If they know they are BPD does this make them feel bad

[outside9x]

Just wondering how this panned out for any of you, or if you know of people who are in a relationship now dealing with this.

Like if you finally got them to admit that they are most likely BPD,  (Though they usually like to blame YOU for everything, or they just ignored their actions like nothing ever happenned- More the norm from my exBPDgf)   and start to seek counseling, do they start to resent you, feel guilty, or not good because of this?

I am thinking this is a shock upon discovery and then they start to think of previous relationships, (and people) they ruined or destroyed, and eventual can’t face that and now get mad at you or possibly themselves which usually causes them to drop counseling.

Any history on this? 

[Confused?]

Mine knew. She was diagnosed. Still didn't stop her from impulsive actions and never seemed help. She basically played victim the entire time. Constantly told me she wasn't good enough. The bottom line is she knew she was the problem but instead of getting better she got worse.

[Mr. Solo]

Mt dBPDw was diagnosed in a mental hospital and she was devastated. She accepted it and worked on it for a few weeks and then went back to what she was doing (and actually got much worse). She took some blame and apologized but she still tends to revert back to blaming me when the rubber meets the road. She does feel a tremendous amount of guilt at times. She will bust out crying and tell me she is sorry she broke my heart, sorry she cheated, sorry she did this and that, but then the next day can turn around and say the total opposite. When she is alone sometimes she breaks down and shuts down because of what she says is guilt. She can face what she has done to me and others at times but at other times she cannot. 

[antonio1213]

My exBPDgf knew something was wrong with her. She didn't know necessarily she had BPD but she called her self mentally/emotionally unstable. A therapist has told her she has BPD though, I guess she just forgot or something. When she left me she kept apologizing and telling me she is sorry and she cares for me. She says she was to "unstable" and sorry for being to unstable to be in a relationship.

They feel bad and guilty about what she did and how unstable and emotional she is. But in the end her actions don't meet her words and she is focusing on herself like always. She feels bad for what she did, and being 'unstable' but not bad enough to really do anything about it. And it is passes very quickly. Now when she contacts me it is because she wants me in her life. All for selfish reasons. Run from these people

[Zpinal]

Mine knew. She was diagnosed. Still didn't stop her from impulsive actions and never seemed help. She basically played victim the entire time. Constantly told me she wasn't good enough. The bottom line is she knew she was the problem but instead of getting better she got worse.

Right there with you. Mine accepted her illnesses (BPD co-morbid with bipolar type 2 rapid cycling, hyper anxiety and ADHD). She was on med for Bipolar but as for the rest, she resisted treatment making up lies about over qualifying for BCT (Behavioral Cognitive Therapy) refusing to see a psychologist again after 1 appointment etc. She sees her Psychiatrist still like once every 3 months but I dont know at this point, I have NC and frankly shes no longer my problem. I have reach the point that Im less and less angry about the whole thing, maybe Ive reached detachment or something its weird.

[Infared]

I don't think that they have any feelings?

[Mutt]

I don't think that they have any feelings?

It's an emotional based disorder. That being said, BPD is a part of their personality. Just like our personalities are a part of us.

[Infared]

I don't think that they have any feelings?

It's an emotional based disorder. That being said, BPD is a part of their personality. Just like our personalities are a part of us.

I have to keep trying to imagine that. it's hard to understand. I was told soo many cold-hearted lies. I was lied to about everything that mattered. Repeatedly. I just don't do that. I have feelings and values that matter to me. If I lie to everyone I know to manipulate them... .to me I end up with NOTHING. It's empty.  There's no truth. No trust. No relationship that has any meaning?

So it is difficult for me to wrap my head around someone doing that. Someone that I was manipulated into caring for, I guess? I'll never know.

