I'm done with her. She's moving out.

[paperlung]

I'm sure many of you are familiar with my story involving my ex-girlfriend. This thread is basically a carry over from my last one, which is now locked.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=271258.0

Last Friday (February 13th) my ex sent me text message early in the morning while I was away on my snowboarding trip with my brother and friend. I hadn't heard from her since the 9th when I messaged her asking if she was still thinking of moving out. Hear is the conversation:


Her: I've been like couch surfing downtown, so I don't have to go home. What a life.

Her: I should just live like Emile Hirsch's character in Into the Wild. I have nothing else going for me.

Me: Have you made time to see the doctor yet?

Her: paperlung, I've been downtown for like... Over a week.

Me: Why?

Her: Because being at my dad's makes me miserable.

Me: I understand that, but what you are doing right now isn't healthy for you in the long run. I can't believe you still haven't gone to the doctor.

Her: I can. I'm such a up . My dad doesn't even care to know where I am.

Her: Maybe I should be on Intervention.

Me: Anyway, I'm going out for breakfast. Take care of yourself. I'm coming home tomorrow.

Her: I don't know what the do I. I'm gonna end my life if I go to my dad's house.


=======================================


Just this morning she messages me again. Here is the conversation.

Her: Back now?

Me: Yup.

Her: You're not gonna want to talk to me anymore.

Me: Probably not if you continue to do silly things such as "couch surfing" instead of maturely facing your problems. I realize you don't like living at your dad's, but it's realistically the best option you have in saving yourself from this vicious cycle. You wouldn't have to pay rent, you wouldn't have to cam, you could focus on expanding your YouTube channel... .all of this while getting help/treatment. Where your dad lives isn't even THAT bad; you're within walking distance of everything that you need practically. I 100% would've been there for you if you chose that path because I care a lot about you, more than you probably know.

Her: Yeahhh we are gonna fall out I guess now.

Her: I'm moving downtown.

Me: I entirely disagree with your decision; just look at your past history. You're running away again and setting yourself up for another collapse down the line. But, you're an adult, and there is nothing I can do to stop you. I've already expressed how I felt. So please just leave me alone now because I don't have the time or place for people like you in my life.

Her: I got other people there for me.

Me: That's good. I hope you find solace from them. I will certainly not forget what you told me a couple of weeks ago as it completely contradicts what you are going to do.

Me: "I became very aware that I would not sustain a healthy functioning relationship like this, a job, or living alone. I had thoughts of moving out of my dad's place because I hate living here but I needed to think in the bigger grand scheme of things in my life. I am incapable of taking care of myself right now and the last thing I need to do is put myself in a position where I've been for the last two years. The last months in X (where she was before she moved back home) really changed me. And I apologize for acting like everything was fine when I spoke with you about it all before."

Me: How you're able to turn on a dime like that baffles me.

Her: paperlung. I told you how deeply unhappy I was here. Everyone I know is downtown. I prefer downtown. You will never understand my life/lifestyle cause it's completely different than mine. I don't have a great family who supports me in my endeavors and I'm not rushing into school just to please you. I wasn't taking care of myself here more so. At my friend's I always ate/barely smoked/was happier. My dad's place is toxic for me and you know it. It's not my time or place to "be a university student" I'm not there yet or maybe never. I don't know what my life holds for me. I had two options. Be more happy downtown on my own or be miserable here. PS. My dad's also moving.

Her: I cannot sit at my dad's miserable, alone, not working in crappy X [where she's staying with her dad]. I isolate myself here in my bedroom cause I can't even go downstairs cause it's disgusting and my dad hoards crap. And I do find solace in my friends cause they know exactly who I am and what I've been through and still support me.

Me: To please me? I was only concerned about your health at this point, not your future education. Everyone you know is downtown? Like who? Some new Tinder and POF guys you've recently befriended? Give me a break.

=======================================


"Other people," she says. Not really. Online she has a couple of ex-boyfriends she keeps in contact with who live in other areas. In real life, these "other people" are just random guys she's just recently met off Tinder or POF and befriended. No one even close to my level.

Well, I guess that's that.

[oletimefeelin]

I am sure I am not the first person to write this, but you are extremely enmeshed with this woman.  You have to let her make her own way in the world.  She'll get to the hospital in her own time. 

