how to change my habit of codependency

[Depression = 72% of members]

I feel my husband is a well practised manipulator, whether he realises it consciously or not. But i realise we are both codependent with me enabling his behaviour by being too scared to say no or stick up for myself. My dad beat us as a kid so i realise why I'm like this. I just need some skills to enable me to put in place boundaries and keep them no matter how much fuss my hubby makes when i do it.

[minka]

I feel my husband is a well practised manipulator, whether he realises it consciously or not. But i realise we are both codependent with me enabling his behaviour by being too scared to say no or stick up for myself. My dad beat us as a kid so i realise why I'm like this. I just need some skills to enable me to put in place boundaries and keep them no matter how much fuss my hubby makes when i do it.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[maxsterling]

Minka, 

I'm glad you found us here.  What you describe is a common issue we all face - we feel the BPD person in our lives is walking all over us, and we want to know how to stand up for ourselves and stop it.  I certainly face the same issue, and feel like I am letting way too much bad behavior slide.  Is your husband actually diagnosed with BPD?  What kind of behaviors are you dealing with?  Each different behavior may have a different approach of how to deal with.

Personally, I don't like the word "co-dependent" - I don't believe in it as I think it is usually a way of passing some blame onto the victim.  Yes, we have roles in the r/s, but it's not like we asked to be manipulated or abused.  "Co-dependent" sometimes carries with it the false connotation that we somehow are addicted to the drama, intentionally sought out a controlling partner, or are somehow enabling or responsible for their bad behavior.  I think that is false 99% of the time - and instead the "co-dependent" behavior we exhibit is a natural reaction of us trying to deal with an extremely difficult situation that was thrust upon us, and we don't know how to properly deal with.

Your husband's behavior towards you is wrong.  You are NOT enabling it.  Having and enforcing proper boundaries will protect you from abuse, but WILL NOT STOP OR CHANGE HIS BEHAVIOR.  He is a grown man, and it's not like he is a 6-year old where you can still teach him right from wrong.  Boundaries are about protecting you, not changing him.  As for how to have boundaries - the links on the right side of this page have been helpful to me .

[maric]

So glad to read this, Max. I have been beating myself these days wondering how much of what I have been through was my fault, because of co-dependency... .

[maxsterling]

maric - My "moment of clarity" on this issue was sitting in counseling with her, her basically abusing me and blaming me right in session, and her excusing her behavior because of my "co-dependency" and poor/improper boundaries - saying that I am manipulative because I am co-dependent and get my rocks off by trying to control her into "being good".       Talk about an alternate reality!  She claimed I was so sick with "co-dependency" when from my end all I was trying to do was set and keep boundaries, keep my sense of independence, and try and maintain some peace and order in my life.  She made it sounds like I asked for this... .

[maric]

maric - saying that I am manipulative because I am co-dependent and get my rocks off by trying to control her into "being good". 

I know exactly how you feel. I wonder what is the alternative to this supposed "controlling" behavior we nons have... .not caring at all? Go numb? I just don't know.

I have been almost a year out of rs, and I am scared to death to be into a new one. I still have hard days, when I cannot stop thinking of all I went through. Conversations we had, accusations she made. Telling me I am passive agressive and controlling. I am afraid of hurting others now... .

My god, this rs messed my head up.

[Grey Kitty]

  and hello, minka!

I just need some skills to enable me to put in place boundaries and keep them no matter how much fuss my hubby makes when i do it.

We can help a lot on that! Can you tell us about a boundary you tried to place which didn't work the way you wanted? Sometimes it is easier with specifics than generalities.

 GK

[minka]

I want to reserve the right to go to another room to get some sleep, if I cant sleep thru my husband's snoring. We always start off in the same room, but if I cant sleep I now go into another room, and come back before the alarm goes off next morning. We have only been married nearly 2 years, and hubby really struggles with this. He insists we have "separate rooms" and reckons that's the beginning of the end of our marriage. He kicks up a massive fuss about this.