[Mutt]

I understand Infrared and I agree. My values don't align with my ex and that's important to me. I do understand why she lies (dissociates) I have no ill-will towards her. I forgive her. I believe a healthy foundation for a relationship is built on trust. If you don't have trust, how solid is the foundation? I also believe boundaries need to be set early in a r/s and it's a lesson I learned having been in this one. If your cheating emotionally, physically or both. We're done. Maybe that's a little too black and white for some members. Some may give another chance and there's nothing wrong with that. It's happened to me more than once and I feel like its not something I'm willing to put up with.

In the context of not knowing or knowing that a pwBPD is BPD, this is their reality because it is a part of their personality. Their reality is as real to them as ours is to us. A disordered person needs to be committed to wanting to work through therapy. They make take one step forward and three steps back in therapy, not an easy thing. It takes a lot of courage for someone to help themselves and the same can be said for our members. It takes a big person to admit their faults and work on themselves. I think it's better to focus on ourselves and take lessons away from a relationship. Live and learn.

[Raybo48]

I broached the subject with mine toward the end.  I kind of knew it was sort of like spitting in the wind, but I got so tired of her telling me I was psycho (her fav word) and bi-polar all the time I decided to try and tell her I thought she had BPD.  All I can say is that it didn't go over well at all and she got very upset, which caused a prototypical BPD lashing out episode.  I went to that well a couple of times with her and it always generated the same reaponse.  The only thing she ever admitted was she knew she wasn't totally 'healthy' emotionally, but that's as far as she ever went. 

[Infared]

Yeah... .I didn't know until after about BPD. Upon researching that and doing a lot of reading and blogging here the disorder attributes really fit the dynamics of what I went through.  I was soo emotionally damaged I kept looking for answers.

I am sure that if I had raised the topic in the relationship, nothing would have changed. We are taking about a person here that went to therapy and sat there and told lie after lie to the therapist?   I was invited to a "closure" session after she left me and it was just a set-up to abuse me, by her and her manipulate "therapist". I was in therapy myself at the time and her T was soo unprofessional. What I went thru was just unbelievable to me.  I just didn't see the train coming.

Because of what I went thru, I do not date any longer, and I don't think I ever will. I would never take that chance again. I just pursue other things in life.

[Mutt]

We are taking about a person here that went to therapy and sat there and told lie after lie to the therapist?   I was invited to a "closure" session after she left me and it was just a set-up to abuse me, by her and her manipulate "therapist". I was in therapy myself at the time and her T was soo unprofessional. What I went thru was just unbelievable to me.

She didn't have the right T.

Therapists and doctors should learn to be like a rock when dealing with a person who has this disorder. That is, the doctor should offer his or her stability to contrast the client’s lability of emotion and thinking. Many professionals are turned-off by working with people with this disorder, because it draws on many negative feelings from the clinician. These occur because of the client’s constant demands on a clinician, the constant suicidal gestures, thoughts, and behaviors, and the possibility of self-mutiliating behavior. These are sometimes very difficult items for a therapist to understand and work with.

Providing a structured therapeutic setting is important no matter which therapy type is undertaken. Because people with this disorder often try and “test the limits” of the therapist or professional when in treatment, proper and well-defined boundaries of your relationship with the client need to be carefully explained at the onset of therapy. Clinicians need to be especially aware of their own feelings toward the patient, when the client may display behavior which is deemed “inappropriate.” Individuals with borderline personality disorder are often unfairly discriminated against within the broad range of mental health professionals because they are seen as “trouble-makers.” While they may indeed need more care than many other patients, their behavior is caused by their disorder. Phillip W. Long, M.D. also notes that:

“The therapeutic alliance should form within the patient’s real experiences with the therapist and with the treatment. The therapist must be able to tolerate repeated episodes of primitive rage, distrust, and fear. Uncovering is to be avoided in favor of bolstering of ego defenses, in order to eventually allow the patient to be less anxious about potential fragmentation and loss. The goals of therapy should be in terms of life gains toward independent functioning, and not complete restructuring of the personality.”

www.psychcentral.com/lib/borderline-personality-disorder-treatment/0001065

[Infared]

Thanks for your input Mutt.

My ex had run off with new supply a week before Christmas and said that there was no one.

