Why Do They WANT to Hurt Us?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

This is the latest question I have been pondering.  I cannot fathom why ANY person wants to hurt another--call me Pollyanna, etc. I'm certain I have unintentionally hurt others or in fits of anger, said things I do not mean, but no one hurts more than I when I recognize that I have hurt another.  So, I have really been contemplating the why's.  Below is a letter from a BPD to Nons from bluelight.org.  It has really brought me some understanding tonight:

Bluelight.org

From: BPD to NON

This is something to keep in mind for people who are trying to maintain a relationship with someone with BPD:

You wanted to know the worst about me, the things I told no one and hid below the surface. How do I explain it? How do I explain who I am when I am not even sure of it myself? How do I put into words the worst parts of me that I have run from for so long? I will tell you my secrets, I will tell you everything. Maybe it will help me. Maybe you will hate me for it or maybe you will understand. I don't know, but I am sick of running. So here it is, I will give you what you want.

I hate you. That is not true, but sometimes I think it is. I will not answer the phone when you call, even though I want to talk to you. I will not call you, even though it is all I want to do. I will not reach out to you, even though every part of me wants to. I will be mad at you, I will want to hurt you, I will drive you away because I am afraid to let you closer. I need your constant attention, your reassurances, but I will greet them with cold indifference. I will be jealous of the attention you give others, and I will get mad at you for ignoring me. I will feel close to you and care for you one day, only to be mad and want you out of my life the next.

I am an emotional amnesiac, maybe I always have been. I take each event, each day, each conversation as a seperate event, always looking for signs that you might hurt me. When I feel neglected, I will get mad and forget that the day before you told me how much you cared. I am an inconsistent mess. There is a part of me who is happy and confident and another part that is insecure and needy. These days, I never know which one it will be. Every time I think I am in control, that I know you care and I feel comfortable with our relationship, the fear and doubt will come back. Maybe with time it will go away completely, but doubt it. All it will take is another close relationship, another new friend, another day and it will be back.

You ask what you can do and I do not know what to say. The needy part of me wants your constant attention, it needs your words and thoughts, your presence. But I know that is not the answer, I must accept the limitations on our relationship. The scared part of me wants you out of my life because it would be easier. The hateful part of me wants to hurt you because it thinks you have hurt me. All I can ask you to do is to understand, to not give up. I will ignore you at times, I may be rude to you, I may try to hurt you. I may hide from you and wait for you to reach out to me, so I know you will care. It is not fair to do these things, but I will. I cannot ask you to put up with this, it is not fair and no matter how I act, I care too much to put you through this. But you asked, and this is all I have to tell you.

I do not like this. I do not like that I am needy and clinging. I do not like that I hurt people. I do not like that I am rude and sarcastic to those around me. I do not like this part of myself. For years, I have ignored this and pretended it was me, but I have realized that is wrong. This is not me, it is a false identity created to protect me from the world. This was not an easy realization, and perhaps I haven't fully accepted it yet. But I have found my path, I have realized I can change and I can accept this side of me and keep it from becoming who I am. It will not be easy and it will not be quick, but I have faith that I can do it. Perhaps one day I will see me as the person you see behind my defenses, and perhaps one day I will let others see that person as well.

This is for you, but you are many people. You are the people close to me now. You are the people I want to be close to even though I have kept you away. You are the friends I have pushed away in the past, the friends I never forgave and never let back in my life, the friends I never had the chance to tell this to. You are the people I will meet in the future, the people I will care about until once again I push them out of my life. You are the part of me that is still trying to understand who I am. You are all of these people and many more. [nsfw]

[Loveofhislife]

This is the latest question I have been pondering.  I cannot fathom why ANY person wants to hurt another--call me Pollyanna, etc. I'm certain I have unintentionally hurt others or in fits of anger, said things I do not mean, but no one hurts more than I when I recognize that I have hurt another.  So, I have really been contemplating the why's.  Below is a letter from a BPD to Nons from bluelight.org.  It has really brought me some understanding tonight:

Bluelight.org

From: BPD to NON

This is something to keep in mind for people who are trying to maintain a relationship with someone with BPD:

You wanted to know the worst about me, the things I told no one and hid below the surface. How do I explain it? How do I explain who I am when I am not even sure of it myself? How do I put into words the worst parts of me that I have run from for so long? I will tell you my secrets, I will tell you everything. Maybe it will help me. Maybe you will hate me for it or maybe you will understand. I don't know, but I am sick of running. So here it is, I will give you what you want.

