I want to work it out

[blueeyes567]

I am here because just recently my wife was diagnosed with BPD. looking back on the past 5 years I can now see the pattern. I was not educated before but have learned so much in the past few days. She has reached rock bottom. She is going on spending sprees she has physically cheated and feels like she is worthless. This has happened in the past but with only online flirtation not actual physical cheating. We are seeing a marriage counselor now and she does have an individual therapist. This the psychologists believe is from her childhood but she was discharged from the Army with PTSD anxiety depression disorder. we are trying to go day by day to see if our relationship can withstand the infidelity. I don't know how to deal with that. We have a three year old daughter together which she is the natural mother and she shares custody with her ex husband of a 10 year old son. When she divorced him seven years ago she was going through this same type of situation. She just up and left her son with her ex-husband and started sleeping around. She always chooses men to flirt with and sleep with also she says she feels more comfortable with women and identifies as being a lesbian. I am just here to get some other support and see how other people have dealt with BP D and the hardships on our relationship it is causing. Thanks. I look back on the last five years we have been together and can now see all the signs and her ups and downs. It is hard not to look back and think, I should have done this or that. For instance, she told me she needed space and wanted to be alone so I spent the night at a friends with our daughter to give her that space. The next night she said she wanted this again but our daughter had preschool the next day so I told her it was unfair to have her not sleep in her own bed. She stayed at a hotel and that is when the cheating occured. I can't help but think, I shouldn't have let her go to the hotel but then I try to rationalize and say it would have just happened some other time. I want to not think about that night. I want to move forward... .

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[maxsterling]

Just wanted to say welcome, and that your story isn't unfamiliar to us.

The title of your thread says "I want to work it out" - I can understand this, because I am trying to work things through with a fiancé who has many of the same behaviors.   Sometimes I question myself as to why I want to work it out, and not just throw in the towel and move on.

Given all that has happened with your r/s, and the unstable nature of your wife - what is motivating you to "work it out"?  Because of your daughter?  Have you thought about what your boundaries are and what would have to happen for you to no longer want to work it out?

BPD is an extremely frustrating disorder to deal with.  I'm glad to see your wife is in therapy on her own - it sounds like she really needs it.  Are you seeing a therapist on your own?  Dealing with a pwBPD is exhausting and confusing, and I have found seeing a T has helped me sort through my feelings, or at the very least given me some validation and a place to vent.

[blueeyes567]

Many things motivate me to want to stay with her. We have built an entire life together not only emotionally through experiences but financially as well. I am not one to believe that just because something got boring or difficult or even broken that it needs to be replaced. All relationships require work. Our daughter is a big reason, I won't lie, but not the founding reason. If my wife cannot get help or starts refusing, this is not a healthy situation for our daughter and I will have to do what I have to do at that point so our daughter doesn't this destructive behavior. I try to just think about day by day though. I am trying not to look really far in the future because I don't want to get too hopeful and at the same time I don't want to be negative. I do have my own therapist to vent to. The VA has been awesome with helping and have been a great resource to turn to. It is frustrating for her because so many groups and what not exist for me as a family member but our area doesn't have a group sort of meeting for her so she feels as if though she is the only one dealing with this. I have emailed her links to ones I found online but I don't think she will do any of those. She explains it isn't the same as talking to a person but then again, she is in the state of mind still where she wants to sleep around so she may want to meet others that want to sleep around. Those thoughts run through my head often and I try to push them back. I try to think about when things are not like this and the awesome relationship that we have. Day by day maxsterling as exhausting as it is. How are you motivated with your fiancé?

[MissyM]

Hi, blueeyes.  Sorry you are dealing with the sexually acting out that some BPDs have.  My dBPDh is a diagnosed sex addict and the time that he was being sexually compulsive with other people was just a nightmare.  I am glad you are getting help for yourself.  Just wanted to let you know that I have been where you are and can fully sympathize.

[blueeyes567]

Missy, how do you cope and deal with that behavior and stay?

[MissyM]

Blueeyes, I can stay because my dBPDh is in recovery for sex addiction.  He is working his program, has a sponsor, goes to individual therapy and group therapy.  I go to my own support group for spouses of sex addicts (COSA), also go to alanon, have my own therapist and group therapy.  It has taken a long time for things to get to this point and a lot of specialized help.  My boundary is that I won't stay in this marriage if he isn't in recovery for his addictions (he also has had drug addictions).  Our lives are headed in a good direction, I know that he could relapse eventually but I am much stronger and would either leave or he would go to inpatient treatment. 

The best thing you can do for yourself is get yourself help.  Getting you and your daughter in the most stable position possible, really has to be your focus.  Your wife will either come along or not but as they say, air mask on yourself first!