Before she actually moved out of the house she had mentioned hurting herself. I called her stepmother and in a very caring way strongly advised that she get some help from a professional. I was relieved when I knew she was going.

I want to say... .I am not playing victim here. I was invited by her to 6 "closure" sessions... .I was in REALLY bad shape emotionally but seeing someone myself and in a self help recovery group. Daily mtgs. I am in AA. It kept me sane.

Went to the 1st closure session and Mutt, I was decently dressed etc. and very wired I.e. upset... .but keeping it together.  Within a few minutes I see she has told the therapist that she was not cheating on me... .and I realize that she has spun her webs on the therapist and then says that she didn't cheat on me, but couldn't look me in the eye and hangs her head down in shame... .it was so obvious that she was lying and the T says nothing? I was calm and not attacking her verbally in any way.

Then the T says to her, like I am not in the room:"He isn't exactly marriage material"! (She just met me 5 mins before the comment? She knew nothing about me other than whatever my ex told her... .and God knows what that was?)I was so upset that this person said this... .I started getting tears in my eyes and then the T turns to me and say:"we didn't come here to get upset."?

UNBELIEVEABLE. Therapy is a place to feel you feelings... .but the T was verbally abusing me and telling me not to get upset.

I left there in soo much emotional pain as I feel that they BOTH set me up.

I did not go back. I had a little self esteem left I guess! LOL.

If I had been in a better place I would have told the T how unprofessional I thought she was and left... .but I was in a really weak and vulnerable place at the time, and stunned by what was going on.

I don't believe that she got any diagnosis... but I would never have been included in that conversation by that point in time if she was.

[Deeno02]

I had absolutely no idea what BPD was. I thought I was just F*ck up. She always warned me "better be careful, I mean!". So Id chuckle about it. Guess she was warning me...

[outside9x]

Hi Infared,

I think they have feelings but only for themselves their sadness.  I seen her cry many times, but mostly for being a victim.  She did cry when my dog got injured as well, but it was more association than anything.  I guess it matters what type of BPD they are, but man, she could be vicious, cruel, and a big time C

Rage maniac.   She was cruel!

[Raybo48]

The only time I saw emotions (crying, sadness, etc)out of mine was when she was drinking heavily. When her grandmother died she went about her day, nothing... .When my friend dropped dead one day and I told her I got, "wow sorry" and right onto the next subject.  When I found out my girlfriend (of 7 years) from years prior died of cancer and I told her I got, "why are you bringing her up for and why do you care that was years ago".  I never saw remorse, never ever saw empathy for anyone especially me.  The strange thing I did witness time and time again was her immediately friending people from AA who were either recovering or still active drinkers and and would have some empathy for them... Basically let them walk all over her, and some of these people were users for her money, etc... .I always found that interesting that she somehow connected with their plight in life, but never ever with what youd consider and emotionally balanced person...

[fred6]

The only time I saw emotions (crying, sadness, etc)out of mine was when she was drinking heavily. When her grandmother died she went about her day, nothing... .When my friend dropped dead one day and I told her I got, "wow sorry" and right onto the next subject.  When I found out my girlfriend (of 7 years) from years prior died of cancer and I told her I got, "why are you bringing her up for and why do you care that was years ago".  I never saw remorse, never ever saw empathy for anyone especially me.  The strange thing I did witness time and time again was her immediately friending people from AA who were either recovering or still active drinkers and and would have some empathy for them... Basically let them walk all over her, and some of these people were users for her money, etc... .I always found that interesting that she somehow connected with their plight in life, but never ever with what youd consider and emotionally balanced person...

That's interesting. Mine always said that she wanted to work with handicapped kids. She would always try to help people in the grocery store. If an old lady dropped a can of biscuits on the floor, she would run over there and pick it up for her. She once asked a pregnant lady with 3 kids with her if she could help her take her groceries to her car. That lady looked at her like she was "crazy". I think this type of behavior is to make themselves feel like they are doing something "good" in life, since they cause so much turmoil in the lives of people that they are close to in their personal life.