Stop analyzing her words.  They are basically meaningless.  They'll vary wildly from moment to moment such that you will make yourself crazy.

[fromheeltoheal]

Well, I guess that's that.

It is if you say it is paper.  What are you going to do the next time she contacts you?

[paperlung]

Well, I guess that's that.

It is if you say it is paper.  What are you going to do the next time she contacts you?

I told her I was going to block her number right before I did it. I don't expect to hear from her for a long time once she moves out.

I have her blocked on basically everything. I can't see or look up anything about her on my laptop or phone. I'm ready to move on again.

The conversation continued back and forth some more before I eventually blocked her.

======================================

Her: Yes to please you cause like Mr. England (the 40-year-old man she had an online affair with back in 2012 when we dated) you were always on my ass about quitting camming or "doing something else" as I just said my hea. lth is worse here because when I'm miserable I don't eat. Some (her friends) are recent and some are older. I don't talk to you about who my friends are. I told you I knew lots of people now when I saw you, but it goes beyond that, it's boring here, has no vegetarian stuff/no cool places and I don't drive. Why would I stay here and waste away in misery when I can live in a nice house near my friends? You're upset because you think I'm this tragic camgirl mess. This is the first time I'm moving entirely on my own without the help of someone. I've had several people ask to date me. I'm still single. And I know you care about my education or else you wouldn't of been so disappointed that I didn't do that stupid vet assistance program.

Her: And yes everyone I know knows my history and past

Me: You moved to Place #1 because you were miserable living with your dad and look what happened. Look what happened in Place #2. Look what happened in Place #3 and #4. Do you really think you'll suddenly be and remain a happy, healthy functioning individual living alone in the city working as a cam girl again?

Me: I was only dissapointed because you told me you were going to do it (the program). You tell me a lot of things but don't follow through.

Her: Yes because in Place #1 I had no friends and my BF (me) was distant. In Place #2 that was bound for failure, that WAS me running away. Place #3 not my fault. Got sick. Aunt suggested I go back to my dad's as there was no proper doctors. It was remote and boring anyway. No one lives there intentionally unless you're old. I was happy in Place #4 for a bit but once again chose not to make friends and I moved in with my ex was too fast cause I need to leave my dad's. My outlook and lifestyle is different... .You just have a hard time beliving it... Not everyone has a life like you where they get to stay rent free (she can at her dad's)/all that crap. I've had to do what I've had to do in order to survive and despite being depressed and messed up then I was still responsible and paid my rent. As I've said before we've led completely different lives

Me: You're delusional. You have an excuse for everything, don't you? I tried to provide the best advice and support that I could, but it does not sound to me like you are at the point where you want to be fixed. Although sometimes you'll occasionally have some awareness of your issues, you shift from considering it as a possibility to just avoiding or denying it (thanks to Mike-X for that one). These new friends of yours who live in the city don't know you like I do. Like you said, I've seen you at your best and worst; we dated for over a year. And I'm sure they're all enabling you somewhat, saying how you should just move out of your dad's if you're unhappy. Problem solved, right? It's just that simple. Anyway, I think we're done here. Good bye.

Her: Bye exey

Me: I'm blocking your number, so don't bother messaging me again.

======================================


I know for a fact that these "friends" of hers are barley even friends. They are all just men from Tinder or POF, most of whom she hasn't even probably met yet. Not a single longtime friend. So basically, she's going to live on her own in the city, work as a cam girl again to pay rent, and just sleep around with a bunch of her guy friends. Unbelievable.

[Ripped Heart]

paperlung, I've been following your story all the way through and at this point I have to agree with the comment from oletimefeelin that you have to let her make her own way in this world.

I feel for you, I really do  I'm seeing similar patterns emerging with my exBPDgf a slow motion train heading straight into a brick wall and there is nothing I can do to stop it. But there is something I can do to help and that's to let her plough head long into that wall.

There was a story my T reminded me of which is very apt for your situation as well as mine. It's about a boy watching a butterfly cocoon and for 3 days he watched as the butterfly desperately tried to push it's way out of the cocoon and was so exhausted because it failed every time. On the 4th day the boy felt bad for the butterfly and decided to help it by cutting a whole in the cocoon so the butterfly could finally emerge. When it did, it fell to the ground and died. The reason being that it needed that struggle in life to strengthen it's own wings to be able to strengthen and support itself. It didn't matter if it took 1 day, a week or even a month. It needed to let nature take it's course. The boy wasn't being cruel or vindictive, he was trying to help but in doing so, it didn't allow the butterfly to do what was needed in order for it to become what it would have done.