[Lucky One]

Blueeyes, I can stay because my dBPDh is in recovery for sex addiction.  He is working his program, has a sponsor, goes to individual therapy and group therapy.  I go to my own support group for spouses of sex addicts (COSA), also go to alanon, have my own therapist and group therapy.  It has taken a long time for things to get to this point and a lot of specialized help.  My boundary is that I won't stay in this marriage if he isn't in recovery for his addictions (he also has had drug addictions).  Our lives are headed in a good direction, I know that he could relapse eventually but I am much stronger and would either leave or he would go to inpatient treatment. 

The best thing you can do for yourself is get yourself help.  Getting you and your daughter in the most stable position possible, really has to be your focus.  Your wife will either come along or not but as they say, air mask on yourself first!

Absolutely amazing. That's you. And so forgiving, understanding and patient.

I wouldn't be able to do it. Which makes you the better person.

Do you also have children from the marriage.

Also I like the boundary you have set

Thanks for sharing. And wishing you only the best. You deserve it.

[blueeyes567]

My wife and I aren't back to the point yet to talk about boundaries.  The last week has still been an unpredictable mess. I thought things were getting better. All week she has communicated her "want" to still sleep around but said it lessens each day and she wanted to cuddle every night, among other things but last night she wanted nothing to dobwith me. She said she felt so disconnected and was very easily agitated.  I thought we were moving in the right direction but maybe I was too hopeful too soon

[Lucky One]

All week she has communicated her "want" to still sleep around but said it lessens each day and ... .

This is one of the Top Boundaries in my relationship.

My uBPDw knows if she sleeps around, or if it comes to my knowledge that she has done  this, at any time during the 38 year relationship, she's history.

Immediately - NO discussion. I will not TOLERATE IT FOR ONE SECOND. That's it.

Nor am I a person, who could live with someone doing this to me. I know my limitations (call them boundaries).

She can expect the same behaviour from me - absolutely no messing around.

Otherwise, why stay together? For a disloyal person. No ways!

Maybe I come from a different era - older generation - so reacting differently should not be viewed as being out of touch with a Modern day world.

Although I think most partners in a relationship want their loved one to be faithful. I think its the way we have been made. Normal & natural. The other way is NOT normal.

Also, doing it to the wrong person, may just cost more than one bargained for!

Could end up fatally dangerous - that's how serious it can be.

[blueeyes567]

Well the last breakdown she had before she was diagnosed was almost three years ago and I caught her emailing multiple guys sexual things back and forth but when I caught her sge snapped out of this funk. I'm not sure when she will be on the recovery path again. Waiting is the hardest part

[Lucky One]

Well the last breakdown she had before she was diagnosed was almost three years ago and I caught her emailing multiple guys sexual things back and forth but when I caught her sge snapped out of this funk. I'm not sure when she will be on the recovery path again. Waiting is the hardest part

See my post, just above yours.

[fred6]

Well the last breakdown she had before she was diagnosed was almost three years ago and I caught her emailing multiple guys sexual things back and forth but when I caught her sge snapped out of this funk. I'm not sure when she will be on the recovery path again. Waiting is the hardest part

I think you said that this happened with her ex husband also. Do you think that this behavior will change? I guess it all comes down to how much you're willing to put up with. Tough situation!

[blueeyes567]

She just up and left her ex husband one day and looking back it was a breakdown. She knows she was depressed but before being diagnosed with borderline she thought it was just the depression. I know she can be a different person and I want that but I have discussed with her that there is so much I am willing to take. I know she is in selfish mode right now. I hope some of my words got through to her

[MissyM]

Absolutely amazing. That's you. And so forgiving, understanding and patient.

I wouldn't be able to do it. Which makes you the better person.

Do you also have children from the marriage.

Also I like the boundary you have set

Thanks for sharing. And wishing you only the best. You deserve it.

Well, thank you!  My dBPDh and I had a long history before he switched to sex addiction from drug addiction.  I see people that are able to recover their relationships when the cheating was their entire marriage but I think that would be harder for me to accept.  He could easily stop when confronted by professionals, which is apparently the BPD because most SAs can't do that.

Blueeyes, you are not going to be able to say anything that is going to fix your wife.  She has to decide this is what she wants, to be in a healthy relationship.  Are you still letting her come and go as she pleases?  That would seem a boundary you could set pretty easily.

[blueeyes567]

She is currently staying. She has said that if ahe goes she will sleep around and I have told her I dont want that. She says the want to do something is getting less and less but today seemed like a huge set back. She has been saying ahe cant stand to be arpund me due to the guilt she feels and the guilt and emptiness feeling combined makes her want to leave

[MissyM]

She has been saying ahe cant stand to be arpund me due to the guilt she feels and the guilt and emptiness feeling combined makes her want to leave

BPDs have a great deal of shame, even without the compulsive behaviors.  Then they behave badly and that adds to their core shame.  This is why 12 step group for sex addiction and a sponsor have been great from my dBPDh.  Letting other people in on the things that he has done and they don't shun him, has really helped him reduce some shame.