[Raybo48]

I would have to agree fred6.  I mean some of these people she was associating with were not just drinkers.  Some were active/recovering herion addicts etc... .I kept trying to tell her that although it was a nice gesture these people were using her and they were 'transients' in her life and she really need to work on her own alcoholism/life etc.  Nope, time and time again she'd be at their house helping them get sober buying them groceries, etc. One of them even walked off with $500 she had in her bedroom and she barely got upset, but when it came to the 'close people' in her life like good friends and family and me you got the full BPD version. 

[Mutt]

I am not playing victim here. I was invited by her to 6 "closure" sessions... .I was in REALLY bad shape emotionally but seeing someone myself and in a self help recovery group. Daily mtgs. I am in AA. It kept me sane.

Went to the 1st closure session and Mutt, I was decently dressed etc. and very wired I.e. upset... .but keeping it together.  Within a few minutes I see she has told the therapist that she was not cheating on me... .and I realize that she has spun her webs on the therapist and then says that she didn't cheat on me, but couldn't look me in the eye and hangs her head down in shame... .it was so obvious that she was lying and the T says nothing? I was calm and not attacking her verbally in any way.

Then the T says to her, like I am not in the room:"He isn't exactly marriage material"! (She just met me 5 mins before the comment? She knew nothing about me other than whatever my ex told her... .and God knows what that was?)I was so upset that this person said this... .I started getting tears in my eyes and then the T turns to me and say:"we didn't come here to get upset."?

UNBELIEVEABLE. Therapy is a place to feel you feelings... .but the T was verbally abusing me and telling me not to get upset.

That's horrible. You're not playing the victim here,  the T didn't see that your ex was playing the victim.

The T didn't pick up on the Karpmann Drama Triangle. You as persecutor, the T as rescuer and your ex as victim.

I'm sorry Infrared. I was triangulated many times in MC sessions. I agree with you that therapy is supposed to be a safe place, not a place to be verbally abused. You have a right to be upset.

[Infared]

WOW! Mutt... .that is EXACTLY what happened!

"The T didn't pick up on the Karpmann Drama Triangle. You as persecutor, the T as rescuer and your ex as victim"

The way I was treated in that room was UNBELIEVEABLE. It was more like I went to see her lawyer and didn't bring one wit me.

Plus she had the new guy as a rescuer, too and I'm sure she was rewriting history there about me as well so that she was a victim yet again. Her manipulation knows no bounds and does very well for her. Cold-hearted and selfish and void of any feelings as far as I can see. It was all about manipulating and controlling everyone with victimhood and lies.

Seems like I was the one with all of the feelings. LOL!

[Mr. Solo]

I had absolutely no idea what BPD was. I thought I was just F*ck up. She always warned me "better be careful, I mean!". So Id chuckle about it. Guess she was warning me...

My wife would tell me, "I don't think I have a conscience." I too laughed it off.

[Mutt]

WOW! Mutt... .that is EXACTLY what happened!

"The T didn't pick up on the Karpmann Drama Triangle. You as persecutor, the T as rescuer and your ex as victim"

The way I was treated in that room was UNBELIEVEABLE. It was more like I went to see her lawyer and didn't bring one wit me.

Plus she had the new guy as a rescuer, too and I'm sure she was rewriting history there about me as well so that she was a victim yet again. Her manipulation knows no bounds and does very well for her. Cold-hearted and selfish and void of any feelings as far as I can see. It was all about manipulating and controlling everyone with victimhood and lies.

Seems like I was the one with all of the feelings. LOL!

Hi Infared,

I think they have feelings but only for themselves their sadness.  I seen her cry many times, but mostly for being a victim.  She did cry when my dog got injured as well, but it was more association than anything.  I guess it matters what type of BPD they are, but man, she could be vicious, cruel, and a big time C

Rage maniac.   She was cruel!

Sounds like Witch was triggered.