I know you only want the best for your ex, I know it's been a difficult struggle for you watching her taking the same paths over and over again but always ending in 1 step forward and 2 steps back. You are a good man who cares deeply for someone who up to now hasn't been able to make things work for her and I know how that feels.

I know with my own situation, there were moments of frustration because the solution seemed so simple but I could never grasp why exBPDgf would take the long and dangerous path when the easy and brighter path was a 5 minute solution. I know the more I tried to help her, the more resentful she became because essentially it is trying to take their independence away from them and if that's something they are desperately trying to hold on to, it's not a good feeling for them. Our intentions don't come from a bad place, they come from caring and love but the outcome is going to be the same regardless.

You mention about her "friends" barely even being friends. I'll be honest with you, part of that may very well be your own ego at play. You know her better than they do and what must be better for her than they do. I'll be honest with you, those may very well be the friends she needs right now and may be able to do what you have tried so much in vein to accomplish.

Here's why I say that. It's clear from your posts that you are trying to guide her down the right path but she's fighting you at every stage.

Do you remember a time in your life (possibly early teens) where you thought and felt you knew more than your parents? Or there would be rules, curfews etc... that you didn't necessarily like and tried either to avoid or navigate around. As children we at least attempted at some point to push the boundaries our parents set and that's part of growing up. a pwBPD hasn't really developed that process but is still facing you in an adult body so it can be very difficult to distinguish between their behaviours and their thought process.

What I see from your messages is a father trying to look out for his rebellious daughter and she feels she knows best. The more you try, the more she will rebel against anything you say in an effort to test that boundary. Where we let ourselves down (and I've been guilty of it as a parent as well as a husband and boyfriend) is that we tend to care about them too much that we allow that boundary to be pushed until it collapses. So the next time you say no to a child, on something you've previously caved on they will continue to push to try and find that button again that will get you to drop your guard.

As an adult, you can look back on those times and see that what you thought you knew, you didn't really and that your parents knew best because they too had been through a similar process when they were young. They pushed boundaries too looking for that button or knew how to bend the rules and it's through that time in our lives that we learn and are able to teach our own children. They might not see it immediately or rebel or think you are being unfair but as they develop, they learn and understand why that was in place.

So in terms of your ex going to her "friends" do you honestly believe she can sustain that happiness, given her past history? Do you honestly think when the mask finally comes off that these "friends" are going to be as accommodating or understanding as you have been? Your ex may very well find herself in a whole world of trouble and that may very well have been what brought her back this last time and directly to you. But what happens if that door is no longer open to her? This time it was and she leant on you to get what she needed, to know you were there as a safety net so she could go back out and follow the exact same pattern. Essentially, you cut open the cocoon.

So what could possibly happen if that door is no longer open is that she may very well realise that she is on her own. The safety net is gone and that it's a very scary place for her to be in. That could be the push she needs to seek out the help she needs because she no longer has you as the excuse. You've broken your part of the triangle and given what you have said about the men that are out there on Tinder, I'm not entirely sure she's going to find someone who was willing to put up with what you have done.

As I say, in order for her to seek the help, it could be exactly where she needs to be right now. But at the same time, you have to take this time now to heal, detach from it all and start to build a healthy life for you. We sometimes get trapped in the same spot waiting to see if they come knocking again and that doesn't do us any good.

You are a good man paperlung and there is someone out there waiting for you to find your healthy life so that you can share it with them. Don't deny them that opportunity by holding on to what can be false hope, begin to move forward so you can find that girl who is waiting for you 

[fromheeltoheal]

I told her I was going to block her number right before I did it. I don't expect to hear from her for a long time once she moves out.

OK, and good for you!  And once you've handled the technology and really stop communicating with her, the real work starts.  You are still emotionally connected to her, and letting that go, along with the hope that it could ever work, is where the work and the growth are.  I look forward to hearing updates as we travel this path together here.  Take care of you!

[paperlung]

paperlung, I've been following your story all the way through and at this point I have to agree with the comment from oletimefeelin that you have to let her make her own way in this world.