[blueeyes567]

I am having a hard time holding back and disassociating myself right now. She can say the most hurtful things lately.  Its my fault she has no friends, its my fault we were fighting, its my fault thag she felt lonely. The only thing that isnt my fault is her cheating according to her.  I have been working on validation but every day is getting harder and harder

[MissyM]

Hopefully one of the very experienced members will come along on this thread.  I know that I have read not to over validated, to the point of it causing resentments on our end.  I know I still get caught JADEing when my dBPDh says things that are so victim driven.  That projection is hard to deal with, when they victimize and yet claim to be the victim.  Hey, we are human. 

[Grey Kitty]

I am having a hard time holding back and disassociating myself right now. She can say the most hurtful things lately.  Its my fault she has no friends, its my fault we were fighting, its my fault thag she felt lonely. The only thing that isnt my fault is her cheating according to her.  I have been working on validation but every day is getting harder and harder

Validation is fantastic when you can do it.

I have found that if I'm feeling too hurt, or just too exhausted, I can't do it well. My observation is that half-validation doesn't work half as well as full-validation. I find that it backfires completely.

What always helped was working on avoiding invalidation. That means stepping out before you say something hurtful, or at least before you say anything else that is hurtful.

The other huge one is when you are accused of something absolutely bogus, like being the reason she has no friends. Your completely natural reaction is to JADE (Justify, Argue, Defend, or Explain why it isn't so). Teach yourself to avoid this at all costs. Just don't say it. There may be good and validating things you could have said... .and you may not have that in you.

Sometimes saying nothing at all, or just not biting on that attempt to push your buttons is a huge victory on your part.

[Lucky One]

but every day is getting harder and harder

Sometimes saying nothing at all, or just not biting on that attempt to push your buttons is a huge victory on your part.

Agree - Silence is Golden.

Sometimes. But not all the time!

[MissyM]

She can say the most hurtful things lately.  Its my fault she has no friends, its my fault we were fighting, its my fault thag she felt lonely.

She is giving up her tool for self-soothing, acting out sexually with other people.  I know you don't like the term sex addiction but it takes about 90 days after someone has been having this behavior, for them to kind of calm down.  Their brain is sending out a lot of signals to push them to go back to this self-soothing, harmful behavior.  Then they have to learn new coping skills.  Their pain and angst haven't gone away and now they have no way of handling it.  Try the lessons and stay out of the arguments as much as possible.  Walking away works wonders for me!

[blueeyes567]

How do you deal with a friend that enables and almost pushes her to do destructive things? She has this male friend that she thinks of only as a friend and I believe she wpuld never do anything as when she does she has a type and he is the opposite of what she goes for. He knows she has BPD and is going through a rough time but he texts her and calls her sexy and invites her out to bars to drink and ahe always ends up paying for him. I knkw I cant say anything to her or I will get blamed for her no friends situation but he is using her and almost seems like he wants to have sex with her. We have a mutual friend with him that is going through a divorce and he keeps trying to talk my wife into having a threesome with him and the woman after the divorce is over

[MissyM]

Wow, that is tough. I have the right to say I am uncomfortable with a relationship my husband has.  Thing is, your wife isn't at the point where she is recognizing and making changes herself.  At this point, my husband wouldn't have a "friendship" like this.  I am very clear that this kind of thing would be unacceptable to me.  The 1st year of his recovery, we had battles about inappropriate relationships.  He no longer tries to justify those kind of relationships and doesn't have private communications with other women that are not work related.  That isn't where you are right now.  She may well choose to continue these destructive relationships.  You do not have to enable them out of fear.  Learning to have my own voice and decide what is acceptable for me, has taken me a very long time to get to.  I highly recommend some sort of 12 step for codependency and a therapist for the same, for you. 

[Grey Kitty]

How do you deal with a friend that enables and almost pushes her to do destructive things?

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt, and currently broken hearted about it. Pretty much your worst fears are happening to me right now, and will go on for a couple more days.  :'(  Then I choose my response in the aftermath.

The one bit of advice I can give you is this:

Understand that you absolutely cannot control either of their behavior. You have limited influence over it.

And if you get stuck in blindly reacting to her behavior or your fears about her behavior, your actions really won't help.

 I wish you the best navigating this one. I sure hope it goes better for you than it is for me.

[blueeyes567]

The talk about our friends divorce this morning led my wife to start talking about how if her friendship with this guy gets anynore awkward that she wont be his friend. Whoo hoo! Its hard to not get too excited about that but she seems genuine. She has helped another friend this week move out of her boyfriend's house so that hits home for her as well as she stated she doesnt want a broken family. She also explained it would never work with one of her one night stands because ahe isnt honest with them and realizes her feelings are exasperated and intense too fast