I hate you. That is not true, but sometimes I think it is. I will not answer the phone when you call, even though I want to talk to you. I will not call you, even though it is all I want to do. I will not reach out to you, even though every part of me wants to. I will be mad at you, I will want to hurt you, I will drive you away because I am afraid to let you closer. I need your constant attention, your reassurances, but I will greet them with cold indifference. I will be jealous of the attention you give others, and I will get mad at you for ignoring me. I will feel close to you and care for you one day, only to be mad and want you out of my life the next.

I am an emotional amnesiac, maybe I always have been. I take each event, each day, each conversation as a seperate event, always looking for signs that you might hurt me. When I feel neglected, I will get mad and forget that the day before you told me how much you cared. I am an inconsistent mess. There is a part of me who is happy and confident and another part that is insecure and needy. These days, I never know which one it will be. Every time I think I am in control, that I know you care and I feel comfortable with our relationship, the fear and doubt will come back. Maybe with time it will go away completely, but doubt it. All it will take is another close relationship, another new friend, another day and it will be back.

You ask what you can do and I do not know what to say. The needy part of me wants your constant attention, it needs your words and thoughts, your presence. But I know that is not the answer, I must accept the limitations on our relationship. The scared part of me wants you out of my life because it would be easier. The hateful part of me wants to hurt you because it thinks you have hurt me. All I can ask you to do is to understand, to not give up. I will ignore you at times, I may be rude to you, I may try to hurt you. I may hide from you and wait for you to reach out to me, so I know you will care. It is not fair to do these things, but I will. I cannot ask you to put up with this, it is not fair and no matter how I act, I care too much to put you through this. But you asked, and this is all I have to tell you.

I do not like this. I do not like that I am needy and clinging. I do not like that I hurt people. I do not like that I am rude and sarcastic to those around me. I do not like this part of myself. For years, I have ignored this and pretended it was me, but I have realized that is wrong. This is not me, it is a false identity created to protect me from the world. This was not an easy realization, and perhaps I haven't fully accepted it yet. But I have found my path, I have realized I can change and I can accept this side of me and keep it from becoming who I am. It will not be easy and it will not be quick, but I have faith that I can do it. Perhaps one day I will see me as the person you see behind my defenses, and perhaps one day I will let others see that person as well.

This is for you, but you are many people. You are the people close to me now. You are the people I want to be close to even though I have kept you away. You are the friends I have pushed away in the past, the friends I never forgave and never let back in my life, the friends I never had the chance to tell this to. You are the people I will meet in the future, the people I will care about until once again I push them out of my life. You are the part of me that is still trying to understand who I am. You are all of these people and many more. [nsfw]

[Loveofhislife]

I pasted this in exactly as it was on the web site; however, I do not agree that it is necessarily for someone in a relationship with a pwBPD; instead, it is very helpful in my ongoing attempts to detach and come to acceptance.

[Hadlee]

That is pretty sad.  I wouldn't wish that kind of life on anyone.  My struggle with detaching from my BPD friend is the difficulty I have in depersonalizing her behavior.  I, at times, understand where the behavior comes from, but cannot help but be angry and hurt by it.

It's when I have compassion for her that I get sucked back in.  I'm thinking my best option is to just believe she's crazy and toxic, so I can move on

[fromheeltoheal]

This is fascinating to read Love, it confirms a lot of the things understood about the disorder and how it manifests, although from within the disorder, which is very confirming.  My ex could have written it, although maybe not with so much awareness; my guess is the person who wrote it is in some kind of therapy and is digging for why they do what they do, or it could be someone who's trying to write something that a borderline would write if they could.  In any case, validating and transparent.  Thanks!

[downwhim]

This says it all! I needed to read this tonight. Thanks for the reminder.

[bpd3103]

Needed to read this, its as if my ex wrote it herself, really helped

She has been acting ridiculous on FB, and I can only imagine that it is to spite me. She doesn't direct it towards me personally, but I think it is meant to hurt me in a backward BPD kind of way, to get attention. Ignoring you because they care, and then attacking/hurting you because they think you've hurt them. Crazy.