I realise I reward his behaviour by giving in, when he makes a fuss. I just need some skills to learn how to say no, i need my sleep, this is not negotiable. The more fuss he makes, the harder it is to not back down. I'm sick of being exhausted at work and feeling shattered thru insufficient sleep

[Grey Kitty]

I think you actually have two issues you need to protect yourself on here:

1. You need your sleep.

If you can't sleep because of his snoring, you can leave and sleep elsewhere.

You already know how to do this one--it worked for you before 

Since he is sleeping (at the time, or he wouldn't snore!), he doesn't interfere, making it easier.

2. He kicks up a massive fuss over it later.

I'm assuming that both of you slept the night, that this isn't a 3am fight.

The issue here is that your H picking a fight. He is criticizing you, yelling at you, and/or verbally abusing you. I'll use the phrase verbal abuse going forward; substitute whatever fits your experience as needed.

The boundary you can enforce is "I will not remain present while you verbally abuse me."

Refuse to engage. (You might explain once that you are doing this to save your marriage, not end it. If you've said this dozens of times, perhaps don't bother.) Say clearly that you won't participate in this anymore.

If he won't stop, leave the room. If he follows you, leave the house.



There is another approach for you to consider, especially if you have tried validation with some success already.

It sounds like he's got some real fears and concerns around this. If you can set aside your anger and frustration (and lack of sleep!) for a while and be genuinely interested in what his feelings about this are, and where they come from, you might be able to ask him about this.

This seems like a conflict that may be resolvable if you and he understand each other a little better. Perhaps he has some weird assumptions or history that colors this for him.

Don't try it when he's already upset... .try it when he's open and available.

[maxsterling]

I don't want to derail the topic - but interesting you mention snoring.  Of course, you probably already know that if you were the one snoring, he would be all over you about it   My SO snores, too.  Quite loudly at times.  And it is 99% clear to me she has sleep apnea.  A couple of things I have noticed - she has been taking trazodone to help her sleep for almost a year now - something she started on as a result of her psychological issues.  But since she has been on it, her snoring is nearly 100% gone!  When she doesn't take the trazodone - she snores.  I also seem to notice that when she is having trouble sleeping, that correlates to stronger BPD symptoms.  Not sure which causes which, but I do wonder how many other pwBPD have sleep/snoring issues. 

[minka]

Thanks grey kitty that was helpful. I guess my real problem is alot of time I'm too scared to leave and go to next room just cos of the flak i know I'll cop later. I guess I'm a conflict avoider. But the only way i guess is to feel the fear and do it anyway

[Grey Kitty]

it is 99% clear to me she has sleep apnea.

I don't want to derail either... .but I gotta say something. Would she be receptive to a sleep study? I personally know of several people who have sleep apnea, and the many ways it sucked all the life out of them over the years before they dealt with it is astounding. And so was the turnaround after they did deal with it!

Back on topic... .

I guess I'm a conflict avoider. But the only way i guess is to feel the fear and do it anyway

Being that way is pretty normal. I'm lucky--I wasn't raised with it, unlike many members here. My wife still managed to turn me into someone who avoided conflicts out of fear over the years. It was really tough changing that.

Feeling the fear and going forward anyhow isn't the only way. It is the best way. You've tried avoiding the fear and giving in enough times to know how that one works for you. 

[minka]

Guess what grey kitty. This morning i tried what u suggested about saying what i was doing was saving the marriage. I told him the fact of me going to the other room wasnt the problem, it was his negative perception of what that meant. I said he needs to change his negative perception, not change my actions. And he agreed! I couldn't believe it. So thanks heaps. 1 small victory but its a good start

[minka]

Re sleep apnoea, i dont have sleep apnoea, I'm just cursed with being a really light sleeper. I have no trouble sleeping when I'm by myself, with no loud snoring next to me

[Grey Kitty]

Yay!

That is fantastic news that he was able to see so quickly that he was barking up the wrong tree, so to speak!

Do keep in mind for the future that you don't have to stand there and take it if he gets angry and starts fussing at you.

It is OK to say you can't discuss it now, and ask for some space.

And it is OK to go away for a little while if he can't help but bring the topic back up.