I feel for you, I really do  I'm seeing similar patterns emerging with my exBPDgf a slow motion train heading straight into a brick wall and there is nothing I can do to stop it. But there is something I can do to help and that's to let her plough head long into that wall.

There was a story my T reminded me of which is very apt for your situation as well as mine. It's about a boy watching a butterfly cocoon and for 3 days he watched as the butterfly desperately tried to push it's way out of the cocoon and was so exhausted because it failed every time. On the 4th day the boy felt bad for the butterfly and decided to help it by cutting a whole in the cocoon so the butterfly could finally emerge. When it did, it fell to the ground and died. The reason being that it needed that struggle in life to strengthen it's own wings to be able to strengthen and support itself. It didn't matter if it took 1 day, a week or even a month. It needed to let nature take it's course. The boy wasn't being cruel or vindictive, he was trying to help but in doing so, it didn't allow the butterfly to do what was needed in order for it to become what it would have done.

I know you only want the best for your ex, I know it's been a difficult struggle for you watching her taking the same paths over and over again but always ending in 1 step forward and 2 steps back. You are a good man who cares deeply for someone who up to now hasn't been able to make things work for her and I know how that feels.

I know with my own situation, there were moments of frustration because the solution seemed so simple but I could never grasp why exBPDgf would take the long and dangerous path when the easy and brighter path was a 5 minute solution. I know the more I tried to help her, the more resentful she became because essentially it is trying to take their independence away from them and if that's something they are desperately trying to hold on to, it's not a good feeling for them. Our intentions don't come from a bad place, they come from caring and love but the outcome is going to be the same regardless.

You mention about her "friends" barely even being friends. I'll be honest with you, part of that may very well be your own ego at play. You know her better than they do and what must be better for her than they do. I'll be honest with you, those may very well be the friends she needs right now and may be able to do what you have tried so much in vein to accomplish.

Here's why I say that. It's clear from your posts that you are trying to guide her down the right path but she's fighting you at every stage.

Do you remember a time in your life (possibly early teens) where you thought and felt you knew more than your parents? Or there would be rules, curfews etc... that you didn't necessarily like and tried either to avoid or navigate around. As children we at least attempted at some point to push the boundaries our parents set and that's part of growing up. a pwBPD hasn't really developed that process but is still facing you in an adult body so it can be very difficult to distinguish between their behaviours and their thought process.

What I see from your messages is a father trying to look out for his rebellious daughter and she feels she knows best. The more you try, the more she will rebel against anything you say in an effort to test that boundary. Where we let ourselves down (and I've been guilty of it as a parent as well as a husband and boyfriend) is that we tend to care about them too much that we allow that boundary to be pushed until it collapses. So the next time you say no to a child, on something you've previously caved on they will continue to push to try and find that button again that will get you to drop your guard.

As an adult, you can look back on those times and see that what you thought you knew, you didn't really and that your parents knew best because they too had been through a similar process when they were young. They pushed boundaries too looking for that button or knew how to bend the rules and it's through that time in our lives that we learn and are able to teach our own children. They might not see it immediately or rebel or think you are being unfair but as they develop, they learn and understand why that was in place.

So in terms of your ex going to her "friends" do you honestly believe she can sustain that happiness, given her past history? Do you honestly think when the mask finally comes off that these "friends" are going to be as accommodating or understanding as you have been? Your ex may very well find herself in a whole world of trouble and that may very well have been what brought her back this last time and directly to you. But what happens if that door is no longer open to her? This time it was and she leant on you to get what she needed, to know you were there as a safety net so she could go back out and follow the exact same pattern. Essentially, you cut open the cocoon.

So what could possibly happen if that door is no longer open is that she may very well realise that she is on her own. The safety net is gone and that it's a very scary place for her to be in. That could be the push she needs to seek out the help she needs because she no longer has you as the excuse. You've broken your part of the triangle and given what you have said about the men that are out there on Tinder, I'm not entirely sure she's going to find someone who was willing to put up with what you have done.

As I say, in order for her to seek the help, it could be exactly where she needs to be right now. But at the same time, you have to take this time now to heal, detach from it all and start to build a healthy life for you. We sometimes get trapped in the same spot waiting to see if they come knocking again and that doesn't do us any good.