Anyways, knowledge is power and I don't take it personal or even seriously. I know the nature of the disorder, but being a healthy non we react to things rationally, and when dealing with these people we have to train our brains to almost turn off, and not care, as they do. Otherwise we will get wrapped up in the whirlwind that is their minds. Caring about them and all the while losing ourselves.

Its sad.

[BorisAcusio]

or it could be someone who's trying to write something that a borderline would write if they coul

It is most likely written by someone who still cares and try to imagine what's going on in a borderline's mind.

[Loveofhislife]

Thanks to all for remarks.  I hope the letter helped others as it helped me.  I will not claim to authenticate the authorship--only noting that there were lots of disclaimers that it could be triggering for BPD's and was reportedly authored by a BPD on a site devoted to BPD sufferers.

There were other related posts for BPD's on the site, but they were more along the clinical lines (diagnostic criteria), and most of us here have read those many times.

Whoever wrote it, I know those words could have been written by my exbfBPD.  Reading them, as I percevorated over and over about why he would want to  hurt me, brought me a lot of peace on an evening when I, "the lonely child," was missing other attachments in her life.  Namely, a youngest who left to return to college last night.

I find this healing process not to be unlike what they tell people in addictions therapy:  HALT.  Don't get too Hungry, Angry, Lonely, or Tired.  I was all of those when I found the letter last night.

[letmeout]

That was a good post, thank you for sharing!

[willtimeheal]

Thanks for the post. It was very interesting to read. I do feel that my ex BPD hated her father so much for all the abuse he put her thru as a child. Although she hated him she also wanted his love. I do feel that throughout our relationship she slowly began treating me the way her father treated her. I do feel that whether it was conscious or unconscious she wanted someone to feel as miserable about themselves and go thru exactly what she went thru. I was the lucky recipient of that abuse.

[Tim300]

Thanks for the post. It was very interesting to read. I do feel that my ex BPD hated her father so much for all the abuse he put her thru as a child. Although she hated him she also wanted his love. I do feel that throughout our relationship she slowly began treating me the way her father treated her. I do feel that whether it was conscious or unconscious she wanted someone to feel as miserable about themselves and go thru exactly what she went thru. I was the lucky recipient of that abuse.

I felt like this a bit too.  Like she was jealous that I came from a stable family, had a solid educational and job background, etc.  Because of this jealousy she wanted to deliver me some pain.

My ex also alleged to have an abusive father.  This allegation didn't really add up much though, and now that I understand BPD more I actually think it's 100% bogus but that perhaps she really feels like she was abused somehow.  I am curious, do you think your ex's father really put her through all the abuse she alleged?

[apple2]

This is the latest question I have been pondering.  I cannot fathom why ANY person wants to hurt another--call me Pollyanna, etc. I'm certain I have unintentionally hurt others or in fits of anger, said things I do not mean, but no one hurts more than I when I recognize that I have hurt another.  So, I have really been contemplating the why's.  Below is a letter from a BPD to Nons from bluelight.org.  It has really brought me some understanding tonight:

Bluelight.org

From: BPD to NON

This is something to keep in mind for people who are trying to maintain a relationship with someone with BPD:

You wanted to know the worst about me, the things I told no one and hid below the surface. How do I explain it? How do I explain who I am when I am not even sure of it myself? How do I put into words the worst parts of me that I have run from for so long? I will tell you my secrets, I will tell you everything. Maybe it will help me. Maybe you will hate me for it or maybe you will understand. I don't know, but I am sick of running. So here it is, I will give you what you want.

I hate you. That is not true, but sometimes I think it is. I will not answer the phone when you call, even though I want to talk to you. I will not call you, even though it is all I want to do. I will not reach out to you, even though every part of me wants to. I will be mad at you, I will want to hurt you, I will drive you away because I am afraid to let you closer. I need your constant attention, your reassurances, but I will greet them with cold indifference. I will be jealous of the attention you give others, and I will get mad at you for ignoring me. I will feel close to you and care for you one day, only to be mad and want you out of my life the next.

I am an emotional amnesiac, maybe I always have been. I take each event, each day, each conversation as a seperate event, always looking for signs that you might hurt me. When I feel neglected, I will get mad and forget that the day before you told me how much you cared. I am an inconsistent mess. There is a part of me who is happy and confident and another part that is insecure and needy. These days, I never know which one it will be. Every time I think I am in control, that I know you care and I feel comfortable with our relationship, the fear and doubt will come back. Maybe with time it will go away completely, but doubt it. All it will take is another close relationship, another new friend, another day and it will be back.

