I got an apology... sort of

[Depression = 72% of members]

She move out a year ago (in a week), but she's been in a r/s with her fall back lover (now fiancée) for about 19 months.

We share joint custody of D2 and S5. The week after she moved out, her first weekend with the kids, she brought them to our church, the one she had never come to on Sundays. She was flirting with Buddhism (because of her hair dresser) up until that point. Her fiancée is some goofy religious guy and goes to a protestant mega church. So I took this as partly guilt to give the kids stability (good mom), partly to still see me (when she knew I didn't want to see her), partly to gain my approval (the father-daughter dynamic  , and part of it mirroring her "new" bf now fiancée. I've neither encouraged nor discouraged it. The first few months I was very angry (hurt), and found excuses to avoid a few Sundays so I could go 2-3 weeks without seeing her. Very slowly my anger (pain) faded.

After I learned from a secret squirrel that she got engaged on her almost 2 week vacation after Christmas, I avoided that Sunday as well, the first in 8 months. I went out of town to hang with a buddy I hadn't in a very long time. Somewhat legit, and we had planned it before I found out.

Meeting her fiancée gave me a bit of closure. He's a goofy kid to me, and he was appropriately obsequious, even if he thought he was being slick, "Mr. Turkish? Pleased to meet you sir!" As if I didn't know anything. Idiot. It was nice to finally meet my new SIL (he's young enough to be my son, an 18 year spread). It gave me a type of closure. He's better for her... .for now, but a kid. My anger faded a lot for some reason.

This past Sunday, her weekend, she brought the kids to church. She was running late, and asked the kids if they wanted to go directly to Sunday school, or go see me in the sanctuary first. They charged across the parking lot to see me. She told me she had to yell at them they had seen me the night before at S5's bd party. They are so attached to me. She denies that she neglected them, and says, ":)2 and S5 are a priority in my life." This was a conversation a week ago. "A priority."

After taking the kids to Sunday school during the singing part, we came back. She sat on the opposite side of the section, even though she had seen where I was originally sitting with the kids. We had previously sat together sometimes, after I said it was ok. A lot of people,.except fir a few friends there, think we are married, naturally.

The sermon, coincidentally, happened to be on marriage, centered around 1 Corinthians 7. Since I don't intend this to be a Christian thread, I won't quote it. All I will say is that it was very good that we weren't sitting next to each other. I was nervous enough!

After the service,  i helped the kids to her car to say goodbye. As she came around the car, she kind of paused with her back turned towards me and said, "I see now how much I did wrong." I put my hand on her shoulder. She turned to me and gave me a fierce body hug. I returned it. This was the first time we'd hugged in 14 months. She said, almost sobbing, "You're a good man Turkish." I said, "I know I did things wrong, too" (like avoindantly withholding attention and affection---- which the Bible chapter warns about, and to a pwBPD,.that's like the ultimate invalidation. She said, "I wish things could have been different." Then I said something I have wanted to say for many months, after I looked back and figured out her FOO trigger which had nothing to do with me, though as it progressed, I handled it poorly, "it took me a while to figure out, but I can't help but wonder how much your father's affair [a kept woman] triggered all of this." Surprisingly to me, she replied, "I know! What he did hangs like a shadow over everything!"

We were still hugging. I kissed the top of her head, then let her go. We were standing towards the rear of her car. I don't know if the kids saw anything. If S5 saw, it may have been confusing. He's known the new guy for a year, and she shared with me later that he is rebelling against their r/s again like he did (and D, then 1) did. That, however, is another story.

To be honest, I have a lingering thought that we could be back together in a year. Her admission of her core pain still there is something she avoided by leaving, since I became her abandoning father, nevermind that in reality, she became like him: the cheater. Feelings to a pwBPD are facts. No matter how much validation and Staying tools I've learned here, far too much damage has been done. More drama will come due to our connection because of the kids. It's unavoidable. Still, it felt good to hug her, despite the fact that I've thought for a year that her touch disgusts me.

Her feelings were real in that moment, and despite the validation I received, I know that feelings change, and then change again. Not only for her, but for me as well. Though I feel a bit of peace right now, more than I've felt for a year (and more), I know a storm is coming. All I can do is live in and be mindful of the moment. The future is unavoidable. If I'm at peace now, then it's the best I can do for me, and for my children.

[Turkish]

She move out a year ago (in a week), but she's been in a r/s with her fall back lover (now fiancée) for about 19 months.

We share joint custody of D2 and S5. The week after she moved out, her first weekend with the kids, she brought them to our church, the one she had never come to on Sundays. She was flirting with Buddhism (because of her hair dresser) up until that point. Her fiancée is some goofy religious guy and goes to a protestant mega church. So I took this as partly guilt to give the kids stability (good mom), partly to still see me (when she knew I didn't want to see her), partly to gain my approval (the father-daughter dynamic  , and part of it mirroring her "new" bf now fiancée. I've neither encouraged nor discouraged it. The first few months I was very angry (hurt), and found excuses to avoid a few Sundays so I could go 2-3 weeks without seeing her. Very slowly my anger (pain) faded.

After I learned from a secret squirrel that she got engaged on her almost 2 week vacation after Christmas, I avoided that Sunday as well, the first in 8 months. I went out of town to hang with a buddy I hadn't in a very long time. Somewhat legit, and we had planned it before I found out.