You are a good man paperlung and there is someone out there waiting for you to find your healthy life so that you can share it with them. Don't deny them that opportunity by holding on to what can be false hope, begin to move forward so you can find that girl who is waiting for you  

Thank you so much, Ripped Heart. You have no idea how much I appreciated reading this. I liked the butterfly cocoon analogy.

The father/daughter relationship you spoke of is exactly how I feel about my ex. Especially when we were dating. It was like caring for a child.

No, I do not believe she can sustain happiness given her past history. The idea of moving downtown may have her excited/hopeful, but eventually the novelty of it will wear off. My city is one of the most expensive places to live in. In order for her to afford rent, she will have to start camming regularly again. And just a couple of weeks ago she was telling me how she was going to go on welfare because she didn't want to cam anymore. This whole moving ordeal didn't become a thing until she met up with this POF guy who happened to be from the city. I guess they spent the day together downtown, and once she went back to her dad's place the following day or whatever, she decided that she wanted to move out. She's apparently not looking for a relationship, so I don't think she's moving there specifically for him, although she now considers him one of her friends.

What brought my ex back here (where I live) in the beginning of December 2014 was because she found herself in a whole world of trouble in October 2014. After she and her boyfriend of one-year broke up, he moved out and she was living alone. She quickly found a replacement off Tinder who ended up being a total psychopath, according to her. He verbally and physically abused her, and also cheated on her as well. Just a couple of weeks ago when I last saw her she said to me that she felt that was the type of relationship she deserved; to be treated badly. It was after she had caught him cheating was when she came crying to me, telling me how she wanted to leave/was tired of running away. I talked to her, gave her advice and support, but I never got my hands dirty. She had an old ex-boyfriend who she hadn't seen in many, many years help her move back instead. I haven't offered to help her once since she's been back, nor has she asked for it. I didn't want to chance wasting my time, so I just closely spectated.

I've blocked her number this time, so she can can't message me, although she could always text/call from another number. I've also set up my laptop and phone so that I can't do any peeking whatsoever. Everything is password locked, and I don't know the password. I am now completely in the dark. I don't use social media, so she can't keep tabs on me. I also asked a moderator of this other forum I visit to permanently ban my account today so that she can no longer read my future posts (she knows my username). You said you've been following my story, so you probably know about the BPD thread incident when she text messaged me at 1 AM just moments after I had made a post mentioning her.

I don't expect to hear from her for a long time once she moves.

I told her I was going to block her number right before I did it. I don't expect to hear from her for a long time once she moves out.

OK, and good for you!  And once you've handled the technology and really stop communicating with her, the real work starts.  You are still emotionally connected to her, and letting that go, along with the hope that it could ever work, is where the work and the growth are.  I look forward to hearing updates as we travel this path together here.  Take care of you!

It's hard. I really wish I could be there for her. To see her, spend time with her, talk to her, ect. But I just can't tolerate what she is doing, even if there are many things I do like about her as person. Like you said, right now I am still emotionally connected to her. If I continue to stay in her life, I will never be able to properly heal and move forward.

[Ripped Heart]

It was long paperlung but I felt you needed that 

We get so caught up in how much we care that we forget sometimes what it actually is and what's its supposed to be. People often comment that a pwBPD is limited in development much like a child and as such they are needing that replacement parent.

When you care enough about someone with so much crisis, you become that parent because you want to see them succeed and forget that you were the boyfriend/lover/husband.

I think some of our issue that keeps us involved is that it's not only losing that partner but it can also feel like losing a child.

[BatMasterson]

Paperlung - I just did the same (deleted the email she would use to contact me, blocked her number).  Yes she could still find me but it has stopped the obsessive checking etc to see if she's reached out.

Your conversation narrative seems typical of these relationships.  The two of you discuss and discuss in long IM or back and forth email discussions which never seem to result in actionable decisions or agreement.  You've no idea how many times I've heard "we're just different"... .it's like reasoning with a 5 year old.   I did the exactly the same for the last 2.5 years in the relationship trying to "save" her from making terrible mistakes and excusing every hurtful action.  At some point you just have to let go (the butterfly analogy I guess) although I have little hope that she will ever change or stop making self-harming decisions... .and that breaks my heart.   But, it's also something I have to work on - the "saving people" part of my personality.   I don't want to get rid of it completely - I believe we do need to be compassionate people and help each other to whatever extent we can... .just not at the complete violation of our "self", our boundaries, our self-respect.