You ask what you can do and I do not know what to say. The needy part of me wants your constant attention, it needs your words and thoughts, your presence. But I know that is not the answer, I must accept the limitations on our relationship. The scared part of me wants you out of my life because it would be easier. The hateful part of me wants to hurt you because it thinks you have hurt me. All I can ask you to do is to understand, to not give up. I will ignore you at times, I may be rude to you, I may try to hurt you. I may hide from you and wait for you to reach out to me, so I know you will care. It is not fair to do these things, but I will. I cannot ask you to put up with this, it is not fair and no matter how I act, I care too much to put you through this. But you asked, and this is all I have to tell you.

I do not like this. I do not like that I am needy and clinging. I do not like that I hurt people. I do not like that I am rude and sarcastic to those around me. I do not like this part of myself. For years, I have ignored this and pretended it was me, but I have realized that is wrong. This is not me, it is a false identity created to protect me from the world. This was not an easy realization, and perhaps I haven't fully accepted it yet. But I have found my path, I have realized I can change and I can accept this side of me and keep it from becoming who I am. It will not be easy and it will not be quick, but I have faith that I can do it. Perhaps one day I will see me as the person you see behind my defenses, and perhaps one day I will let others see that person as well.

This is for you, but you are many people. You are the people close to me now. You are the people I want to be close to even though I have kept you away. You are the friends I have pushed away in the past, the friends I never forgave and never let back in my life, the friends I never had the chance to tell this to. You are the people I will meet in the future, the people I will care about until once again I push them out of my life. You are the part of me that is still trying to understand who I am. You are all of these people and many more. [nsfw]

Hey there,

after reading this, I really don't know what I can do. My ex broke up with me for the 2. time. After I got some knowledge about BPD, I did not give up, I tried to have a talk with him after one-month NC. He accepted it very actively. And even had sex again with me. And then he said he wanted to get rid of me. He does not love me... .He also put some pictures on FB, not directly against me, but I can read his anger.

Now I just don't know whether I should still give him attention or even contact him after 1 month again. Or just leaving.

The thing is, what he said, is always self-controversial. I cannot understand what he wants... .He neither, I suppose.

[Tim300]

I cannot understand what he wants... .He neither, I suppose.

It seems like maybe they know what they want in the moment (e.g., to get married by the end of the year), but that what they want just keeps changing, either within a day or maybe over the course of a few months passing.

[apple2]

I cannot understand what he wants... .He neither, I suppose.

It seems like maybe they know what they want in the moment (e.g., to get married by the end of the year), but that what they want just keeps changing, either within a day or maybe over the course of a few months passing.

Yes, therefore, mine actually "manipulates" the relationship (just as he said), because I always need to look at his face and guess his mood... .Anyway, I would not try to have a conversation about the relationship with him anymore. There is no logic at all. It always leads to a bigger mess in his mind.

[Leaving]

I cannot understand what he wants... .He neither, I suppose.

It seems like maybe they know what they want in the moment (e.g., to get married by the end of the year), but that what they want just keeps changing, either within a day or maybe over the course of a few months passing.

Yes, therefore, mine actually "manipulates" the relationship (just as he said), because I always need to look at his face and guess his mood... .Anyway, I would not try to have a conversation about the relationship with him anymore. There is no logic at all. It always leads to a bigger mess in his mind.

Good thinking Apple.  It's truly best not to waste precious time trying to discuss issues like relationships with them.

We were talking about passive aggressive abuse yesterday in another post.  Today is my birthday and my husband decided to do something for me ( now that we are separated)  since we still work together ( we own a business together) so here's what he did:

He bought me an old wrinkled damaged tiny box of Christmas truffles called, ' Piggy Truffles' 

He gave me an old bouquet of tulips with yellow leaves

In addition to those ' wonderful' gifts he bought HIMSELF a nice bag of chips and a nice bag of peppermint puffs ( my favorite) and a deli sandwich for lunch.

I didn't say a word.  I didn't say thanks, didn't complain. I put everything aside and went on about my work. I think he really wanted me to get upset so that he could accuse me of being a selfish bi*** who never appreciated what he did for me.  WHATEVA!  If he needs to convince himself that I'm the problem, then so be it but I didn't respond to his passive aggressive baiting today.  He moped around the office, slouched in his chair like a pouty boy, yawned all day.  It took me many years to finally accept that I was married to a man whose entire purpose in life was to hurt me, demoralize me, devalue me and that he resented doing anything nice for me and would punish me for anything he did. 