Meeting her fiancée gave me a bit of closure. He's a goofy kid to me, and he was appropriately obsequious, even if he thought he was being slick, "Mr. Turkish? Pleased to meet you sir!" As if I didn't know anything. Idiot. It was nice to finally meet my new SIL (he's young enough to be my son, an 18 year spread). It gave me a type of closure. He's better for her... .for now, but a kid. My anger faded a lot for some reason.

This past Sunday, her weekend, she brought the kids to church. She was running late, and asked the kids if they wanted to go directly to Sunday school, or go see me in the sanctuary first. They charged across the parking lot to see me. She told me she had to yell at them they had seen me the night before at S5's bd party. They are so attached to me. She denies that she neglected them, and says, ":)2 and S5 are a priority in my life." This was a conversation a week ago. "A priority."

After taking the kids to Sunday school during the singing part, we came back. She sat on the opposite side of the section, even though she had seen where I was originally sitting with the kids. We had previously sat together sometimes, after I said it was ok. A lot of people,.except fir a few friends there, think we are married, naturally.

The sermon, coincidentally, happened to be on marriage, centered around 1 Corinthians 7. Since I don't intend this to be a Christian thread, I won't quote it. All I will say is that it was very good that we weren't sitting next to each other. I was nervous enough!

After the service,  i helped the kids to her car to say goodbye. As she came around the car, she kind of paused with her back turned towards me and said, "I see now how much I did wrong." I put my hand on her shoulder. She turned to me and gave me a fierce body hug. I returned it. This was the first time we'd hugged in 14 months. She said, almost sobbing, "You're a good man Turkish." I said, "I know I did things wrong, too" (like avoindantly withholding attention and affection---- which the Bible chapter warns about, and to a pwBPD,.that's like the ultimate invalidation. She said, "I wish things could have been different." Then I said something I have wanted to say for many months, after I looked back and figured out her FOO trigger which had nothing to do with me, though as it progressed, I handled it poorly, "it took me a while to figure out, but I can't help but wonder how much your father's affair [a kept woman] triggered all of this." Surprisingly to me, she replied, "I know! What he did hangs like a shadow over everything!"

We were still hugging. I kissed the top of her head, then let her go. We were standing towards the rear of her car. I don't know if the kids saw anything. If S5 saw, it may have been confusing. He's known the new guy for a year, and she shared with me later that he is rebelling against their r/s again like he did (and D, then 1) did. That, however, is another story.

To be honest, I have a lingering thought that we could be back together in a year. Her admission of her core pain still there is something she avoided by leaving, since I became her abandoning father, nevermind that in reality, she became like him: the cheater. Feelings to a pwBPD are facts. No matter how much validation and Staying tools I've learned here, far too much damage has been done. More drama will come due to our connection because of the kids. It's unavoidable. Still, it felt good to hug her, despite the fact that I've thought for a year that her touch disgusts me.

Her feelings were real in that moment, and despite the validation I received, I know that feelings change, and then change again. Not only for her, but for me as well. Though I feel a bit of peace right now, more than I've felt for a year (and more), I know a storm is coming. All I can do is live in and be mindful of the moment. The future is unavoidable. If I'm at peace now, then it's the best I can do for me, and for my children.

[patientandclear]

I would find that very difficult.  Very bittersweet.  I hope you're OK.

Also, wow, the new guy is in a bad place.  That's what happens when people use people. 

[Mutt]

Hi Turkish,

I would like to tell you it sounded like a moment of honesty from your ex. It's nice to read that you met her halfway by telling her you were sometimes being avoidant. I think it takes courage despite the circumstances from both sides. Overall, it sounds like you had a good Sunday.

[Turkish]

Yes p&c, it was bittersweet. It changes nothing, and my boundaries need to stay strong, especially regarding what the kids are doing as a consequence of her choices.

Mutt, it was probably a little bit of trianguation, with me rescuing her from her guilt, but sometimes we tend to look for psychological reasons for every little thing instead of stepping back a bit and realizing that they are people, too. Kindness and patience are the only aspects of love I feel that I can show her, and it seems to make a difference in whatever r/s we have still as parents.

[Hazelrah]

Turkish, I'm glad you were able to have a moment like this, even if it's only a temporary peace.  There seems to be a lot going on there right now, so just keep going as you have. 

[myself]

When she jumps in quickly thinking mostly of herself, she's probably scared inside making those moves. While you're not jumping into things, with understanding of all involved, and your fears become less and less.

[Turkish]

Hazelrah, thanks. I'm trying to be constant and Wisemind. (Glad to see you back, btw)

When she jumps in quickly thinking mostly of herself, she's probably scared inside making those moves. While you're not jumping into things, with understanding of all involved, and your fears become less and less.

That is interesting. It makes me think about how much impulsivity is borne of fear? I'm talking about anybody, not just pwBPD. I was also impulsive on my side, moving in after 3 months of the romantic r/s, giving her a kid after a year and months after a recycle (she would have gotten pregnant the first time... .I took the precautions for months until she volunteered to do so, which caused other problems). Proposing to her during a verbal dressing down about getting her a large chow me in instead of a small one (because, "I'll show her!", and a second child when I knew she wasn't that stable. I feared losing her, though my gut feeling each time was to let her go.

Trust the gut, it's what I've been doing for over a year now.