I hope you make some forward progress now you've cut off contact.   I have a good idea what you're feeling and going through and I sympathize.  Kia Kaha

[paperlung]

It was long paperlung but I felt you needed that 

We get so caught up in how much we care that we forget sometimes what it actually is and what's its supposed to be. People often comment that a pwBPD is limited in development much like a child and as such they are needing that replacement parent.

When you care enough about someone with so much crisis, you become that parent because you want to see them succeed and forget that you were the boyfriend/lover/husband.

I think some of our issue that keeps us involved is that it's not only losing that partner but it can also feel like losing a child.

I think I became the parent from the get-go. She told me very early on about her past and it broke my heart. I wanted to help fix her life so that she could finally be happy. That was back in the Summer of 2011. It's 2015 now and she's still searching.

Just curious, Ripped Heart. Did you ever read my first thread on bpdfamily? I only ask because you said you've been following my story, which actually dates back a couple of years on here.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=197383.0

Paperlung - I just did the same (deleted the email she would use to contact me, blocked her number).  Yes she could still find me but it has stopped the obsessive checking etc to see if she's reached out.

Your conversation narrative seems typical of these relationships.  The two of you discuss and discuss in long IM or back and forth email discussions which never seem to result in actionable decisions or agreement.  You've no idea how many times I've heard "we're just different"... .it's like reasoning with a 5 year old.   I did the exactly the same for the last 2.5 years in the relationship trying to "save" her from making terrible mistakes and excusing every hurtful action.  At some point you just have to let go (the butterfly analogy I guess) although I have little hope that she will ever change or stop making self-harming decisions... .and that breaks my heart.   But, it's also something I have to work on - the "saving people" part of my personality.   I don't want to get rid of it completely - I believe we do need to be compassionate people and help each other to whatever extent we can... .just not at the complete violation of our "self", our boundaries, our self-respect.

I hope you make some forward progress now you've cut off contact.   I have a good idea what you're feeling and going through and I sympathize.  Kia Kaha

I actually changed my entire phone number back in March 2013 when we officially went our separate ways. This time I just blocked her number. I also told her back then that I was deleting my email address but that was a lie. I didn't want to change it as it's connected to the internet in so many different ways. The hassle to change it just wasn't worth it. She's aware I still use the same address now. So technically, she can still get a hold of me by using another phone or email address. I don't expect to hear from her for a long time, though.

I have little hope that my ex will ever change now as well. Like I said in my previous thread, I felt manipulated by her; that what she told me was just to appease me. She fed me what I wanted to hear so that I would more easily go along the idea of seeing her in person.

All I feel like doing right now is talking about this to anyone who is willing to listen. It's just like when we broke up two years ago all over again, although this time I'm not nearly as depressed/angry/devastated/ect.

[paperlung]

Mornings are the worst. Especially when I don't have class to go to to distract myself. I wake up feeling anxious, like there is a knot in my stomach. I think it's because even in my sleep I think about her. I know I've dreamt about her occasionally. I take an SSRI for my anxiety, but I can still get anxious if the situation is bad enough. I probably would also be feeling way more depressed at the moment if I wasn't on it. I don't want to imagine that. Sometimes I find it hard to cry though, and I know it's because of the medication. Right now I just want to bawl my eyes out, but can only get a little teary-eyed. I hate it. I want some relief. I wish I didn't have to take this stupid medication, but it has really helped my anxiety.

Sometimes I wonder if I should just accept her as the ___ up she claims to be and stay in her life. I know that probably wouldn't be healthy for me, though. I just miss what we used to have, and although things were never completely perfect between us because of all of her issues, we did manage to create a lot of good memories together. She even admitted to me that I was the best boyfriend she has ever had, which I believe to be true. I enjoyed seeing her again the three times we got together during December-February. I'll miss her. I'll even miss the small talk via text. First loves really do die hard, I guess.

Sorry for rambling on like this, I just like to write when I'm feeling sad.

[Ripped Heart]

Paperlung, never apologise for talking through your feelings. That's why we are here and it is part of the healing process 

I didn't see your first post but I read through it today. You went through a lot then and accommodated a lot of her behaviour too. I felt for you with some of the things you put up with and accepted and also where your boundaries were trampled on.

First loves can be heartbreaking when it ends, simply because there is nothing to compare it too. The pain can be one of the most intense feelings you have and although no break up is easy to deal with, at least you may have some level of expectation of what you are going to feel and know that at some point during the process, thing will get easier.

