there are the occasional "why do we stay" topics.

On the undecided board, why do you stay if you're not married yet?  If I could set my "way-back" machine I would not call my uBPDw for that first date 4+ years ago.

So now I'm married... .the "better or worse" aspect keeps me here to try and work through the problems BPD creates.  

I just don't understand why anyone would knowingly stay in a relationship with a BPD... .Help me understand here... .

Oh, a couple of reasons in my case. I can say I was trying to honor my marriage vows (and I was), and I was scared about the prospect of raising two young kids on my own (and I was), but when it boils down to it, you stay because you're co-dependent. when you live with a BPD, the only way to "cope" is to make their disorder "your new normal."

It's only when you realize just how horrifically twisted "normal" is that you come to a place where you have to make a decision - save yourself or your marriage. I saved myself.

Boss302,

Can i just give you a high five or something?

One day... .

Thanks... .I'm not 100% free, but I'd say I'm 90% of the way there two years after the divorce.

And, yes, the divorce was hell. BPDx threw a whole boatload of accusations at me and used the kids like battleaxes. But in the end, this worked out better for them - I could provide a stable household and she couldn't. That made a HUGE difference in their lives. It also made a huge difference when it came to custody.

Anything you can to do stabilize YOUR situation and make you more free to be the dad you want to be is going to be a positive in their lives. They do learn who the stable parent is... .it takes a while, but they do learn. In my case, it took a divorce.

A few months ago, when D17 graduated from high school, BPDx was at my apartment complex clubhouse, making a scene of herself because they wouldn't release some piece of clothing she had shipped to my daughter (they only release things to residents). And she was on the phone with D13 screaming about me. Afterwards, D13 turned to me and said, "you know, I think I figured out why you divorced mom." Since then, we have been able to talk about what is happening between her and BPDx. I cannot think of a better day - one daughter graduates from high school, the other FINALLY "figures it out." Can I get me a hallelujah?

Not to say it wasn't hell getting to that point - three years earlier, BPDx used D13 to rummage through my closet looking for a Playboy magazine (not kidding about that), and used both kids to make false accusations about me. That still hurts me deeper than I can possibly tell you. But things do get better. The alternative would have been to stay with BPDx and watch my family completely self destruct.

As far as divorce is concerned, yes it's scary if you want to go down that path. There are consequences for staying and consequences for leaving. In my case, I came to believe that leaving was my best option, but it has definitely left scars on me, and my kids. I'm still convinced it was the right move, though.

Be the best dad and man you can be, and make sure you have a good support system in place, including a therapist so that your anger doesn't show unless it's to someone you trust. You can come through this. God bless no matter what road you choose.

[Bak86]

I have a difficult time "running" because she made me insecure. At the moment i have the feeling i will never find a girl that was this great again. That's what keeping me hoping... .It's awful i know.

[wishfulthinking]

I'd have never let my friend set us up.  Not even a first date.  Now, I stay for one reason... .Love is stupid, I am stupid.  That's my only reason.

[Forestaken]

Thanks... .I'm not 100% free, but I'd say I'm 90% of the way there two years after the divorce.

... .

A few months ago, when D17 graduated from high school, BPDx was at my apartment complex clubhouse, making a scene of herself because they wouldn't release some piece of clothing she had shipped to my daughter (they only release things to residents). And she was on the phone with D13 screaming about me. Afterwards, D13 turned to me and said, "you know, I think I figured out why you divorced mom." Since then, we have been able to talk about what is happening between her and BPDx. I cannot think of a better day - one daughter graduates from high school, the other FINALLY "figures it out." Can I get me a hallelujah?

... .

As far as divorce is concerned, yes it's scary if you want to go down that path. There are consequences for staying and consequences for leaving. In my case, I came to believe that leaving was my best option, but it has definitely left scars on me, and my kids. I'm still convinced it was the right move, though.

I walked into divorce court May 2012, decree finalized May 2014 and her stuff is still in >> my << house.  I understand the 90%

Your D13 comment reminds me of both my kids advice (now D20 & D24).  While they were in middle school, on separate occasions, they told me to file for divorce from their mother.  Kids see crazy.

[workinprogress]

If I could set the way back machine, I would go back to when I was with my adoptive family, and find a way to run like hell.

Their belittling of me paved the way to my lifelong enslavement in my marriage.

Right now I am staying in some ignorant hope that the woman I married will suddenly reappeared.  To quote her, I guess I'm "pathetic."

[Recooperating]

Would you consider staying knowing he is in therapy, progressing, but still sucking the life out of you with only 1 year together, and no kids?

I left, 3 weeks before the wedding, 14 years on and off but the last 2 years officially together.

He was in therapy, but didnt take it serious at all... .I was the nut job that needed to be locked up... .

I felt terribly guilty, leaving him while he couldnt help it... .Its the disorder... .He didnt coose this! Guess what... .He does have a choice! He could have taken his therapy serious. He could have done the exersizes, he could have walked away instead of a verbally/emotionally abusing me.

I got out before I had kids, before I made the vow for better or worse. People sometimes dont understand (his people... .My people are over the moon!). I dont care. I had to deal with lying, cheating (several times), physical abuse, verbal abuse, manipulating, isolating... .

I am still dealing with the guilt, but 6 days NC now and I already feel less drained, anxious, tense and stressed out. I am heart broken, only because I realized I was in love with something that never exsisted... .

[ziniztar]

I had to deal with lying, cheating (several times), physical abuse, verbal abuse, manipulating, isolating... .

Sorry you had to deal with all of that. NC can be a good choice now. Good luck in keeping that up.