I hope you and I can find total freedom from this evil soon!

[apple2]

I cannot understand what he wants... .He neither, I suppose.

It seems like maybe they know what they want in the moment (e.g., to get married by the end of the year), but that what they want just keeps changing, either within a day or maybe over the course of a few months passing.

Yes, therefore, mine actually "manipulates" the relationship (just as he said), because I always need to look at his face and guess his mood... .Anyway, I would not try to have a conversation about the relationship with him anymore. There is no logic at all. It always leads to a bigger mess in his mind.

Good thinking Apple.  It's truly best not to waste precious time trying to discuss issues like relationships with them.

We were talking about passive aggressive abuse yesterday in another post.  Today is my birthday and my husband decided to do something for me ( now that we are separated)  since we still work together ( we own a business together) so here's what he did:

He bought me an old wrinkled damaged tiny box of Christmas truffles called, ' Piggy Truffles' 

He gave me an old bouquet of tulips with yellow leaves

In addition to those ' wonderful' gifts he bought HIMSELF a nice bag of chips and a nice bag of peppermint puffs ( my favorite) and a deli sandwich for lunch.

I didn't say a word.  I didn't say thanks, didn't complain. I put everything aside and went on about my work. I think he really wanted me to get upset so that he could accuse me of being a selfish bi*** who never appreciated what he did for me.  WHATEVA!  If he needs to convince himself that I'm the problem, then so be it but I didn't respond to his passive aggressive baiting today.  He moped around the office, slouched in his chair like a pouty boy, yawned all day.  It took me many years to finally accept that I was married to a man whose entire purpose in life was to hurt me, demoralize me, devalue me and that he resented doing anything nice for me and would punish me for anything he did. 

I hope you and I can find total freedom from this evil soon!

Hey Leaving,

Happy Birthday!   Enjoy the special day with your friends and people who care about you! It's your day! Buy a present you like or have a delicious birthday cake Just ignore what he did.

You just pointed out the very true nature: we should not waste time to discuss issues about them, man can never figure out anything.

I am so happy that I need not work with mine anymore (We were in the same company, then I decided to change my job). For you, the thing would be harder. You still need to see your man everyday. I don't know how to comfort you or support you, but at least we can try to set our mind free. The whatever attitude is good for us.

We are on the journey, but are close to freedom

[HappyNihilist]

Thank you so much for sharing this, Loveofhislife.

I have some emails and letters similar to this from my exBPDbf. I don't doubt that it could have been written by a self-aware pwBPD.

The phrase "emotional amnesiac" especially resonated with me. It really is such a heartbreaking disorder. I have loads of empathy for my ex, and I know how much he suffers. I'm incredibly thankful that my mind isn't such a hellish place - although I have my own hellish places, so... .much sympathy there.

But, like all adults, they also have the power of choice, self-discovery, and personal growth.

[eyvindr]

Trouble is... .

But, like all adults, they also have the power of choice, self-discovery, and personal growth.

They're adults, physically and by the norms of society -- no doubt. But emotionally, were dealing with people who have no more coping tools than most 5 yr old children. Of course, it's a spectrum disorder -- so everything varies.

[HappyNihilist]

Trouble is... .

But, like all adults, they also have the power of choice, self-discovery, and personal growth.

They're adults, physically and by the norms of society -- no doubt. But emotionally, were dealing with people who have no more coping tools than most 5 yr old children. Of course, it's a spectrum disorder -- so everything varies.

Agreed... .there is hope for improvement, and even recovery - but it begins (and ends) with that person. It's hard for anyone to be self-aware, and then to do the necessary work... .harder still given the nature of BPD.

I meant that more as... .despite the pain and suffering inside their heads, they are still responsible for their behavior. There is always the choice of a.) repeating the same patterns (with the same results), or b.) making a change.

[eyvindr]

I agree with you completely, Happy Nihilist.

[willtimeheal]

  I am curious, do you think your ex's father really put her through all the abuse she alleged?

I met her father and her whole family... .they are mean sick and disordered people. Although maybe she did twist some facts about the abuse I don't doubt for a second that she was verbally physically emotionally and sexually abused. I witnessed her father in rages. He is a sick man.