Your last post shows how far you have come despite the difficulties you are feeling right now. You are addressing your emotions and applying logical thought to them. Its the beginning of acceptance and as time progresses, the pain will diminish as long as each time it starts to creep in, your brain will let you know and vice versa.

My old T used to tell me to recognise and remember what you are feeling right now because months or years down the line, if/when an ex resurfaces that caused this much emotional pain, by remembering the pain you dont let yourself get drawn back in to it. Its how I've managed to maintain NC with exN/BPDw for 3 years despite all her little attempts. The day I get an apology and told that she has been in Therapy for the past 3 years because she is willing to accept her responsibility, may be the day I say hello but I won't ever allow myself to be emotionally drawn back in because I still remember the pain.

[myself]

You know she's going to contact you again, and again, because part of this is she wants an audience for what she's doing. Being in the role of 'parent' to her, as you were saying, she gets to 'be naughty' and have you chastise her. Then she denies and turns it around so you're the one doing something wrong, and she feels she 'gets away with it'. She's not seeing you as a lover or friend. She sounds too lost to even really see herself. It's best to let go.

[paperlung]

Paperlung, never apologise for talking through your feelings. That's why we are here and it is part of the healing process 

I didn't see your first post but I read through it today. You went through a lot then and accommodated a lot of her behaviour too. I felt for you with some of the things you put up with and accepted and also where your boundaries were trampled on.

First loves can be heartbreaking when it ends, simply because there is nothing to compare it too. The pain can be one of the most intense feelings you have and although no break up is easy to deal with, at least you may have some level of expectation of what you are going to feel and know that at some point during the process, thing will get easier.

Your last post shows how far you have come despite the difficulties you are feeling right now. You are addressing your emotions and applying logical thought to them. Its the beginning of acceptance and as time progresses, the pain will diminish as long as each time it starts to creep in, your brain will let you know and vice versa.

My old T used to tell me to recognise and remember what you are feeling right now because months or years down the line, if/when an ex resurfaces that caused this much emotional pain, by remembering the pain you dont let yourself get drawn back in to it. Its how I've managed to maintain NC with exN/BPDw for 3 years despite all her little attempts. The day I get an apology and told that she has been in Therapy for the past 3 years because she is willing to accept her responsibility, may be the day I say hello but I won't ever allow myself to be emotionally drawn back in because I still remember the pain.

Oh, well thank you very much for taking your time and reading it. I feel you must know me pretty well now, haha.

Yup, I put up with a lot. I certainly don't anymore, at least not with other women.  She was my first girlfriend, first and only love... .I had no idea what a good, healthy relationship was supposed to be like. I was naive. I thought she was easily fixable if I just behaved like a saint and got her treatment/therapy/medication. But as my story goes, she just got worse.

She told me the last time I saw her, which was a couple of weeks ago, that the time she spent living on her own in a condo back in the Fall of 2012 to when she moved back here at the very end of November 2014 were her "lost years". As to say she isn't lost anymore. Sureeeeeee.

And 3 years of NC despite all of her attempts, eh? I'm impressed. You're a strong individual. Are you NC with your exGF as well?

You know she's going to contact you again, and again, because part of this is she wants an audience for what she's doing. Being in the role of 'parent' to her, as you were saying, she gets to 'be naughty' and have you chastise her. Then she denies and turns it around so you're the one doing something wrong, and she feels she 'gets away with it'. She's not seeing you as a lover or friend. She sounds too lost to even really see herself. It's best to let go.

Well, she always does... .Especially when there's a crisis. But who knows, now she apparently has "friends" who just so happen to all be guys she met off either Tinder or POF who obviously want to date/have sex with her.

[paperlung]

My ex is so weird. She and I both have Tinder and she swiped right on me earlier today. For those of you who don't know what Tinder is, it's a phone app where you can either like (swipe right) or dislike (swipe left) somebody. If you both swipe right on each other you will match and then you can start a conversation.

I didn't swipe right on her, so I never got official confirmation that we matched, but I didn't need to. People who like you (swipe right) will pop up first when you log into Tinder, and she kept popping up first out of the thousands of women in my area every time I logged in. That's how the logarithm of the app works.

Just yesterday I told her I was going to block her number and that I didn't want her in my life anymore because of the recent decisions she's made. So what is this all about? Some kind of test to see if I'm still attached to her, perhaps?

I remember we matched on Tinder back in December before we eventually met up after not having seen each other in almost two years. She liked me first. I then sent her a corny pickup line on Tinder as a joke and then she sent me an actual text message saying, "You're funny."

[fromheeltoheal]

So what is this all about? Some kind of test to see if I'm still attached to her, perhaps?

Yup.  At least you didn't bite, but you'll never get her out of your head if you expose yourself to things like that.  Time to get rid of Tinder for a while?

[paperlung]

So what is this all about? Some kind of test to see if I'm still attached to her, perhaps?

Yup.  At least you didn't bite, but you'll never get her out of your head if you expose yourself to things like that.  Time to get rid of Tinder for a while?

Once you dislike/swipe left on somebody, they will never appear for you again unless they were to delete and remake their account, so I'm not concerned. Still weird of her considering just yesterday I said, "I entirely disagree with your decision; just look at your past history. You're running away again and setting yourself up for another collapse down the line. But, you're an adult, and there is nothing I can do to stop you. I've already expressed how I felt. So please just leave me alone now because I don't have the time or place for people like you in my life."

[Ripped Heart]

Paperlung, I've followed because your ex's patterns are somewhat similar to my ex and how you have dealt with things and what you've had to endure is somewhat similar too. Albeit very different situations with similar actions 

Like you, I dont really know what a healthy relationship should feel like either. My own FOO was a father with NPD and a uBPD mother. So in my circumstance I'm drawn to people with the same traits as my parents where my own traits appear to be the exact opposite. I was a young caretaker to my younger sister and also to my mother after my father left so all I've known is receiving affection or attention through providing for others.

However, finding a healthy relationship with that mindset can also pose difficulties as it tends the opposite end to a pwBPD so would bring our own dysfunction to the party. The key is finding a balance to it all, knowing when its ok to care but without exposing vulnerabilities that can be exploited.

Even your interaction with Tinder rings true with something my exN/BPDw did after I was ousted from the marriage. She would send me game requests for Words with Friends, despite filing false charges against me and me being NC. It felt surreal at the time. Here was a person bent on total annihilation but at the same time was stating, play a game with me. My marriage was a game to her, the divorce was a game to her and the past 3 years have been a game to her too. We used to play Words with Friends a lot when we were married and she never beat me. I'm pretty sure that the requests after everything ended was because it tore her up inside and played on her NPD. I dont think it was personal, she just didn't like to be beaten and wanted to go out on top.

By remaining NC for 3 years, I still have control of me and she will continue to keep resurfacing because she isn't in control and that will eat away at her. To her its about winning and losing, to me its about not giving up control of me. The easiest solution is for her to seek help, but sadly she will never be able to do so because by doing that would mean she would have to recognise she isn't perfect and her NPD tells her she is.

I'm only 1 week into NC with exBPDgf and have blocked all avenues she has to contact me. Its been tough and still is but I know its the right thing to do for both her and me.

[paperlung]

What happened with your exBPDgf? Is she and your ex-wife both diagnosed?

Tinder said yesterday when she popped up on my phone screen that she was only 6 km away, so she's back at her dad's at the moment. Most likely getting ready to move. I still find the whole her "liking me" on there thing really bizarre. Do you think it was simply just to see if I was still attached or not?

I've also come to terms today about what you said in your first post about my ego, Ripped Heart. Like her choosing to move downtown instead of closer to me shows that she cares more about those "friends" than she does about our friendship. Leading up to her move back in with her dad on November 29th, we texted a fair bit on what she was going to do and stuff. I remember she told me one day in November that she was probably going to move back into the same condominium she used to live at when we broke up (it's just down the road from me) because she liked my area better and her friend (the ex who helped her move back) lives in the area as well. But then she changed her mind, saying she realized she was being too impulsive and needed more time to think.

I would've said to her all the same things if she choose to move out anywhere, though. I believed she was best off staying at her dad's place for a while longer. She wouldn't have to cam, wouldn't have to pay rent, and could just focus on getting help/treatment/therapy. She said to me when she was downtown staying at her friend's (she called it couch surfing) she felt happier/would eat more/smoke less. I don't for one second believe that's sustainable or the cure to all her problems; moving to the city.